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Posted: 7/23/2009 12:28:03 PM EST
I know they are the same thing right? Just one is without the bayonet? Anyways, who has them for sale? I'd really like to have one of these but I never see them on any websites. Maybe I just don't know the right places to look? Anyone?
Link Posted: 7/23/2009 12:57:44 PM EST
[Last Edit: 7/23/2009 1:04:00 PM EST by bloodsport2885]
M38's seem to be nonexistent and M44's are getting to be rare. I thing SOG might still have M44's. Check gunbroker too.

Yep the M38 has no bayonet and the M44 has an integral folding bayonet.

If you can pick up a good condition M38 second hand, it might be worth the price not to have to deal with the bayonet nonsense. The 91/30 and M44 were sighted in with the bayonet fixed and shoots slightly different when it is not.
Link Posted: 7/23/2009 1:39:07 PM EST
I would pick up an M38 if you can get your hands on a nice one, the M44's bayo is not my taste for practical reasons but I like the look of it.
Link Posted: 7/23/2009 2:18:23 PM EST
[Last Edit: 7/23/2009 2:28:53 PM EST by glazer1972]
M38.
Link Posted: 7/23/2009 3:48:55 PM EST
Yeah I'd REALLY like the 38, no use for and really don't like having to deal with the bayonet on the side. I was just curious cause I see lots of people talking about them but I never seem to see any for sale.
Link Posted: 7/23/2009 4:21:55 PM EST
Gunbroker and various trader boards are full of them. SOG advertises M44s for sale and Century just got some in, too, from what I have heard. They're not $49 anymore, but still widely available if you look around.
Link Posted: 7/23/2009 4:32:44 PM EST
[Last Edit: 7/23/2009 4:40:48 PM EST by TxSoldier]
LOL I know it...why couldn't I have been into this stuff when they were only 49 dollars!? Damnit all!

I see century has both 38's and 44's. I hate though that you can't see the prices on them unless you are a dealer or whatever.
Link Posted: 7/23/2009 5:04:34 PM EST
Century has both. Getting expensive now though.

Go with a M38 to begin with, much fewer of those made.
Link Posted: 7/23/2009 5:10:08 PM EST
Get on Empire Arms e-mail list. They had M38s earlier this week.
Link Posted: 7/25/2009 6:25:54 AM EST
38 for sure. Rarer. Much more handier and practical. The bayonet on the 44 adds considerable weight and on many rifles it has so be extended in order to shoot well.
Link Posted: 7/25/2009 7:53:44 PM EST
Yeah, I just dunno what it is but I don't really like the look of the folded bayonet either.
Link Posted: 7/29/2009 2:31:11 PM EST
Originally Posted By bloodsport2885: The 91/30 and M44 were sighted in with the bayonet fixed and shoots slightly different when it is not.


Ya know, I've always HEARD this, but I tried with my 91.30 and it doesn't seem to give a crap @ 100 yards. I tried light and heavy ball, and the POI shift was less than I can shoot with irons. Do you having any info on this? (I'm not calling you out, just curious).

Link Posted: 7/29/2009 2:58:27 PM EST
Soviet Mil doctrine of the time required bayonets fixed unless being transported. I have had personal experience with the POI shift in the M44. They consistantly will shoot left 6 and high 1 and some farther than that with the bayo folded. Most return to POA when bayo is extended. Now there will be differences from rifle to rifle but of the 20 or so I have shot/seen shot this has been the case.
Reason for the shift is barrel harmonics. The barrel is "harmonically" longer with the bayo extended. Therefore the muzzle is in a different location when the bullet leaves the muzzle than when the bayo is folded.
Link Posted: 7/29/2009 8:02:22 PM EST
Originally Posted By KB7DX:
Soviet Mil doctrine of the time required bayonets fixed unless being transported. I have had personal experience with the POI shift in the M44. They consistantly will shoot left 6 and high 1 and some farther than that with the bayo folded. Most return to POA when bayo is extended. Now there will be differences from rifle to rifle but of the 20 or so I have shot/seen shot this has been the case.
Reason for the shift is barrel harmonics. The barrel is "harmonically" longer with the bayo extended. Therefore the muzzle is in a different location when the bullet leaves the muzzle than when the bayo is folded.


