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Posted: 3/15/2011 6:34:09 AM EDT
I recently got a deal on two ceramic plates, one is a Tactical Armor Products Gamma M plate, and one is a Ceradyne Ceramic 7.62/M-80 Ball plate. I got both for just over $200 which isnt too shabby, agreed?

After researching them, it seems they are not standalone plates, correct? Meaning by themselves, they wont stop XM193/M855/.233 SD rounds from civilians without a IIIA plate backer, correct?

This begs the question, am I better off just buying a set of DSG Titanium plates and using them without backers? Or should I just invest in IIIA backers for the set of ceramics?
Link Posted: 3/15/2011 10:43:38 AM EDT
[#1]
I would just go with plate backers or wear a concealable level 3A vest under your plate carrier.   Either way, you get the same result.  The vest would give you extra protection from handgun rounds in a larger area of your body., but would weigh more.  

Plate backers will run you about $200-225 for a pair, and a level 3A vest (a decent one) will run around $400-600.

If you go with the vest, you could wear it by itself without the plate carrier for a pistol class, etc.
Link Posted: 3/15/2011 11:13:09 AM EDT
[#2]
Quoted:
I would just go with plate backers or wear a concealable level 3A vest under your plate carrier.   Either way, you get the same result.  The vest would give you extra protection from handgun rounds in a larger area of your body., but would weigh more.  

Plate backers will run you about $200-225 for a pair, and a level 3A vest (a decent one) will run around $400-600.

If you go with the vest, you could wear it by itself without the plate carrier for a pistol class, etc.


All of the options will go inside just one vest; a low profile carrier. It's either the ceramics with backers, or just the DSG Ti plates. Both options will cost the same for me.
Link Posted: 3/15/2011 11:24:44 AM EDT
[#3]
i have the DSG Ti plates,and while they offer great protection the weight is an issue.they come in at just under 8 pounds per plate.so if you plan on useing this rig as a weekend warrior set up for the occasional class,then i dont see a problem with the Ti plates.if your going to use this set up professionally in the stan or or on the streets as an LEO id reconsider useing them.IMO
Link Posted: 3/15/2011 12:24:35 PM EDT
[#4]
Quoted:
i have the DSG Ti plates,and while they offer great protection the weight is an issue.they come in at just under 8 pounds per plate.so if you plan on useing this rig as a weekend warrior set up for the occasional class,then i dont see a problem with the Ti plates.if your going to use this set up professionally in the stan or or on the streets as an LEO id reconsider useing them.IMO


They will be just for classes and once-monthly carbine competitions.

Weight is not what I'm concerned about; it's which is a better option for stopping XM193/M855/.223 Common rounds economically. Either JUST the DSG plates, or both the ceramic plates and backers....and this is all given that the ceramic plates are not standalone plates. I am not sure on that so I'm waiting for someone to correct me.
Link Posted: 3/15/2011 6:17:14 PM EDT
[#5]
If your concern is simply which is better for stopping M855 and similar rounds, regardless of weight or cost, I'd go for the Ti plates.  They're more "multi-hit" capable.  If I remember correctly, military testing for SAPI is for three hits, so if your Ceradynes are military, then they're rated for up to 3 hits.  If they're civvie, they're only rated for one.

CORRECTION:  Just re-read your post and saw that they're the M80 plates.  Those, if military, are rated for 3 rounds, if civilian, for six.  However, they're NOT rated for any type of 5.56mm ammunition, and are tested solely with 7.62x51mm M80 ball rounds.
Link Posted: 3/15/2011 7:32:17 PM EDT
[#6]
something you should consider with the Ti plates is spalling...
Link Posted: 3/16/2011 4:31:48 AM EDT
[#7]
Quoted:
If your concern is simply which is better for stopping M855 and similar rounds, regardless of weight or cost, I'd go for the Ti plates.  They're more "multi-hit" capable.  If I remember correctly, military testing for SAPI is for three hits, so if your Ceradynes are military, then they're rated for up to 3 hits.  If they're civvie, they're only rated for one.

CORRECTION:  Just re-read your post and saw that they're the M80 plates.  Those, if military, are rated for 3 rounds, if civilian, for six.  However, they're NOT rated for any type of 5.56mm ammunition, and are tested solely with 7.62x51mm M80 ball rounds.


So without backers they are absolutely useless to use in an environment with primarily 5.56 ammunition being shot?

The DSG Ti plates can stop XM193/M855 if I'm not mistaken....
Link Posted: 3/16/2011 6:13:46 AM EDT
[#8]





Quoted:



something you should consider with the Ti plates is spalling...



Most people do not comprehend the wounds that come from spall.


I need to shoot a video of some steel plates being shot and a slab of beef catching the spall...



Don't get me wrong, its better than taking a round through the chest piece, but there is nothing fun about pulling hundreds of shards of copper and lead out of your neck/chin/groin/legs/arms/ect..





CXS





 
Link Posted: 3/16/2011 7:58:49 AM EDT
[#9]
Quoted:

Quoted:
something you should consider with the Ti plates is spalling...

Most people do not comprehend the wounds that come from spall.
I need to shoot a video of some steel plates being shot and a slab of beef catching the spall...

Don't get me wrong, its better than taking a round through the chest piece, but there is nothing fun about pulling hundreds of shards of copper and lead out of your neck/chin/groin/legs/arms/ect..

CXS
 


A piece of kevler in front of the plate helps this right? Not a backer though...?
Link Posted: 3/16/2011 11:03:54 AM EDT
[#10]
Quoted:
Quoted:
If your concern is simply which is better for stopping M855 and similar rounds, regardless of weight or cost, I'd go for the Ti plates.  They're more "multi-hit" capable.  If I remember correctly, military testing for SAPI is for three hits, so if your Ceradynes are military, then they're rated for up to 3 hits.  If they're civvie, they're only rated for one.

CORRECTION:  Just re-read your post and saw that they're the M80 plates.  Those, if military, are rated for 3 rounds, if civilian, for six.  However, they're NOT rated for any type of 5.56mm ammunition, and are tested solely with 7.62x51mm M80 ball rounds.


So without backers they are absolutely useless to use in an environment with primarily 5.56 ammunition being shot?

The DSG Ti plates can stop XM193/M855 if I'm not mistaken....


For SAPI, backers are irrelevant to the caliber they are rated for.  Backers are required for tehm to work properly AT ALL, for the blunt trauma.  Keep inmind, they were originally designed to be worn over the Interceptor OTV, and most of them wil say on the label "NOT TO BE WORN SEPARATELY", "FAILURE TO WEAR PROPERLY WILL RESULT IN ABSENCE OF BALLISTIC PROTECTION", or words to that effect.  Without the backers, they MIGHT still stop the rounds they're rated for, but they'll also probably ruin your day with blunt trauma and pieces of broken plate getting lodged in your chest after it takes a round and shatters.  WITH the backers, you're getting what the label says, nothing more.
Link Posted: 3/16/2011 11:23:39 AM EDT
[#11]
Quoted:
Quoted:

Quoted:
something you should consider with the Ti plates is spalling...

Most people do not comprehend the wounds that come from spall.
I need to shoot a video of some steel plates being shot and a slab of beef catching the spall...

Don't get me wrong, its better than taking a round through the chest piece, but there is nothing fun about pulling hundreds of shards of copper and lead out of your neck/chin/groin/legs/arms/ect..

CXS
 


A piece of kevler in front of the plate helps this right? Not a backer though...?


i would recommend LINE-X PAXCON-2100 heres a great page showing its application.
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