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Posted: 8/25/2004 8:48:07 AM EST
Illegal under the ban? Illegal in any state? Just curious.

Hep
Link Posted: 8/25/2004 8:56:52 AM EST

Originally Posted By hepcat85:
Illegal under the ban? Illegal in any state? Just curious.

Hep



Depends.

If you have a Pre ban naturally it's ok.

Post ban, you woudln't be able to have any other banned featured. Most post bans i've seen still have a flashhider, but no bayonet lug. I have seen M1A Comps and Muzzle breaks. If you were to permanently attach one, you could legally get a pistol grip stock.

Jsut remember..... only 1 feature may be present on a post ban.
Link Posted: 8/25/2004 9:06:54 AM EST
Link Posted: 8/25/2004 9:37:48 AM EST
[Last Edit: 8/31/2004 7:21:21 AM EST by hepcat85]

Originally Posted By NAM:

Originally Posted By hepcat85:
Illegal under the ban? Illegal in any state? Just curious.

Hep



Depends.

If you have a Pre ban naturally it's ok.

Post ban, you woudln't be able to have any other banned featured. Most post bans i've seen still have a flashhider, but no bayonet lug. I have seen M1A Comps and Muzzle breaks. If you were to permanently attach one, you could legally get a pistol grip stock.

Jsut remember..... only 1 feature may be present on a post ban.



Thanks.

I'm talking about a SA M1A "standard"

Would a pistol grip be legal? Also, legal in CA and NJ?

Thanks for the input so far guys, you're the tops!



Link Posted: 8/25/2004 8:23:31 PM EST
In order for the M1A to be legal in CA, you MUST remove the flash hider and replace it with a muzzle brake. The detachable magazine qualifies it for "assault weapon" status, and if you add a flash hider, pistol grip, telescoping / folding stock, or a thumbhole stock, you are creating an AW by CA's definition.
Link Posted: 8/26/2004 5:50:47 AM EST

Originally Posted By NAM:

Originally Posted By hepcat85:
Illegal under the ban? Illegal in any state? Just curious.

Hep



Depends.

If you have a Pre ban naturally it's ok.

Post ban, you woudln't be able to have any other banned featured. Most post bans i've seen still have a flashhider, but no bayonet lug. I have seen M1A Comps and Muzzle breaks. If you were to permanently attach one, you could legally get a pistol grip stock.

Jsut remember..... only 1 feature may be present on a post ban.



If I remember correctly you can have two "EVIL" features on a domestic post ban gun under Federal Law. CA, NY, and other places that suck, most likely have more restrictive laws.

If you mean, one feature in addition to the ability to accept a mag of more than ten rounds, then I guess you would be correct.



FB
Link Posted: 8/26/2004 6:09:05 AM EST

Originally Posted By Fat_Boy:

Originally Posted By NAM:

Originally Posted By hepcat85:
Illegal under the ban? Illegal in any state? Just curious.

Hep



Depends.

If you have a Pre ban naturally it's ok.

Post ban, you woudln't be able to have any other banned featured. Most post bans i've seen still have a flashhider, but no bayonet lug. I have seen M1A Comps and Muzzle breaks. If you were to permanently attach one, you could legally get a pistol grip stock.

Jsut remember..... only 1 feature may be present on a post ban.



If I remember correctly you can have two "EVIL" features on a domestic post ban gun under Federal Law. CA, NY, and other places that suck, most likely have more restrictive laws.

If you mean, one feature in addition to the ability to accept a mag of more than ten rounds, then I guess you would be correct.



FB



So a SA M1A "Standard" could NOT have pistol grip because of the detachable over 10 round mag and the flashhider, (hence the CA Brake that SA sells)

HOWEVER, that's not the case for New Jersey, correct?

Hey fellas, thanks for the input, it's much appreciated.

Hep
Link Posted: 8/26/2004 7:45:08 PM EST
Anyone???
Link Posted: 8/26/2004 7:52:40 PM EST
Link Posted: 8/27/2004 7:22:26 AM EST

Originally Posted By Fat_Boy:


If you mean, one feature in addition to the ability to accept a mag of more than ten rounds, then I guess you would be correct.

