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Posted: 7/1/2015 11:47:38 AM EDT
[#1]
AWC got bought out IIRC
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Posted: 7/1/2015 12:04:53 PM EDT
[#2]
Quoted: What happened to AWC and SRT? They seem to have no market share any more. I think AWC and SRT both survive on their integral 22 lines. Those are great but not rocket science. The lack of cutting edge designs and a much more competitive market has resulted in these companies demise. Personally, one of the ways I judge suppressor companies on their ability to make a hearing safe dry .45 can. These have been around for half a decade now but lots of companies still want you to think their wet cans are cutting edge. The Silencer market today offers many more options and information than 5-10 years ago. This is a good thing for the customer. |
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Posted: 7/1/2015 2:59:12 PM EDT
[#3]
I know SRT is still around. I've got an SRT Shadow Ti XL in jail at my LGS right now.
And, I agree you don't hear much about 'em. I asked here and on the hide. The good news is that virtually all of what I was able to find on SRT was positive. Doug just seems to not advertise much from what I can tell. Guess he doesn't have to and if it keep the cost per unit lower, I'm for that, as a consumer. |
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Posted: 7/1/2015 3:47:45 PM EDT
[#4]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
AWC got bought out IIRC I thought this also, but the website is still current and operating under the AWC name. ETA: Lynn McWilliams appears to still be the owner according to the innerweb. |
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Posted: 7/1/2015 5:32:54 PM EDT
[#5]
Didnt SRT get the contract for a bunch of integral MK3 pistols for super-secret squirrels?
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Posted: 7/1/2015 5:40:30 PM EDT
[#6]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Gemtech should be added to this list.bbthey have a fairly robust marketing effort of they would be just as impotent. It's looking like AAC is heading this way now too. I think AWC and SRT both survive on their integral 22 lines. Those are great but not rocket science. The lack of cutting edge designs and a much more competitive market has resulted in these companies demise. Personally, one of the ways I judge suppressor companies on their ability to make a hearing safe dry .45 can. These have been around for half a decade now but lots of companies still want you to think their wet cans are cutting edge. The Silencer market today offers many more options and information than 5-10 years ago. This is a good thing for the customer. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: What happened to AWC and SRT? They seem to have no market share any more. I think AWC and SRT both survive on their integral 22 lines. Those are great but not rocket science. The lack of cutting edge designs and a much more competitive market has resulted in these companies demise. Personally, one of the ways I judge suppressor companies on their ability to make a hearing safe dry .45 can. These have been around for half a decade now but lots of companies still want you to think their wet cans are cutting edge. The Silencer market today offers many more options and information than 5-10 years ago. This is a good thing for the customer. That bit in red is a word salad, for sure. |
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Posted: 7/1/2015 5:55:52 PM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
What? Are you saying they have no market share, they arent turning out products, etc...? That bit in red is a word salad, for sure. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
What happened to AWC and SRT? They seem to have no market share any more. I think AWC and SRT both survive on their integral 22 lines. Those are great but not rocket science. The lack of cutting edge designs and a much more competitive market has resulted in these companies demise. Personally, one of the ways I judge suppressor companies on their ability to make a hearing safe dry .45 can. These have been around for half a decade now but lots of companies still want you to think their wet cans are cutting edge. The Silencer market today offers many more options and information than 5-10 years ago. This is a good thing for the customer. That bit in red is a word salad, for sure. Ya, not sure I agree either. I bought two gemtech cans in the last 9 months and my buddy bought one too. Anecdotes and all. 
Maybe they're not super quiet or they don't have the latest badass QD system but I would think they're still a solid player. Ymmv |
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Posted: 7/1/2015 5:59:21 PM EDT
[#8]
Gemtech seems to be more aggressive about marketing than AAC nowadays. Maybe AAC is resting on their military contracts?
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Posted: 7/1/2015 6:05:39 PM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryQuoted: What? Are you saying they have no market share, they arent turning out products, etc...? That bit in red is a word salad, for sure. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: What happened to AWC and SRT? They seem to have no market share any more. I think AWC and SRT both survive on their integral 22 lines. Those are great but not rocket science. The lack of cutting edge designs and a much more competitive market has resulted in these companies demise. Personally, one of the ways I judge suppressor companies on their ability to make a hearing safe dry .45 can. These have been around for half a decade now but lots of companies still want you to think their wet cans are cutting edge. The Silencer market today offers many more options and information than 5-10 years ago. This is a good thing for the customer. That bit in red is a word salad, for sure. Their rifle cans are nothing special nor are the mounting systems. In fact, the only reason I can think of to go with a Gemtech rifle can is if you are married to an A2 flash hider. Then a Halo might make sense. I do have a Mist-22 in NFA jail but you can reference my original comments on integral 22 cans. The Silencer market today is extremely competitive. Never before has there been so many companies offering cutting edge tech. |
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Posted: 7/1/2015 6:08:37 PM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Ya, not sure I agree either. I bought two gemtech cans in the last 9 months and my buddy bought one too. Anecdotes and all.
