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Link Posted: 7/27/2022 9:12:25 PM EST
[#1]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By DDS87:

This weighs 15oz. Don't forget the tape switch(es) and end cap(s)!
View Quote View All Quotes
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Originally Posted By DDS87:
Originally Posted By jt526:

.call it $750 for the KIJI, $550 for the laser plus ~250 for a scout light for $1550 or so and all you give up is a red laser and some switches for a smaller setup

This weighs 15oz. Don't forget the tape switch(es) and end cap(s)!



I'm glad that you guys are excited about it and that it meets your needs and price point.

I too am happy to see another vendor / manufacturer enter the marketplace.  I think this alone is a plus for everyone.

.
brownells
Link Posted: 7/27/2022 9:19:12 PM EST
[Last Edit: Croak] [#2]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By DDS87:

Interesting, but this weight and price doesn't include a white light. You'll need the whole white light, not just the head. Extra for any switch/cap if wanted.
View Quote


Not a huge deal, my PLHv2 18650 is about 4.5 oz on an Arisaka M-Lok mount, with UE tailcap.  

Whole thing would weigh about the same as a PEQ-15 and WL combo.

I'm just not that keen on giving up a visible laser and switch options with the CTF-2.  

Coming in cold, without a plethora of white lights, mounts, and a collection of switches (and a lot of muscle memory!), the value proposition of the CTF-2 makes more sense.
Link Posted: 8/11/2022 3:17:18 PM EST
[#3]
What IR illuminator would you guys consider for this that isn’t a BE Meyers KIJI?
Link Posted: 8/11/2022 6:31:45 PM EST
[#4]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By tranzformer:
What IR illuminator would you guys consider for this that isn’t a BE Meyers KIJI?
View Quote

I'm looking at the Malkoff EX IR 250.
Link Posted: 8/11/2022 7:23:32 PM EST
[#5]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By tranzformer:
What IR illuminator would you guys consider for this that isn’t a BE Meyers KIJI?
View Quote

Take a look at this VCSEL IR head, should be similar to the Kiji's performance imo: https://usnightvision.com/3eir-vulcan-vcsel-ir-illumination-head/
Link Posted: 8/12/2022 5:23:20 PM EST
[#6]
This phantom hill ctf-2 would look pretty sweet on the new cloud rails once they release.

Just don't know if you would run into the light and kiji hitting the suppressor because its so low. Or have extreme suppressor shadow.

Attachment Attached File

Attachment Attached File
Link Posted: 8/17/2022 6:32:16 AM EST
[#7]
Anyone know if 16650 will work in this with the two cell extender?
Link Posted: 8/17/2022 7:13:48 AM EST
[#8]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By smeeg:
Anyone know if 16650 will work in this with the two cell extender?
View Quote

It will not.
Link Posted: 9/3/2022 12:49:04 PM EST
[Last Edit: 42tula] [#9]
I emailed PH about the timeline on the CTF release, but haven’t heard back. Does anyone know what the anticipated timeline is? I’m flip flopping on waiting for it or just going with DBAL D2 or le117ir holosun and an IR 250 light from arisaka. Thoughts?
Link Posted: 9/4/2022 3:11:52 PM EST
[Last Edit: slappomatt] [#10]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By 42tula:
I emailed PH about the timeline on the CTF release, but haven't heard back. Does anyone know what the anticipated timeline is? I'm flip flopping on waiting for it or just going with DBAL D2 or le117ir holosun and an IR 250 light from arisaka. Thoughts?
View Quote
if you dont plan to ever need tape switches than the CTF is a pretty sweet setup. that's kind of the deal for me. it really comes down to external controls or not. if you can live with the built in controls I don't see much topping this setup.

now, this thing takes normal heads obviously and airsaka is having a sale. so buy a IR250 now. and when this comes out you can throw the head on it. that's kind of the beauty of it. takes your existing stuff. can always buy a laser and a IR250 and then when this comes out sell your laser.
Link Posted: 9/4/2022 8:12:44 PM EST
[#11]
The current production ships September 6th. Their Instagram page is the best place to get info. Looks like they are going after radios next.
Link Posted: 9/4/2022 11:21:38 PM EST
[#12]
Originally Posted By slappomatt:
if you dont plan to ever need tape switches than the CTF is a pretty sweet setup. that's kind of the deal for me. it really comes down to external controls or not. if you can live with the built in controls I don't see much topping this setup.

