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Posted: 4/30/2009 5:37:24 AM EDT
Hello shotgun forum.

I'm thinking that now might be the time to pick up one of these.
I have zero knowledge of these firearms.

Can someone point me to some info (such as a forum) that would give me the basics, such tath I can at least determine what my choices might be?
Also, if anyone has any suggestions for a good model, please let me know.
thanks for your help.
Link Posted: 4/30/2009 5:44:42 AM EDT
http://forum.saiga-12.com/


you want model IZ-109 then convert it yourself, or find an expensive Tromix conversion.
Link Posted: 4/30/2009 8:58:19 AM EDT
The specific forums that the others posted

Why do you want one? Just asking. Any special reason?
Link Posted: 4/30/2009 10:17:38 AM EDT
Reasons:

Rumored to be extremely reliable
Relatively inexpensive
20 round Drum
12 Round Magazine
10 Round Magazine
Might not be around for long
12 gauge is cheaper than xm193
Link Posted: 4/30/2009 11:38:52 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Gthirteen:
Reasons:

Rumored to be extremely reliable
Relatively inexpensive
20 round Drum
12 Round Magazine
10 Round Magazine
Might not be around for long
12 gauge is cheaper than xm193



+1

Just ordered one yesterday for the same reasons.

(I was able to get it online for $499 from a pretty large supplier).
Link Posted: 4/30/2009 11:47:19 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/30/2009 12:28:53 PM EDT by Gthirteen]
Originally Posted By billyjoebob:
Originally Posted By Gthirteen:
Reasons:

Rumored to be extremely reliable
Relatively inexpensive
20 round Drum
12 Round Magazine
10 Round Magazine
Might not be around for long
12 gauge is cheaper than xm193



+1

Just ordered one yesterday for the same reasons.

(I was able to get it online for $499 from a pretty large supplier).


do tell do tell....

ALso, who manufactures these things?
Is it one company in Russia?
Link Posted: 4/30/2009 2:21:52 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/30/2009 2:24:20 PM EDT by shadesofgrey]
Originally Posted By Gthirteen:
Originally Posted By billyjoebob:
Originally Posted By Gthirteen:
Reasons:

Rumored to be extremely reliable
Relatively inexpensive
20 round Drum
12 Round Magazine
10 Round Magazine
Might not be around for long
12 gauge is cheaper than xm193



+1

Just ordered one yesterday for the same reasons.

(I was able to get it online for $499 from a pretty large supplier).


do tell do tell....

ALso, who manufactures these things?
Is it one company in Russia?

One company,
Ижевский Mашзавод

Izhevsk Mechanical Works
Or, more popularly known as
IZHMASH

ETA:  I tell everyone considering one to buy now if they want one.  These could be prohibited to import tomorrow by Executive Order, no AWB necessary.
Link Posted: 4/30/2009 5:49:39 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/30/2009 5:59:32 PM EDT by billyjoebob]
do tell do tell....

Check your in-box

**EDIT** a few other IM's sent as well
Link Posted: 4/30/2009 7:04:50 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/30/2009 7:08:23 PM EDT by Gthirteen]
Originally Posted By shadesofgrey:
Originally Posted By Gthirteen:
Originally Posted By billyjoebob:
Originally Posted By Gthirteen:
Reasons:

Rumored to be extremely reliable
Relatively inexpensive
20 round Drum
12 Round Magazine
10 Round Magazine
Might not be around for long
12 gauge is cheaper than xm193





+1

Just ordered one yesterday for the same reasons.

(I was able to get it online for $499 from a pretty large supplier).


do tell do tell....

ALso, who manufactures these things?
Is it one company in Russia?

One company,
Ижевский Mашзавод

Izhevsk Mechanical Works
Or, more popularly known as
IZHMASH

ETA:  I tell everyone considering one to buy now if they want one.  These could be prohibited to import tomorrow by Executive Order, no AWB necessary.



Then who is this Russian American Arms that seems to "make" these shotguns?

Are there multiple manufacturers?

Also, anyone know if a model fitting these characteristics is available?
19" with threaded barrel that ships with replaceable choke tubes, and having adjustable sights?

Link Posted: 4/30/2009 7:17:34 PM EDT
Just got two so my son and I can play 3 Gun a little better.  Lots of fun.  Put a muzzle break, railed forearm, six position stock pistol grip, new gas plug, new gas piston, and competition springs in mind.  Now it's a monster with a 12 round mag.  Sure Gun Mags work best IMHO.  Our's are cylinder bore with a thread protector.  Several external chokes, including a polychoke are available.  They're combat shotguns and right out of the box work best with full power loads.  Check Saiga12.com for lots of links to vendors for modification to get Wally World inexpensive ammo to work.  If you install a pistol grip you'll need to be aware and comply with 922R.  Our's took some polishing and 4 or 5 boxes of shell for break in before they ran without FTE.  They're a blast!!
Link Posted: 4/30/2009 7:31:06 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/30/2009 7:33:49 PM EDT by shadesofgrey]
Originally Posted By Gthirteen:
Originally Posted By shadesofgrey:
Originally Posted By Gthirteen:
Originally Posted By billyjoebob:
Originally Posted By Gthirteen:
Reasons:

Rumored to be extremely reliable
Relatively inexpensive
20 round Drum
12 Round Magazine
10 Round Magazine
Might not be around for long
12 gauge is cheaper than xm193





+1

Just ordered one yesterday for the same reasons.

