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Posted: 11/5/2008 3:00:22 PM EDT
which was the better weapon over all? accuracy, quality, reliablity, etc. the k-98 or the k-31?

Remington makes a newer k-98 currently.
Link Posted: 11/5/2008 3:36:20 PM EDT
I'm pretty sure the Mauser marketed by Remington is a CZ Mauser from eastern Europe and is a commercial Mauser. It is not a Kar98k nor any other type of military Mauser.

The 98 Mauser action is superior to just about anything made up to WW2 and after. It has a much better gas escape design than the K31, which has none. The 98 has a stronger action than the K31.

Your question as to quality means nothing when you don't specify what exact rifle it is you're talking about. Mauser 98 in general is way too vague.


Dutch
Link Posted: 11/5/2008 4:17:21 PM EDT
forgive me. this is my first time delving into the c&r realm. looking to pick up a nice useable bolt action
Link Posted: 11/5/2008 5:10:07 PM EDT
The K98 was a proven battle design as to the K31 is not.

The K31 is by far a superior rifle craftsmanship wise and the design itself is way more advanced then the Mauser action.

I love both and we know a lot of actions were based off of the Mauser. The K31 never had it's time to prove itself in battel, but there was a thread on this months and months back and we had some great discussion on this very topic.
Link Posted: 11/5/2008 7:08:32 PM EDT
Originally Posted By haLfLiFe:
The K98 was a proven battle design as to the K31 is not.

The K31 is by far a superior rifle craftsmanship wise and the design itself is way more advanced then the Mauser action.

I love both and we know a lot of actions were based off of the Mauser. The K31 never had it's time to prove itself in battel, but there was a thread on this months and months back and we had some great discussion on this very topic.




Yeah, noone wanted to climb those mountains and then have to fight.
The Swiss are fanatics about weapon design and maintenance. About any K31 you find will be extremely accurate.
The 98k Mauser is, well, a Mauser. It set a standard that is still followed today. The '03, Remington 700 and Winchester 70 are all basically slightly modified mauser actions. It is a very strong well made weapon.

Get both!


Jim
Link Posted: 11/5/2008 8:33:20 PM EDT
Better weapon overall.... K98

K31 is a nice rifle, Accurate/well made but the 98k is a better combat bolt gun.
Link Posted: 11/6/2008 12:37:47 AM EDT
I would take my K31 before any of my mauser's into battle if I had to take a bolt gun. The accuracy of the k31 is far greater than the K98 with milsurp ammo. The straight pull design is fast. It has six round stripper clips compared to the five of a mauser. It is built by the Swiss, ever heard the saying "Built like a Swiss watch"? The only down side is that the ammo cost more for the K31.

Don't get me wrong, I love my mauser's. But, the K31 is a better bolt gun. Not battle tested like the K98, but IMHO a better rifle.

YMMV,

Toad
Link Posted: 11/6/2008 4:31:08 PM EDT
I own a k98 and a k31. They are both excellent rifles. I find, however, that the k31 works much better for me - faster to load and operate the bolt. The sights are also *significantly* better. It is much easier to put 5 rounds in the bullseye with the Swiss rifle than the German one.
Link Posted: 11/7/2008 9:31:17 AM EDT
I own one K98 and six K31s. I won't have to choose one over the other but if i did I'd take the K31 every time. The only Mausers I own with decent triggers are the Swedish M96s and my one M38. The triggers on my K31s are all excellent ant they are far more accurate than I am. I installed a Huber trigger in my K98............wow! what a difference! I haven't had it to the range yet but I'm hoping the new trigger helps my accuracy.
I have several C$R bolt actions and they are just target fun rifles and I don't consider anyone of them to be a battle rifle. I think the current crop of K98s are overpriced and the K31s are headed in that direction. If I were buying my first C$R it would be either a Swedish M96 or the K31.
Link Posted: 11/8/2008 12:23:27 PM EDT
I would take my K-31 into battle over the K98 any day. The K-98 is a great rifle and does have a more "durable" action. However, the K-31 is plenty of durable and very accurate. When I shoot it open sight at 300 yards, it rivals my 2500 dollar AR-10 scoped.
Link Posted: 11/8/2008 6:53:48 PM EDT
You tend to meet many different people at the range and they are more than happy to let you shoot their rifles.

I have shot only about 5 different K31's and about 8 different K98s. In every case, the K31 performed better than the K98.