now, this thing takes normal heads obviously and airsaka is having a sale. so buy a IR250 now. and when this comes out you can throw the head on it. that's kind of the beauty of it. takes your existing stuff. can always buy a laser and a IR250 and then when this comes out sell your laser.
View Quote

Originally Posted By DDS87:
The current production ships September 6th. Their Instagram page is the best place to get info. Looks like they are going after radios next.
View Quote


Thanks for the input. I ordered an Arisaka IR250, and will just order the CTF without heads since I now kinda have that covered. For one of my rifles I don’t think I’ll have much if at all rail space for external controls, and the other I will have to figure out when the time comes. I spent way over my fun budget this month.

I will start following them on Instagram for the product updates. Thank you for replying!
Link Posted: 9/4/2022 11:47:23 PM EST
[#13]
My apologies people but my brain is meatsauce now..

https://phantomhill.design/products/bundle-base-kiji-malkoff-white-light

What is this?

This is a IR illuminator, IR Laser, Visible laser, and White light?

Link Posted: 9/5/2022 12:07:12 AM EST
[#14]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Jozsi:
My apologies people but my brain is meatsauce now..

https://phantomhill.design/products/bundle-base-kiji-malkoff-white-light

What is this?

This is a IR illuminator, IR Laser, Visible laser, and White light?

View Quote
No visible laser, but otherwise you got it. Takes scout heads, and 2 123a batts. There is an extension for 6v heads I guess as well.
Link Posted: 9/5/2022 12:16:33 AM EST
[Last Edit: Millennial] [#15]
Originally Posted By CJofFL:


Not quite, it says, “HARD-ANODIZED MACHINED ALUMINUM COMPONENTS” and “MONOLITHIC DMLS ALUMINUM BODY”.

Looking at the picture, it appears there’s a  machined aluminum part anodized black in between the DLMS body and the heads, but the DLMS body shown is still silver and not anodized just like the silver body of the CTF1.

Also regarding another post above, I’m no expert, but I don’t believe there is “clear” hardcoat anodize.

https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/0602/4829/3634/products/CTF-2_v007_Proto_300dpi_118b67a0-218e-4052-9844-9692ccd403f1.jpg?v=1658082949
View Quote

Originally Posted By CJofFL:


Yes, agreed, I'm just dissecting what little I see on their site. Hopefully, if they're planning on raw aluminum, they'll reconsider based on feedback.

I used Photoshop to auto contrast the pic above in case anyone else is interested...

https://i.imgur.com/kjWMDBy.jpg
View Quote

Originally Posted By x_red_beard_x:


Hmmm, that's interesting as typical 6061 aluminum with a type 3 hard coat anodizing will come out with a natural grey finish if no dye is added. Also, anodizing without dye will produce a slightly harder coating than if dye is added (although it's pretty negligible).
View Quote

Been following, just thought I’d mention…

If the body is DMLS aluminum, the alloy is likely almost certainly AlSi10Mg.  With certain heat treats it’s mechanical properties are basically identical to 6061-T6… it’s basically the “6061” of aluminum DMLS land.  However the significant amount of silicon in AlSi10Mg (16X more than 6061 alloy) means it will not take typical anodizing processes well, if at all.  It’s not surprising the CTF-1 and CTF-2 are not offered with anodizing on the main body.

However the porous-like matte surface takes cerakote like a boss and as mentioned tends to be very subdued compared to a machined finish.
Link Posted: 9/5/2022 12:23:11 AM EST
[Last Edit: Millennial] [#16]
Any news on if the CTF-2 will have a recoil lug or two on the underside?

