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1/22/2020 12:12:56 PM
Posted: 11/11/2012 2:25:57 PM EST
[Last Edit: 11/11/2012 3:44:34 PM EST by NapeSticksToKids]
ok, so i googled winchester model 1894 scope mount and i got confused real quick. i see all different kinds of 94's in google images under this search, but when i go to the 1894 wiki page there isn't much detailing different variants.

i deer hunt with a 1894 30-30, it has open sights on it right now and always has (nothing is new/changed on it), but my dad has offered to buy me a scope for it if i want one on it. so i am trying to get information on what kind of mount i need or if it is feasible.

its build date is 1912.
Link Posted: 11/11/2012 3:04:02 PM EST
[Last Edit: 11/11/2012 3:08:31 PM EST by 50-140]
There is a Warne Weaver side scope mount made to work with pre 63 model 94's.
Bownells and Midway are backorder, these folks have them in stock. They are used in conjunction with the side mount rings (in the same link)
I personally don't know any more information than the link gives, I had entertained the idea of scoping my pre 63, but that's as far as it went.



ETA corrected.
Link Posted: 11/11/2012 3:15:42 PM EST
[Last Edit: 11/11/2012 3:32:14 PM EST by Casper507]
Could just get peep sight and call it good.
Probably Skinner version.
IIRC many newer 94s come ready for a Lyman micro adjustable sights to be mounted on the side of the reciever.
Link Posted: 11/11/2012 3:16:37 PM EST
oops i gave you the wrong date, its a 1912.
Link Posted: 11/11/2012 3:18:53 PM EST
Originally Posted By Casper507:
Peep sight and call it good.
Probably Skinner version.
IIRC many newer 94s come ready for a Lyman micro adjustable sights to be mounted on the side of the reciever.


tell me more of this peep sight. if i hunt with the 94 it's for deer, and if im hunting deer with a 94 its usually in Minnesota where it's pretty thick brush where we hunt. thats why i never thought of a scope until now. now we are hunting on some land of a friend's in PA where there is some good open sight lines where the stands are. the v-notched sights that are on there now are a bit of a strain for my eyes. (i'm only 25 but still, my eyes suck).
Link Posted: 11/11/2012 3:37:49 PM EST
[Last Edit: 11/11/2012 3:38:06 PM EST by NapeSticksToKids]
ok after some googles i have found that i do NOT have the required holes drilled in the side of the receiver because this is such an old rifle.

this rifle holds too much sentimental value for me to go drilling and tapping in the receiver, so are there any other options?

pic:



Link Posted: 11/11/2012 4:12:24 PM EST
[Last Edit: 11/11/2012 4:29:33 PM EST by Casper507]
Originally Posted By NapeSticksToKids:
Originally Posted By Casper507:
Peep sight and call it good.
Probably Skinner version.
IIRC many newer 94s come ready for a Lyman micro adjustable sights to be mounted on the side of the reciever.


tell me more of this peep sight. if i hunt with the 94 it's for deer, and if im hunting deer with a 94 its usually in Minnesota where it's pretty thick brush where we hunt. thats why i never thought of a scope until now. now we are hunting on some land of a friend's in PA where there is some good open sight lines where the stands are. the v-notched sights that are on there now are a bit of a strain for my eyes. (i'm only 25 but still, my eyes suck).


Skinnersights.com
EDIT: Patience, I'm on dial up here. Go to Skinnersights.com and look at the barrel mounted version. The brass one will get patina to look like old brass.
Something like vinegar may help it to age a little quicker. I'm not sure.

Your buckhorn doesn't look like it would have the little insert with the notch on one side and u on the other and white diamond on the face of it so the other cheap option probably won't work. Buffaloe Sights Big concentric circle peep sight could be an option.


From their home page:
Here is some information on sighting errors as put forth by no less than, Col.Townsend Whelen, in his book on reloading, "Why Not Load Your Own," published in 1949 when the use of telescopic sights was a rarity. With normal eyesight, either naturally or corrected by glasses, he found that the following list applied at a distance of 100 yards:

Open Rear Sight: Accuracy is unpredictable due to lighting conditions (shoots away from side lighting, and high for overhead mid-day conditions).
Aperture Rear, Gold or Ivory bead front: 1.5 -2"
Aperture Rear, Black Post front: 1"
Aperture Rear, Aperture front: 1/2 to 3/4"
2-1/2x Scope: 1/4-1/2"
6x Scope: 1/8" to 1/4"
10x Scope: 1/16" to 1/8"
20x Scope: Practically None.
As you can see from the information above, the ability to sight using a aperture sight exceeds the accuracy of most rifles.
They have a receiver mounted version for Mossberg 94 IIRC. For Winchester they have a simple vertically adjusted peep that goes in the dovetail of the rear sight. I really like the brass one and think it would look good with a nice age patina.

If you have rear semi-buckhorn with the little white diamond insert that has a tiny set screw you can get a insert that is a small piece of blued sheet metal with a peep sight that will sit in the semi-buckhorn sight. I have one for my Taurus Lightning but haven’t gotten out to test it extensively. If your rifle already has that kind of sight the insert would be a dirt cheap fix to try if you can find one. If you have an AR with afull rail just mount the rear sight about nine inches ahead and see if you like the long eye relief peep. It won't have a very long sight radius that way but it is just to see if you want to spend the money on skinner.

Lyman-and probably one or two other companies have made peep sights that attach on the left side of the receiver. Some have micro-adjustment clicks and others are just slide and tighten with reference lines for adjustment. I’ve seen the same type of setup on 1903s that were sporterized.

