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1/22/2020 12:12:56 PM
Posted: 11/18/2012 4:22:37 PM EST
I've been planning a home defense SBR build for the purposes of suppressing and it not get too long. I've been researching barrels and cans for a little while, but this weekend I went to a gun show and ran across a suppresor manufacturer who said they could permanently attach their can to the barrel which would avoid two tax stamps.

I was wanting to get some input from you guys on that idea. The way I see it, if I am going to suppress this rifle and just as long or shorter than a 16" standard AR, why would I want to take it off. But a concern I do have is cleaning and maintenance. How much cleaning and maintenance do the cans require if any and. How difficult would it be, if possible, to maintain the can and barrel. Any input would be appreciated.
Link Posted: 11/18/2012 4:39:32 PM EST
Originally Posted By gsoto188:
l which would avoid two tax stamps.
.


it will avoid 1 tax stamp
for your question it really depends on who's can is on the barrel
but I can tell you that just cleaning your barrel will be hell
you lose patches in there and all sorts of bad things happen

Link Posted: 11/18/2012 4:50:19 PM EST
I have a buddy that permanently attached a shroud that brought the barrel to legal length on a 22. He ran the suppressor on it most of the time, but was still able to take it off for cleaning etc. It worked out really well. I would try to get a pic, but he is deployed right now. Hope this helps.
Link Posted: 11/18/2012 11:42:55 PM EST
Make a pistol AR. You wont have to worry about it being a SBR and pinning your suppressor.
Link Posted: 11/19/2012 7:41:14 AM EST
Not a fan of the pistols. If I build an ar, I want it to be a shoulder weapon.
Link Posted: 11/19/2012 8:31:04 AM EST
[Last Edit: 11/19/2012 8:31:33 AM EST by Zcwilkins]
I wouldn't do it.

I'm guessing they won't attach it for free. Cleaning the barrel/can will be much more difficult. What happens if you have a baffle strike and need to send the can to the manufacturer? My personal opinion, the issues brought about aren't worth it to save 1 of 2 stamps.

ETA - I agree about pistols
Link Posted: 11/19/2012 11:38:09 AM EST
Originally Posted By fmkenner:
Make a pistol AR. You wont have to worry about it being a SBR and pinning your suppressor.


Truly awful advice to anyone in a free state.... scratch that.... any state. Selectfire carbine > SBR Semi > 16" Semi > Actual Handgun > AR Pistol > Rocks


OP: Just SBR the AR and get a suppressor later. The SBR is way more useful since 556 doesn't really get any sort of "quiet". Plus with at least one SBR lower you have short barrel options from 22, 9mm, 300blk, 556, etc. You'll find that sometimes you won't shoot suppressed, or if you order a 30cal can it can go on the AR and 308 guns, so multiple uses are something a fixed can won't allow. Cleaning sucks. And certain rails won't work with a fixed can like that. It's not really worth it for most people.

If you absolutely can only do one stamp or live in a NON-SBR state.... 11.5"-12.5" + pinned AAC Ranger3 with the gas port sized/adjusted for 100% suppressed use.

Link Posted: 11/19/2012 1:22:31 PM EST
The company that is to pin it is the manufacture if the can so I think that will help with any issue that I might have. But thanks for the advise, taking it all in consideration.
Link Posted: 11/19/2012 1:26:09 PM EST
Yea, I don't want to catch any paper over this whole thing. Not worth the risk. I didn't think about the different options on an SBR lower. Good stuff to think about. Thanks
Link Posted: 11/19/2012 3:40:41 PM EST
AAC made the ranger 3 able to be pinned. They must not think it will be a problem.
Link Posted: 11/19/2012 4:59:55 PM EST
One of the best things about suppressors is that you can use them on any weapon you want without paying an additional fee. That benefit goes away if you pin your suppressor to one barrel.

You think you will never need to use that suppressor on any other firearm, but for the cost of an SBR stamp, you get an SBR that you can shoot unsuppressed when you want plus the ability to use your can on other firearms.
Link Posted: 11/19/2012 5:16:36 PM EST
Originally Posted By new21022:
Originally Posted By fmkenner:
Make a pistol AR. You wont have to worry about it being a SBR and pinning your suppressor.


Truly awful advice to anyone in a free state.... scratch that.... any state. Selectfire carbine > SBR Semi > 16" Semi > Actual Handgun > AR Pistol > Rocks


OP: Just SBR the AR and get a suppressor later. The SBR is way more useful since 556 doesn't really get any sort of "quiet". Plus with at least one SBR lower you have short barrel options from 22, 9mm, 300blk, 556, etc. You'll find that sometimes you won't shoot suppressed, or if you order a 30cal can it can go on the AR and 308 guns, so multiple uses are something a fixed can won't allow. Cleaning sucks. And certain rails won't work with a fixed can like that. It's not really worth it for most people.

If you absolutely can only do one stamp or live in a NON-SBR state.... 11.5"-12.5" + pinned AAC Ranger3 with the gas port sized/adjusted for 100% suppressed use.