Maybe they're not super quiet or they don't have the latest badass QD system but I would think they're still a solid player. Ymmv Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
What happened to AWC and SRT? They seem to have no market share any more. I think AWC and SRT both survive on their integral 22 lines. Those are great but not rocket science. The lack of cutting edge designs and a much more competitive market has resulted in these companies demise. Personally, one of the ways I judge suppressor companies on their ability to make a hearing safe dry .45 can. These have been around for half a decade now but lots of companies still want you to think their wet cans are cutting edge. The Silencer market today offers many more options and information than 5-10 years ago. This is a good thing for the customer. That bit in red is a word salad, for sure. Ya, not sure I agree either. I bought two gemtech cans in the last 9 months and my buddy bought one too. Anecdotes and all.
Maybe they're not super quiet or they don't have the latest badass QD system but I would think they're still a solid player. Ymmv +1...I have been using my GMT-556QM about 6 months now and the weight, sound on the 10.3" and the repeatable 1" 90 degree POI shift @ 50yrds has me with no complaints. Customer Service was and has been great from my experience communicating with PHD & Joey here on the board too |
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Posted: 7/1/2015 6:15:27 PM EDT
[#11]
Gemtech's marketing is weird. They are trying to be "cool" like SilencerCo. Fancy, overly-tactical videos have progressed to the lifestyle-oriented videos. Eh, whatever. Lets hope the Youtube video thing isnt raising the sticker price of the cans too much. I cant help but think that 25-30 bucks of that 850 dollar SilencerCo Omega price tag is YouTube videos.
I just wish Gemtech would do away with the goofy names like "Dagger" and "Shield" and go back to less bombastic stuff like G5 and HVT. Remember, these are lifetime purchases. Most of their cans are competitive and most of the Silencer buying public is still interested in the technical aspects of the cans. I bet they could sell alot more of them if they limited their marketing to tech-filled overviews by someone like Dr. Dater. Even if their advertisements dont make me want to go out and get Gemtech tattoos, I would still appreciate a little bit of info. |
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Posted: 7/1/2015 6:24:31 PM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Their market share certainly isn't what it was a few years ago. They just released a new .45 can with great fanfare. Not hearing safe, meanwhile some of their competitors have released multiple generations of hearing safe .45acp cans. Their rifle cans are nothing special nor are the mounting systems. In fact, the only reason I can think of to go with a Gemtech rifle can is if you are married to an A2 flash hider. Then a Halo might make sense. I do have a Mist-22 in NFA jail but you can reference my original comments on integral 22 cans. The Silencer market today is extremely competitive. Never before has there been so many companies offering cutting edge tech. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: What happened to AWC and SRT? They seem to have no market share any more. I think AWC and SRT both survive on their integral 22 lines. Those are great but not rocket science. The lack of cutting edge designs and a much more competitive market has resulted in these companies demise. Personally, one of the ways I judge suppressor companies on their ability to make a hearing safe dry .45 can. These have been around for half a decade now but lots of companies still want you to think their wet cans are cutting edge. The Silencer market today offers many more options and information than 5-10 years ago. This is a good thing for the customer. That bit in red is a word salad, for sure. Their rifle cans are nothing special nor are the mounting systems. In fact, the only reason I can think of to go with a Gemtech rifle can is if you are married to an A2 flash hider. Then a Halo might make sense. I do have a Mist-22 in NFA jail but you can reference my original comments on integral 22 cans. The Silencer market today is extremely competitive. Never before has there been so many companies offering cutting edge tech. The bilock mount point you made is off base, in my opinion. I think the bilock is an excellent mount. Its as good, or better than the ASR mount, and much better than the 51T mount. There is no chance of the can loosening on the mount or not properly engaging the lugs. It gets stuck on about as much as every other mount does these days, but its intuitive and foolproof. Its one handed, simple, and consistent. I would go so far as to say its arguably be the best QD mount available. YMMV. |
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Posted: 7/1/2015 6:39:14 PM EDT
[#13]
It may equal the SiCo ASR mount but not the Trifecta.
