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Posted: 10/31/2011 7:30:10 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/1/2011 6:40:42 PM EDT by M35A2Driver]



now for #2 fail

Had an OSW built with rail and they also sent me the standard Para top cover ans a spare part.
This top cover was not shaved like my other DSA Para. With it in this configuration I cant push the top cover all the way in so its non functional
in addition the right side shelf wasnt smoothened and make it hard to put on the receiver

see the difference

Link Posted: 10/31/2011 7:34:14 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 10/31/2011 7:34:58 AM EDT by RDTCU]
They probably didn't bother fitting the spare part. Did you specify that you wanted the original top cover too? Did you tell them that you wanted to be able to use the original top cover on that gun? If the answer is no to either one of those, it's not really their fault as they could have just thrown the extra part in their spare parts bin....
Link Posted: 10/31/2011 8:12:04 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 10/31/2011 8:12:39 AM EDT by M35A2Driver]
I was charged for a complete rifle including the standard cover mount. I was then charged for a rail mount that they put on it. Why would any company give you a part for a complete rifle you paid for that doesnt fit?

If the send you a part for your rifle it should fit period.

Link Posted: 10/31/2011 8:42:14 AM EDT
Originally Posted By M35A2Driver:
I was charged for a complete rifle including the standard cover mount. I was then charged for a rail mount that they put on it. Why would any company give you a part for a complete rifle you paid for that doesnt fit?

If the send you a part for your rifle it should fit period.



They didn't send you a part for your rifle, they sent you the leftovers to do what you want with. If you wanted them to fit it, I'm sure they would have, probably for a small fee. Does the wording of their service description mention anything about modifying take-off parts?
Link Posted: 10/31/2011 9:05:49 AM EDT
that makes no sense


I order a complete rifle and you send with it a part I cant use

Link Posted: 10/31/2011 9:10:11 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 10/31/2011 9:13:00 AM EDT by RDTCU]
Originally Posted By M35A2Driver:
that makes no sense


I order a complete rifle and you send with it a part I cant use



My motorcycle came with a license plate mount that wouldn't fit because it had a different model plate mount already installed.
Doesn't mean I'm going to complain about the extra piece that I'll never need anyway...

If it were me and I were that worried about having a spare cover that fit, I would take the grinder and files to it.
Do you ever forsee the need for an extra top cover on your FAL?

THEY NEVER SAID THAT THEY WOULD MODIFY THE EXTRA COVER TO FIT, did they?
And you never asked, did you?
Did you even expect to get the extra part back?
If you didn't get it back, would you be complaining about it?
Link Posted: 10/31/2011 9:10:41 AM EDT
no good deed goes unpunished
Link Posted: 10/31/2011 9:12:18 AM EDT
Originally Posted By RDTCU:
Originally Posted By M35A2Driver:
I was charged for a complete rifle including the standard cover mount. I was then charged for a rail mount that they put on it. Why would any company give you a part for a complete rifle you paid for that doesnt fit?

If the send you a part for your rifle it should fit period.



They didn't send you a part for your rifle, they sent you the leftovers to do what you want with. If you wanted them to fit it, I'm sure they would have, probably for a small fee. Does the wording of their service description mention anything about modifying take-off parts?


I see them sending the standard cover mount kind of like getting your brakes replaced and then shop that did it giving your old brake pads back. You will never use them...
Link Posted: 10/31/2011 9:29:13 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 10/31/2011 9:29:25 AM EDT by M35A2Driver]
I did put it back on and took the rail off.


So if you order a motorcycle complete with 2 rims and upgrade it by paying for a third you wouldn't expect the original rim to fit? And when you get it people would say well....did you ask them...etc

if I didnt have my other FAL to compare to I wouldnt have known.

Link Posted: 10/31/2011 9:32:56 AM EDT
Originally Posted By M35A2Driver:
I did put it back on and took the rail off.


So if you order a motorcycle complete with 2 rims and upgrade it by paying for a third you wouldn't expect the original rim to fit? And when you get it people would say well....did you ask them...etc

if I didnt have my other FAL to compare to I wouldnt have known.



