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Posted: 2/16/2006 1:22:56 PM EDT
[Last Edit: EdAvilaSr]
Link Posted: 2/16/2006 1:20:02 PM EDT
Link Posted: 2/11/2006 11:36:04 PM EDT
Hi Kevin

I'm new to the board and nv mountings.  Wonder if I can get some info on rifle sites?  I am
looking for the best (poor man's) combination unit that can be used as a pocket scope & can also be mounted on a bolt action/ AR15/ FN (IF that is at all possible).  I'm checked out the pvs-14 behind the EOS & reddots, & am looking at the Aurora 8012 (ITT 7210) as another good dual purpose unit, but now that I've seen the Elcan with pvs-14 combo that looks really interesting.  

Naturally I'd like to have a kite system, but most of my needs are for a hand held or helmet mounted cootie catcher so I just have to keep it a bit reasonable for a while.

Any help would be appreciated.

Thanks, HG
Link Posted: 2/11/2006 3:16:41 PM EDT
Link Posted: 2/11/2006 11:38:52 AM EDT
[Last Edit: Victor] [#4]
Link Posted: 2/11/2006 6:31:19 AM EDT
Link Posted: 2/10/2006 8:03:45 PM EDT
Link Posted: 2/10/2006 12:15:33 PM EDT
this came to mind the other day, where earlier in this thread there was mention of tubes from netherlands ect,

Im making a bet with in a few yrs we will see chinese made tubes why?
when a country gives china our smart bomb technology, look up magnaquench , valporaiso In, they used to make the rare earth magnets for our smart bomb stuff as the articles read,
what do you want to bet, image intesifiers are not outside of the reach of chinese manufacturing in time,
some days you wonder,
since we know ITT couldnt give a hoot about the civie market here, you leave a vacume in a market , someone WILL fill it,
Link Posted: 2/9/2006 8:23:23 PM EDT

Have not received an email.

Please try [email protected]

My email in my profile has been flaky as of late.

Thanks again,

Link Posted: 2/6/2006 9:52:19 PM EDT
Thanks murderman- That is kinda what I figured but it just did not feel right.  
Link Posted: 2/6/2006 7:17:54 PM EDT

Originally Posted By M4shooter:
Just picked up a helmet mount for my PVS 14.  Can anybody tell me what the second strap is used for?  It is the peice with the fastex buckle and the u-shape loop.  Thanks_M4

The strap goes through the bracket at the lower rear of the helmet, and the U-loop goes on your chin.....it helps to keep everything from rocking forward and back due to the weight of the NVD cantilevered off the front of the helmet.
Link Posted: 2/6/2006 11:29:06 AM EDT
Link Posted: 2/4/2006 6:14:19 PM EDT
Just picked up a helmet mount for my PVS 14.  Can anybody tell me what the second strap is used for?  It is the peice with the fastex buckle and the u-shape loop.  Thanks_M4
Link Posted: 2/3/2006 10:17:08 PM EDT
Right thread this time, I hope......



Newbie to NVDs

Being in Canada, ITT is out of the question as getting an export permit for civy use is near impossible. I am completely confused as to what to look for in a tube, other than resolution higher number better, Signal to noise ration higher # better These guys list:

Gen 2+ 32 lp/mm min
SuperGen type 1 45
SuperGen type 2 51
XD-4 57
XR-5 64

What does resolution and signal to niose ratio tell me? How can I tell how many blems will be on the tube? Due you have any pics that would show the difference between the type of tubes? (view thru of course) Primary application would be a head mounted unit, similar to a mum, i guess you would call it. Seconday would be weapon mounted, but only intermitantly, mostly for predator control....(we can shoot in the dark to protect our livestock, just not ourselves)

Also for curiosity sake, what would be the resolution of gen 1 and gen 2 for comparison purposes?

Thanks for any help you can offer.
Link Posted: 2/2/2006 12:16:03 AM EDT
I just got my MUM in today and I am impressed, this is my first NV optic and....I'm giddy like a school girl. This is so cool, I went wander around our property for like an hour, it was great.