And AAC has released the 90 tooth mounts which are suppose to somehow be better than the 51 tooth. I haven't tried them. |
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Posted: 7/1/2015 6:56:54 PM EDT
[#14]
The Trifecta mount is great, but its complex, easily misadjusted, and easy to install improperly.
The Trifecta may be a more accurate mount, since it seats the can on a taper and has no slop, but its nowhere near as intutitive as the bilock. Frankly, if absolute accuracy is your thing, the whole QD world will be sorely lacking. I know nothing about the 90T system either. Of course, I never thought the wobble on the AAC cans was a big deal. I only thought it was a problem if the can would back off. |
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Posted: 7/1/2015 7:10:57 PM EDT
[#15]
First complaints I've ever heard about the Trifecta. Got a few ordered, too.
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Posted: 7/1/2015 8:10:16 PM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Gemtech should be added to this list.bbthey have a fairly robust marketing effort of they would be just as impotent. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
What happened to AWC and SRT? They seem to have no market share any more. You need to realize the Silencer market is a lot bigger than the handful of companies that are internet darlings. Just because fanbois are not raving about it on the internet, does not mean it is not good or selling. Gemtech makes the best 9mm subgun can, period. Their Uzi-specific Mossad is also top notch. The Viper 45 is as good as it gets for 45 subguns and the Outback is a top performer. |
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Posted: 7/1/2015 8:37:13 PM EDT
[#17]
Subgun cans are a niche within a small market. But the MK9 is a great can, it can be hard to find in stock though. Surely that cuts down on sales
The Outback is good but so is every .22lr can. Gemtech still does a good bit of business but less than they use to and it will continue to decline unless something changes. They just aren't keeping up with their competitors. Same thing that happened with AWC and SRT. |
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Posted: 7/1/2015 9:14:59 PM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Gemtech still does a good bit of business but less than they use to How do you know this? I thought they were privately held? |
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Posted: 7/1/2015 9:29:39 PM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The bilock mount point you made is off base, in my opinion. I think the bilock is an excellent mount. Its as good, or better than the ASR mount, and much better than the 51T mount. There is no chance of the can loosening on the mount or not properly engaging the lugs. It gets stuck on about as much as every other mount does these days, but its intuitive and foolproof. Its one handed, simple, and consistent. I would go so far as to say its arguably be the best QD mount available. YMMV. Seconded here. I have a Quicksand and G5-T and the bilock mounts are great - easy one hand push and engage. |
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Posted: 7/1/2015 10:20:43 PM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Gemtech should be added to this list.bbthey have a fairly robust marketing effort of they would be just as impotent. It's looking like AAC is heading this way now too. I think AWC and SRT both survive on their integral 22 lines. Those are great but not rocket science. The lack of cutting edge designs and a much more competitive market has resulted in these companies demise. Personally, one of the ways I judge suppressor companies on their ability to make a hearing safe dry .45 can. These have been around for half a decade now but lots of companies still want you to think their wet cans are cutting edge. The Silencer market today offers many more options and information than 5-10 years ago. This is a good thing for the customer. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
What happened to AWC and SRT? They seem to have no market share any more. I think AWC and SRT both survive on their integral 22 lines. Those are great but not rocket science. The lack of cutting edge designs and a much more competitive market has resulted in these companies demise. Personally, one of the ways I judge suppressor companies on their ability to make a hearing safe dry .45 can. These have been around for half a decade now but lots of companies still want you to think their wet cans are cutting edge. The Silencer market today offers many more options and information than 5-10 years ago. This is a good thing for the customer. Wat? They're easily in the top handful. At this point (in no particular order), AAC, Gemtech, and SiCo probably have the most extensive product lines and you can't do that unless you're moving product at a decent clip. As much quality, respect, hype, internet popularity, or whatever shops like Griffin, Liberty, Thompson, Bowers, AWC, whoever.... Look, I can't audit their books but I'd wager Gemtech moves more product than those mentioned in the prior sentence. Disclaimer: own 11 cans.. Various makes. 1 is a Gemtech. |
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Posted: 7/1/2015 11:35:41 PM EDT
[#21]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Subgun cans are a niche within a small market. But the MK9 is a great can, it can be hard to find in stock though. Surely that cuts down on sales The Outback is good but so is every .22lr can. Gemtech still does a good bit of business but less than they use to and it will continue to decline unless something changes. They just aren't keeping up with their competitors. Same thing that happened with AWC and SRT. Gemtech doesn't need gimmicks to sell their product. As asked prior, you an investor in their company. Or getting ready to shill for a company you know? |
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Posted: 7/1/2015 11:53:21 PM EDT
[#22]
I own Gemtech products. But as a company they peaked a long time ago. Come back to this thread in three years. I'll be right.
