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Posted: 9/2/2004 12:59:07 PM EST
I was just wondering why you don't really hear about tactical/police shotguns made from the Winchester 1300? All the major companies make the same tactical sidesaddles, stocks, etc. Is there any reason?
Link Posted: 9/2/2004 4:03:47 PM EST
i'm with you. i have been a huge fan of used winchester 1300s for a while. direct technological descendent of the model 12, which was probably the best overall bird gun ever built. i've owned several, and while i've sold 'em off over the years, always seem to sell or give one to someone important to me. never sell a winchester to a stranger.

i just bought a new bird gun today, a model 1300 in mossy oak camo, 26" bbl, brand new in a winchester box with all 3 chokes. weighs 7 lbs. w/ammo. and has sling attachment points. i also own a 1300 in the short turkey model with some additions for home defense which doesn't work too well with the short barrel on texas doves. kinda like throwing up a field of flak hoping one of 'em will take a hit. whitewings are friggin' acrobats in the air and by the time they get to the austin area they're plenty gun-shy, ergo the camo pattern on the new gun.

i don't care what the "sometimes hunters" say, you can put three guys in a field, two of 'em wearing camo and one of 'em in street clothes, spread out over 150 yards crosswise in a fly zone and you can sit there and watch the birds avoid the non-camo guy and fly right over the camo-ed ones. this year i'm camo-ing out. gun and all.

i can't figure out why winchester is so unappreciated in the gun world nowadays. i always thought their attention to detail and finish level were excellent compared to remingtons. i don't want to get flamed by remmy guys, most of my hunting buds are rem-freaks and my brother even owns two. my junk shoots just as good or better, just looks a little better with better finish, i think.

i do know one thing, the winchester 1300 action is super slick. my turkey gun is so broken in that if you load a live shell into the chamber, leave the safety on, press on the slide release and *ever* so lightly tap the buttstock of the weapon on a table or countertop, the whole slide comes back freely and the shell ejects itself. i've never seen 870s or benellis do that, and i see a whole lot fewer winchester shooters short-cycle their guns.

whatever. 870s are great guns, and i was sorely tempted by the benelli sitting next to the winnie at the gun shop, it was even a little cheaper, but for the same reason i don't own a glock anymore i am reluctant to purchase a shotgun with a polymer receiver. i think glocks flex in your hand. i bet the novas do too.

just my .02 and i'm a texas redneck bird murderer so there.
Link Posted: 9/2/2004 10:11:46 PM EST
the guns is an excellent gun..

it has 1 drawback...that designers flubbed on and the LEO community...now realizes it.

the pump release.

the safety is perfect...
the pump is the quickest you'll ever find...

but to release the pump can be troublesome.
Link Posted: 9/2/2004 10:27:31 PM EST
The 1300 Defender is my favorite pump gun , If you want you can get all the tactical accessories for a 1300 . Add in the fact that it's the only pump out there that will cycle mini shells without any mods , and it becomes a great choice for a Home defense unit .
Link Posted: 9/3/2004 10:21:29 AM EST
FN seems to think they are great gun...I agree since I am biased with a standard 1300 and one of these now...

Cheers

FN Tactical
Link Posted: 9/3/2004 7:19:34 PM EST
well hell, muddy, if it was 3am and i was drunker'n hell and couldn't type i'd say the same thing.

Link Posted: 9/4/2004 9:33:49 AM EST
I actually have a semi-tactical 1300 Defender. It has the full length magazine tube (7+1) and a Speedfeed pistol grip stock. The pump-release location does take a little getting used to, but it really doesn't make that much difference. I like the gun just as much as any 870 or Mossy I have ever owned!
Link Posted: 9/6/2004 5:54:22 AM EST
I personally like the pump release on the Winchesters better than the Rems or Mossys. All I have to do is barely rotate my right hand (firing hand) and I can hit it with my thumb. Lot better than having to break my entire firing grip for the Rem and Mossy pump release.
Granted though, my fingers and thumb are fairly long; if they were shorter, maybe I'd prefer the Rem/Mossy style. I still think it'd be faster to get back to firing grip on the Winchester though.
Link Posted: 9/7/2004 5:12:01 AM EST
bump
Link Posted: 9/10/2004 7:18:35 AM EST
Copy of my text from another post:


An FN Tactical shotgun is based on the 1300 so all the accessories will work with it.

Since it is based on the 1300 the Aguila minishells should work with it.

The barrel is already ported. It comes with an 18 1/2" barrel and the tube extends all the way to the end of the barrel so no extensions are neccesary. Comes with a built in scope rail for adding optics.

You get a pistol grip and retractable stock. Add a nice AR15 buttstock pad and you are ready to go.

Link Posted: 9/10/2004 5:45:19 PM EST
Seems to me that the consumer(and the pros) has spoken - the 870 is a better shotgun, and all the Winchester whining in the world isn't going to change that...

Waa - no one respects our shotguns... Waa - no one BUYS our shotguns... Waaa, waa, waa....

There, you happy now, ajm1911??? Seeing how you brought it up(and bumped it)...

- georgestrings
Link Posted: 9/10/2004 6:07:25 PM EST
no need to act like that
Link Posted: 9/12/2004 2:14:02 PM EST
[Last Edit: 9/13/2004 2:05:14 PM EST by Jason280]

Originally Posted By georgestrings:
Seems to me that the consumer(and the pros) has spoken - the 870 is a better shotgun, and all the Winchester whining in the world isn't going to change that...

Waa - no one respects our shotguns... Waa - no one BUYS our shotguns... Waaa, waa, waa....

There, you happy now, ajm1911??? Seeing how you brought it up(and bumped it)...

- georgestrings



WTF are you talking about??