(I was able to get it online for $499 from a pretty large supplier).


do tell do tell....

ALso, who manufactures these things?
Is it one company in Russia?

One company,
Ижевский Mашзавод

Izhevsk Mechanical Works
Or, more popularly known as
IZHMASH

ETA:  I tell everyone considering one to buy now if they want one.  These could be prohibited to import tomorrow by Executive Order, no AWB necessary.



Then who is this Russian American Arms that seems to "make" these shotguns?
The importer, not the manufacturer
Are there multiple manufacturers?
no
Also, anyone know if a model fitting these characteristics is available?
19" with threaded barrel that ships with replaceable choke tubes, and having adjustable sights?



Link Posted: 5/1/2009 12:01:43 AM EDT
billyjoebob-
IM sent!
Link Posted: 5/1/2009 2:48:54 AM EDT

Also, anyone know if a model fitting these characteristics is available?
19" with threaded barrel that ships with replaceable choke tubes, and having adjustable sights?



Kinda, sorta....look here

Link Posted: 5/1/2009 5:39:37 AM EDT
Good info. Thanks guys.

Does anyone suggest a different model?
Link Posted: 5/1/2009 6:03:14 AM EDT
I had a Saiga 308 for a while. Pretty decent weapon, but you have to get used to the fit and finish. Pretty much looks like it was made in your basement-as do all Saigas. That one was handicapped by the fact that AK parts wouldn't fit and it didn't shoot as well as a good quality AK. The worst thing was the trigger. It was made for the 1980 East German Women's Weight Lifting team!!  

I don't think anyone mentioned this: Russian American Arms is simply a warehouse in FL (IIRC) that serves as an importer. I've never owned or shot the Saiga-12 though the folks who have them are pretty satisfied.
Link Posted: 5/1/2009 6:04:56 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Gthirteen:
Good info. Thanks guys.

Does anyone suggest a different model?

The most common stock models that are available in US:

24" bbl Non-treaded Fixed / Full Fixed
22" bbl Non-treaded Fixed / Full Fixed
22" bbl Threaded 3 chokes         Fixed
19" bbl Non-treaded Fixed / IC   Fixed
19" bbl Non-treaded Fixed / Full Adjustable
19" bbl Threaded 1 choke     Adjustable

Go here and learn how to build it into what you want.
Link Posted: 5/1/2009 8:40:22 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 5/1/2009 10:11:39 AM EDT by bash0321]
The Russian chokes thread on externally, but we have done some with Remchokes.

edit: alot of guys use the polychoke as well, and there is a model made with the correct threads.

The mag-fed design makes for a great SBS, here's my personal one:



Link Posted: 5/1/2009 8:57:10 AM EDT
Originally Posted By bash0321:
The Russian chokes thread on externally, but we have done some with Remchokes.

The mag-fed design makes for a great SBS, here's my personal one:

http://i186.photobucket.com/albums/x8/BobAsh_album/F2.jpg

http://i186.photobucket.com/albums/x8/BobAsh_album/F1.jpg


Bob Ash of Tromix.

I love the skull charging handle.

I might have to do something similar on my 308 Galil build but facing forward.
Link Posted: 5/1/2009 8:59:33 AM EDT
that's just badass.
Link Posted: 5/1/2009 10:03:13 AM EDT
Originally Posted By SOC:
I might have to do something similar on my 308 Galil build but facing forward


In stock now at MAA and CSS.  You can weld it on any direction you like!

Link Posted: 5/1/2009 10:09:35 AM EDT
Originally Posted By persimmonpete:
I had a Saiga 308 for a while. Pretty decent weapon, but you have to get used to the fit and finish. Pretty much looks like it was made in your basement-as do all Saigas. That one was handicapped by the fact that AK parts wouldn't fit and it didn't shoot as well as a good quality AK. The worst thing was the trigger


The fit & finish are pretty regular for an AK, if you're an AR guy they do look pretty rough.

The 308 is the most different of the Saiga rifles when it comes to parts; not sure which parts you mean but the 762 Saiga takes pretty much all AK parts including the mags.

The triggers are terrible because of the "sporterizing" necessary for import.  One of the best reasons to convert, IMO.



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