There are also a couple types of tang mounted peep sights that give a long sight radius but I wouldn’t think that extra part on the wrist of the stock would get in the way.


XS Sights has a Scout rail that will work on some 94s if the dovetail is 4” down the barrel IIRC.
Link Posted: 11/11/2012 10:25:13 PM EST
[Last Edit: 11/11/2012 10:26:10 PM EST by Tim_the_enchanter]
If you must hunt with a .30-30, and iron sights aren't doing it for you anymore, get a Marlin. You've got a 100 year old Saddle Ring Carbine for Christ's sake.

Edit;

More Pics, please.
Link Posted: 11/12/2012 5:47:01 AM EST
[Last Edit: 11/12/2012 6:00:58 AM EST by DakotaFAL]
Good call on the "don't tap the receiver" decision. I've never been a fan of side mounted receiver sights or scope mounts on vintage 94's. Few things will kill their value faster.

The good news is that it appears there is a screw on the upper portion of your tang, and if that's the case, then it's been drilled and tapped for a tang sight.

In that case you have 2 very good sight options that won't alter the carbine and will let you re-store it to original condition later as both sights use the stock retention screw at the rear of the tang (with a longer screw) and the smaller hole in the front of the tang.

The Lyman Number 2:





And the Marbles 99101 tang sight (with 995003 screw set):





The Lyman is a reproduction of the vintage Lyman No 2 and is probably more correct for the rifle and offers easy 1/2 minute click elevation adjustments with a lock screw. You can also find original Lyman No 2 sights on e-bay, and that may give you an option to go with a useable sight that matches the wear and patina on your carbine.

The Marbles sight has a similar elevation adjustment and also has a windage adjustment on the rear sight, so there is no need to drift adjust the front sight. For overall shootability, I prefer the Marbles, but they are very close, and if you don't routinely make windage adjustments, it's a toss up.

Both offer 3 different aperture interchangeable aperture options, as well as the no aperture installed ghost ring option.

Personally, I am opposed to scoping a Model 94 as it really ruins the balance and feel of the carbine. The tang site works well as it limits the amount of light reaching the eye, increases depth of field and only requires focus on the front sight, as the eye naturally centers the front sight in the rear aperture. It's also a lot more precise than the barrel mounted sights on '94.

I use contacts to correct my 20/600 vision to 20/20, and for the last few years I've used reading glasses, yet I still shoot tang sight equipped rifles very well.

I zero both my .30-30 and .375 Win at 200 yards. That leaves them shooting about 3" high at 50 yards, 4.5" high at 100 yards, 3.5" high at 150 yards and 5" low at 240 yards - about as far as you want to hunt with either cartridge. The advantage of this is that it leaves you holding slightly under at all ranges out to 200 yards, so the front bead never obscures the target out to 200 yards.
Link Posted: 11/12/2012 6:32:51 AM EST
Casper, thanks for the info, as for the receiver mounted peep sights I can't do that since my receiver doesn't have the mounting holes.

Really liking the tang peep sights, I think I'll get a set of marbles since they have windage, and the open sights on the rifle are marbles so yeah.

I posted some more pics in the pic thread.
Link Posted: 11/12/2012 4:54:34 PM EST
the skinners won't work either, would need to drill and tap holes for them as well.

ordered a marbles tang peep sight from midway, should be here thursday. pretty excited, i hope it fits with no mods needed.
Link Posted: 11/13/2012 7:42:26 AM EST
Originally Posted By NapeSticksToKids:
the skinners won't work either, would need to drill and tap holes for them as well.

ordered a marbles tang peep sight from midway, should be here thursday. pretty excited, i hope it fits with no mods needed.


Go to Skinnersights.com and look at the barrel mounted version. The brass one will get patina to look like old brass.
Something like vinegar may help it to age a little quicker. I'm not sure.


Let me say that again, "barrel mounted version." It slides into the dovetail on the barrel.
Link Posted: 11/13/2012 8:17:25 AM EST
Ah ok I see it now. When I went to the site I went to the Winchester section and figured any sights they have that are compatible would be there.

How do I know what dimensions are mine?
Link Posted: 11/15/2012 8:23:46 PM EST
Originally Posted By NapeSticksToKids:
Ah ok I see it now. When I went to the site I went to the Winchester section and figured any sights they have that are compatible would be there.

How do I know what dimensions are mine?


Micrometer? Measure and call them. Two way communication really ads to what you see on the web site.
Link Posted: 11/16/2012 5:49:57 AM EST
Well I guess this is an excuse to go buy a set of digital calipers.
Link Posted: 11/21/2012 10:09:56 AM EST
Originally Posted By NapeSticksToKids:
Well I guess this is an excuse to go buy a set of digital calipers.


You aren't really going to mount a scope on an 1894 made in 1912 are you?

Link Posted: 11/21/2012 12:15:10 PM EST
Originally Posted By Warhawk:
Originally Posted By NapeSticksToKids:
Well I guess this is an excuse to go buy a set of digital calipers.


You aren't really going to mount a scope on an 1894 made in 1912 are you?



no. i didn't want anything that would permanently change the rifle, and i am too lazy to go fucking around with the dovetailed sights. i ordered a tang peep sight from marbles and mounted that. the short screw that came with it fit fine, but the long rear screw that came with it was much too long. i thought of cutting it, but then i tried the original screw. it seems to work fine and the sight is sturdy.




Link Posted: 11/21/2012 9:05:21 PM EST
I'm sooo glad you didn't drill into it, beautiful rifle!
Link Posted: 11/21/2012 10:01:26 PM EST
drilling into it was not even an option
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