If you sent in an AR carbine upper with standard handguards and had a 20" bull barrel installed with a free-float rail, would you complain that your carbine handguards don't fit anymore?
Link Posted: 10/31/2011 9:40:12 AM EDT
Looks like it has the nose for a para cut upper. If its not cut for a paratrooper top cover you simply cut the damn thing off to what the non nose looks like.... its not rocket science.
Link Posted: 10/31/2011 9:42:55 AM EDT
Its simple... I ordered a rifle and I expect everything that came with it to work on that rifle especially if I paid a lot of money for it.
Link Posted: 10/31/2011 9:48:11 AM EDT
I have ordered many parts that I had to "fit" to my rifle in order for them to work right. DSA or not still got to do some work with it. Yeah things cost money but I dont expect everything I get that wasn't originally on something (spare parts) to fit perfectly. If I ordered a rifle and it came popped apart because the top cover didn't fit I would complain. But they gave you a spare regular top cover that wasn't on the rifle during shipping. In that case I would expect some hand fitting may be required.
Link Posted: 10/31/2011 12:05:39 PM EDT
Seems to me that the real problem is that DSA sold him a para configured firearm without the properly "para cut" receiver.
Link Posted: 10/31/2011 12:17:00 PM EDT
I didn't think that DSA did the Para cuts.
Link Posted: 10/31/2011 12:39:52 PM EDT
Originally Posted By MRJJ:
I didn't think that DSA did the Para cuts.


They do, I own one. Curious why the OP's Para is not Para-cut...?

Link Posted: 10/31/2011 12:45:16 PM EDT
Your other -1 is irrelevant because it is an absolute FAIL on your part. You removed a scope rail and then reinstalled it and expected it to hold zero (illogical).

This -1 is confusing...did you ever contact them and ask for a resolution? You don't mention that.

Link Posted: 10/31/2011 2:05:59 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 10/31/2011 2:14:15 PM EDT by M35A2Driver]
they didnt give me anything
the cover was part of the original weapon and should fit
this is oversight on their part
Link Posted: 10/31/2011 2:50:38 PM EDT
Was it shipped on the rifle?
Link Posted: 10/31/2011 4:12:45 PM EDT
Originally Posted By M35A2Driver:
they didnt give me anything
the cover was part of the original weapon and should fit
this is oversight on their part


Unless you told them and paid them to modify TWO covers you don't have a leg to stand on.
Link Posted: 10/31/2011 5:41:08 PM EDT
Originally Posted By RDTCU:
Originally Posted By M35A2Driver:
they didnt give me anything
the cover was part of the original weapon and should fit
this is oversight on their part


Unless you told them and paid them to modify TWO covers you don't have a leg to stand on.


what are you talking about!?

I paid for a complete rifle and an additional rail
doesnt matter what they put on it
all the parts should fit the rifle
Link Posted: 10/31/2011 6:08:56 PM EDT
I need a para top cover, I'll cut the nose no problem, if you want to sell it, let me know.
Link Posted: 10/31/2011 6:18:47 PM EDT
Originally Posted By M35A2Driver:
Originally Posted By RDTCU:
Originally Posted By M35A2Driver:
they didnt give me anything
the cover was part of the original weapon and should fit
this is oversight on their part


Unless you told them and paid them to modify TWO covers you don't have a leg to stand on.


what are you talking about!?

I paid for a complete rifle and an additional rail
doesnt matter what they put on it
all the parts should fit the rifle


Did you pay them to install the rail? Could you use the original cover with the rail installed?
It just seems to me you're LOOKING for something to gripe about.
Mod it yourself, surely you can handle that, or sell it.
Link Posted: 10/31/2011 6:18:51 PM EDT
I already cut it and put it back on my rifle
I took off the rail
it wasnt hard to do but it should have been done by the factory since it was for this rifle
and if I didnt have one to check it against I might not have figured out what to do
Link Posted: 10/31/2011 6:23:31 PM EDT
Originally Posted By RDTCU:
Originally Posted By M35A2Driver:
they didnt give me anything
the cover was part of the original weapon and should fit
this is oversight on their part


Unless you told them and paid them to modify TWO covers you don't have a leg to stand on.