As I recall the CTF1 did not.  That seemed like an oversight to me on a body that was 3D printed… it’s not like a lug feature complicates anything at all and really seems like an important feature on an aiming device.
Link Posted: 9/5/2022 8:32:44 AM EST
[#17]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Millennial:
Any news on if the CTF-2 will have a recoil lug or two on the underside?
As I recall the CTF1 did not.  That seemed like an oversight to me on a body that was 3D printed… it’s not like a lug feature complicates anything at all and really seems like an important feature on an aiming device.
View Quote

You'd have to look back thru multiple posts for the owners info - or the website of course - he's a wicked solid guy w fantastic comms. I'm sure he'll be able to answer this question and all the dupes on release dates etc.
Link Posted: 9/5/2022 9:41:58 AM EST
[#18]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By DDS87:
The current production ships September 6th. Their Instagram page is the best place to get info. Looks like they are going after radios next.
View Quote


Seriously hoping this is the case. I've already got the cash set aside.
Link Posted: 9/5/2022 9:46:32 AM EST
[#19]
Website says "pilot production Ships the 6th, production ships on SME feedback." So I think we have a lot longer to wait than I expected. But fingers crossed.
Link Posted: 9/5/2022 12:38:57 PM EST
[Last Edit: Millennial] [#20]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By jt526:
Website says "pilot production Ships the 6th, production ships on SME feedback." So I think we have a lot longer to wait than I expected. But fingers crossed.
View Quote

Yeah, the wording has me worried and I’ve got a gun waiting for it.  Hoping, at a minimum, to get it in my hands to get it set up for the East Coast Nightshoot in November.

I’d flat out pay for one preorder at this point.
Link Posted: 9/5/2022 12:44:02 PM EST
[#21]
I gave up on it and bought a DBAL D2.  Other than the LED illuminator wart, I'm happy with it, like being able to use my collection of switches with it, and greatly appreciate having a vis laser.
Link Posted: 9/6/2022 11:53:00 AM EST
[#22]
Am I the only one that wishes the unit also had a visible laser?
Link Posted: 9/6/2022 12:17:49 PM EST
[#23]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Zone0ne:
Am I the only one that wishes the unit also had a visible laser?
View Quote


Yes, just you.

In reality, lots of users would like to have a vis laser, but when it comes to increasing cost and adding complications to the button layout, I think most people are satisfied with IR laser only.
Link Posted: 9/6/2022 2:07:06 PM EST
[Last Edit: Millennial] [#24]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Zone0ne:
Am I the only one that wishes the unit also had a visible laser?
View Quote

I honestly don’t see the added advantage of paying more for a vis laser.  Maybe I’m missing something.

If you have NV you pretty much NEED/WANT an IR illuminator and IR laser and a white light is basically a necessity on a night gun too.  But a visible laser?

The only scenarios I can think of is a vis laser lets someone shoot from very unconventional positions during daytime (from retention while clearing doorways, from the hip or through extra tight wall holes).  I don’t think those eventualities justify a cost increase for the civilian NV market this product targets. And even then, a visible laser is not really good for mid or longer ranges.  Most legal red/green lasers wash out and become basically impossible to track beyond 100yds.  Even a low power 0.7mW legal laser under NODs will reach out 300+ yards
Link Posted: 9/6/2022 2:25:02 PM EST
[#25]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Millennial:

I honestly don’t see the added advantage of paying more for a vis laser.  Maybe I’m missing something.

If you have NV you pretty much NEED/WANT an IR illuminator and IR laser and a white light is basically a necessity on a night gun too.  But a visible laser?

The only scenarios I can think of is a vis laser lets someone shoot from very unconventional positions during daytime (from retention while clearing doorways, from the hip or through extra tight wall holes).  I don’t think those eventualities are realistic or probably enough to justify a cost increase for the civilian NV market this product targets. And even then, a visible laser is not really good for mid or longer ranges.  Most legal red/green lasers wash out and become basically impossible to track beyond 100yds.  Even a low power 0.7mW legal laser under NODs will reach out 300+ yards
View Quote


Everything you said is correct.

My only point of contention is that the visible laser offers a viable training solution for daytime use.  Working presentations without NODS and the associated training environment is something that I like to do.

Considering this is a civilian unit, I would like it to be able to accommodate my civilian needs. :)

Having said that, this being a civilian unit has a civilian price tag associated with it and I along with others appreciate that.