Now, the K98 has the history that the K31 doesn't have. So are you going to collect or shoot the rifle.
Link Posted: 11/8/2008 7:44:06 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/8/2008 7:47:18 PM EDT by dillonivik]
K98 to K31, I like the K31 better(i own a 1932 K31, a 1940 K98 and a 1912 Carl Gustav). The K31 is just a more refined rifle all around it seems, the actions are smooth and just plain cool. Also the round itself is a work of art just about (the GP11).
As far as the the new Remington Mauser actioned rifles, those are made in Serbia by Zastava.
Link Posted: 11/8/2008 8:53:16 PM EDT
K31 > k98

Fact.
Link Posted: 11/8/2008 9:17:56 PM EDT
I remember an article in Rifle magazine years ago. The writer did a review of the K31.
The GP11 ammo is basically match grade and the rifle was designed around the ammo.
The writer's conclusion was that it was as accurate as his custom weatherby. He said that to have a rifle like that built today would cost around $5,000.00. Keep in mind that back when they were made labor was cheap. They were all handfitted. The wood to metal fit is better than any modern rifle you will find short of a custom rifle.
The trigger is a very good 2 stage, which really helps accuracy. The barrels were freefloated at the factory. Some today have the barrel touching the forestock due to the stock warping slightly over the past 50+ years.
The Swiss still use these in matches there, and they are fanatics about shooting.
The 7.5x55 is ballistically equilavent to a .308 but in a low pressure cartridge.
Watching the bolt work is amazing considering when it was designed. The bolt handle comes straight back with no lift. The bolt itself cams like a semi-auto.
For some reason these aren't as popular as other milsurps. There were only about 500,000 made so they will run out and are already getting scarce. There will be 98ks for a while. get a K31.

Jim

Link Posted: 11/8/2008 9:19:28 PM EDT
Originally Posted By dillonivik:
K98 to K31, I like the K31 better(i own a 1932 K31, a 1940 K98 and a 1912 Carl Gustav). The K31 is just a more refined rifle all around it seems, the actions are smooth and just plain cool. Also the round itself is a work of art just about (the GP11).
As far as the the new Remington Mauser actioned rifles, those are made in Serbia by Zastava.



The GP11 ammo pretty much makes K-31's the way they are. Not only are those rounds pretty much handload quality, but they were non-corrosive, meaning our K-31's have great bores overall. You definitely cannot say the same for surplus era K-98's.
Link Posted: 11/8/2008 9:49:05 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/8/2008 9:54:16 PM EDT by tangeant]
I've shot a few Mausers that are extremely accurate with good handloads particularily Arg 1909's, Swede 1896's, the extremely good GP11 ammo is a great part of the accuracy of K31's..
Link Posted: 11/9/2008 4:17:24 AM EDT
Originally Posted By ns2002:
Originally Posted By dillonivik:
K98 to K31, I like the K31 better(i own a 1932 K31, a 1940 K98 and a 1912 Carl Gustav). The K31 is just a more refined rifle all around it seems, the actions are smooth and just plain cool. Also the round itself is a work of art just about (the GP11).
As far as the the new Remington Mauser actioned rifles, those are made in Serbia by Zastava.



The GP11 ammo pretty much makes K-31's the way they are. Not only are those rounds pretty much handload quality, but they were non-corrosive, meaning our K-31's have great bores overall. You definitely cannot say the same for surplus era K-98's.


Yeah, both of my K31s have fantastic, bright, bores.

In fact, that seems to be the common feature they all share. Every one I have ever inspected has had a fantastic bore.
Link Posted: 11/9/2008 4:38:25 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/9/2008 4:40:44 AM EDT by Bladeswitcher]
Originally Posted By calicojack:
which was the better weapon over all? accuracy, quality, reliablity, etc. the k-98 or the k-31?

Remington makes a newer k-98 currently.




I own five Mausers (three 98's, one 96 and a 95) and two Swiss K-31 rifles. I shoot the Swiss rifles pretty regularly. I rarely take the Mausers to the range. The K31 is more fun to shoot and more accurate. They've got great triggers. The Mauser's 8mm round is too stout for much enjoyable range time, the sights are crude and stock barely lends itself to accurate shooting. But if I were building a custom rifle, I'd start with the 98 action every time.

Does that answer your question? Of course not. You know why? Because it's an invalid comparison. The '98 Mauser is the basis for almost every centerfire bolt action rifle that came after it. It is the quintessential bolt action. The K31 is an odd-ball. It's cool, fun and remarkably accurate. But it's basically a dead end in the development of rifles.

So where does that leave you? In keeping with AR15.com tradition: get both.
Link Posted: 11/9/2008 8:48:10 AM EDT
The only Mauser that is close to my K31 is my Carl Gustav. But again the round has allot to do with it. The Swedes and Norwegians put ALLOT of thought into the 6.5x55, and again that round was never corrosive so the bores havent taken as much abuse. The Germans just wanted to be launching a huge round down range...
Link Posted: 11/9/2008 10:38:39 AM EDT
Actually the <WW2 vintage 6.5x55 ammo was corrosive primed , thats why so many 1896's do have dark bores...
Link Posted: 11/9/2008 10:49:41 AM EDT
Originally Posted By tangeant:
Actually the <WW2 vintage 6.5x55 ammo was corrosive primed , thats why so many 1896's do have dark bores...