Link Posted: 10/31/2011 9:30:09 PM EDT
Originally Posted By M35A2Driver:
I already cut it and put it back on my rifle
I took off the rail
it wasnt hard to do but it should have been done by the factory since it was for this rifle
and if I didnt have one to check it against I might not have figured out what to do


If you didn't have one to check it against, you wouldn't have had a complete rifle, which WOULD be a reason to be upset.
Link Posted: 11/1/2011 4:50:37 AM EDT
Ok for the S L O W PEOPLE...

I had a DSA Para that I picked up a short time ago...not purchased from DSA
I ordered another PARA from DSA directly - complete rifle. I also ordered the rail which they put on the rifle. The standard cover that is part of the rifle I already paid for came with it. It was not at the kindness of DSA to send me an extra part. It was a part of the original rifle and is mine with the purchase. They gave me a part for a rifle they built that didn't fit. Although its not hard to fix I would not have known unless I had my other para to compare it to.
Link Posted: 11/1/2011 5:19:37 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/1/2011 5:22:00 AM EDT by deltaheavy]
Originally Posted By M35A2Driver:

I ordered another PARA from DSA directly - complete rifle.


I'm with you up to this point: why did you accept a Para rifle without a Para cut receiver in the first place?
The unmodified top cover should fit a rifle that was ordered as a Para. Dot period.
Unless this is a step DSA started skipping recently, in which case I'd raise hell.
In my mind, the question should not be why was the cover unmodified.
To me, the question is why is modification necessary at all??

ETA pertinent quote.
Link Posted: 11/1/2011 6:18:58 AM EDT
Did you call them and ask about the issue before this (2nd and probably unecessary) complaint thread?
Link Posted: 11/1/2011 6:37:19 AM EDT
Originally Posted By deltaheavy:
Originally Posted By M35A2Driver:

I ordered another PARA from DSA directly - complete rifle.


I'm with you up to this point: why did you accept a Para rifle without a Para cut receiver in the first place?
The unmodified top cover should fit a rifle that was ordered as a Para. Dot period.
Unless this is a step DSA started skipping recently, in which case I'd raise hell.
In my mind, the question should not be why was the cover unmodified.
To me, the question is why is modification necessary at all??

ETA pertinent quote.


+1

If the upper had the proper para relief cut made then that top cover should have fit as is. Since it doesn't it would seem that DSA didn't make the cut at all. Can you post a pic of the receiver in that area? If it's not cut, then that's what I'd be pissed about.
Link Posted: 11/1/2011 9:22:11 AM EDT
Originally Posted By M35A2Driver:
I had a DSA Para that I picked up a short time ago...not purchased from DSA


OP, this other "Para" sounds like a standard FAL that was converted to Para-config.
Whether DSA or the previous owner did the conversion, it's still not a "true" Para model.
Neither is the new rifle which is the source of your current frustration.
The modified top covers (such as yours) allow the use of Para parts with a standard FAL upper receiver.
I'm hesitant to call this method "half-assed" since it obviously works, but resale on a true Para model is higher.
No jacking around with modded parts; pretty much any FN-spec Para parts are interchangeable, etc.
It would be advisable to contact DSA directly and inquire what they will do to make this right for you.
In my opinion, if you ordered a Para directly from DSA, it should have been Para-cut unless specifically stated otherwise.
Shipping it back on their dime for the relief cut would not be unreasonable from where I'm standing.
There's really nothing to say about the other converted FAL, since it sounds like you purchased it second-hand.
Best of luck.
Link Posted: 11/1/2011 11:08:43 AM EDT
I just got off the phone with Nicki (customer service mgr) (847) 277-7258 . She told me that "all Para receivers need the nose cut off."
Link Posted: 11/1/2011 11:16:23 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/1/2011 11:18:35 AM EDT by DRich]
Originally Posted By M35A2Driver:
I just got off the phone with Nicki (customer service mgr) (847) 277-7258 . She told me that "all Para receivers need the nose cut off."


