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7/8/2020 3:01:36 PM
Posted: 10/6/2005 3:20:53 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 10/6/2005 3:20:53 PM EDT by new-arguy]
I am looking to purchase a 308 rifle. Of course I would love an AR-10, but I can't afford one right now.
I am torn between a CETME and a SAIGA. Since I have never shot either I would like some feedback on both.
I could ask this same question on the CETME website and the SAIGA website, but you know the answer will be biased.

As for me, I found that both are close in price, the CETME offers inexpensive hi-cap mags, the SAIGA offers very expensive and hard to get low-cap mags, the CETME looks better to me (even though a dressed up SAIGA can look decent),  and the CETME from what I read has more reliability issues.

Any additional pros and cons  to help me decide would be greatly appreciated.
Primary usage for this weapon will be target hunting and occasional terrorist hunting

Thanks,
Mike
Link Posted: 10/4/2005 10:59:40 AM EDT
i can only speak from the one experience ive had w/ a CETME, and it was a jam-o-matic, constant feed problems.
Link Posted: 10/4/2005 11:03:04 AM EDT
Tag. Also looking at dragonovs here...

-Foxxz
Link Posted: 10/4/2005 12:02:31 PM EDT
Pardon me, but asking for an unbiased OPINION, is kind of like asking for a sexually proficient virgin. It ain't possible

I don't have an opinion about either piece, because my unbiased attitude is a result of zero experience w/either piece.

If I ever develop an opinion about either or both, it'll be because I've had experience w/them  and therefor have developed a bias.
Link Posted: 10/4/2005 12:35:57 PM EDT
Link Posted: 10/4/2005 12:47:59 PM EDT
Love my Cetme sporter except for the trigger and that will be remedied soon.  No failures except surplus ammo failures.  Saiga in .308 as I understand have thin barrels, once they heat up they are no longer consistently accurate, other than that I wanted a pistol grip, which is why I went Cetme.  Century arms makes workable guns just some need a hair of tinkering for smoother operation, all mine run great.  
Link Posted: 10/4/2005 1:35:08 PM EDT
my cetme is accurate and reliable.  Recoil was greatly increased after ditching the century muzzle brake.  The only problem I have is the damn trigger let's off a couple of doubles now and again even after a bill springfield trigger job...
Link Posted: 10/4/2005 2:01:40 PM EDT
Thanks for the input. I guess it is like anything else. It seems like it may be hit or miss (no pun intended) with the CETME.
Link Posted: 10/4/2005 3:10:56 PM EDT
What does this have to do with AR15 uppers and lowers?
Link Posted: 10/4/2005 3:55:21 PM EDT
I had a CETME.




RUN!  RUN AWAY!    If you want that style, save up for a JLD 91.  Ive heard great things about them.


- BG
Link Posted: 10/4/2005 4:00:11 PM EDT
Just get an FAL.  Save your money and get the best first.
Link Posted: 10/5/2005 6:06:07 AM EDT
I have a cetme and a cetme sometimes gun, Both bought same day one works like no tommorow the other might as well be a single shot. 2 times sent to the gun shop jam jam jam, but the other is a sweet rifle. I dont get it maybe I was blessed with a lemon? but from experience alot of gun mfg let lemons slip through even well known brands
Link Posted: 10/5/2005 6:27:36 AM EDT
Excuse me, but is this the CETME and Saiga forum?
Link Posted: 10/6/2005 4:28:54 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Va_Dinger:
Excuse me, but is this the CETME and Saiga forum?





Originally Posted By DevL:
What does this have to do with AR15 uppers and lowers?




Hey, looks like you both missed the point of my thread.

Va_Dinger: How do you think someone on a CETME forum would answer my question?

DevL: This forum is titled "rifles, uppers, lowers, barrels, & more". While my question is not AR15 related, I could fine no other forum on this site that I felt would get me an answer. I own an AR. I have owned other rifles and pistols also. I wouldn't mind giving my opinion on my other firearms if someone on this site asked me. Also I noticed that I am a Team Member and you are not. That means I spent money to help fund and keep this board going. YOU'RE WELCOME

I felt I could ask my fellow ARFCOMMERs this question. Sorry if this took up valuable forum space, but you know what, I got the answer I was looking for. I appreciate those who took the time to answer my question.