Crappy pic, doesn't do the tube justice:

I have 2 NV compatible eotecs on the way, and I am looking for a laser and a light.

Any recomendations on helmet to use with the mount?
Link Posted: 2/2/2006 12:20:12 AM EDT
Link Posted: 1/26/2006 2:07:35 PM EDT
Link Posted: 1/21/2006 8:47:11 PM EDT
Is there anything new in the NV market for 2006?
Link Posted: 1/15/2006 7:11:18 PM EDT
I can't believe I didn't find this thread a long time ago....

My original intention was to start a topic later this year regarding night vision devices for use in the civilian world.  After reading this topic, I might as well post here, even though I'm not quite ready to offer exacting details.  That said, please forgive the vagueries and length of this post.

For Phase II of a project I'm working on, I'm interested in assembling what we'll call the "Best Night Vision Kit".  I could use knowledgeable input, here, since it's been a few years since I've conducted any NVD research and the industry seems to have advanced enough to re-evaluate that prior material.  In fact, I'm expecting a good bit of discussion.

Perhaps the single most used watch-word of this project, as it was proposed to me, was "versatility".  There are many excellent NV products on the market which have been optimized for a particular usage, but function poorly outside that arena.  The idea here is to arrive at a kit compiled of the fewest components, of the lightest weight, at the best price, for the widest potential applications, including accessories, case(s), manuals, and spares.

These applications include:
small arms use
long arm CQB use (including lightless building interior)
long arm DMR use
nighttime vehicular operation
photographic surveillance
video surveillance

Anticipated presentation timeframe : 3-4Q06
Anticipated kit prototype submittal : 4Q06-1Q07

My line of thinking is that such a kit cannot be developed in a vacuum.  The only "right" way to do it is to consider all the factors, including optics, cameras used, headsets, commonality of power supply, life cycle, ease of training, etc.  It's a big topic.

To have something to start from, I've selected the components found hereafter.  Your thoughts on better pieces are welcome, but please consider how optimization in one arena will impact another.  Of course, it's not a given there is a single "best" kit possible, although the aim is to try and prove out one way or another.

MUM2 (aka, NVM-001, Mini-14) -- with (hand select) ITT Select Alpha tube (too bad no Pinnacle) -- waterproof to 20m (66'), good for full-on rain and being knocked into a pool; lighter than PVS-14, uses CR123A power cell common to a great deal of illuminators, cameras, etc.  Not certain about exposure to saline environment.

MUM Universal Adapter -- allows adaptation to rifle scope, SLR cameras, video equipment, etc.  Will have to look at specific adapters for the cameras chosen.

Mil.Spec. Headgear -- have read these are not necessarily the most comfortable for long-duration wear.  Will need to be able to run without loss of vision.

Weapon Mount -- would prefer something QD (eg, throwlever), wish for something Titanium or equally weightless.  For scope application, a cantilever mount would be useful to achieve proper eye relief over a KAC BUIS.  The current scope in inventory is a Springfield 4-14x40 TGM.

IR illuminator -- for CQB, the Surefire M1 seems to be high on the list; for longer ranges, well, how can you beat Da Torch?  Have not compared effectiveness (FOV, range) with a M952XM07 using an IR filter in order to reduce kit components.  All powered by CR123As.

IR laser designator -- the going idea for CQB is not to mount the unit to the weapon, so perhaps an IWAL2 (also powered by CR123A).  Proposed tactical reflex sight is new-model Trijicon Tripower, if illuminated reticule is compatible (no field feedback, as yet).

Needs a hard storage case for full kit, list of anticipated spares, other suggested accessories.  No doubt there'll be questions concerning the daylight components, cameras (not research to date), etc., so I'll stop here, except to add one final point.

There was a question regarding individuals who have little-to-no Lutein remaining in their eyes and how the brightness of phosphor/CRT screens might effect them.  For those who may not know, Lutein is a greenish substance in the back of the eye which absorbs excess light that is otherwise transmitted to the optic nerve.  Low Lutein allows for excellent low light vision, but as the eye's natural Auto Brightness Control, its absence makes most illuminated input that much brighter.