3600 for a Mawl or Ngal is full on retarded.
Link Posted: 9/6/2022 2:36:41 PM EST
[Last Edit: Millennial] [#26]
Double post.
Link Posted: 9/6/2022 2:42:23 PM EST
[#27]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Zone0ne:
Am I the only one that wishes the unit also had a visible laser?
View Quote


Nah, I've been bugging Phantom Hill Machine about it, and posting about it in this thread.
Link Posted: 9/6/2022 2:52:48 PM EST
[#28]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Magsz18:


Having said that, this being a civilian unit has a civilian price tag associated with it and I along with others appreciate that.

3600 for a Mawl or Ngal is full on retarded.
View Quote

That’s really the issue there.  We’ve been pretty much stuck with mil-centric units that have FDA permissive civilian legal laser swapped into them as an afterthought.  Then we still end up paying similar mil prices because it’s not like the high powered diodes are actually the expensive part.

Although, to be fair how much $ is in an even very very basic head setup… $3k for a Rhino and entry PVS-14?  $6k for entry level duals?  MAWLs and NGALs aren’t cheap, but they’re far from retarded levels of spending were already into this for…. They’re more just really hard to swallow pills.
Link Posted: 9/6/2022 7:10:56 PM EST
[#29]
Here is another option.


$725 Le221 Vis/IR laser  (bore centered laser, not offset )


$288  LEP white light


$388 vcsel IR
 
$1401  tot

Yes the set up weighs more but each will have it's power and will last longer in theory.
Link Posted: 9/6/2022 7:19:22 PM EST
[#30]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Visigothic:
Here is another option.

Yes the set up weighs more but each will have it's power and will last longer in theory.
View Quote

Another thing to mention is all the pressure pads and wiring that you will need to route to get a clean setup and synchronized button activation.
Link Posted: 9/6/2022 7:42:24 PM EST
[#31]
Thread title should be changed to official CTF2 thread to stay up to date.
Link Posted: 9/6/2022 8:21:11 PM EST
[Last Edit: GunnyFitz] [#32]
Perhaps.

However, what not many of us know is the behind the scenes Mike A @ Phantom Hill is one solid as dude. Yeah, sure I've had comms w him and can attest that t he replies well under a day and contributes to more than one external NV source than this. Been contemplating on posting such repositories - not the one which goes up your ass!

The crew here obviously knows that everything written herein is being read by the man responsible for the product tossed back & forth each time someone throws out a response.

I'll go ahead and Vouch for Mike whether vis/non vis and all bs airsoft aside.

Eff It.....
Link Posted: 9/7/2022 7:43:15 AM EST
[#33]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By UndrGrndPrdcts:
Thread title should be changed to official CTF2 thread to stay up to date.
View Quote

Agree. Is this something that I can initiate?
Link Posted: 9/7/2022 9:16:39 AM EST
[#34]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By DDS87:

Agree. Is this something that I can initiate?
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By DDS87:
Originally Posted By UndrGrndPrdcts:
Thread title should be changed to official CTF2 thread to stay up to date.

Agree. Is this something that I can initiate?

Yea just edit the thread title.
Link Posted: 9/7/2022 9:30:12 AM EST
[#35]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Visigothic:
Here is another option.

https://cityarsenal.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/09/Holosun-LE221G-IR.jpg
$725 Le221 Vis/IR laser  (bore centered laser, not offset )

https://www.z-bolt.com/assets/images/SB-FDE-BLACK-CABLE-PORT.jpg
$288  LEP white light

https://www.z-bolt.com/assets/images/VCSEL-3B-CATEGORY.png
$388 vcsel IR
 
$1401  tot

Yes the set up weighs more but each will have it's power and will last longer in theory.
View Quote



WL is clicky tail cap and laser and illuminator get spliced into a single button.
Link Posted: 9/7/2022 10:33:40 AM EST
[Last Edit: Millennial] [#36]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Visigothic:
Here is another option.

https://cityarsenal.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/09/Holosun-LE221G-IR.jpg
$725 Le221 Vis/IR laser  (bore centered laser, not offset )

https://www.z-bolt.com/assets/images/SB-FDE-BLACK-CABLE-PORT.jpg
$288  LEP white light

https://www.z-bolt.com/assets/images/VCSEL-3B-CATEGORY.png
$388 vcsel IR
 
$1401  tot

Yes the set up weighs more but each will have it's power and will last longer in theory.
View Quote

That combo will weigh A LOT more… 17-18oz for just the three units.  Then you still have to factor in a couple remote cables and switches.  So realistically the combo is probably >22oz and over $1600 total.  

