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Posted: 3/31/2012 2:53:08 PM EDT
I am in the process of getting my CCW and I started wondering if people were loading their own defensive ammo instead of buying it. If you do, what caliber and what bullet are you using? Also, do you use any better quality control processes than with plinking ammo? (Additional quality controls could be using the same brass, measuring each charge, or whatever.)
Link Posted: 3/31/2012 3:11:08 PM EDT
Most people don't reload their own ammo for CCW. There are multiple reasons why not, including reliability issues, legal reasons and peace of mind. I wouldn't do it myself, I buy Ranger for my CCW load out. Rocky Mountain Reloading is selling pulled Gold Dots if you want to though. I plan on stocking up for my SHTF stash, just not my everyday carry.


Rogue
Link Posted: 3/31/2012 3:14:51 PM EDT
I wont load for personal defense.
theres some legalities that you may want to be aware of.

Link Posted: 3/31/2012 3:29:29 PM EDT
Do not load your own defensive ammo. Ever!
If, god forbid you have to use it to defend yourself or family, you can bet your ass that a chickenshit prosecutor, or the "victims" family lawyer that will no doubt sue for wrongfull death will point that out to the jury and make you out to be a vigilante that was so intent on killing he made his own special rounds.
Buy what your local PD uses and run 2 mags thru whatever your using.
Link Posted: 3/31/2012 3:31:02 PM EDT
With the prices I'm starting. I have Gold Dots just waiting. Everyone throws out the legal issues but i have yet to see any real data or case info to back up the legal claims. As for reliable I am more inclined to trust myself then mass produced ammo. I won't be reloading the rounds I carry on the progressive but instead loading them on the single stage. I have shot 1000's of reloads and find my reloads just as reliable as factory. I don't understand it when guys throw at the reliable statement then when asked about the costs of reloading throw out the it isn't cheaper but you make better ammo statement.
Link Posted: 3/31/2012 3:31:27 PM EDT
We've been over this a million times here.

#1. There are zero cases where hand loaded HD ammo has been used in court to convict a shooter in a SD shoot. Either the shoot was legal or it wasn't. That story is a crock of shit put out by Massad Ayoob. In all the times that it's been brought up as a reason not to load your own, we have asked for cases to be presented for proof, and no one has come forth.


#2. Hand loaded ammo that you load, is more consistent, more accurate, and unless you are a sloppy, shitty, careless person, it is more reliable. You are your own QC department. I have never had even 1, not one. single round not fire that I have loaded. Not even 1. That is including over 15,000 .45acp rounds, 10,000 .308 rounds, 3,000 9mm rounds, 2,000 7.62x39 rounds, 5,000 5.56 rounds, and 2,000 6.8 rounds.

Please add that up. Not one single solitary failure to fire, feed, or eject. Zero.

Now let's compare that to the numerous times that I've had factory loads fail to fire, fail to feed, and fail to extract, even in high dollar SD loads. I've had many of those fail. And switching back to my own loads, brings me back to complete functionality. I trust my own a hell of a lot more.

#3, You can tune your load to your gun, and make it more accurate, and better feeding that factory, and it is cheaper. by far.

As to what I carry.

I carry a 1911, with 8 rounds of 230gr Hornady XTP, in Starline cases, with Fed Magnum primers, with 5.0 gr Bullseye, all buttoned up tight in a Chip McCormik magazine, and a couple of his buddies riding shotgun.

Don't buy into the bullshit and urban legends.

Link Posted: 3/31/2012 4:14:30 PM EDT
Originally Posted By pavlovwolf:
We've been over this a million times here.

#1. There are zero cases where hand loaded HD ammo has been used in court to convict a shooter in a SD shoot. Either the shoot was legal or it wasn't. That story is a crock of shit put out by Massad Ayoob. In all the times that it's been brought up as a reason not to load your own, we have asked for cases to be presented for proof, and no one has come forth.


#2. Hand loaded ammo that you load, is more consistent, more accurate, and unless you are a sloppy, shitty, careless person, it is more reliable. You are your own QC department. I have never had even 1, not one. single round not fire that I have loaded. Not even 1. That is including over 15,000 .45acp rounds, 10,000 .308 rounds, 3,000 9mm rounds, 2,000 7.62x39 rounds, 5,000 5.56 rounds, and 2,000 6.8 rounds.

Please add that up. Not one single solitary failure to fire, feed, or eject. Zero.

Now let's compare that to the numerous times that I've had factory loads fail to fire, fail to feed, and fail to extract, even in high dollar SD loads. I've had many of those fail. And switching back to my own loads, brings me back to complete functionality. I trust my own a hell of a lot more.

#3, You can tune your load to your gun, and make it more accurate, and better feeding that factory, and it is cheaper. by far.

As to what I carry.

I carry a 1911, with 8 rounds of 230gr Hornady XTP, in Starline cases, with Fed Magnum primers, with 5.0 gr Bullseye, all buttoned up tight in a Chip McCormik magazine, and a couple of his buddies riding shotgun.