FB




If you have a detachable magazine, you may also have 1 banned feature and still be in accordance with the law. a detachable magazinedoes not count as 1 item. If you do not have a detachable magazine, you are no longer subject to the AWB. No matter if you've got all the banned items, No detachable mag, and it's not an AW. Same goes if it's not semi automatic.
Link Posted: 8/27/2004 8:29:30 AM EST
Link Posted: 8/27/2004 9:25:27 AM EST
Link Posted: 8/27/2004 12:15:43 PM EST
[Last Edit: 8/27/2004 12:21:21 PM EST by raf]
Link Posted: 8/27/2004 1:15:07 PM EST

Originally Posted By NAM:

Originally Posted By Fat_Boy:


If you mean, one feature in addition to the ability to accept a mag of more than ten rounds, then I guess you would be correct.

FB




If you have a detachable magazine, you may also have 1 banned feature and still be in accordance with the law. a detachable magazinedoes not count as 1 item. If you do not have a detachable magazine, you are no longer subject to the AWB. No matter if you've got all the banned items, No detachable mag, and it's not an AW. Same goes if it's not semi automatic.



NAM,

Sorry, I always considered a detachable mag "one evil feature", as you couldn't have an assault weapon with out it. After re-reading the AWB I see it isn't technically an evil feature. I will be glad in three weeks when it is gone.

FB
Link Posted: 8/27/2004 6:00:15 PM EST
reese surplus also sells folders for the M-1A. They're modified BM-59 folders
Link Posted: 8/27/2004 9:00:53 PM EST

Originally Posted By warpusher:
reese surplus also sells folders for the M-1A. They're modified BM-59 folders



So what ARE the Italians using? Have they moved on beyond the 59?
Link Posted: 8/27/2004 9:03:05 PM EST

Originally Posted By Fat_Boy:

Originally Posted By NAM:

Originally Posted By Fat_Boy:


If you mean, one feature in addition to the ability to accept a mag of more than ten rounds, then I guess you would be correct.

FB




If you have a detachable magazine, you may also have 1 banned feature and still be in accordance with the law. a detachable magazinedoes not count as 1 item. If you do not have a detachable magazine, you are no longer subject to the AWB. No matter if you've got all the banned items, No detachable mag, and it's not an AW. Same goes if it's not semi automatic.



NAM,

Sorry, I always considered a detachable mag "one evil feature", as you couldn't have an assault weapon with out it. After re-reading the AWB I see it isn't technically an evil feature. I will be glad in three weeks when it is gone.

FB



Okay....so a postban SA M1A Standard CAN sport a pistol grip in New Jersy?

Not trying to be dense her fellas....appreciate the help.
Link Posted: 8/28/2004 2:26:16 PM EST
I believe the Italians have gone to the Berreta AR-70 and it's variants (to stay the same with NATO standardibility regs)
Link Posted: 8/28/2004 2:37:46 PM EST

Originally Posted By hepcat85:

Originally Posted By Fat_Boy:

Originally Posted By NAM:

Originally Posted By Fat_Boy:


If you mean, one feature in addition to the ability to accept a mag of more than ten rounds, then I guess you would be correct.

FB




If you have a detachable magazine, you may also have 1 banned feature and still be in accordance with the law. a detachable magazinedoes not count as 1 item. If you do not have a detachable magazine, you are no longer subject to the AWB. No matter if you've got all the banned items, No detachable mag, and it's not an AW. Same goes if it's not semi automatic.



NAM,

Sorry, I always considered a detachable mag "one evil feature", as you couldn't have an assault weapon with out it. After re-reading the AWB I see it isn't technically an evil feature. I will be glad in three weeks when it is gone.

FB



Okay....so a postban SA M1A Standard CAN sport a pistol grip in New Jersy?

Not trying to be dense her fellas....appreciate the help.