Thanks in advance for the feedback.
Link Posted: 1/8/2006 4:22:00 PM EDT
[Last Edit: triggerfinger] [#19]
I just spent a couple of minutes looking at my eotech, I think part of the glare is actually coming from the front lens of the eotech, and being projected onto the "shelf", above the control buttons.  

Now I'm thinking that maybe a couple of inches of "sunshade" may be in order-like the ones used on the front of target scopes.  

Once again, I'm not knocking the setup, but if a guy can tweak extra performance out of a system, why not?

BTW, I did go out last night to a more remote area, sighting at pieces of farm equipment probably 400 yards away.  Even though 100-150 yards might be max for a coyote, in a defensive situation you could make someone very uncomfortable at much longer ranges.
Link Posted: 1/8/2006 10:51:18 AM EDT
[Last Edit: Victor] [#20]
Link Posted: 1/8/2006 8:25:48 AM EDT
[Last Edit: TX_Rancher] [#21]

  I saw the same issue triggerfinger is talking about. My setup is the Eotech and a Mini-14 (no magnification).
  The lights close to the house definitely “cloud” the image, but on anything more then a half moon, I see the same effect in the field. I’m pretty sure it’s the reflected light off the Eotech lens that’s the primary culprit.
  Now the Eotech / Mini is still a very useful tool, and I use mine a lot. Of course if I’m going after game where I need the best sight picture, I use that unbelievable D-740 you sold me (talk about being spoiled!).
  I made a little tent for the Eotech/Mini combo and it cuts the reflected light down considerably, but I did lose some FOV which negatively impacts situational awareness (tolerable, but still a loss).
  To put it in context, if I thought I was going to end up in CQB in an urban environment with a fair amount of ambient light, I would still use the Eotech/Mini combo (minus the “tent”). The sight picture, even with the reflected interference is very serviceable, and a couple thousand times better then your naked eye!
  But if I was planning on hunting on a night with anything more then a quarter moon, the Eotech/Mini combo would not be my choice.
Link Posted: 1/7/2006 11:55:33 AM EDT
Saw that one, why do you think I had to have the eotech?

Any chance that halo effect of the tube itself could be a factor?  Could you try draping a doubled bandana between the two units next time you check out a setup, just to see if you notice a difference?  Halo effect wasn't something I was terribly concerned about when shopping for my pvs-14's, but I can see now that it is a factor.

Another question for you, I think I read that you didn't recommend the 740, and 760 on any caliber higher than 6.8?  How do you think one would fare on a suppressed .308 bolt action?  The recoil impulse actually seems much softer than my AR.  

By the way, thank you for the time on this thread, it really has been informative!
Link Posted: 1/7/2006 12:24:03 PM EDT
[Last Edit: Victor] [#23]
Link Posted: 1/7/2006 10:59:00 AM EDT
[Last Edit: Victor] [#24]
Link Posted: 1/7/2006 2:27:07 AM EDT
Victor, don't think the illuminator could have been on, the worst I noticed the fogging was when I was standing about fifteen yards from the house, light from a window was probably illuminating the eotech.  I did notice, however, that moonlight would give a little of the same effect.  

Leaving the warm house, and going out into 35 degree temps may have added to the glare, as it's pretty humid out.  Tomorrow night, I'll spend more time, and try moving the (mil-spec) convertor objective closer to the eotech.  I'll also spend a little more time removing the thumb-print I put on the eotech lens during mounting, as I'm sure that didn't help matters.  

Don't get me wrong, I'm happy with the setup...I simply mounted the eotech, did a sloppy daylight sight-in job, then with the pvs, got hits on a 8" plate (which needs repainted, by the way) at 100 actual yards.  

Link Posted: 1/6/2006 9:46:34 PM EDT
After finally getting an eotech 552, I tried the pvs-14, 3x convertor, eotech combination tonight.  At first I was a bit disappointed, the image wasn't very good.  Then I noticed that if I shielded the gap between the night vision, and the eotech, things got much clearer.  

There was enough ambient light illuminating the back of the eotech, and the lenses on the pvs-14, to cause a fogging effect.  At first I thought it was only from the lights coming from my house, but after I moved away from the light, I found that even the light from a 3/8 moon degraded  the sight picture.