No hard numbers but I've been around cans for a while. Back in the 00's they were all over the place, top dog. This was before AAC and SWR really took off and before SiCo, Griffin etc. They are still around but when I go can shopping there are A LOT more options. Gemtech's market share is clearly smaller. I am sort of surprised the collective hive-mind wasn't incensed by my categorization of AAC. They are actually still putting out innovative products. Lack of innovation kills companies. But I don't care, you buy what you want. |
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Posted: 7/2/2015 12:39:06 AM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I own Gemtech products. But as a company they peaked a long time ago. Come back to this thread in three years. I'll be right. No hard numbers but I've been around cans for a while. Back in the 00's they were all over the place, top dog. This was before AAC and SWR really took off and before SiCo, Griffin etc. They are still around but when I go can shopping there are A LOT more options. Gemtech's market share is clearly smaller. I am sort of surprised the collective hive-mind wasn't incensed by my categorization of AAC. They are actually still putting out innovative products. Lack of innovation kills companies. But I don't care, you buy what you want. 15 years has given us the gun owner, not only a large selection of mfg to buy suppressors from. It's also given us how many places that sell lowers for $30 - 75 per. 12 years ago the options for a take apart 22 can were what 3 or 4? Now it's the industry standard when producing 22 cans. You left out Thunder Beast (TBA) Their market share is no where near SiCo, or would it be. They cater to the high end, long distance shooter. Do they have their product in the same number of stores SiCo or AAC , of course not. However their product is one of the best out there, for the market they cater to. I stopped buying commercial cans last year, roll my own now. That's a market that could put a dent in suppressor sales across the board, eventually. Especially when i'm in to 3 cans for the price of 1 commercial unit, stamp cost excluded. |
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Posted: 7/2/2015 8:51:46 AM EDT
[#24]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
They are still around but when I go can shopping there are A LOT more options. Quote HistoryQuoted:
They are still around but when I go can shopping there are A LOT more options. GemTech has the largest product offering of anybody. In addition to the "niche" subgun market which few others cover (who else makes a MAC10 or Uzi can, and for a while UMP can), they offer ammo, BBLS, etc. No one else offers all this. SiCo is trying with ammo, and BBLs, but Gemtech has been doing it for a decade or more. And before they made ammo, Gemtech offered Dater subsonic 9mm recipe to homeload. Your opinions are just not in line with the facts. Quoted:
Gemtech's market share is clearly smaller. When you post sales figures, then we will know who has what market share. Till then, it is make-believe. |
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Posted: 7/2/2015 10:04:00 AM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryQuoted: GemTech has the largest product offering of anybody. In addition to the "niche" subgun market which few others cover (who else makes a MAC10 or Uzi can, and for a while UMP can), they offer ammo, BBLS, etc. No one else offers all this. SiCo is trying with ammo, and BBLs, but Gemtech has been doing it for a decade or more. And before they made ammo, Gemtech offered Dater subsonic 9mm recipe to homeload. Your opinions are just not in line with the facts. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: They are still around but when I go can shopping there are A LOT more options. GemTech has the largest product offering of anybody. In addition to the "niche" subgun market which few others cover (who else makes a MAC10 or Uzi can, and for a while UMP can), they offer ammo, BBLS, etc. No one else offers all this. SiCo is trying with ammo, and BBLs, but Gemtech has been doing it for a decade or more. And before they made ammo, Gemtech offered Dater subsonic 9mm recipe to homeload. Your opinions are just not in line with the facts. Great Subgun cans. But my regular old pistol cans work just fine on my MP5K. I'm sure Gemtech's dedicated subgun cans work better but I'm not spending my money to check. I doubt Gemtech has a great market share for ammo or barrels (opinion.) Again lots of options and few reasons to go Gemtech. Everybody makes threaded barrels and the .22lr doesn't do anything CCI standard doesn't. In fact I think it's made by CCI. Their .300 black is great but I think that's a reloaders cartridge if it's going to be bought/shot in any quantity. Gemtech is clearly a big company. But I believe they are on a downward trend. I just see less and less reasons to go Gemtech. They have a robust marketing and distribution network and that helps. But I don't see that lasting. Look at their big releases at SHOT this year... Yawn. Again, this is my opinion. And you know what they say about those. |
