Warning

 

Close

Confirm Action

Are you sure you wish to do this?

Confirm Cancel
Member Login

Page Armory » 50 Cal
Site Notices
Posted: 2/19/2007 2:40:07 AM EST
Ball bullets that is. I bought 200 of the new "Ball" bulelts that Widner's is selling. Seems from looking at the web there are a number of suppliers with these for sale lately.

They weight the same as AP (695 grains)and have the same style cannalure (turned rather than rolled). As I understand it, all 50 BMG Ball bullets have a steel inner jacket. A magnet test did not reflect any differences between the "Ball" and my AP. The rear of the "Ball" bullets do have exposed lead as opposed to the surplus AP bullets having a very small opening with a steel core showing.

Just out of curiosity, I sized a 10 and 2 were noticeably harder to push through the sizing die. I ahve not shot the resized "Ball" yet.

In loading them with H5010 and H50BMG, the groups out of my AR-50 at 100 yards are in the 3" range as compaired to the same load with pulled and resized surplus AP bullets which are shooting within 1".

Any idea (1) if these are really ball?; and, (2) anyone one getting better results?

If you are getting better results, what are you loading them with
Link Posted: 2/20/2007 11:23:06 AM EST
Your balls? I tell you this much if we were golfing together I'd wash them for you.
Link Posted: 2/20/2007 2:28:56 PM EST
Curious if you weighed the bullets before loading them. I haven't loaded any of mine yet but pulled a few to sample their weight and they were all over the board - between 687 to 694 just on the handful that I looked at.
Link Posted: 2/21/2007 2:13:00 AM EST
Mine weights were int he +/- 8 grain range also. This is probably why they were surplused in the first place as they must not have met accruacy standards.
Link Posted: 2/21/2007 1:18:43 PM EST
Thier not blue are they? Like a smurfs?
Link Posted: 2/21/2007 5:29:54 PM EST
What do you expect for $40 / 1000? These are military bullets, right? Weigh them and sort them out. With Talon gone, our only other option is going to be Hornady at $1.50 each. All AP's, blue tips all the other fun stuff are on the way out.

BTW, how funny to say that less than a 1% weight variance is a reason to reject military bullets. That is extremely close for military weights.
Link Posted: 2/21/2007 5:56:43 PM EST

Originally Posted By Force750:
With Talon gone, our only other option is going to be Hornady at $1.50 each.




there are a lot of ultra grade projo manufacturers out there that exceed the hornady's performance and they are cheaper to boot.

i have a thread here regarding bullets that you might be interested in. also, i've recently worked with Barnes on something similar. there are many others as well.

somebody is highly likely to fill talon's shoes. do you think the military will opt to throw that stuff in trash instead of de-milling it and making a buck?
Link Posted: 2/21/2007 6:35:56 PM EST

Originally Posted By Force750:
What do you expect for $40 / 1000?


They're $40/100, not 1000. The surplus AP bullets (which are less than half the cost) I bought recently are more on spot when it comes to weight consistency.
Link Posted: 2/22/2007 2:13:42 AM EST
septic-tank13 - where is your thread on bullet performance?

Found the one of TTI bullet avaiability, but nothing on the target performance.

George
Link Posted: 2/22/2007 3:24:32 AM EST
[Last Edit: 2/22/2007 3:27:58 AM EST by septic-tank13]
i have no feedback yet. i know this sounds bad, as i just made a claim i can't back up with hard results - i'm in the process of building up items to build my own ammo. i have shot factory ammunition from TTI in both 750solid, 705solid, and 750AMAX and know my personal results now with each. i started with the AMAX, much like everybody i heard the most about it, i live in the midwest - go figure. i had great results. 13" groups to 15" at 1k. i used some 750 solids and had inconsistent results and only used one box, so i threw out the results. i then used the 705 solids and shot 9" at 1k. no bags, no rest, just in the dirt. the prior groups were on a cement bench at the same range. (the AMAX groups were shot from a cement bench with a bipod and rear monopod - the 750's and 705's in solids were shot with the same pods in the prone position beside the bench on the ground) so again, the tests weren't same, but similar.

it is reasonable to extrapolate that a machined solid brass projectile will outperform the average swaged bullets. start weighing them and see what you think. i'm not saying they are always better, but consistency of build and flight would lean towards a machined projectile and away from swaged bullets.

consistency is the key to repeatable shot placement and that equates to accuracy. i like hornady and have many, many, of their products. i'm in touch with them in Grand Island on a weekly basis. i don't want anyone here to think the 750 AMAX is a lesser bullet. however, they get much press. sometimes too much IMO. all i really want people to take from this are the facts, and the facts are there are many high quality bullets out there for the same or less money.

a quick trip through the FCSA directory and you'll find quite a few folks that are making high quality bullets that don't break the bank.

as for folks who want to do some blasting, you still don't want to spend $1 per bullet or more. i can understand this and adhere to it as well. talon won't be our only source for de-mil stuff. someone will take their place. there is a market niche to be filled, and someone will fill it. supply and demand.

just my opinion of course. the proof is in the pudding, right?



Link Posted: 2/22/2007 3:36:40 AM EST
[Last Edit: 2/22/2007 3:37:06 AM EST by treemydawg]
Try here the guys a friend of mine and will set you up right.

stores.ebay.com/Northwest-Custom-Projectile
Link Posted: 2/22/2007 7:49:24 PM EST

Originally Posted By septic-tank13:

Originally Posted By Force750:
With Talon gone, our only other option is going to be Hornady at $1.50 each.




there are a lot of ultra grade projo manufacturers out there that exceed the hornady's performance and they are cheaper to boot.

i have a thread here regarding bullets that you might be interested in. also, i've recently worked with Barnes on something similar. there are many others as well.

somebody is highly likely to fill talon's shoes. do you think the military will opt to throw that stuff in trash instead of de-milling it and making a buck?


The military never "make a buck" on Talon. It was a way to get rid of the trash for the military. The ammo was GIVEN to Talon. Turns out it just delayed having to deal with a big mess that the military is NOW having to clean up. Yes, someone will fill Talon's shoes, but we won't see the product. It will be disposed of without sales to the public, IMHO.

You are absolutely correct that there are several ultra grade small projo mfg out there, but none of them make or can make the fun stuff that Talon demiled. This is what I focused on. Hornady and the "ultras" can never replace what Talon released to the public. Have you ever fired an incendiary or spotter tracer? PLUS, it is very expensive to use these "ultra grade" bullets in an M2 or semi-M2. When referred to Hornady, I incorporated by reference all the other small match 50 BMG bullet makers. I just didn't make that very clear. Sorry.
Link Posted: 2/25/2007 11:25:22 AM EST
you might be 100% right. i'd like to think that someone will step up and fill their shoes and sell to the public. supply and demand. maybe i'm being more wishful than realistic.

we'll see.
Link Posted: 2/25/2007 1:31:04 PM EST
Oh I'm sure the demand is there, so there will be a supplier, it just ain't gonna be cheap. At least as far as .50bmg being cheap.
Page Armory » 50 Cal
Top Top