I’m not sure I want to pay a couple hundred more and eat 14 or so extra ounces (plus added bulk) just to get a visible laser.  

If visible laser were THAT important to me, I’d throw one of those Viridian HS1 res or greeen lasers (1.5oz, $100-150) under the hand guard along with the CTF2 on top.  HS1 adds negligible weight, it’s cheap, ergonomic, no cables and ambidextrous.

I have the IR one on a rifle.  It works very well for a sub-$150 laser.  Just gripping the handguard activates the IR laser with my finger and the vampire light with my thumb, so you can have dual activation.  This is about the lightest/simplest setup that gives you white or IR light, and IR laser (and it’s <$600 total). This is only a tiny 9” rail, but with a slightly longer rail you can put another scout light (with momentary tailcap) in front of the pressure switch to run separate white/IR lights using your thumb and the IR laser with your finger.

Attachment Attached File


Attachment Attached File


Link Posted: 9/7/2022 6:34:16 PM EST
[#37]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Millennial:

That combo will weigh A LOT more… 17-18oz for just the three units.  Then you still have to factor in a couple remote cables and switches.  So realistically the combo is probably >22oz and over $1600 total.  

I’m not sure I want to pay a couple hundred more and eat 14 or so extra ounces (plus added bulk) just to get a visible laser.  

If visible laser were THAT important to me, I’d throw one of those Viridian HS1 res or greeen lasers (1.5oz, $100-150) under the hand guard along with the CTF2 on top.  HS1 adds negligible weight, it’s cheap, ergonomic, no cables and ambidextrous.

I have the IR one on a rifle.  It works very well for a sub-$150 laser.  Just gripping the handguard activates the IR laser with my finger and the vampire light with my thumb, so you can have dual activation.  This is about the lightest/simplest setup that gives you white or IR light, and IR laser (and it’s <$600 total). This is only a tiny 9” rail, but with a slightly longer rail you can put another scout light (with momentary tailcap) in front of the pressure switch to run separate white/IR lights using your thumb and the IR laser with your finger.

https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/132797/99865FB7-BED8-462D-8EF7-B9644C80E4A0_jpe-2517489.JPG

https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/132797/F835EEC6-466F-45AF-8A56-D953FABD909F_jpe-2517493.JPG

View Quote


It's not that a visible laser is that important to me.  A co aligned  vis / ir laser is. That way I can sight things in during the day. The daytime laser sets the night time laser.  Having 2 separate ir / vis lasers is of no interest.

But it seems I'm in the minority because most don't care about co aligned vis lasers.

.
Link Posted: 9/7/2022 10:08:15 PM EST
[#38]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By carholio:


It's not that a visible laser is that important to me.  A co aligned  vis / ir laser is. That way I can sight things in during the day. The daytime laser sets the night time laser.  Having 2 separate ir / vis lasers is of no interest.

But it seems I'm in the minority because most don't care about co aligned vis lasers.

.
View Quote
Luckily for you there are plenty of options on the market that offer that capability.

For those of us that aren't particularly interested in that capability and don't want the price or weight penalty of incorporating it, this product makes a lot of sense.

Might not be for you though.
Link Posted: 9/8/2022 6:08:43 AM EST
[#39]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By carholio:


It's not that a visible laser is that important to me.  A co aligned  vis / ir laser is. That way I can sight things in during the day. The daytime laser sets the night time laser.  Having 2 separate ir / vis lasers is of no interest.

But it seems I'm in the minority because most don't care about co aligned vis lasers.

.
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By carholio:
Originally Posted By Millennial:

That combo will weigh A LOT more… 17-18oz for just the three units.  Then you still have to factor in a couple remote cables and switches.  So realistically the combo is probably >22oz and over $1600 total.  