I have owned most all of the major shotguns, including Mossy's, Benelli's, Remingtons, etc, and my 1300 Defender has been just as reliable and dependable as any of them. As a matter of fact, I would gladly put the 1300 up against any shotgun on the list. Pump shotguns, inherently, are some of the most relaible guns available. But to say one is better than the other is a good indication of ignorance. How exactly is an 870 better than a 1300, George?
Link Posted: 9/12/2004 5:31:48 PM EST
OK, Jason - I've owned a 1300, a couple of model 37s, a couple of 500s, a nice old model 12, and a handful of 870s - the model 12, the Ithacas, and the 870s all were well made shotguns that had a very solid feel to them - the 1300 just didn't feel as solidly made as my 870s - it seemed closer to the mossy 500s, actually... All those shotguns ended up going down the road, except for three 870s, and an 1100 - out of personal preference... I would also add, that there are probably more 870s in professional use(LEOs) than all other makes combined - why do you think that is???

Like I said before - the market has spoken... I suppose I was just a tad "harsh" in my earlier post, but it seemed to me like the thread had a sort of whining tone of "why don't 1300s sell as well as they should??" - and again, I'd say that if the 1300 WAS a better shotgun than the 870, it would be outselling the 870 - now wouldn't it???


- georgestrings
Link Posted: 9/13/2004 2:04:18 PM EST
[Last Edit: 9/13/2004 2:05:47 PM EST by Jason280]
I see you were still unable to tell us how the 870 is better than the 1300...

Numbers sold has nothing to do with whether one product is better than another. Let's see, Tasco and Bushnell sell a hell of a lot more scopes than Swarovski or Zeiss. So, by your logic, does that mean Tasco and Bushnell scopes are much better because they sell more?? Does it also mean that Ruger makes a better .22 rifle because they sell more than Anshutz or Kimber? Your statement doesn't make a lot of sense, so let's see what kind of negative experiences you have had with the 1300. Since you say the 870 is a much better gun, surely you have had some problems with 1300s in the past. Oh, thats right, you haven't. All you can provide on the subject is that the 1300 simply doesn't "feel as solid to you" as does the 870.

No one is debating whether the 870 is a good shotgun. But to say it is better than the 1300 without any solid evidence as to why is foolish. Both are pump shotguns, and both go "bang" when you pull the trigger. They both cycle reliably, and are easy to maintain. To say one is better than the other quickly shows how little you do know about shotguns. Sure, you may have owned a few, but that does not make you an expert on the subject. Clearly, you have no legitimate information to add to the thread other than you simply don't like the 1300. If you have some valid points to make, feel free. But to sit here and babble on with your BS just shows how little you have to offer on the subject.

I have no problem with the Remington shotguns, nor do I have a problem with Winchesters or Mossy's. I own a 1300 Defender, a semi 1400, and more than a few Remingtons (including an 870 and three 1100s). There all great guns, and serve their purposes well.
Link Posted: 9/13/2004 5:48:07 PM EST
Link Posted: 9/13/2004 6:41:37 PM EST
[Last Edit: 9/13/2004 6:42:46 PM EST by MT_Pockets]
This seems to get pondered over like the Ford vs Chevy vs Dodge questions.

I like the controlled feed of the 1300, the slide release of the 870 and the safety position of the 500.

MT

But you have to admit this looks sexy!

Link Posted: 9/13/2004 6:54:51 PM EST
george I wasn't whinning, I just ask if anyone had experience with a tactical Winchester 1300. I didn't know that the FN was based on a 1300.
Your argument about # produced/used is also flawed because all government agencies go with the lowest bid. They get a deal on the shotgun they buy it. Also a local guy gave me this to think about. The 870 has been around for decades in the same trim, layout, etc. Familiarity with a shotgun means its continued use. The changes in the other products could lead police to shy away. I only wanted to know about practicality of a 1300 tactical project and I found out its feasible.
thanks for your input.
Link Posted: 9/13/2004 7:01:45 PM EST

Originally Posted By muddydog:

the pump is the quickest you'll ever find...




I have to pick the original High Standard Riot for that honor...
Link Posted: 9/16/2004 5:38:20 PM EST
[Last Edit: 9/16/2004 7:31:14 PM EST by GunDraw]
Tommygs and Jason 280 are right on,

Nobody is disputing that the 870 is a good, quality, reliable shotgun. I can be found shooting my Wingmaster on many occasions. However, to out and out call it simply "the best" as so many people on this board do, is really quite silly.

I really don't care what other people shoot. I really don't care what is the most popular. I buy shotguns (and guns in general) I like that fit ME, not what my friends, or what "everybody else" has or says is good.

I've shot a 1200 (almost the same as a 1300) for years, and I just bought a brand new 1300 Sporting/Field. The 1300 fits me like a glove, has a creamy smooth action (need I mention very FAST when you learn to utilize the speed pump), the bolt release is like second nature to me, and the gun is light and nimble. I am nothing but elated with it.

My old 1200 is more of the same. Not to mention the action is WELL broken in and is SILKY smooth. It's like night and day compared to my 870. But like I say, it's my opinion, and I know hands down which shotgun I prefer.

The quality is definitely there as well. The aluminum reciever is well engineered and lighter than it's steel counterparts. (as I know this is bound to be brought up, Aluminum is VERY suitable for shotgun recievers.) The action is great, and the speed pump is a definite plus. NEVER had a problem with ANY of my Winchester shotguns.

If people would actually shop for shotguns based on quality and comfort instead of what everyone else tells them is good, I think there would be many more very pleased Winchester owners. I know I am. However, I'm not gonna go out and say hands down they are the best shotgun ever. Certainly I think it has features that surpass the competition, but to each it's own.

Gundraw
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