I'm going to make a tentlike shield, probably out of thin black suede leather to cut down on the light contamination, or maybe something as simple as a paper-towel tube would work.  

Anybody noticed this?  If so, how did you solve the problem?  
Link Posted: 1/6/2006 9:56:14 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Victor:
Someone wanted to see a D-760 with a PAQ-4 along for the ride, so here is a few shots. I placed the laser onto some palm trees next to the transformer.  The other is the same except for I selected to turn on the amber reticule. Distance here around 400yards+.  Btw, I did NOT take out that wire/cable harness you see the reticule center dot covering. Always amazed by what you can REALLY see through good gear!!  Enjoy!


For anyone that is even considering a new NVD - go to vic - you won't be disappointed. Another Satisfied customer
Link Posted: 1/6/2006 11:18:06 PM EDT
Link Posted: 1/6/2006 11:18:39 PM EDT
Link Posted: 12/28/2005 11:28:56 PM EDT
[Last Edit: Victor] [#30]
Link Posted: 12/26/2005 9:04:20 PM EDT
Total noob here.  Have read through the thread at least twice, all of it.  I understand enough to be dangerous now I think.  I am starting to get a handle on which numbers need to be up, or down on the spec sheet.  But, how do you know if you are getting a tube with blems on it or not?  do you just throw 3 grand at em and hope for the best?  Do most places allow you to inspect, and return if you want?
Link Posted: 12/26/2005 11:46:14 PM EDT
[Last Edit: Victor] [#32]
Link Posted: 12/23/2005 7:43:26 PM EDT
Link Posted: 12/24/2005 12:31:20 AM EDT
[Last Edit: edwin907] [#34]
I received my PVS-14 (my xmas present from my girlfriend) today from Victor's friends at OpticsHQ.
This unit is superb, only a couple of tiny black specs in an otherwise perfect image,
If I said I was pleased it would be a tremendous understatement. Likewise, the Pri mount is awesome, now I have to get a helmet mount for it, any one got a used one for sale?
I'll post some photos of it mounted when I get the chance which, with our work schedule, won't be till Chrismas.

Link Posted: 12/24/2005 12:37:12 AM EDT
You need an IR laser!
Link Posted: 12/24/2005 6:30:27 AM EDT
[Last Edit: edwin907] [#36]

Originally Posted By Duffy:
You need an IR laser!

Got one, see the IWAL 2 thread!
This little laser is dang nice!

Link Posted: 12/21/2005 12:44:47 PM EDT
Link Posted: 12/21/2005 12:57:29 PM EDT
Link Posted: 12/21/2005 1:42:59 PM EDT
Damn, you are going to "make" me buy one of those mil-spec 3x's with all this talk.  
Link Posted: 12/20/2005 1:33:58 PM EDT
PRI is the bomb

Link Posted: 12/20/2005 1:48:54 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Duffy:
PRI is the bomb


Got a PRI on the way with my PVS-14 also.

Duffy, did you ever experiment around with the 3X Magnifier with the Aimpoint and the PVS-14 any more?
Looking forward to trying that exact combo on my MRP.
Link Posted: 12/20/2005 2:09:43 PM EDT
[Last Edit: Duffy] [#42]
Edwin, I posted some goofy pics with the 3x, PVS14 and M2 all on the MRP (in that order), it doesn't work that way.  I think it needs to be PVS14, 3x, and M2.  Victor posted a pic of it somewhere...
Meanwhile I sold my 3X.  I'm spoiled by the ACOG 4x32 great FOV.  I also bought a 740D from Victor, so it takes the place of multiple optics
Link Posted: 12/20/2005 2:16:53 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Duffy:
Edwin, I posted some goofy pics with the 3x, PVS14 and M2 all on the MRP (in that order), it doesn't work that way.  I think it needs to be PVS14, 3x, and M2.  Victor posted a pic of it somewhere...
Meanwhile I sold my 3X.  I'm spoiled by the ACOG 4x32 great FOV.  I also bought a 740D from Victor, so it takes the place of multiple optics

14 and a 740 - Dude, you are my hero.
Link Posted: 12/20/2005 3:07:54 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Duffy:
Edwin, I posted some goofy pics with the 3x, PVS14 and M2 all on the MRP (in that order), it doesn't work that way.  I think it needs to be PVS14, 3x, and M2.  Victor posted a pic of it somewhere...
Meanwhile I sold my 3X.  I'm spoiled by the ACOG 4x32 great FOV.  I also bought a 740D from Victor, so it takes the place of multiple optics

I'll try the setup as Victor has illustrated elsewhere and post some photos when I get a chance.

