Is there a document, manual or place I can visit on the web that will describe specifically what is required to qualify as expert in either the Marine Corps or Army?  I am learning to shoot and would like to get whatever exact targets, time limits, distances, etc. would be appropriate to qualify with my S&W M&P 15.  I assume this would have to be done with iron sights only, no EOTECHS, ACOGS, etc.  Thank you for any help you can provide.

Respectfully,

Jet

I don't know if this will help you or not but if you can print this out, standard 8.5"X11" it will give you something to work with.

The instructions are on it.  You shoot it at 50 ft.  I use these quite a bit on my own 100 yard range when I can't get to my gun club.  It helps to keep me sharp.

Sorry I can't loan you a 300 meter range with pop up targets.

If I remember right, to qualify expert in the army you have to be able to hit at least 36 out of 40 targets on the qualification range.   Half are shot standing, but supported, from a foxhole and half are shot from the prone.

Don't go by the Army range BS. They still have the shooter stand in a pose from WWII.(Bent knee, slombed over). Find something like LAPD standards. Expert in the Army means you drew a weapon that wasn't half way worn out. Plus the rounds they give you were made made by the lowest bidder.

Quoted: Don't go by the Army range BS. They still have the shooter stand in a pose from WWII.(Bent knee, slombed over). Find something like LAPD standards. Expert in the Army means you drew a weapon that wasn't half way worn out. Plus the rounds they give you were made made by the lowest bidder.

+1

I carried the S&W Model 10 for four years in the Army, which is about the same gun as the M15 except without the sights a GI could break.

It wasn't exactly a test of what you needed to survive anything.  It was sort of a test to see if you could operate a revolver, knew which end the bullets came out of, and didn't kill anyone in the process.  That was about it.  

I'll see if I can dig it up anyway for the revolver.  It would be the same course of fire, regardless of revolver.

On a somewhat related note:  If you are in the military and qualify expert on any weapon, insist on getting a copy of the paperwork for yourself, instead of letting it go into your range file!

I qual'd expert for M16 & 9mm during tech school (95).  Ribbon with oak cluster.  Qualified same every time I shot.  When I went to outprocess in 99, my 214 did not list expert on either under awards/medals.  I asked about it, and eventually got upset (not yelling, but rather ticked) - they could not find any records for my ever qualifying...even though it was a requirement for both weapons.

It doesn't really matter in the long run, but still ticks me off when I have to turn over a DD214 for anything

OK, What we usually shot was the Alternate Revolver Qualification Course.  Depending upon what era manual you look at, the courses are different, but the RQC/ARQC were the last ones the Army used while it replace the revolvers with the M9.

The RQC used pop-up targets, and honestly I've never shot it in the Army because no one ever had a range for it.  The ARQC uses a 25 meter range, and every post has one of those, so that's actually what most people probably used.

All ranges are 25m.
Targets are an E-type silhouette with the scoring rings.  It's the one with "5" in the middle, "4" outside of that, and "3" outside of that along the edges.  If you can't find it, just modify the scoring to fit.
There is no speed reloading.  All reloading is controlled and does not factor into time or score in anyway.

Fire the following tables:

6 rounds standing, 21 seconds

12 rounds kneeling, start from a standing postion, assume a kneeling postion, engage the target with six rounds within 23 seconds.  Repeat for the other six rounds.

12 rounds crouch, start from a standing, assume a crouch position and engage the target within 23 seconds.  Repeat for the other six rounds.

10 rounds prone, start from standing, assume a prone postion, engage the target with six rounds within 23 seconds.  Repeat for the other four rounds but reduce the time limit to 18 seconds.

Why 40 instead of 50 rounds you might ask?  It's because the old M1911 qual was done with 40 rounds and they made the RQC fit the same number of rounds.  No other really good reason.  

Scoring the qual portion:

You add up the points for each bullet.  Misses or no fires due to time running out are counted as zero.  Add the total score.  You need:

160-200=Expert
120-159=Sharpshooter
80-119  =Marksman

There you go.

There was also an NBC and Night qual, but they were Go/NO GO.

Night: 30 rounds at night, start from standing, assume a crouch, engage six pop-up targets with one round each within 30 seconds.  Repeat for next 24 rounds.  No time on reloading, you have all night.  Out of the 30 targets and 30 rounds you need to hit 5 targets to pass.  

NBC: 20 rounds in NBC gear (mask, etc.) during daylight, engage a single pop-up target with six rounds, repeat for next 14 rounds.  Out of 20 rounds, you need to hit 7 targets to pass.

With night/NBC it's just hits.  Point score doesn't matter.

JetTaylor- Some of these guys are talking about pistol qualification, for some reason.  Don't get confused.  When I was in the Army, we always qualified on 300 meter ranges.  When I was in the NG, we qualified on 25 meter ranges or used the 50 ft. targets I posted above.

The 300 meter range was shot half from the foxhole and half from prone as elmehfudd said.  I was in the Army in the early 80's so I'm sure a lot has changed.

BTW- We had A1's at that time, nobody ever heard of Aimpoint's, ACOG's, etc.  I would'nt know if they let you use them or not.

Thanks guys,

Basically all I'm trying to do is see if I could "qualify" for sniper school.  I don't expect to, especially at my age and with virtually no experience but I just want to do it for the challenge.  I never thought I could do anything with my bolt gun but I did finally put three rounds into a single hole at 100 yards with an ES measurement of 0.192" so I figure I at least had some potential.  When I'm in practice, I seem to be able to keep it around 0.5 MOA.  Since you had to qualify as expert with what I think was just the basic M-16 service rifle, I wanted to see if I could come close with the equivalent of an M-4.  Thanks for your help.

Jet