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Posted: 12/12/2013 7:03:51 PM EDT
Hey guys, this is my first post here. I just signed up for this site. And what a great site it is.

Anyway, here is the thing... I have been wanting to buy a new rifle for a while now but i cant decide on what to get.
I currently have 2 AKs and several handguns. I was was thinking about adding a PTR 91 to my armory.. But then i was reading how bad they are on brass and how rough the roller delayed blowback system is. Also, i don't really like the charging handle on the G3 style rifles and reloading them. So then I was looking at the FALs by DS Arms.
But i was told that they're too big and after a while i wouldn't like these battle rifles and so I was pushed towards the ARs by many.
I initially wanted a semi auto 308 rifle. But then the guys at the local gun stores told me that I'll hate them and wont shoot them much due to the high cost of the .308.

Now for ARs, i dont really like them much or scared of them rather..
They look very good, they handle perfectly and shoot very accurate. I shot many at the range. But I hear how the direct gas impingement system is dirty and not reliable.
Also, I dont have much faith in the .223 round. I dont want to make this long. But please help mee. Which would you get and whyy???

I was thinking about getting either a colt 6920 basic model or the DPMS Tac2. Leaning more towards the Tac 2 because of the rails and full length gas system and sh*t like that.
Please help a fellow member outtt! Much appreciated and happy shootinggg
Link Posted: 12/12/2013 7:28:01 PM EDT
Oh where to start......


I agree that the two rifles in 308 you listed are going to be heavy.....also ammo expensive but if I just had to pick one over the other its the FAL hands down.

I would say out of everything you listed to me the choice is obvious......the AR......who has been feeding you the "ARs arent reliable" bullshit.....keep it lubed and you will more than likely never have an issue(am I going to tell you ARs will always be 100% no issues....nope.....its a tool and sometimes tools fail....and I will say the same for any rifle...including your AKs).  There is nothing wrong with 223/5.56 its been killing shit dead for years......I sure as shit would not want to be on the receiving end of one.


look into a lightweight AR......the 6920 is a great choice....if I had to buy tomorrow it would be the 6720(difference between the 6920 is the 6720 has a lightweight barrel).....screw DPMS.
Link Posted: 12/12/2013 7:50:45 PM EDT
Originally Posted By pistolshooter404:
But I hear how the direct gas impingement system is dirty and not reliable.
View Quote


The first thing you need to do is stop listening to idiots who spew that crap.
Link Posted: 12/12/2013 8:07:55 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/12/2013 8:21:15 PM EDT by Gamma762]
Originally Posted By pistolshooter404:
guys at the local gun stores
View Quote

Step 1:  forget everything you've ever heard in a gun shop.  EVERYTHING.


Hey guys, this is my first post here. I just signed up for this site. And what a great site it is.

Anyway, here is the thing... I have been wanting to buy a new rifle for a while now but i cant decide on what to get.
I currently have 2 AKs and several handguns. I was was thinking about adding a PTR 91 to my armory.. But then i was reading how bad they are on brass and how rough the roller delayed blowback system is.
They have a reasonably stiff recoil compared to other 7.62x51 rifles, most find them less than ergonomic (ie, don't like getting punched in the face), and the HK design is not optimum for reloading.
Also, i don't really like the charging handle on the G3 style rifles and reloading them. So then I was looking at the FALs by DS Arms.
But i was told that they're too big and after a while i wouldn't like these battle rifles and so I was pushed towards the ARs by many.
FALs aren't any bigger than an HK/PTR91, maybe a few inches longer on barrel length on the 21" models, but you can get an 18 or something.  FALs are much nicer shooting, and easier on brass - with the adjustable gas system, you can turn it down to minimal function and the cases just dribble out, a couple feet.  If you reload they're a good option on that alone.  Plus they're indestructible, and have good parts availability.
I initially wanted a semi auto 308 rifle. But then the guys at the local gun stores told me that I'll hate them and wont shoot them much due to the high cost of the .308.
I can't tell you whether you'll hate them or not, and factory 308 is kinda pricey, but if you load then it's probably not much more expensive.  If you're handloading you could even load some lower power loads and tune your loads to the maximum adjustment on the gas system for a low recoil fun load.
Now for ARs, i dont really like them much or scared of them rather..
They look very good, they handle perfectly and shoot very accurate. I shot many at the range. But I hear how the direct gas impingement system is dirty and not reliable.
Please.  Read my first response.  If you're concerned about dirty a roller lock rifle like the PTR would be exponentially worse as they actually do blast gas and fouling directly into the action, unlike the AR even though that's what the clueless out there like to say.
Also, I dont have much faith in the .223 round.
What are you shooting with it?
I dont want to make this long. But please help mee. Which would you get and whyy???
If you're an American shooter and you don't have a decent AR, get a decent AR.
I was thinking about getting either a colt 6920 basic model or the DPMS Tac2. Leaning more towards the Tac 2 because of the rails and full length gas system and sh*t like that.
I said decent.... the Colt is ok but I don't recommend carbine gas 16" barrel ARs. Maybe take a look at BCM or Spikes which both have quality midlength gas rifles, or the S&W Magpul edition
Please help a fellow member outtt! Much appreciated and happy shootinggg
View Quote