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Posted: 7/2/2015 11:29:01 AM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I doubt Gemtech has a great market share for ammo or barrels (opinion.) Well I am not arguing with you, just point out some things you may not know. They pretty much have 100% of the market for drop-in Beretta 21 BBLs, and Sig Mosquito BBLs. They pretty much have 100% of market for fast attach/detach 22 adaptors. Need a Sig or P22 adaptor, again, that is Gemtech. And as mentioned, subguns, A2 mounts, they pretty much own that market too. And right now, they cannot make MIST-22 BBLs to keep up with demand, so that is another market they pretty much have a majority on IMO. So there are a lot of products they make that nobody else makes. Since they have been around so long, they have had some ups and downs, but I would say their product line is the best it has ever been right now. |
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Posted: 7/2/2015 1:01:40 PM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
GemTech has the largest product offering of anybody. In addition to the "niche" subgun market which few others cover (who else makes a MAC10 or Uzi can, and for a while UMP can), they offer ammo, BBLS, etc. No one else offers all this. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
They are still around but when I go can shopping there are A LOT more options. GemTech has the largest product offering of anybody. In addition to the "niche" subgun market which few others cover (who else makes a MAC10 or Uzi can, and for a while UMP can), they offer ammo, BBLS, etc. No one else offers all this. Excuse my ignorance about subguns and subgun cans - are they actually different cans? Even if the attachment/thread pitch was different, why can't you use the same baffle design and just weld the appropriate back end on for a Mac, Uzi, UMP, etc? |
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Posted: 7/2/2015 1:04:33 PM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Excuse my ignorance about subguns and subgun cans - are they actually different cans? Even if the attachment/thread pitch was different, why can't you use the same baffle design and just weld the appropriate back end on for a Mac, Uzi, UMP, etc? Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
They are still around but when I go can shopping there are A LOT more options. GemTech has the largest product offering of anybody. In addition to the "niche" subgun market which few others cover (who else makes a MAC10 or Uzi can, and for a while UMP can), they offer ammo, BBLS, etc. No one else offers all this. Excuse my ignorance about subguns and subgun cans - are they actually different cans? Even if the attachment/thread pitch was different, why can't you use the same baffle design and just weld the appropriate back end on for a Mac, Uzi, UMP, etc? Generally bigger and can take F/A abuse. Current generation of pistol cans are very good for this role, but the larger volume of subgun cans makes them sound great. |
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Posted: 7/2/2015 1:08:55 PM EDT
[#29]
This forum is full of Surefire and Silencerco fanboys. Gemtech, YHM, and AAC are all doing just fine.
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Posted: 7/2/2015 1:14:35 PM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryQuoted: AAC are all doing just fine. Also discontinued the Tirant 9 which is still king on dbs (lots of people make their decisions on that.) Not fine. Btw I totally get the whole "forum fanboy" disdain. But that's a real factor and it's only growing more important. Younger guys go to this site and others to make their decisions. |
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Posted: 7/2/2015 1:22:19 PM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Generally bigger and can take F/A abuse. Current generation of pistol cans are very good for this role, but the larger volume of subgun cans makes them sound great. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
They are still around but when I go can shopping there are A LOT more options. GemTech has the largest product offering of anybody. In addition to the "niche" subgun market which few others cover (who else makes a MAC10 or Uzi can, and for a while UMP can), they offer ammo, BBLS, etc. No one else offers all this. Excuse my ignorance about subguns and subgun cans - are they actually different cans? Even if the attachment/thread pitch was different, why can't you use the same baffle design and just weld the appropriate back end on for a Mac, Uzi, UMP, etc? Generally bigger and can take F/A abuse. Current generation of pistol cans are very good for this role, but the larger volume of subgun cans makes them sound great. Bowers has a pretty significant presence and reputation in the subgun suppressor realm |
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Posted: 7/2/2015 2:43:03 PM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Generally bigger and can take F/A abuse. Current generation of pistol cans are very good for this role, but the larger volume of subgun cans makes them sound great. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: They are still around but when I go can shopping there are A LOT more options. GemTech has the largest product offering of anybody. In addition to the "niche" subgun market which few others cover (who else makes a MAC10 or Uzi can, and for a while UMP can), they offer ammo, BBLS, etc. No one else offers all this. Excuse my ignorance about subguns and subgun cans - are they actually different cans? Even if the attachment/thread pitch was different, why can't you use the same baffle design and just weld the appropriate back end on for a Mac, Uzi, UMP, etc? Generally bigger and can take F/A abuse. Current generation of pistol cans are very good for this role, but the larger volume of subgun cans makes them sound great. Less backpressure running full auto than my Octane 9 (which is a nice can but I prefer the MK9K for full auto)  Also like my .45 UMP can that Gemtech did for me with an UZI barrel nut mount. Pretty compact, Full auto rated .45 UZI can.  |