I think you mean para receiver covers need the nose trimmed. But only if the receiver itself doesn't have the proper para cut to begin with.

None of my paras have the cut, but all mine started off as standard rifles.
Link Posted: 11/1/2011 12:41:36 PM EDT
Originally Posted By M35A2Driver:
I just got off the phone with Nicki (customer service mgr) (847) 277-7258 . She told me that "all Para receivers need the nose cut off."


You might call her back and ask why then is there a nose in the first place.
When I get home, I'll take a picture of what your receiver should look like.


Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile
Link Posted: 11/1/2011 12:42:12 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/1/2011 12:43:32 PM EDT by deltaheavy]
First ever double tap.


Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile
Link Posted: 11/1/2011 12:45:17 PM EDT
She also said "your talking with DSA so don't listen to people on line." Her words not mine. Let say she seemed very confident
Link Posted: 11/1/2011 1:03:08 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/1/2011 1:23:40 PM EDT by AEnemaBay]
Originally Posted By M35A2Driver:
I just got off the phone with Nicki (customer service mgr) (847) 277-7258 . She told me that "all Para receivers need the nose cut off."


Wow, I guess DSA knows more than the Belgians that designed the thing.



ETA: Does your receiver have this circular cut in it (the first picture is cut to depth according to FN spec which was always on the loose side, so it's deeper than the second one):





Also, here's a factory Argentine Para nose top cover (doesn't look ground on or modified to me):
Link Posted: 11/1/2011 1:14:12 PM EDT
Originally Posted By deltaheavy:
Originally Posted By M35A2Driver:
I just got off the phone with Nicki (customer service mgr) (847) 277-7258 . She told me that "all Para receivers need the nose cut off."


You might call her back and ask why then is there a nose in the first place.

When I get home, I'll take a picture of what your receiver should look like.


Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile


+1

On that note ask why they offer top covers with or without a nose. Wouldn't it be easier to just offer covers without a nose if they all need to be cut off?
Link Posted: 11/1/2011 1:20:25 PM EDT
I don't understand why folks would use a cover without the nose. the nose is there for a purpose. its there to hold any upward pressure from the springs recoiling.
Link Posted: 11/1/2011 2:12:07 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Wash-Ar15:
I don't understand why folks would use a cover without the nose. the nose is there for a purpose. its there to hold any upward pressure from the springs recoiling.


If your receiver doesn't have a para cut, the "nose" prevents the cover from fitting.
Link Posted: 11/1/2011 2:18:04 PM EDT
Originally Posted By DRich:
Originally Posted By Wash-Ar15:
I don't understand why folks would use a cover without the nose. the nose is there for a purpose. its there to hold any upward pressure from the springs recoiling.


If your receiver doesn't have a para cut, the "nose" prevents the cover from fitting.



tell that to DSA

they are telling me that you guys dont know what youre talking about

Link Posted: 11/1/2011 3:35:50 PM EDT
So does your new DSA para have the cut pictured above or not?
Link Posted: 11/1/2011 4:17:14 PM EDT
have to wait until my wife brings it to me this weekend since its at my other home but when I put the cover on before it was cut it stuck out past the back of the receiver
Link Posted: 11/1/2011 4:17:38 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/1/2011 4:18:59 PM EDT by boarklr]
Originally Posted By M35A2Driver:
I just got off the phone with Nicki (customer service mgr) (847) 277-7258 . She told me that "all Para receivers need the nose cut off."


Not technical, but I have to add....I spoke to Nicki a couple of times when I ordered my FAL....sexiest voice on the phone I've ever heard. No disrespect to her, but I was wowed!

My FAL runs and looks great and I'm very satisfied. I'd buy again....especially if I could listen to her again....
Link Posted: 11/1/2011 5:14:46 PM EDT
Originally Posted By M35A2Driver:

tell that to DSA

they are telling me that you guys dont know what youre talking about



Yep, not a clue what I'm talking about.