I’m not sure I want to pay a couple hundred more and eat 14 or so extra ounces (plus added bulk) just to get a visible laser.  

If visible laser were THAT important to me, I’d throw one of those Viridian HS1 res or greeen lasers (1.5oz, $100-150) under the hand guard along with the CTF2 on top.  HS1 adds negligible weight, it’s cheap, ergonomic, no cables and ambidextrous.

I have the IR one on a rifle.  It works very well for a sub-$150 laser.  Just gripping the handguard activates the IR laser with my finger and the vampire light with my thumb, so you can have dual activation.  This is about the lightest/simplest setup that gives you white or IR light, and IR laser (and it’s <$600 total). This is only a tiny 9” rail, but with a slightly longer rail you can put another scout light (with momentary tailcap) in front of the pressure switch to run separate white/IR lights using your thumb and the IR laser with your finger.

https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/132797/99865FB7-BED8-462D-8EF7-B9644C80E4A0_jpe-2517489.JPG

https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/132797/F835EEC6-466F-45AF-8A56-D953FABD909F_jpe-2517493.JPG



It's not that a visible laser is that important to me.  A co aligned  vis / ir laser is. That way I can sight things in during the day. The daytime laser sets the night time laser.  Having 2 separate ir / vis lasers is of no interest.

But it seems I'm in the minority because most don't care about co aligned vis lasers.

.


I too prefer a visible co-aligned laser. You aren't the odd man out.
Link Posted: 9/8/2022 10:41:08 AM EST
[Last Edit: Millennial] [#40]
I don’t t think it’s an odd desire, just an overblown one.  It’s convenient, sure… but it’s not worth paying that much extra for.

I’ve never fired a single shot “zeroing” a non-aligned IR laser.  Confirmation, sure… but not actually zeroing.  I simply look through my optic in the backyard at night with NODs at an object the optic is zeroed for and walk the laser onto the reticle zero. BAM!, your IR laser and optic have the same zero.  Or if you want a different actual zero for your laser than your optic, pull up a drop chart for whatever distance, look at an object at that distance through your optic with NODs, and walk the IR laser to the corresponding offset the chart tells you.

Assuming your backyard experiences nighttime 50% of the time like the rest of the planet and you have NV… it takes 10 minutes and requires no shooting or rigamarole.  Next time you night-shoot just confirm the IR zero; but if your optic is quality and actually zeroed and your laser holds zero it will be just fine.  

Edit: in fact this is also a handy tool when you suspect an optic or laser may have walked or been damaged; look through your optic and turn on the laser… if the beam is not where it should be relative to the reticle you’ve got issues.
Link Posted: 9/8/2022 10:51:45 AM EST
[Last Edit: GunnyFitz] [#41]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Millennial:
I don’t t think it’s an odd desire, just an overblown one.  It’s convenient, sure… but it’s not worth paying that much extra for.

I’ve never fired a single shot “zeroing” a non-aligned IR laser.  Confirmation, sure… but not actually zeroing.  I simply look through my optic in the backyard at night with NODs at an object the optic is zeroed for and walk the laser onto the reticle zero. BAM!, your IR laser and optic have the same zero.  Or if you want a different actual zero for your laser than your optic, pull up a drop chart for whatever distance, look at an object at that distance through your optic with NODs, and walk the IR laser to the corresponding offset the chart tells you.

Assuming your backyard experiences nighttime 50% of the time like the rest of the planet and you have NV… it takes 10 minutes and requires no shooting or rigamarole.  Next time you night-shoot just confirm the IR zero; but if your optic is quality and actually zeroed and your laser holds zero it will be just fine.  
Edit: in fact this is also a handy tool when you suspect an optic or laser may have walked or been damaged; look through your optic and turn on the laser… if the beam is not where it should be relative to the reticle you’ve got issues.
View Quote

Good shit. I assume you bench rest the rifle while doing the reticle zero? Is that the same rifle you put the RH on and showed the horizontal plane?
Link Posted: 9/8/2022 11:56:39 AM EST
[#42]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By GunnyFitz:

Good shit. I assume you bench rest the rifle while doing the reticle zero? Is that the same rifle you put the RH on and showed the horizontal plane?
View Quote
I stick it on a bag and aim out the back patio door from the dining room table and pick a tree out at the right distance.  You can of course do this with a visible laser and dayscope, too.