Like you I love the FOV on my TA31 & TA31F, but I use the 3X magnifier with the Samson Flip Mount and I can't see why anyone would use it any other way, and will try it with the PVS-14 but I have no idea whether if the 14 would need to be re-focused when the 3X is flipped up or down as I have never used the combination.

It may be an interesting exercise, even if not entirely practical.   Perhaps Victor can give us some input here, but being able to quickly go from 1X to 3X may be just as useful with the PVS-14 as it is without.  
However, a head mount PVS-14 and IR laser is definitely the way to go, and hopefully Grant's little IR laser will prove to be adequate for this application.  But I still like having the weapon mount option, which is why I got the PRI mount.

I am also looking at a 740 or 760 after the first of the year.  Any thoughts on why you would pick one over the other besides the difference in size/weight.
Link Posted: 12/20/2005 3:14:07 PM EDT
[Last Edit: Duffy] [#45]
I like the 760's 6x magnification but the 740's size.  I figure I've trained and come to like the 4x32 ACOGs up to 400yds, the 740 should do nicely.  Also with hand select and taxes, the 740 is just a tad shy of 4K.  I have no wife to nag me but I'm buying another property soon so I have to watch my budget
I may be selling my PAQ4C and PVS14, it's not an attempt to offset the cost of the D740, but having two NODs and two IR lasers is kind of crazy
Link Posted: 12/20/2005 7:27:05 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Duffy:
I may be selling my PAQ4C and PVS14, it's not an attempt to offset the cost of the D740, but having two NODs and two IR lasers is kind of crazy

Crazy yes, but in a good kind of way.

Having the PSV-14 helmet mount for navigation and use with the IR laser/illuminator for threats out to 100 yards or so, and the D-740 for longer shots strikes me as the ultimate night setup.
In my case, I'll opt for the D-760 & IWAL II mounted on a rifle length 16"SS MRP (hopefully 6.8 soon) and the helmet mounted PSV-14, with a Aimpoint M3/3X Magnifier/FlipMount for the daylight hours (backed up by the MR/T 3-9 M3 TMR).  Still undecided about an IR illuminator, IR filters on a Surefire don't seem the way to go, Victor's "torch" is probably the best bet.
Link Posted: 12/20/2005 8:12:34 PM EDT

Originally Posted By jj01:

Originally Posted By Duffy:
Edwin, I posted some goofy pics with the 3x, PVS14 and M2 all on the MRP (in that order), it doesn't work that way.  I think it needs to be PVS14, 3x, and M2.  Victor posted a pic of it somewhere...
Meanwhile I sold my 3X.  I'm spoiled by the ACOG 4x32 great FOV.  I also bought a 740D from Victor, so it takes the place of multiple optics

14 and a 740 - Dude, you are my hero.

Being single has enabled me to have freedoms otherwise jealously witheld
Link Posted: 12/21/2005 12:27:15 AM EDT
Oh I remember the day, freedom to do what a mans gotta do or just kinda wants to do. Now that I'm an old married man,  purchases such as this must be carefully planned out, stealth, strategy, must be employeed in a clandestine manner so that such fun toys can be aquired without attracking too much attention or god forbid, actual discovery. To be discovered would incur the wrath of the Red Queen() - a bad, very bad thing. Marriage Rocks!!!
Link Posted: 12/21/2005 1:41:18 AM EDT
is a rail mount available for the PVS-18 ?
Link Posted: 12/17/2005 12:07:54 PM EDT
PRI makes a height-adjustable PVS14 mount, if that is what you are looking for.

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