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Posted: 7/2/2015 2:47:53 PM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Also like my .45 UMP can that Gemtech did for me with an UZI barrel nut mount. Pretty compact, Full auto rated .45 UZI can. http://www.c3junkie.com/uzi/magcatches/magcatches-1.jpg Looks like they mated the UMP can to a Mossad mount? |
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Posted: 7/2/2015 3:00:03 PM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Looks like they mated the UMP can to a Mossad mount? Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Also like my .45 UMP can that Gemtech did for me with an UZI barrel nut mount. Pretty compact, Full auto rated .45 UZI can. http://www.c3junkie.com/uzi/magcatches/magcatches-1.jpg Looks like they mated the UMP can to a Mossad mount? Sorta....It was a one off that Dr Dater did for me. It is using a cut down UZI barrel. It is sticks out around 1/2" in front of the flange. I really wanted a .45 'MK45K'....Dr. Dater has done so many different things that I think he forgets all the stuff he's done. He mentioned that he never did a MK45K and one of my friends bought a used one off the boards and he forgot he ever made those. |
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Posted: 7/2/2015 3:07:58 PM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
The GM45 pissed me off, too. I can easily foresee poor sales on that one. They shouldnt even have let that one go to market. In my opinion, if your .45 can isnt "hearing safe" dry, you are five years behind the market. Why is that? The GM45 is a short can, not a full size one. None of the 6"-ish 45 cans are hearing safe dry. It will sell just like the other smaller ones will as it performs the same as them. |
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Posted: 7/2/2015 4:26:32 PM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Generally bigger and can take F/A abuse. Current generation of pistol cans are very good for this role, but the larger volume of subgun cans makes them sound great. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
They are still around but when I go can shopping there are A LOT more options. GemTech has the largest product offering of anybody. In addition to the "niche" subgun market which few others cover (who else makes a MAC10 or Uzi can, and for a while UMP can), they offer ammo, BBLS, etc. No one else offers all this. Excuse my ignorance about subguns and subgun cans - are they actually different cans? Even if the attachment/thread pitch was different, why can't you use the same baffle design and just weld the appropriate back end on for a Mac, Uzi, UMP, etc? Generally bigger and can take F/A abuse. Current generation of pistol cans are very good for this role, but the larger volume of subgun cans makes them sound great. I read your original post in this quote tree as: Gemtech makes multiple subgun cans for different subguns i.e. Mac, uzi, UMP. I can grasp why a subgun can is different than a pistol can but I was wondering why Gemtech would make multiple sugbun cans. Maybe I'm misinterpreting. |
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Posted: 7/2/2015 5:08:48 PM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Why is that? The GM45 is a short can, not a full size one. None of the 6"-ish 45 cans are hearing safe dry. It will sell just like the other smaller ones will as it performs the same as them. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: The GM45 pissed me off, too. I can easily foresee poor sales on that one. They shouldnt even have let that one go to market. In my opinion, if your .45 can isnt "hearing safe" dry, you are five years behind the market. Why is that? The GM45 is a short can, not a full size one. None of the 6"-ish 45 cans are hearing safe dry. It will sell just like the other smaller ones will as it performs the same as them. However, Gemtech simply doesnt have a 45 can in their catalog that is hearing safe, dry. I think they should square that away before they go down the "K can" road. |
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Posted: 7/2/2015 5:12:00 PM EDT
[#38]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I read your original post in this quote tree as: Gemtech makes multiple subgun cans for different subguns i.e. Mac, uzi, UMP. I can grasp why a subgun can is different than a pistol can but I was wondering why Gemtech would make multiple sugbun cans. Maybe I'm misinterpreting. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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They are still around but when I go can shopping there are A LOT more options. GemTech has the largest product offering of anybody. In addition to the "niche" subgun market which few others cover (who else makes a MAC10 or Uzi can, and for a while UMP can), they offer ammo, BBLS, etc. No one else offers all this. Excuse my ignorance about subguns and subgun cans - are they actually different cans? Even if the attachment/thread pitch was different, why can't you use the same baffle design and just weld the appropriate back end on for a Mac, Uzi, UMP, etc? Generally bigger and can take F/A abuse. Current generation of pistol cans are very good for this role, but the larger volume of subgun cans makes them sound great. I read your original post in this quote tree as: Gemtech makes multiple subgun cans for different subguns i.e. Mac, uzi, UMP. I can grasp why a subgun can is different than a pistol can but I was wondering why Gemtech would make multiple sugbun cans. Maybe I'm misinterpreting. Gotcha. Do not have an answer but those cans were designed during different periods so may it was based on customer req at time? |