Attachment Attached File


I was so pumped hearing about the PH CTF2 release that I used it as the excuse to rebuild my 10.3” upper into an 11.5” (for that extra bit of rail space and reach to grip the CTF2)  and figured while I was at it I might as well get a cheap FTS magnifier and longer riser to use the RH25, too.

Bobro Double Decker, EXPS3, SpecPrecision Unity-knockoff mount + PA Gen IV 3x LER ($40+$99)… and adding a CTF2 (Kiji/E1HT) as soon as I can get one.

Attachment Attached File


Attachment Attached File


Attachment Attached File

Link Posted: 9/8/2022 4:26:41 PM EST
[#43]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Daggertt:
Luckily for you there are plenty of options on the market that offer that capability.

For those of us that aren't particularly interested in that capability and don't want the price or weight penalty of incorporating it, this product makes a lot of sense.

Might not be for you though.
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Originally Posted By Daggertt:
Originally Posted By carholio:


It's not that a visible laser is that important to me.  A co aligned  vis / ir laser is. That way I can sight things in during the day. The daytime laser sets the night time laser.  Having 2 separate ir / vis lasers is of no interest.

But it seems I'm in the minority because most don't care about co aligned vis lasers.

.
Luckily for you there are plenty of options on the market that offer that capability.

For those of us that aren't particularly interested in that capability and don't want the price or weight penalty of incorporating it, this product makes a lot of sense.

Might not be for you though.



I don't agree that there are plenty of other options.  There's the dbal a3 and holosun 321.  I'm not aware of any other reasonably priced options?

I have the holosun on 1 ar and a non vis laser tlr vir ii on my 9mm ar.  I just didn't want to spend 700 - 800 ish on another holosun for the short distance 9mm.

.
Link Posted: 9/8/2022 5:57:53 PM EST
[#44]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By SpyHawk:


I too prefer a visible co-aligned laser. You aren't the odd man out.
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Originally Posted By SpyHawk:
Originally Posted By carholio:
Originally Posted By Millennial:

That combo will weigh A LOT more… 17-18oz for just the three units.  Then you still have to factor in a couple remote cables and switches.  So realistically the combo is probably >22oz and over $1600 total.  

I’m not sure I want to pay a couple hundred more and eat 14 or so extra ounces (plus added bulk) just to get a visible laser.  

If visible laser were THAT important to me, I’d throw one of those Viridian HS1 res or greeen lasers (1.5oz, $100-150) under the hand guard along with the CTF2 on top.  HS1 adds negligible weight, it’s cheap, ergonomic, no cables and ambidextrous.

I have the IR one on a rifle.  It works very well for a sub-$150 laser.  Just gripping the handguard activates the IR laser with my finger and the vampire light with my thumb, so you can have dual activation.  This is about the lightest/simplest setup that gives you white or IR light, and IR laser (and it’s <$600 total). This is only a tiny 9” rail, but with a slightly longer rail you can put another scout light (with momentary tailcap) in front of the pressure switch to run separate white/IR lights using your thumb and the IR laser with your finger.

https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/132797/99865FB7-BED8-462D-8EF7-B9644C80E4A0_jpe-2517489.JPG

https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/132797/F835EEC6-466F-45AF-8A56-D953FABD909F_jpe-2517493.JPG



It's not that a visible laser is that important to me.  A co aligned  vis / ir laser is. That way I can sight things in during the day. The daytime laser sets the night time laser.  Having 2 separate ir / vis lasers is of no interest.

But it seems I'm in the minority because most don't care about co aligned vis lasers.

.


I too prefer a visible co-aligned laser. You aren't the odd man out.


The slaving part is literally the only thing that makes it valuable.
Link Posted: 9/8/2022 9:01:57 PM EST
[#45]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Millennial:
I stick it on a bag and aim out the back patio door from the dining room table and pick a tree out at the right distance.  You can of course do this with a visible laser and dayscope, too.