Only had the pistol idea as we in Michigan cant have SBR/SBS. I want a 10" .300blk suppressed and this is the best way for me to do it. Oh and we just got the right to own suppressors just over a year now, Im going to be so broke. Alot of us in Michigan are hoping for SBR to be legal, Im just not holding my breath. If I were the OP I would just get the two stamps as its legal there and enjoy. Wish I had the choice.

Link Posted: 11/20/2012 6:20:19 AM EST
[Last Edit: 11/20/2012 6:21:21 AM EST by new21022]
Originally Posted By fmkenner:
Originally Posted By new21022:
Originally Posted By fmkenner:
Make a pistol AR. You wont have to worry about it being a SBR and pinning your suppressor.


Truly awful advice to anyone in a free state.... scratch that.... any state. Selectfire carbine > SBR Semi > 16" Semi > Actual Handgun > AR Pistol > Rocks


OP: Just SBR the AR and get a suppressor later. The SBR is way more useful since 556 doesn't really get any sort of "quiet". Plus with at least one SBR lower you have short barrel options from 22, 9mm, 300blk, 556, etc. You'll find that sometimes you won't shoot suppressed, or if you order a 30cal can it can go on the AR and 308 guns, so multiple uses are something a fixed can won't allow. Cleaning sucks. And certain rails won't work with a fixed can like that. It's not really worth it for most people.

If you absolutely can only do one stamp or live in a NON-SBR state.... 11.5"-12.5" + pinned AAC Ranger3 with the gas port sized/adjusted for 100% suppressed use.



Only had the pistol idea as we in Michigan cant have SBR/SBS. I want a 10" .300blk suppressed and this is the best way for me to do it. Oh and we just got the right to own suppressors just over a year now, Im going to be so broke. Alot of us in Michigan are hoping for SBR to be legal, Im just not holding my breath. If I were the OP I would just get the two stamps as its legal there and enjoy. Wish I had the choice.



I feel for you being in MI, but having some time on AR pistols, I have to stress that a 16 is WAY more useful. I would consider a pinned Ranger3 in your position at least by setting the gas block up for a pinned can you get away from some issues that suppressed users face. But that would be ONLY if I could not have an SBR ever. It does seem like its going to happen for you guys... Maybe. I also wouldn't do 14.5" pinned in a free state but that's a fair compromise for ban states
Link Posted: 11/20/2012 8:05:01 AM EST
Link Posted: 11/20/2012 8:29:40 AM EST
Originally Posted By INgunner54:
I have a buddy that permanently attached a shroud that brought the barrel to legal length on a 22. He ran the suppressor on it most of the time, but was still able to take it off for cleaning etc. It worked out really well. I would try to get a pic, but he is deployed right now. Hope this helps.


Lol I don't know you but this is what I did for a M&P 15-22

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UKpfdf3bcRU&feature=youtube_gdata_player
Link Posted: 11/20/2012 9:19:09 AM EST
Was thinking if you do decide to pin your suppressor you may want to go with a user serviceable can. Huntertown Arms has a Kestrel 556 that might fit the bill. Although I'm alittle unsure how it would be measured, it threads off in the center.

Kestrel 556
Link Posted: 11/20/2012 10:32:14 AM EST
I have many AR's that use a muzzle can and many that are integral (can and barrel as one)
I have never lost anything in the barrel or can when cleaning a integral.
If you use a jag that holds the patch good then you wont have any problems, those
that think its a problem need to learn more about what cleaning tools to use as even a bore snake
will work.
Link Posted: 11/21/2012 7:32:14 AM EST
[Last Edit: 11/21/2012 10:18:47 AM EST by stre-tch]
There are a few options besides welding the can to the barrel.

1. You could put a shroud on your barrel a la TacSol SBX barrel

There is actually a guy in Washington or Oregon who offers this as well as ADCO did it for a guy in Michigan for a 9mm can. (there might be others but I forget) - One problem would be you more or less have to figure what handguard you want and keep it that way (barrel nut has to go on before the shroud), same with the gas block

2. Supposedly Delta Company Arms was developing a freefloat tube that you could weld/pin onto your upper which was over 16" in length making it a monolithic upper and they had a letter from the ATF stating that with the Freefloat tube permanently attached it became like a shroud on a barrel and you could have a barrel < 16" on the inside. - Like the one above unless you are crazy creative I think you will have to pretty much determine which gas block and barrel you want because the only way to get it off afterwards it to cut/drill it out.

Hope this helps

not mine but
ETA - Another way of doing it but it is only bolt action straight pull http://www.quarterbore.net/forums/showthread.php?t=8871



Link Posted: 11/22/2012 5:07:58 AM EST
[Last Edit: 11/22/2012 5:11:32 AM EST by Redtazdog]
A 16 inch barrel with a can on the end gets long

A shroud on a shorter barrel that comes to 16" then drop a can in and you then have a short package

Shrouded barrels are nice in non SBR states



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