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9/22/2017 12:11:25 AM
Posted: 11/24/2003 2:37:21 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/12/2003 3:36:36 AM EDT by Chuck]
I spoke with a gunsmith in West Virginia couple 4 years ago who told me he was asembleing civillian m-14's from proper parts and I did not follow thru and order one.

I still want one. Does anyone know who this is? Is there a current source for this? Is the rifle Springfield offered as their 'closest clone' worth a look?
Link Posted: 11/25/2003 3:28:12 AM EDT
Watch out for M14s, especially those "assembled from parts." There is one manufacturer currently making M14 receivers in correct,legal configuration - may be Smith, though it could be another. But, other than that, an M14 is considered to be a machine gun, since the original receivers were able to be made full auto. (Remember the BATF "Once a machine gun, always a machine gun.") Any M14, other than the one being current, would have to have Class III paperwork and tax. BEWARE OF REWELDS! There are some out there which have been rewelded from demilitarized M14s. I saw one at a gun show a couple of months ago. Fortunately, I checked battlerifles.com , an excellent source of M1A/M14 knowledge, and was put wise to it. The reweld would be illegal. There are also tales (many, corroborating each other, so it sounds legit) of people having bought what they thought were legit M14 remanufactures only to find they were to be confiscated by BATF because they were
illegal machine guns.

Bottom line, buy an older - meaning 2 years or so - M1A. Look for GI parts, especially bolts and operating rods, etc. The current crop of Springfields, I understand, are using a lot of "newly manufactured", meaning not GI parts, some of which may not be as good a quality as the GI.
Link Posted: 11/25/2003 2:51:13 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/26/2003 2:46:51 AM EDT by Chuck]
Alan --

That gunsmith in Grafton, WV, was Mike Kelly and he was recently inditedindicted on ~350 counts of selling untaxed machineguns.

These rifles were stunning and literally perfect in all respects. They were jig welded, headheat treated, and parkerized. Assembled with correct parts for each rifle. Springfield barrels on Springfield receivers, correct dates, etc. They were made from scrap and were semiautomatic only.

BATF disagreed, and so did the Grand Jury who heard the inditementsindictments. Case has not gone to trial. All the receivers ATF could find were seized if the owners didn't abandon them.

A complete waste of BATF resources, these were semiautomatic rifles.

The case has yet to go to trial.

-- Chuck
Link Posted: 11/25/2003 4:04:15 PM EDT
Chuck, thank you for helping me find 'an old ad'.

I remember Mr.Kelly's open and public ad. I also remember his courtesy on the phone. I hope he is found to have made a mistake. Good thing I never got involved. I still want one, legally of course.

Excuse me, I gotta go!
Link Posted: 11/25/2003 4:56:21 PM EDT
What's that sound? Did someone open a can of worms?
Link Posted: 11/26/2003 2:44:52 AM EDT
There should be a long thread on this in this section. The case has not gone to trial and the "can of worms," if there is one, will be opened at that time. I believe Kelly's customers included a federal judge, US senator, and general officers.

This may turn out to be a landmark case, we'll have to wait and see.

-- Chuck
Link Posted: 11/26/2003 4:27:12 AM EDT
Chuck, I'm just saying that everytime this subject comes up, it turns into a big mess. That's all.
People who lost money accuse Kelly of being a thief and want him executed. People who don't believe in the "once a machinegun, always a machinegun" rule, think he's a great guy. I'd like to see him win this but I doubt he will.
Link Posted: 11/26/2003 2:59:45 PM EDT
Springfield Armory, Inc. sells very good receivers. Though they are cast they are strong enough. The heat treatment and dimensional geometry of their receivers are very good too. The same for Armscorp.

If you can find someone willing to sell their Smith Enterprise receiver/rifle buy it!
Link Posted: 11/26/2003 3:16:46 PM EDT
We're on the same page. If the case is decided in Kelly's favor and ATF has used their "once a machinegun" rule -- which has no status in law -- this will prove to be a landmark case.

The rifles Kelly made could be just as easily converted to full auto as the current M1A.

-- Chuck
Link Posted: 12/8/2003 2:36:58 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Chuck:
The rifles Kelly made could be just as easily converted to full auto as the current M1A.
-- Chuck

Shouldn't that be "just as difficult"?
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