/media/mediaFiles/sharedAlbum/hillaryNod-496.gif

I was so pumped hearing about the PH CTF2 release that I used it as the excuse to rebuild my 10.3" upper into an 11.5" (for that extra bit of rail space and reach to grip the CTF2)  and figured while I was at it I might as well get a cheap FTS magnifier and longer riser to use the RH25, too.

Bobro Double Decker, EXPS3, SpecPrecision Unity-knockoff mount + PA Gen IV 3x LER ($40+$99)  and adding a CTF2 (Kiji/E1HT) as soon as I can get one.

https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/132797/A9A68B08-DC37-4D0C-BA31-C96EC483C73E_jpe-2518698.JPG

https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/132797/824C8A7E-FFFC-49D4-BC60-71111D38E1D6_jpe-2518699.JPG

https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/132797/98396D9E-B192-4E26-A42C-F627C3B96595_jpe-2518701.JPG
View Quote
nice stick. I'm Jelly.
Link Posted: 9/8/2022 9:49:57 PM EST
[#46]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By carholio:



I don't agree that there are plenty of other options.  There's the dbal a3 and holosun 321.  I'm not aware of any other reasonably priced options?

I have the holosun on 1 ar and a non vis laser tlr vir ii on my 9mm ar.  I just didn't want to spend 700 - 800 ish on another holosun for the short distance 9mm.

.
View Quote View All Quotes
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Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By carholio:
Originally Posted By Daggertt:
Originally Posted By carholio:


It's not that a visible laser is that important to me.  A co aligned  vis / ir laser is. That way I can sight things in during the day. The daytime laser sets the night time laser.  Having 2 separate ir / vis lasers is of no interest.

But it seems I'm in the minority because most don't care about co aligned vis lasers.

.
Luckily for you there are plenty of options on the market that offer that capability.

For those of us that aren't particularly interested in that capability and don't want the price or weight penalty of incorporating it, this product makes a lot of sense.

Might not be for you though.



I don't agree that there are plenty of other options.  There's the dbal a3 and holosun 321.  I'm not aware of any other reasonably priced options?

I have the holosun on 1 ar and a non vis laser tlr vir ii on my 9mm ar.  I just didn't want to spend 700 - 800 ish on another holosun for the short distance 9mm.

.
Our point is that to keep it reasonably priced compared to the full feature options, we are happy to give up the vis laser.

If you want full features, you can get them, but it's going to cost more. Which is why we aren't worried about getting phantom him to try to add it in.
Link Posted: 9/9/2022 6:17:22 PM EST
[#47]
Version/adapter for a stream light head?
Protac HL-X
Link Posted: 9/9/2022 9:15:53 PM EST
[#48]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By snaggletooth1925:
Version/adapter for a stream light head?
Protac HL-X
View Quote
thats a great ideal. have white light and vis laser. I dont see how you adjust the laser?
Link Posted: 9/9/2022 9:29:38 PM EST
[#49]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By slappomatt:
thats a great ideal. have white light and vis laser. I dont see how you adjust the laser?
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“There are two adjustment screws located on the head of the flashlight body. The windage adjustment is located in the deeper counter bored hole on the left side of the flashlight. Using the provided 2.0 mm Allen wrench, turn the set screw clockwise to move the laser to the left (POI right). Turn the set screw counter-clockwise to move the laser to the right (POI left). The elevation adjustment is located on the top of the lights (it’s in line with the HOT symbol) body. With the ProTac® Rail Mount HL-X Laser pointed down range a clockwise turn of the adjustment screw will move the laser up (POI down). A counter-clockwise turn on the adjustment screw will move the laser down (POI up).
Move the laser dot in the direction that the shots are hitting the target (example: If the bullets are striking low and right, move the laser dot down and right to coincide with the bullet strike).
NOTE: When making large adjustments there may be an interaction that causes the laser to move diagonally or bind. It may become necessary to rotate the opposing adjustment screw counterclockwise to allow the laser cartridge to move to the desired position.”
Link Posted: 9/10/2022 6:49:16 AM EST
[#50]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By snaggletooth1925:
Version/adapter for a stream light head?
Protac HL-X
View Quote


That is a neat idea, but as the person above mentioned, if the vis laser isn't slaved with the IR, it greatly diminishes the value.
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