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Posted: 7/2/2015 6:49:41 PM EDT
[#39]
^^
Ahh, thanks for the reply |
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Posted: 7/3/2015 5:51:25 PM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
The Trifecta mount is great, but its complex, easily misadjusted, and easy to install improperly. The Trifecta may be a more accurate mount, since it seats the can on a taper and has no slop, but its nowhere near as intutitive as the bilock. Frankly, if absolute accuracy is your thing, the whole QD world will be sorely lacking. I know nothing about the 90T system either. Of course, I never thought the wobble on the AAC cans was a big deal. I only thought it was a problem if the can would back off. Your'e kidding about the trifecta mount right? i mean really? How could you POSSIBLY install it improperly? |
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Posted: 7/3/2015 5:59:35 PM EDT
[#41]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Your'e kidding about the trifecta mount right? i mean really? How could you POSSIBLY install it improperly? I'm going to guess he's talking about installing the can on the mount, not the mount on the barrel. That happens quite often to people on here, where they think it's locked on but it's not. |
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Posted: 7/3/2015 9:08:16 PM EDT
[#42]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Aquired by Freedom Group and just about everybody that worked there has been fired or defected. Mostly to Sig.Also discontinued the Tirant 9 which is still king on dbs (lots of people make their decisions on that.) Not fine. Btw I totally get the whole "forum fanboy" disdain. But that's a real factor and it's only growing more important. Younger guys go to this site and others to make their decisions. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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AAC are all doing just fine. Not fine. Btw I totally get the whole "forum fanboy" disdain. But that's a real factor and it's only growing more important. Younger guys go to this site and others to make their decisions. AAC still has a big part of the market. They've moved on with some of their best sellers, but that's to be expected. People laud SCO and others for making new products, but somehow AAC coming out with new products (admittedly very late) is a sign of their demise? |
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Posted: 7/3/2015 10:13:13 PM EDT
[#43]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
AAC still has a big part of the market. They've moved on with some of their best sellers, but that's to be expected. People laud SCO and others for making new products, but somehow AAC coming out with new products (admittedly very late) is a sign of their demise? Quote HistoryQuoted:
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AAC are all doing just fine. Not fine. Btw I totally get the whole "forum fanboy" disdain. But that's a real factor and it's only growing more important. Younger guys go to this site and others to make their decisions. AAC still has a big part of the market. They've moved on with some of their best sellers, but that's to be expected. People laud SCO and others for making new products, but somehow AAC coming out with new products (admittedly very late) is a sign of their demise? Can we say the illusion is a down grade? At least in a somewhat different subcategory? What is their new flagship 556? SR7 or something? No typical in your face AAC marketing ensuring I know what the flagship is... Is it at least as quiet as the M4-2k? Neither here not there but why was their SPR discontinued? Lauded as the quietest 556 available. Why try to sell the consumer "new coke" when coca cola is amazingly popular? It's borderline insulting to tell customers "51t wobble" is okay and then develop 90t. And don't tell me AAC couldn't have two main 556 cans - see saker and specwar. Anyone who argues AAC is no longer a major player most likely gets crayons for Christmas but their reputation has suffered. Ymmv |
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Posted: 7/3/2015 10:25:42 PM EDT
[#44]