Don't buy into the bullshit and urban legends.



Listen to the above...or if you are not sure of your own reloads...read the ammo oracle and buy accordingly... this place has some great hard to find "law enforcement ammo only"

Link Posted: 3/31/2012 4:23:46 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/31/2012 4:24:28 PM EDT by GUNSnDONUTS]
Originally Posted By pavlovwolf:
We've been over this a million times here.

#1. There are zero cases where hand loaded HD ammo has been used in court to convict a shooter in a SD shoot. Either the shoot was legal or it wasn't. That story is a crock of shit put out by Massad Ayoob. In all the times that it's been brought up as a reason not to load your own, we have asked for cases to be presented for proof, and no one has come forth.


#2. Hand loaded ammo that you load, is more consistent, more accurate, and unless you are a sloppy, shitty, careless person, it is more reliable. You are your own QC department. I have never had even 1, not one. single round not fire that I have loaded. Not even 1. That is including over 15,000 .45acp rounds, 10,000 .308 rounds, 3,000 9mm rounds, 2,000 7.62x39 rounds, 5,000 5.56 rounds, and 2,000 6.8 rounds.

Please add that up. Not one single solitary failure to fire, feed, or eject. Zero.

Now let's compare that to the numerous times that I've had factory loads fail to fire, fail to feed, and fail to extract, even in high dollar SD loads. I've had many of those fail. And switching back to my own loads, brings me back to complete functionality. I trust my own a hell of a lot more.


Exactly this....stop spreading rumors


Thank you. +1.
#3, You can tune your load to your gun, and make it more accurate, and better feeding that factory, and it is cheaper. by far.

As to what I carry.

I carry a 1911, with 8 rounds of 230gr Hornady XTP, in Starline cases, with Fed Magnum primers, with 5.0 gr Bullseye, all buttoned up tight in a Chip McCormik magazine, and a couple of his buddies riding shotgun.

Don't buy into the bullshit and urban legends.



Link Posted: 3/31/2012 4:27:32 PM EDT
contrary to many i load my own sd loads. i believe in practicing with what you have to use and i couldn't afford to practice with the sd ammo you have to buy. they rape the heck out of you on that.

i use published loads with hornady xtp bullets. To each their own use what you feel the most comfortable with.
Link Posted: 3/31/2012 5:10:04 PM EDT
This man speaks the truth.

I only carry ammo that I make.

Originally Posted By pavlovwolf:
We've been over this a million times here.

#1. There are zero cases where hand loaded HD ammo has been used in court to convict a shooter in a SD shoot. Either the shoot was legal or it wasn't. That story is a crock of shit put out by Massad Ayoob. In all the times that it's been brought up as a reason not to load your own, we have asked for cases to be presented for proof, and no one has come forth.


#2. Hand loaded ammo that you load, is more consistent, more accurate, and unless you are a sloppy, shitty, careless person, it is more reliable. You are your own QC department. I have never had even 1, not one. single round not fire that I have loaded. Not even 1. That is including over 15,000 .45acp rounds, 10,000 .308 rounds, 3,000 9mm rounds, 2,000 7.62x39 rounds, 5,000 5.56 rounds, and 2,000 6.8 rounds.

Please add that up. Not one single solitary failure to fire, feed, or eject. Zero.

Now let's compare that to the numerous times that I've had factory loads fail to fire, fail to feed, and fail to extract, even in high dollar SD loads. I've had many of those fail. And switching back to my own loads, brings me back to complete functionality. I trust my own a hell of a lot more.

#3, You can tune your load to your gun, and make it more accurate, and better feeding that factory, and it is cheaper. by far.

As to what I carry.

I carry a 1911, with 8 rounds of 230gr Hornady XTP, in Starline cases, with Fed Magnum primers, with 5.0 gr Bullseye, all buttoned up tight in a Chip McCormik magazine, and a couple of his buddies riding shotgun.

Don't buy into the bullshit and urban legends.



Link Posted: 3/31/2012 5:48:55 PM EDT

Originally Posted By pavlovwolf:
We've been over this a million times here.

#1. There are zero cases where hand loaded HD ammo has been used in court to convict a shooter in a SD shoot. Either the shoot was legal or it wasn't. That story is a crock of shit put out by Massad Ayoob. In all the times that it's been brought up as a reason not to load your own, we have asked for cases to be presented for proof, and no one has come forth.


#2. Hand loaded ammo that you load, is more consistent, more accurate, and unless you are a sloppy, shitty, careless person, it is more reliable. You are your own QC department. I have never had even 1, not one. single round not fire that I have loaded. Not even 1. That is including over 15,000 .45acp rounds, 10,000 .308 rounds, 3,000 9mm rounds, 2,000 7.62x39 rounds, 5,000 5.56 rounds, and 2,000 6.8 rounds.

Please add that up. Not one single solitary failure to fire, feed, or eject. Zero.