Last week I had my 44 at the range and at 50 yards with the bayo folded it was consistently left. I extended the bayo and it was damn near right on, a little high. I also noticed the muzzle flash is larger with the bayo extended.
Link Posted: 7/29/2009 8:21:29 PM EST
I like my m44. The bayonet folded/extended point of aim thing seems pretty non exsistent on mine. It shoots pretty well either way. It's minute of pie plate, and I'm happy for that much. I shoot the m44 for the noise, recoil and nostalgia, just like any other mosin. I usually leave it extended though. Seems to get more weird looks from the Fudds then an ar-15 with all the bells and whistles hanging off it. A vertical fore grip may look tactical, an 18 inch chisel point bayonet that can't be removed looks evil.

The stock on an m44 differs slight from the m38's. It's just a little cutout so the bayo folds flat. Some m44's were restocked with an m38 stock, and lack the little cutout. Some m38s got the same treatment in reverse. It doesn't mean much to function or value, but it's something to look for.

-Local
Link Posted: 7/30/2009 6:37:55 AM EST
Wideners has M44s in stock.
Link Posted: 8/1/2009 6:11:47 AM EST
[Last Edit: 8/1/2009 6:14:26 AM EST by Hoppy]
The weight of the M44 (heavier than the 91/30) works to quell some of the recoil while the reduced weight of the M38 makes it much more handy. My son liked my M44 a lot and shot it well so I gave it to him and replaced it with an M38. A slip on recoil pad and light ball ammo tames the M38.

I drifted the front sight on the M44 to shoot POA with the bayonet closed but it is almost all the way to one side.

My local fun store had a couple of M44's in the $200. range the last time I was in.

ETA: M44's are usually in better shape than M38's as they were produced mostly after the war.
Link Posted: 8/1/2009 6:50:12 AM EST

I have both.

If you can find one, the M38 is a better real world gun than the M44. It's lighter and better balanced than the M44.

The dog collar sling is pretty good for carrying and shooting. It's a good trunk gun since it doesn't take up much space.
I often throw my M38 over my shoulder when hiking off the beaten path.

Obligatory M38 flamethrower pics.




Link Posted: 8/1/2009 7:38:13 AM EST
[Last Edit: 8/1/2009 7:40:02 AM EST by Screwball]
I bought my M44 at Cabelas. Was like brand new (maybe shot in the arsenal, that’s it), but had import marks. Figured it would be a nice range gun. Picked up the extra stuff, like cleaning accessories, sling, and stripper clips (brass ones on eBay work great). I did clean some dust out of it, as well as replacing the firing pin spring.

May have taken it out twice, all of which I shot non-corrosive ammo (Winchester). But after buying a M1903, and getting it rebuilt by DGR, I doubt I'll be shooting the M44 again. So, it takes up room in the safe. The only way I could see myself using it would be if I install a “correct” scope for it. Yes, I know that there weren’t scoped M44s, but I can’t see myself swapping out stocks and alike. Would want it to look somewhat like it belongs, which is how I am with all my guns.

I wanted to get rid of it, and I knew I would lose out after buying it from Cabelas (paid $175 for it). I put it up for sale a few times, and with everything I have, including ammo, I would get less than $100 offers. Most also wanted me to ship the rifle in the deal. I'm not that strapped for cash, so I'd rather leave it in the safe than give it completely away. At the most, I’ll mention it to people I see at the range, and maybe I’ll get lucky.
Link Posted: 8/1/2009 8:39:28 AM EST
I bought my M38 on an impulse buy at a gun show when looking for AR and AK magazines. Since they were all overpriced, I left without any magazines. On the way out, I saw a guy with 2 AKs, and he had a sign about an M38. I asked to see the M38, and I was a bit reluctant to buy it. He wanted $200 for it with a 440 round can of Albanian surplus ammo. He also had an extra stock for it. I said, "What the hell," and knocked it down to $180.

After shooting it, I absolutely love my M38. It can do 2 MOA if I do my part. It has also done sub-MOA once excluding the called flier. I learned how to shoot rifles on irons back in high school, and have never owned a scoped rifle. I think it has contributed to me being able to shoot a military surplus weapons well.

My dad is a hunter and learned how to shoot on optics only. He only cares about "accurate enough," and doesn't believe that my targets were shot at 100 yards with irons.
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