Link Posted: 12/12/2013 8:45:18 PM EDT
Problem solved.
Buy my SAR 4800. FAL in 5.56 uses AR mags. Win - Win.

Link Posted: 12/13/2013 5:19:05 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/13/2013 9:41:35 AM EDT by urbanredneck]
It depends on what you want....and need in your inventory.

I would say that with 2 ak's you have already filled the void of a SHTF rifle but you have limited yourself as far as range. AK's are not easy to ad optics, accuracy is minute of man, you are limited to 200 - 300 meters....not to mention you have limited yourself to those bulk steel cased ammo selections and the possibility that ammo will dry up one day.

All the crap you have mentioned about ARs not being reliable is horsesh#t of the first order. DI has been working for 50 years now... The AR system has tighter tolerances which may need to be cleaned a little more but if you are on top of your game you are going to be checking your weapon at the end of everyday out in the field. And those tighter tolerances along with the cartridge make it more accurate. Now what you lost by choosing AKs can be rectified with ARs. You could choose to pick-up a 20" AR with a freefloat barrel. Add a scope and you can be shooting out to 600 yards with some good ammo.

If you want something with more punch and longer ranges then go for the 7.62 rifles, might even consider a good bolt gun.

Personally my next pick would be the AR, a RECCE, SPR or DMR type set-up.

precision builds
Link Posted: 12/13/2013 6:44:11 AM EDT
not enough info and everyone hit on the basics
Link Posted: 12/13/2013 7:12:18 AM EDT
A Saiga or Vepr in .308 would be a solid choice.  Multiple barrel lengths to choose from, very reliable, decently accurate (more accurate than most people give them credit for), and reasonably priced.  Very solid and flexible rifles that can fill multiple roles.




Link Posted: 12/13/2013 10:49:53 AM EDT
Build an AR in 7.62x39 FTW.  You already have the ammo, and you'll shoot tighter groups than you ever have w/ your AKs...
Link Posted: 12/13/2013 11:03:49 AM EDT
get somthing you can afford or already are set to feed. As stated .308 is costly and reloading for the g3  rifles is tuff with out takeing steps to preserve youe cases they get beat up. so weigh your ability to feed the weapon you decide on.
Link Posted: 12/13/2013 11:45:19 AM EDT
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By AEnemaBay:


The first thing you need to do is stop listening to idiots who spew that crap.
View Quote View All Quotes
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Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By AEnemaBay:
Originally Posted By pistolshooter404:
But I hear how the direct gas impingement system is dirty and not reliable.


The first thing you need to do is stop listening to idiots who spew that crap.



this.

I've used the M4/M16 in 4 combat tours, 0 malfunctions. I've owned a lot of Ar15s from several manufacturers. all good to go. I think the AR15/M16/M4 is a world class weapon system
Link Posted: 12/14/2013 7:56:41 AM EDT
Welcome Aboard!!!!!!!!!!

The AR is a world class weapon system.  If the round was so bad why did Russia develop the AK74?  In the past I purchased three AK based rifles.  Here are the results:

SAR-1 - could not hit the side of a barn from the inside.  50 yard groups looked like I was shooting my shotgun.  Gone

PSL - first one had a receiver failure after 80 rounds.  Second one is so magazine picky that I would never use it if my life depended upon it.  Jams almost every mag load.  It took 8 months and several different mags to finally get two to work somewhat reliably.  Now living out of state.  Fun to shoot but

SSR-85C-2 Bulgarian AK47.  I only found 1 magazine that would even work in it.  Most would not even fit much less feed properly.  Gone.
Link Posted: 12/14/2013 10:54:02 AM EDT
Buy a .308 AR.



