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What is the lightest/that will still function round you have loaded for the .223 Rem that will function in a AR platform?
Bullet? Powder? Charge? Etc..... Looking for the lowest velocity obtainable from the 223 Rem round that will function reliably. |
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USA
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Posted: 3/11/2011 10:13:39 AM EST
Originally Posted By BrennanC9093:
What is the lightest/that will still function round you have loaded for the .223 Rem that will function in a AR platform? Bullet? Powder? Charge? Etc..... Looking for the lowest velocity obtainable from the 223 Rem round that will function reliably. That's going to depend highly on the AR in question. I have a friend whose rifle works 100% with any commercial load, yet he has a batch of mid-80's Radway Green that is VERY low powered, and it will short-stroke and fail to pick up a new cartridge every time. Yet, in my rifle, it works fine. So... the only way you'll find the lightest that will work is to try them in YOUR rifle. |
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Posted: 3/11/2011 10:18:59 AM EST
Im looking to handload these rounds, so any reloading data or reciepes is what im looking for. Over the past few months i have shot over 20 different factory loads with no problem...those of course are all loaded "med to high". Just looking for any ideas on how to handload a 223 round that shoots at the lowest velocity possible that wont create to much pressure. Thanks i understand what you mean.
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Posted: 3/11/2011 11:17:04 AM EST
Use a load manual or three. Check the minimum charge weights listed for each bullet.
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USA
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Posted: 3/11/2011 12:33:15 PM EST
Originally Posted By AeroE:
Use a load manual or three. Check the minimum charge weights listed for each bullet. Yeah, that. Pick the lightest bullet that fits your price range, and start with the published loads that produce the lowest velocity. |
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Posted: 3/11/2011 2:03:02 PM EST
What works in one AR might not work in another. Usually bulk 55gr fmj w/ starting loads have worked well for me for blasting ammo.
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Posted: 3/11/2011 2:26:45 PM EST
"LIGHT"...........ok just pick up the manual and go with the loads listed as "starting loads." Know that (because, your rifle is different from someone else) what works in mine MAY NOT work for you.
Then (I'm curious)................. WHY? Aloha, Mark |
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Posted: 3/11/2011 3:58:30 PM EST
The lightest load I have used is 22.4 grains of H335, 55g Hornady FMJ and CCI 450 primer. It would cycle my 14.5 inch M4-gery about 90% of the time. I stepped the charge up to 22.7g and it cycles 100%. Velocity was in the 2400-2500 fps range if memory serves. I quit loading those in favor of 24.0g H335. The 24.0g loads are very accurate for me and I felt I was wasting components loading underpowered, in-accurate ammo.
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Posted: 3/12/2011 9:14:46 AM EST
[Last Edit: 3/12/2011 9:15:23 AM EST by BrennanC9093]
I understand that all guns are not the same....sorry i should have "rephrased" my question. A buddy and i have been looking around for any jacketed bullet loads (doesnt matter weight/ or type) that we could load closely to sub-sonic. After looking yesterday it looks as if cast bullets and pistol powder loads are what we'll have to work with. We're trying to find a load that cycles reliably and shoots at a velocity close to sub sonic as possible......for use in a suppressed gun of course
 . thanks
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Posted: 3/12/2011 9:51:20 AM EST
I don't think shooting a lead bullet through a suppressor would be good. You'll be leaving much more lead deposit in it. Maybe try a heavier grain fmj with the minimum powder. But my logic maybe off.
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NY, USA
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Posted: 3/12/2011 11:44:09 AM EST
[Last Edit: 3/12/2011 11:44:40 AM EST by joedapro]
Originally Posted By BrennanC9093:
What is the lightest/that will still function round you have loaded for the .223 Rem that will function in a AR platform? Bullet? Powder? Charge? Etc..... Looking for the lowest velocity obtainable from the 223 Rem round that will function reliably. 40 grain nosler unique - 8-9 grains rem 7.5 1900 - 2000 fps cycles my colt 6731. very accurate load. |
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Posted: 3/12/2011 11:59:15 AM EST
24.5 grains of H335 under 55 grain FMJ's are VERY light in my 20 inch BCM.