Now let's compare that to the numerous times that I've had factory loads fail to fire, fail to feed, and fail to extract, even in high dollar SD loads. I've had many of those fail. And switching back to my own loads, brings me back to complete functionality. I trust my own a hell of a lot more.

#3, You can tune your load to your gun, and make it more accurate, and better feeding that factory, and it is cheaper. by far.

As to what I carry.

I carry a 1911, with 8 rounds of 230gr Hornady XTP, in Starline cases, with Fed Magnum primers, with 5.0 gr Bullseye, all buttoned up tight in a Chip McCormik magazine, and a couple of his buddies riding shotgun.

Don't buy into the bullshit and urban legends.


This is my take on it as well. I don't carry, for obvious reason (), but have home defense ammo that is 200gr Hornady XTP with 7.0 gr Power Pistol
Link Posted: 3/31/2012 6:04:15 PM EDT
The using reloaded ammo thing is a myth... but I wouldn't load my own SD ammo. Unless it was just what you call the SHTF stash of reloads. For my main SD mags, a couple loose and a full magazine bag, I use factory quality SD ammo. If I burn through all that and need my reloads, then they become my SD rounds...

If I were going to load my own SD, I would do it will all NEW components... brass, bullet and powder... no pull downs, no pulls, no once fired brass...
Link Posted: 3/31/2012 6:37:08 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/31/2012 6:41:34 PM EDT by 1911smith]
Should you load your own self defense loads ?

If live in a state having I-95 or I-5 run through and majority of citizenship holds Nancy Pelosi in high regard maybe not a good idea.

If living in Illinois you're not worthy of 2nd amendment rights.

If you live or travel through St. Louis maybe not the smartest decision. If all of St. Louis were annexed to Illinois it would thrill most Missourians.

If you have self esteem or quality issues with your loading discipline, probably shouldn't.

If your hand loaded cartridges aren't as accurate or feedable as factory, then definately not.


If you have good bearing, moral compass to not go looking for things you shouldn't in places where main stream folks don't go, then yes you should.

If you're ability to hand load a more accurate and feedable cartridge than factory, you should definately load your own.

If you understand basics of press and die tuning for optimal conformity, then by all means hand load your own.

If you understand your weapons basic functions. Feed channel and how to tune cartridge for seamless feed, then most definately roll your own.


It's not for everyone, just like CCW isn't for everyone.

This one thing you can take to the bank. When shit hits the fan and a weapon fired in self defense. The blow back won't be about how custom a weapon is or hand loaded cartridges. The blow back is gonna be about reaction justified and forced used appropriate to threat. If those two things are on your side it won't matter if you rolled your own.

If you're one of those who think no is the answer. Then it's appropriate for you to use factory ammunition.

All boils down in the end. Can you stand behind you ?

If any doubt in your mind and you feel factory over hand load is the difference between good judgement or not. I might suggest you review if CCW is appropriate for you period.

My EDC is not only custom. It's heavily modified well past what factory or top tier pistol smith will do with exception to one cranky old bastard who did one before mine. Of course it and every weapon I own runs hand loaded ammunition. They're also known to run Winchester PDX1.

Link Posted: 3/31/2012 6:42:35 PM EDT
Not pistol ammo, because you can't buy pistol bullets as components that are as good as factory rounds.

Rifle, on the other hand... TSXs are pricy, but awfully effective.
Link Posted: 3/31/2012 6:45:53 PM EDT
I've never seen any court cases where self loaded ammo was to blame for someone losing the case.

I Personally trust my own loaded ammo to factory anyday and I think most competent loaders will say the same.

Since I do feel my rounds are better than any factory I can buy I will use them for carry without worry. To be honest it would take some real experts looking into the rounds to even tell they were reloaded to begin with if you go it right.

As I've always heard and it's a good saying within reason. I'd rather be judged by 12 than carried by 6.
Link Posted: 3/31/2012 6:56:13 PM EDT
Originally Posted By GlutealCleft:
Not pistol ammo, because you can't buy pistol bullets as components that are as good as factory rounds.

Rifle, on the other hand... TSXs are pricy, but awfully effective.



Huh ? What brand bullets do you think companies like Federal. Wilson Combat and Assym use ?

There's more than those brands that use bullets made by Sierra, Hornady. Nosler and Barnes.

I'll put my handloaded Barnes against any brand made. 185 grain, 45 acp Barnes XP-Tac or whatever its called moving at 900 + fps is dead ball accurate and expansion is plenty to prove fatal.

Nope, might want to research that some. Sure there are some proprietary bullets we would like to have. To say better ?

Well you know I'm from the Sho-Me state. My testing with Barnes more than satisfies any concerns between factory and my hand loads. Both Wilson Combat and Assym Precision seem to back my conclusions based on their SD cartridges.
Link Posted: 3/31/2012 8:39:34 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/31/2012 8:39:34 PM EDT by AeroE]
Yes, I do.
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