The DPMS .308 is a pretty good rifle. there is also CMMG, Bushmaster, RRA, Aramalite, etc....




They are good on brass and very accurate.
Link Posted: 12/14/2013 2:18:48 PM EDT
Thank you so much for  all of the great replies and advice guys. You people are very kind and helpful in sharing your knowledge.
Based on the replies I've received in the research I've conducted in the past few days, i decided to go with the AR 15 for versatility, ergonomics, accuracy, and most  importantly, cost of ammo.
Now the problem is deciding which Ar to get..
I have narrowed it down to Colt 6920, DPMS AP4, Ruger SP 556, or buy a lower and a 5.45x39 upper to shoot the dirt cheap 5.45 ammo, and a 556 upper later.
What do you guys think??
Whats your opinion on the Ruger sp 556? What do you guys think of the piston ARs?
Why are all the 5.45 uppers I see are piston operated?
Link Posted: 12/14/2013 9:02:00 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/14/2013 9:08:36 PM EDT by Gamma762]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By pistolshooter404:
Thank you so much for  all of the great replies and advice guys. You people are very kind and helpful in sharing your knowledge.
Based on the replies I've received in the research I've conducted in the past few days, i decided to go with the AR 15 for versatility, ergonomics, accuracy, and most  importantly, cost of ammo.
Now the problem is deciding which Ar to get..
I have narrowed it down to Colt 6920, DPMS AP4, Ruger SP 556, or buy a lower and a 5.45x39 upper to shoot the dirt cheap 5.45 ammo, and a 556 upper later.
What do you guys think??
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By pistolshooter404:
Thank you so much for  all of the great replies and advice guys. You people are very kind and helpful in sharing your knowledge.
Based on the replies I've received in the research I've conducted in the past few days, i decided to go with the AR 15 for versatility, ergonomics, accuracy, and most  importantly, cost of ammo.
Now the problem is deciding which Ar to get..
I have narrowed it down to Colt 6920, DPMS AP4, Ruger SP 556, or buy a lower and a 5.45x39 upper to shoot the dirt cheap 5.45 ammo, and a 556 upper later.
What do you guys think??

I mentioned specific brand and model suggestions earlier, I'd add Daniel Defense to the list if you could find one, although IIRC all their current models are higher end/more $ configurations with free float handguards.  IMO informed consumers should not buy carbine gas length 16" barrel ARs, look for a midlength gas configuration if you want a 16" barrel rifle.  With current parts availability it is probably going to be easier to buy upper and lower halves separately.

Whats your opinion on the Ruger sp 556? What do you guys think of the piston ARs?

Completely unnecessary and creates more issues that they alleviate.  Extra weight, cost, complexity, along with proprietary parts, but most importantly, because the AR15 was not designed with the necessary engineering features to support piston operation makes them a poor choice especially for a beginner to the AR15 platform.

For 99.9999% of AR shooters you're just adding a bunch of burdens because you're believing myths and misinformation about the standard AR15 configuration.

The Ruger version is quite front heavy due to the barrel profile and very heavy gas block along with the piston parts.


Why are all the 5.45 uppers I see are piston operated?

Apparently you're not looking in the right place, Spikes and Model 1 off the top of my head offer 5.45x39 DI uppers.
Link Posted: 12/15/2013 5:06:31 AM EDT
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By pistolshooter404:
Thank you so much for  all of the great replies and advice guys. You people are very kind and helpful in sharing your knowledge.
Based on the replies I've received in the research I've conducted in the past few days, i decided to go with the AR 15 for versatility, ergonomics, accuracy, and most  importantly, cost of ammo.
Now the problem is deciding which Ar to get..
I have narrowed it down to Colt 6920, DPMS AP4, Ruger SP 556, or buy a lower and a 5.45x39 upper to shoot the dirt cheap 5.45 ammo, and a 556 upper later.
What do you guys think??
Whats your opinion on the Ruger sp 556? What do you guys think of the piston ARs?
Why are all the 5.45 uppers I see are piston operated?
View Quote


Of the options listed, I can think of no reason to not buy the 6920. It's reasonably priced and more rifle than you're ever likely going to need.

It will do everything you're looking to do and will be reliable, even in it's DI configuration.
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