It feels like a .22LR |
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Posted: 3/12/2011 12:28:32 PM EST
Originally Posted By BrennanC9093:
I understand that all guns are not the same....sorry i should have "rephrased" my question. A buddy and i have been looking around for any jacketed bullet loads (doesnt matter weight/ or type) that we could load closely to sub-sonic. After looking yesterday it looks as if cast bullets and pistol powder loads are what we'll have to work with. We're trying to find a load that cycles reliably and shoots at a velocity close to sub sonic as possible......for use in a suppressed gun of course . thanksSubsonic and AR cycling do not go together. There is a variety of loads running at around 1500 to 2000 fps, and I know of one that will cycle a rifle. |
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Posted: 3/12/2011 1:36:38 PM EST
Port pressure usually equates to powder mass (weight). Most starting loads cycle fine. But 8 grains of Blue Dot behind a 30 grain HP won't.
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NV, USA
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Posted: 3/12/2011 6:32:30 PM EST
I don't think you will be able to get subsonic to cycle an AR. That said you need to get below transonic if you want to get rid of the sonic crack. If you are stuck on this run a 77 grain bullet as they will naturally have a lower velocity than the lightweight stuff, and run them at starting powder charges.
Trail boss is known for making safe subsonic loads in 308 and would probably work in 223. It sure won't cycle though. But that is not that big of a deal as it will be quieter that way. |
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Posted: 3/14/2011 5:08:02 AM EST
As was stated above, you wont be able to get to subsonic while still cycling the action.
The lowest possible muzzle velocity that willl cycle the action will come from a very slow powder. This is an important point as most recommended light loads are formed using faster powders. Then again, most recommended light loads originated from folks shooting bolt guns. Slower powders put the shape of the pressure curve to work for you. They give you higher port pressure for a given muzzle velocity. |
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Posted: 3/14/2011 7:18:35 AM EST
Originally Posted By ziebart:
I don't think you will be able to get subsonic to cycle an AR. That said you need to get below transonic if you want to get rid of the sonic crack. If you are stuck on this run a 77 grain bullet as they will naturally have a lower velocity than the lightweight stuff, and run them at starting powder charges. Trail boss is known for making safe subsonic loads in 308 and would probably work in 223. It sure won't cycle though. But that is not that big of a deal as it will be quieter that way. "Below transonic" is subsonic. Period, dot. Eliminating all of the shocks on a bullet requires a speed well below supersonic speeds. The questions are whether it matters, is worth the trade off, or whether a suppressed rifle shooting 5.56X45 ammunition is the right tool for the problem where suppression of muzzle blast and supersonic crack is required. Suppressed firearms are cool to fool with in any case. |
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OH, USA
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Posted: 3/14/2011 7:45:26 AM EST
[Last Edit: 3/14/2011 7:46:12 AM EST by ScottyPotty]
Subsonic .223 and semi auto AR do not go together.
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NV, USA
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Posted: 3/16/2011 11:21:58 AM EST
Originally Posted By AeroE:
Originally Posted By ziebart:
I don't think you will be able to get subsonic to cycle an AR. That said you need to get below transonic if you want to get rid of the sonic crack. If you are stuck on this run a 77 grain bullet as they will naturally have a lower velocity than the lightweight stuff, and run them at starting powder charges. Trail boss is known for making safe subsonic loads in 308 and would probably work in 223. It sure won't cycle though. But that is not that big of a deal as it will be quieter that way. "Below transonic" is subsonic. Period, dot. Eliminating all of the shocks on a bullet requires a speed well below supersonic speeds. The questions are whether it matters, is worth the trade off, or whether a suppressed rifle shooting 5.56X45 ammunition is the right tool for the problem where suppression of muzzle blast and supersonic crack is required. Suppressed firearms are cool to fool with in any case. My word choice was not the best. If you are right on the border of subsonic and supersonic at one altitude/temp it may not be subsonic at a different one. Also you will not get your velocity spread exact, so some will go above and some will be below. I see this with some remington subsonic 22lr ammo. Most of it is subs but every once in a while you will hear a crack. So like AeroE said you need to get well below supersonic speeds to eliminate the shocks on the bullets. Subs in a 223 AR IMHO are for impressing friends on how quite your silencer can be. If you want to use a lot of them a 22lr is more practical. |
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MO, USA
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Posted: 3/16/2011 11:44:20 AM EST
I used 3.3 grains of Titegroup with a 55 grain Hornady FMJ for a subsonic round. It WILL NOT cycle the action. With that said. The novelty wears off pretty quick.
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