Thanks,
Mike

Link Posted: 10/6/2005 4:41:31 AM EDT
A friend of mine bought a CETME a few years back and it was ok.  He was in the same situation.  He said he wished he would have just saved his money until he could afford the AR-10.
Link Posted: 10/6/2005 4:50:23 AM EDT
Doesn't the CETME's by Century Arms have that giant welding mark on the Bbl?
Link Posted: 10/6/2005 5:06:22 AM EDT
Your question belongs in the armory section NOT the AR15 section.  If you are a team member you could have searched the armory section to find opinions of those weapons.
Link Posted: 10/6/2005 5:08:02 AM EDT

Originally Posted By DevL:
Your question belongs in the armory section NOT the AR15 section.  If you are a team member you could have searched the armory section to find opinions of those weapons.



Exactly.
Link Posted: 10/6/2005 5:10:55 AM EDT

Originally Posted By DevL:
Your question belongs in the armory section NOT the AR15 section.  If you are a team member you could have searched the armory section to find opinions of those weapons.



Look whose talkin 7500 posts and not a team member
Link Posted: 10/6/2005 5:37:20 AM EDT

Originally Posted By DevL:
Your question belongs in the armory section NOT the AR15 section.  If you are a team member you could have searched the armory section to find opinions of those weapons.




Hmmm, with over 7500 posts I guess you would know better me where to post this. You could have kindly told me that I would get more response posting there. Or you could have just asked a moderator to have my thread moved. Either option would be more noble.

But that's why I love this website. There are many people that are willing to help out others and then there's YOU.
Link Posted: 10/6/2005 5:45:02 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 10/6/2005 5:51:14 AM EDT by turbomike]
Wait, I just found this. It proves what I thought.

http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=1&f=130&t=396484


Link Posted: 10/6/2005 11:38:22 AM EDT
My short take.......

Saiga= Brand new production gun, good QC, very reliable action ( Please don't use that to start a pissing match!)  BUT...no factory hi-cap mags......but are convertable

CETME=  Surplus parts kit built on sometimes questionable receivers by a volume based production facility. Hit and miss on wether you get a reliable gun. Factory Hi-cap mags, redily available.

Seen some guys swear by their CETME's....others swear about them....I have yet to see a bad word on a Saiga....
Link Posted: 10/6/2005 3:18:34 PM EDT
Link Posted: 10/6/2005 3:20:18 PM EDT
Link Posted: 10/6/2005 4:57:49 PM EDT
Get the saiga for AK reliability. Cross your fingers for higher cap mags or mod one yourself.


Link Posted: 10/6/2005 9:46:00 PM EDT
I vote for...
<­BR>

M1A Scout/Squad/Bush series.
Link Posted: 10/7/2005 10:31:58 AM EDT
I had a cetme, honestly i diddnt like it, too heavy, jammed alot.
Link Posted: 10/7/2005 3:14:03 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 10/11/2005 7:13:16 AM EDT by turbomike]
Thanks for all the feedback. I appreciate it.


Link Posted: 10/7/2005 3:17:55 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 10/11/2005 7:16:22 AM EDT by turbomike]

Link Posted: 10/7/2005 3:19:57 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 10/11/2005 7:16:42 AM EDT by turbomike]
Link Posted: 10/7/2005 6:00:12 PM EDT
Ok Im confused. Was this thread originally in the AR15 forums or did you post it here in the armory forum?
Link Posted: 10/7/2005 7:13:06 PM EDT

Originally Posted By JTAC_Supply:
I haven't owned the Saiga yet, but I've owned the CETME.  My Cetme was very reliable, very accurate for a battle rifle.  However, I like optics and the Cetme is not an ideal mounting platform, or even close to it :)  Unfortunately they are kind of hit or miss I think, I got a good one but sold it due to the scope mounting issue.

J



+1 to what he said, minus the optics comment . Never tried them. The iron sights work great for me.

I have never, ever had a jam and that is shooting all kinds of cheap Indian,Port, handloads etc. It shoots everybit as good as my M1A and magazines are CHEAP. I bought 40 of them for 1.97
each.

Buy one where they have a return policy. try it, if it fails in any way return for another, Like J says it is hit and miss. I love mine. I will NEVER sell it.
Link Posted: 10/8/2005 2:22:12 PM EDT
Link Posted: 10/8/2005 6:46:28 PM EDT

Originally Posted By new-arguy:

Originally Posted By JohnnyMcEldoo:
Ok Im confused. Was this thread originally in the AR15 forums or did you post it here in the armory forum?