Quote HistoryQuoted: AAC still has a big part of the market. They've moved on with some of their best sellers, but that's to be expected. People laud SCO and others for making new products, but somehow AAC coming out with new products (admittedly very late) is a sign of their demise? Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: AAC are all doing just fine. Not fine. Btw I totally get the whole "forum fanboy" disdain. But that's a real factor and it's only growing more important. Younger guys go to this site and others to make their decisions. AAC still has a big part of the market. They've moved on with some of their best sellers, but that's to be expected. People laud SCO and others for making new products, but somehow AAC coming out with new products (admittedly very late) is a sign of their demise? I'm just questioning why they discontinued the TiRant-9 but left the TiRant-9s still in production. So what did they save by killing off the TiRant-9? They still have to make 9mm Ti-Rant baffles, they still have to make 9mm endcaps, they still have to make 9mm pistons and piston housings, they still have to source Titanium tubes for the 9s. The instruction manuals are the same ... so they don't have to cut the outer tube longer and might not need the bigger pouch for the TiRant 9? Don't see why the TiRant-9 and Illusion couldn't coexist since they're still making pretty much all the 9mm TiRant parts. |
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Posted: 7/3/2015 10:33:57 PM EDT
[#45]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I'm just questioning why they discontinued the TiRant-9 but left the TiRant-9s still in production. So what did they save by killing off the TiRant-9? They still have to make 9mm Ti-Rant baffles, they still have to make 9mm endcaps, they still have to make 9mm pistons and piston housings, they still have to source Titanium tubes for the 9s. The instruction manuals are the same ... so they don't have to cut the outer tube longer and might not need the bigger pouch for the TiRant 9? Don't see why the TiRant-9 and Illusion couldn't coexist since they're still making pretty much all the 9mm TiRant parts. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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AAC are all doing just fine. Not fine. Btw I totally get the whole "forum fanboy" disdain. But that's a real factor and it's only growing more important. Younger guys go to this site and others to make their decisions. AAC still has a big part of the market. They've moved on with some of their best sellers, but that's to be expected. People laud SCO and others for making new products, but somehow AAC coming out with new products (admittedly very late) is a sign of their demise? I'm just questioning why they discontinued the TiRant-9 but left the TiRant-9s still in production. So what did they save by killing off the TiRant-9? They still have to make 9mm Ti-Rant baffles, they still have to make 9mm endcaps, they still have to make 9mm pistons and piston housings, they still have to source Titanium tubes for the 9s. The instruction manuals are the same ... so they don't have to cut the outer tube longer and might not need the bigger pouch for the TiRant 9? Don't see why the TiRant-9 and Illusion couldn't coexist since they're still making pretty much all the 9mm TiRant parts. This way there is no choice and sometimes that's easier for the company. |
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Posted: 7/4/2015 2:52:45 AM EDT
[#46]
Forgot sure fire and Templar tactical
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Posted: 7/4/2015 4:12:09 AM EDT
[#47]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I'm going to guess he's talking about installing the can on the mount, not the mount on the barrel. That happens quite often to people on here, where they think it's locked on but it's not. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Your'e kidding about the trifecta mount right? i mean really? How could you POSSIBLY install it improperly? I'm going to guess he's talking about installing the can on the mount, not the mount on the barrel. That happens quite often to people on here, where they think it's locked on but it's not. It has happened to several people. I intentionally tried to get mine to lock improperly but it locked every time so I'm not sure what is happening to cause it. |
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Posted: 7/4/2015 10:29:39 AM EDT
[#48]
Quote HistoryQuoted: It has happened to several people. I intentionally tried to get mine to lock improperly but it locked every time so I'm not sure what is happening to cause it. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: Your'e kidding about the trifecta mount right? i mean really? How could you POSSIBLY install it improperly? I'm going to guess he's talking about installing the can on the mount, not the mount on the barrel. That happens quite often to people on here, where they think it's locked on but it's not. It has happened to several people. I intentionally tried to get mine to lock improperly but it locked every time so I'm not sure what is happening to cause it. I really do love the Trifecta. I like that it seats on a taper, and when its properly seated, the lockup is superior to the other QD mounts out there. The downside is the complexity of the mount and the fact that it must be properly configured prior to installation. YHM, Gemtech, AAC, SWR, Griffin and Surefire mounts dont need this. I am not familiar with the Rugged or Dead Air mounts yet. There is something to be said for simplicity. |
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Posted: 7/4/2015 12:56:19 PM EDT
[#49]
It really does seem like AAC has next to no online presence nowadays.
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Posted: 7/4/2015 1:26:35 PM EDT
[#50]
Quote HistoryQuoted: It really does seem like AAC has next to no online presence nowadays. The Illusion is very interesting to me. I'm waiting to see some reviews. |
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