I can't comment on New Jersey Law, as i'm not form Jersey and have no clue. But, accoridng to the Federal ban, If you get rid of the flash hider, and permanently mount a muzzle break with no bayonet lug, the yes, you can have a pistol grip stock.
Link Posted: 8/29/2004 7:55:27 AM EST

Originally Posted By hepcat85:


Okay....so a postban SA M1A Standard CAN sport a pistol grip in New Jersy?

Not trying to be dense her fellas....appreciate the help.



Try this link www.njsp.org/about/fire_ag2.html

and this one www.njsp.org/about/fire_ag1.html

They should answer your question. It would not hurt to call the ph# on the 2nd link just to make sure before making a change.

"The Springfield M1A is not one of the enumerated firearms which are specifically prohibited under the State’s assault firearms laws. It has been prohibited in this State as being substantially identical to a named firearm.

However, according to the manufacturer’s specifications, the M1A has been modified. The modified M1A, which became available in 1994, would not be considered to be substantially identical to a prohibited firearm in accordance with the statutory provision and the Attorney General’s guidelines cited above.

However, earlier versions of the M1A which contains at least two of the criteria identified in Paragraph B of the Attorney General’s Guidelines, supra, would still be considered to be substantially identical to a prohibited firearm and continue to be banned under our State law.

As a result, it will be necessary to clearly distinguish the physical characteristics or lack of physical characteristics when making a determination regarding the M1A rifle."



FB
Link Posted: 8/30/2004 8:04:59 AM EST
[Last Edit: 8/30/2004 11:29:13 AM EST by hepcat85]
Thanks Fat_Boy

Looks like I'm getting a pistol grip for my M1A!
Link Posted: 8/31/2004 9:04:28 AM EST
[Last Edit: 8/31/2004 11:03:54 AM EST by hepcat85]

Originally Posted By Fat_Boy:

Originally Posted By hepcat85:


Okay....so a postban SA M1A Standard CAN sport a pistol grip in New Jersy?

Not trying to be dense her fellas....appreciate the help.



Try this link www.njsp.org/about/fire_ag2.html

and this one www.njsp.org/about/fire_ag1.html

They should answer your question. It would not hurt to call the ph# on the 2nd link just to make sure before making a change.

"The Springfield M1A is not one of the enumerated firearms which are specifically prohibited under the State’s assault firearms laws. It has been prohibited in this State as being substantially identical to a named firearm.

However, according to the manufacturer’s specifications, the M1A has been modified. The modified M1A, which became available in 1994, would not be considered to be substantially identical to a prohibited firearm in accordance with the statutory provision and the Attorney General’s guidelines cited above.

However, earlier versions of the M1A which contains at least two of the criteria identified in Paragraph B of the Attorney General’s Guidelines, supra, would still be considered to be substantially identical to a prohibited firearm and continue to be banned under our State law.

As a result, it will be necessary to clearly distinguish the physical characteristics or lack of physical characteristics when making a determination regarding the M1A rifle."



FB




Thanks again FB

So...I call the Deputy Attorney General's office JUST TO BE SAFE. I wanted to confirm that my plan was legal. They refused to comment since "That's what attorny's are for" and "Liability issues"

Okay....Thank-you very much he who draws his pay from the taxpayers.

So I call the NJ State Police, Firearms branch. The Sgt. explains that my plans are legal since the 1997 exception was made and it's NOT a Pre-ban.

The 1997 exception:

However, according to the manufacturer’s specifications, the M1A has been modified. The modified M1A, which became available in 1994, would not be considered to be substantially identical to a prohibited firearm in accordance with the statutory provision and the Attorney General’s guidelines cited above.

So, my 2001 M1A w/ Detachable mag + factory flash supressor + pistol grip = LEGAL

Thisis reenforced by:
...However, earlier versions of the M1A which contains at least two of the criteria identified in Paragraph B of the Attorney General’s Guidelines, supra, would still be considered to be substantially identical to a prohibited firearm and continue to be banned under our State law.

So, IF I had a PRE-BAN, I could NOT add the pistol grip.

So...does the above make sense to anyone else but me? Fact check time....

Thanks fellas!



