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Posted: 11/13/2008 5:46:29 PM EDT
I'm sometimes completely amazed by the decisions that ammo companies make.

I can sorta understand Federal marking the 9BPLE ammo as law enforcement ammo. It's SIGNIFICANTLY hotter than standard ammo, and why accept the liability involved with selling it to the general public...

I can even sorta understand selling ammo aimed at cops that's designed to defeat barriers... Most self defense situations won't involve shooting through windshields...

But why, OH WHY, is REDUCED RECOIL BUCKSHOT restricted to Law Enforcement?!?!?
Hornady TAP, Federal 132, etc. etc. Does ANYONE know the answer to this?

Sam
Link Posted: 11/13/2008 6:55:15 PM EDT
Link Posted: 11/13/2008 7:03:36 PM EDT
I'm not having trouble GETTING it. I'm just wondering WHY it's marked Law Enforcement?
Why bother for a REDUCED load?

And it's not really easy to get hold of real TAP... Not heard, but not easy either.

Sam
Link Posted: 11/13/2008 7:48:22 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/13/2008 7:49:52 PM EDT by DvlDog]
Or howabout the TAP practice ammo. good stuff, good price. but unless youre LEO you gotta get it from Grant for a 50% markup (which i refuse to do)
Link Posted: 11/13/2008 8:15:55 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/13/2008 8:17:10 PM EDT by ALASKANFIRE]
Lots of departments went to reduced loads because of the increasing number of smaller officers.

I would guess that in some instances the restriction has more to do with not being able to make enough rather than trying to keep it out of civilian hands

I was talking to a guy from hornady the other day and I was asking about 556 tap. He made it sound like not only do they have trouble keeping up but they are worried about people using it in a 223 chambered gun. I guess they make the departments sign waivers.


Maybe it is a PC thing. Nobody wants to be the next Black Talon
Link Posted: 11/13/2008 8:50:30 PM EDT
Link Posted: 11/14/2008 7:54:26 AM EDT
Originally Posted By ILove2Shoot:
I know that if a firearms manufacturer sells a lower marked for law enforcement, there is know excise tax........wonder if there is something similar for ammo manufacturers?


Ding.

Ammo meant for LE generally does not have the 11% FET paid on it.  The retailer is supposed to collect this tax if the distributor did not charge for it.

Many will not, so the ammo gets listed as "restricted" for LE/.Gov use.  It's not that you can't buy it, it's that you can't buy it unless it has the tax paid on it.
Link Posted: 11/15/2008 1:51:02 AM EDT
Link Posted: 11/15/2008 6:45:55 AM EDT
I remember when the old +P+ ammo was tagged "LAW ENFORCEMENT ONLY".  This was due to the higher pressures this ammo was loaded to and the assumption that LEO guns were not old mil-surp pieces.

Any more I'm not so certain it's not a marketing ploy because the manfactures know that anything marked military or law enforcement only is going to make buyers think the product is really something special and want to buy it all the more, driving up the price.

Rob
Link Posted: 11/19/2008 10:03:41 AM EDT
Link Posted: 11/19/2008 10:42:21 AM EDT
It's a very similar situation with some gear companies. I remember looking for some MOLLE Pouches and the maker said "LEO/GOV Only Customers". FOR A FREAKING PIECE OF NYLON!

I'm a LEO and I can't stand the double standard. Why should I get a price deal on a GLOCK and my fellow citizen can't? Why Should I get three magazines while my fellow citizen only gets two?

I cannot stand this double standard. It's class warfare. The idea that something is legal for one/less expensive/available to one class of society and not another is unjust and unconstitutional. Our founding fathers fought against the crown for this very reason....

Link Posted: 11/19/2008 11:35:29 AM EDT
The glock law enforcement was originally for officers who would need to buy their own duty weapon so they gave them the 3 mags they needed to carry and a price break which was a good thing.  It now includes fire ems and security and the like as well which is kinda pointless I think.
Link Posted: 11/19/2008 12:28:58 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Miami_JBT:
I cannot stand this double standard. It's class warfare. The idea that something is legal for one/less expensive/available to one class of society and not another is unjust and unconstitutional. Our founding fathers fought against the crown for this very reason....


Discounts exist for LE/Mil for a reason, and it isn't class warfare.
It's all about marketing and profit.
Link Posted: 11/19/2008 2:01:29 PM EDT
Originally Posted By thedoctors308:
Originally Posted By Miami_JBT:
I cannot stand this double standard. It's class warfare. The idea that something is legal for one/less expensive/available to one class of society and not another is unjust and unconstitutional. Our founding fathers fought against the crown for this very reason....


Discounts exist for LE/Mil for a reason, and it isn't class warfare.
It's all about marketing and profit.


FUCK THAT.... No reason why I should get a discount and you shouldn't. I became a Police Officer because I wanted to serve after I left the US Army. No reason why I should be able to purchase a firearm at $398; while you have to pay $498. No reason why I should get three magazines and you get two magazines. IT'S THE SAME FUCKING PISTOL.

You want to make profit. If you lower your prices, more of your product will sell. I've worked the business many a time and I still work it part time even though I'm LEO. The dealer I work for doesn't do GLOCK LEO deals. Sucks that he gets fucked in the ass for the price of a pistol and same with a customer.

Just because I have a little tin on my shirt means I get treated better?
Link Posted: 11/19/2008 5:59:08 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/19/2008 6:01:00 PM EDT by FMD]
Again,

It has nothing to do with "class" or marketing.  There are VERY few ammo brands marked LEO only, rather they are marked and marketed as For Law Enforcement Use.

So why won't some folks sell the stuff to Joe The Plumber?

Manufacturer's have to collect an 11% Federal Excise Tax (FET) on all firearms and ammunition destined for private individuals.  This FET is NOT collected on firearms and ammo intended for Law Enforcement and Military customers by the manufacturer.

Now, for a distributor or retailer to sell these non-taxed firearms or ammunition to a non-LEO or non-.mil customer, they have to collect that extra 11% FET, only they are not equipped to do so.

Therefore, it is easier for those distributors and retailers to say "this product is only available for sale to Law Enforcement and Military customers".

There is no anti-civillian conspiracy, it's simply a matter of taxation.

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