I think that was the original 160gr round nose that was mildly corrosive. The 139gr pointed nose bullet isn't. The Swedes did have a unique way of keeping track of the barrel condition. That stock disc, if original to that stock and the stock to the rifle will tell you a lot about the bore.
The Swiss never used corrosive primers and were religeous about cleaning and maintaining their weapons. That is why I have never heard of a K31 with a bad bore.

I have a Swede M38 and a couple of Swiss K31s. All I need now is a Finn M39 to have the whole set. I don't count the Norwegian Krag as part of the set because I will probably never find one.

jim
Link Posted: 11/9/2008 5:32:45 PM EDT
Norwegian Krags are fairly uncommon. I think I've seen more 8mm Danes...

On the stock discs, the # represents the LAST time it was inspected, Just because it is stamped 1 doesn't mean the bore is still mint...People also swap discs. Always inspect bore/muzzle before buying.
Link Posted: 11/20/2008 1:34:03 PM EDT
so what ranges are you all getting out of your k-31s? classicarms has them for $231 hand picked atm. so i'm thinking that's probably the route i'm going to go.

will the k-31 hit accurately out to say 300m? 500m?
Link Posted: 11/20/2008 1:52:46 PM EDT
Originally Posted By calicojack:
will the k-31 hit accurately out to say 300m? 500m?


The gun will but will the shooter? The swiss have a shooting contest/requal for the military/civies and they shoot across canyons.

Soooo.... They may be that accurate.
Link Posted: 11/20/2008 2:21:03 PM EDT
Originally Posted By calicojack:
so what ranges are you all getting out of your k-31s? classicarms has them for $231 hand picked atm. so i'm thinking that's probably the route i'm going to go.

will the k-31 hit accurately out to say 300m? 500m?


If I remember correctly the Swiss matches are all at 300m. They probably shoot further but the 300m match is what they qualify on with the K31.

Jim
Link Posted: 11/20/2008 3:03:18 PM EDT
There are guys all over the net shooting amazing groups at 1,000+ yards with the K31.
Link Posted: 11/20/2008 6:09:50 PM EDT
Originally Posted By haLfLiFe:
There are guys all over the net shooting amazing groups at 1,000+ yards with the K31.


sold. ordering mine this week. any good leads on ammo?
Link Posted: 11/20/2008 6:12:31 PM EDT
ammo should have been the first decision if you are not loading your own the k31 are .50c a round if you can find it.
Link Posted: 11/20/2008 6:12:31 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/20/2008 6:13:44 PM EDT by Python00]
The military ammo i shout was sub "1 at 100 yards good match ammo but its pricey.
Link Posted: 11/21/2008 4:24:32 AM EDT
Originally Posted By calicojack:
Originally Posted By haLfLiFe:
There are guys all over the net shooting amazing groups at 1,000+ yards with the K31.


sold. ordering mine this week. any good leads on ammo?



Graf and sons has GP11 in stock for $4.49/10: http://www.grafs.com/product/187902

Link Posted: 11/21/2008 5:52:24 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Bladeswitcher:
Originally Posted By calicojack:
Originally Posted By haLfLiFe:
There are guys all over the net shooting amazing groups at 1,000+ yards with the K31.


sold. ordering mine this week. any good leads on ammo?



Graf and sons has GP11 in stock for $4.49/10: http://www.grafs.com/product/187902





BIG +1 ..... and only $4.50 shipping and handling no matter how much you order..... just received my second order of one case of 480 rds. and came only to a total of $220.02.... best deal i've seen so far.... will try to get some more if finances permit...
Link Posted: 11/21/2008 12:10:23 PM EDT
Originally Posted By yzryl556:
Originally Posted By Bladeswitcher:
Originally Posted By calicojack:
Originally Posted By haLfLiFe:
There are guys all over the net shooting amazing groups at 1,000+ yards with the K31.


sold. ordering mine this week. any good leads on ammo?



Graf and sons has GP11 in stock for $4.49/10: http://www.grafs.com/product/187902





BIG +1 ..... and only $4.50 shipping and handling no matter how much you order..... just received my second order of one case of 480 rds. and came only to a total of $220.02.... best deal i've seen so far.... will try to get some more if finances permit...




Not bad considering GP11 was $170 for 480 rounds even back in the good old days years ago.

Ratio wise GP11 has gone up less then any other round in the last so many years.
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