Yeah, it was initially in AR Discussion, I moved it to the armory right after my last post to this thread.




Ah, it all makes sense now!
Link Posted: 10/9/2005 5:20:10 AM EDT
My CETME had a few problems at first, ejector needed to be adjusted and so did the extractor. After those issues were fixed it has been quite reliable.
Can't tell you about the .308 Saiga, my .223 Saiga has been dead on reliable and fairly accurate.
Oh yeah, the CETME is very accurate, far more accurate than I thought would be possible.
Link Posted: 10/9/2005 7:06:37 AM EDT
You might want to check out www.cetmerifles.com if you haven't already.  Forums are a great place to find out what types of things to check out like boltgap and such.
Link Posted: 10/9/2005 7:57:21 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 10/9/2005 7:58:23 AM EDT by legonas]
my .308 saiga was awsome after i converted it. i droped on a harris bipod as well. FORGET fancy sights. once i took the fucking scope off i was so much more accurate with the iron sights its not even funny. way more fun to shoot as well. only problem was the 8rnd mags. i sold it VERY cheaply to my best friend for his birthday and went and got a FAL instead. still a gas piston operating system but cheap 20rnd mags. and i love wood stocks, hard to get a good full wood stockset on a .308 saiga, but my FAL will have one.

why not a CAI FAL for around 450-500ish? to high? i would go with the CETME if i had a choice, CAI DOES make a good gun if your willing to work on it. i have 2 CAI's with no problems after a little DIY work.
Link Posted: 10/9/2005 7:59:06 AM EDT
It's easier to get Cetme parts and extras than
Saiga stuff.

I've heard Saigas are great shooters,but I've personnally
never seen one at a range.

Plenty of Cetmes though.

A correctly manufactured Cetme is a surprisingly accurate rifle
for the money.
Link Posted: 10/9/2005 1:09:23 PM EDT
Cetme's truly are a hit or miss.  The gunshop that I smithed' at sold them, and about 30-40% of the time they were brought back because of malfunctions.  If I were to buy one I would insist on shooting at least 10 mags through it.

I don't have any input on the Saiga, except that I have never had to work on one.


Balming
Link Posted: 10/9/2005 5:41:14 PM EDT
Again, thanks for the info.

Does someone have an idea as to the cost involved in getting a Cetme to function properly if I decide to buy one and get stuck with a jammer?
Link Posted: 10/10/2005 6:28:19 AM EDT
Your costs would depend on what was wrong with it ,
if you get a jammer.

The Cetme shares many parts with the HK G3/HK-91 .

Most HK smiths will work on it if something major is wrong with it.

Unless the barrel is misspressed ,or the receiver and trunnion
aren't welded together squarely,you can usually fix what's
wrong with a Cetme yourself.
Either by examining the problem and replacing the parts,or
just go to an HK or Cetme forum and ask those guys.
Most often the malfunctioned part is under $20 ,
$50 if you have to replace the bolt.

The cost of actually building a Cetme/HK from a parts kit is
often around $200-$300 ,excluding your finish.

Repairing it from being built should be less than that ,unless a
major part needs replaced.(Such as barrel,receiver ,trunnion)
As long as you check the barrel prior to purchase,it should be good.
These major components can be dismantled and reassembled several times
before they would need to be replaced.(Barrel can be turned up to 3 times )
Mismanufactured parts do happen,but it's rare.

If you plan on buying a new Cetme ,unless you have one to look over at
a store ,I'd buy it from Atlantic Firearms.
I purchased  a different rifle from Atlantic ,and the manufacturer gave
me the run around on fixing it.
Blaine (President at Atlantic) gave me the option of putting the cash from the
purchase towards another ,or trading for another of the same rifle.
Blaine covered for the manufacturer to  help out a customer ,at a cost to him.
Since then if I don't buy a rifle at a gunshow or store out of impulse ,it's from Atlantic.

Arfcommers get a discount there as well.
Link Posted: 10/11/2005 4:27:10 AM EDT
My CETMEs a total POS. I took it to the range sunday and got 4 shots off then it started jamming every round. I was useing  our very own milsurp ammo so I dont think it was an ammo issue. Some day I will try and work out its issues. It rots in the safe for now.
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