You might notice the logo on the receiver, not exactly an IMBEL or a Coonan or an Entreprise or whatever.
Intact park inside the machined cut, indicating it came this way, not machined later.
I'm the original owner. This carbine was ordered directly from DSA in 2008.
Link Posted: 11/1/2011 6:43:49 PM EDT
Originally Posted By deltaheavy:
Originally Posted By M35A2Driver:

tell that to DSA

they are telling me that you guys dont know what youre talking about



Yep, not a clue what I'm talking about.

http://www.hunt101.com/data/500/medium/DSA_Para_001.jpg

http://www.hunt101.com/data/500/medium/DSA_Para_005.jpg

http://www.hunt101.com/data/500/medium/DSA_Para_003.jpg

http://www.hunt101.com/data/500/medium/DSA_Para_004.jpg

You might notice the logo on the receiver, not exactly an IMBEL or a Coonan or an Entreprise or whatever.
Intact park inside the machined cut, indicating it came this way, not machined later.
I'm the original owner. This carbine was ordered directly from DSA in 2008.


Someone please give her a call and ask her...this is what she told me.
Link Posted: 11/1/2011 9:27:05 PM EDT
Originally Posted By M35A2Driver:
they didnt give me anything
the cover was part of the original weapon and should fit
this is oversight on their part


This 'issue' of yours would be 5, maybe 10 minutes to fix. Tops.
Link Posted: 11/1/2011 9:33:47 PM EDT
Originally Posted By M35A2Driver:
Originally Posted By RDTCU:
Originally Posted By M35A2Driver:
they didnt give me anything
the cover was part of the original weapon and should fit
this is oversight on their part


Unless you told them and paid them to modify TWO covers you don't have a leg to stand on.


what are you talking about!?

I paid for a complete rifle and an additional rail
doesnt matter what they put on it
all the parts should fit the rifle


YOU paid for a rifle AND some parts.

Its your assumption that they should fit THAT rifle.
DSA sells a number of rifles in different configurations.
FAL buyers often have more than one FAL. Usually in different configurations.

So, did you ask, specifically, for additional parts for THAT rifle? Or did you also just order parts?

Link Posted: 11/1/2011 10:39:01 PM EDT
Anything that comes with the rifle OP ordered from DSA should already be a perfect fit. I could see if it was a part he ordered separately, but that top cover came with the gun. The other post was a derp move on OP's part, since there is no need to remove the mount, but he's right on this.
Link Posted: 11/2/2011 3:56:45 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Michael64:
Originally Posted By M35A2Driver:
Originally Posted By RDTCU:
Originally Posted By M35A2Driver:
they didnt give me anything
the cover was part of the original weapon and should fit
this is oversight on their part


Unless you told them and paid them to modify TWO covers you don't have a leg to stand on.


what are you talking about!?

I paid for a complete rifle and an additional rail
doesnt matter what they put on it
all the parts should fit the rifle


YOU paid for a rifle AND some parts.

Its your assumption that they should fit THAT rifle.
DSA sells a number of rifles in different configurations.
FAL buyers often have more than one FAL. Usually in different configurations.

So, did you ask, specifically, for additional parts for THAT rifle? Or did you also just order parts?



NO! I paid for a complete rifle and and additional rail

DSA admitted that it should have come with the proper fitting part
they also wanted me to return the part on their dime
so as far as this issue goes I'm correct

and it didnt take much time to fix but it when youre paying top dollar for quality work you should expect the right parts

as far as the rail thats my bad for not looking more into it
as far as the mags not working thats on them

I think these are valid points that others should be aware of
Link Posted: 11/2/2011 4:40:59 AM EDT
Originally Posted By M35A2Driver:
NO! I paid for a complete rifle and and additional rail

DSA admitted that it should have come with the proper fitting part
they also wanted me to return the part on their dime


So regardless of who's right and who's wrong on this, you started a bitch thread before you even called DSA to see what they would do to make it right?
And lo and behold, they're fixing it on their dime.
If you had called them in the first place instead of whining here, I bet your new or fixed part would have been in your hands a few days sooner.

There is no way I could be in customer service, my head would explode.
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