Link Posted: 8/31/2004 6:21:48 PM EST
[Last Edit: 8/31/2004 6:22:40 PM EST by hepcat85]
Jeebus.....

I'm getting conflicting info from every direction...and the State Attorney General's office won't say shit!

My head is spinning. I'm not sure WHAT to believe.

Anyone know a good attorney would could answer this #$%^%^ question???

Hep

Link Posted: 9/1/2004 6:58:18 AM EST
[Last Edit: 9/3/2004 1:12:59 AM EST by Fat_Boy]

Originally Posted By hepcat85:
Jeebus.....

I'm getting conflicting info from every direction...and the State Attorney General's office won't say shit!

My head is spinning. I'm not sure WHAT to believe.

Anyone know a good attorney would could answer this #$%^%^ question???

Hep




I think the ANTI's want people to be confused. Two guns that look identical and function the same... one can be ok, the other sends you to the "Big House" to meet your new "friend" bubba. I found this link from info @ Packing.org, www.njguns.com/lawyers.htm . I don't know any of them as I am not from NJ. Good Luck,

FB

Edited to add:

If you are a NRA member you could give them a call and see if htey can recommend someone in your area. Just a thought.
Link Posted: 9/1/2004 7:04:41 AM EST
[Last Edit: 9/1/2004 7:05:09 AM EST by hepcat85]

Originally Posted By Fat_Boy:

Originally Posted By hepcat85:
Jeebus.....

I'm getting conflicting info from every direction...and the State Attorney General's office won't say shit!

My head is spinning. I'm not sure WHAT to believe.

Anyone know a good attorney would could answer this #$%^%^ question???

Hep




I think the ANTI's want people to be confused. Two guns that look identical and function the same... one can be ok, the other sends you to the "Big House" to meet your new "friend" bubba. I found this link from info @ Packing.org, www.njguns.com/lawyers.htm . I don't know any of them as I am not from NJ. Good Luck,

FB
Eddited to add:

If your a NRA member you could give them a call and see if can recommend someone in you area. Just a thought.



Thanks man, great idea on the NRA. I'm a Life Member and I'm giving them a call.

The issue is exactly that, cosmetic. I need to probably get a letter defining my M1A as legit.
Link Posted: 9/2/2004 4:16:57 AM EST
I wonder how many terrorists and criminals are sweating the NJ Gun Law details like this???????
Link Posted: 9/2/2004 1:13:38 PM EST
[Last Edit: 9/5/2004 1:57:16 PM EST by Tommmo]
The Democrat 'liberals', aka Commies, are trying to get so many confusing laws on the books that no matter what you do, you have broken a law! I have friends in the PDRNJ, 'Peoples Democratic Republic of New Jersey' and lived there for a short time myself. I really feel sorry for anyone who lives there. It is really a shame because most of the people there are very nice and it is a good place to live except for the corrupt politicians, gun laws, insurance costs and taxes!
Link Posted: 9/2/2004 4:15:20 PM EST

Originally Posted By Tommmo:
The Democrat 'liberals', aka Commies, are trying to get so many confusing laws on the books that no matter what you do, you have broken a law! I have friends in the PDRNJ, 'Peoples Democratic Republic of New Jersey' and lived there for a short time myself. I really feel sorry for anyone who lives there. It is really a shame because most of the people there are very nice and it is a good place to live except for the corrupt polaticians, gun laws, insurance costs and taxes!



That's all flase! For example, look at our Governor! He's a straight as a.....<sigh> Well, that didn't go well.

I think NJ dems will be reaping the whirlwind..........
Link Posted: 9/3/2004 4:12:16 PM EST
[Last Edit: 9/3/2004 4:16:15 PM EST by hepcat85]
Well, I might just consider one of these - Muzzle Break/Stabilizer, CA Legal - so I can get the pistol grip. Then I'll be legal. Lord knows it's all about the evil flash hider.....

That's my last resort to get the set-up I want. I'm still making calls and sending the letter. I want someone to answer me....especially the Deputy State Attorney's office. What a line they dropped. Sheesh!
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