My g/f just gave me the ok to buy another gun (God bless her heart), and after an AR and an AK, a shotgun seems like the most reasonable choice to buy next.  

My price range is up to $350.  Shotgun will be used for home defense and lots of bullshitting at the range.  Was looking at Mossbergs, Remington 870, and Saiga-12.  Oh yeah, 12-guage is what I want, 18" barrel preffered.

Capacity, reliability, and power are definite big plusses and are very important to this choice.

Would also like to know where the best place to buy one is.  I can't seem to find a good source on the net.  

Any input is greatly appreciated.

For that money, run, don't walk, and buy a Remington M870 Express Home Defense with the 2 shot extension.  We sell them at the shop for $279.00 and you shouldn't have a real problem finding them in most of your better stocked shops where you live.

Matte blue finish, 18" cylinder bore barrel, black synthetic stocks, and magazine capacity of 6 rounds.

Use the extra money for ammo, a sling, and a case, and you're good to go.

Think man!  You are going in the wrong direction here.

Buy a .22 handgun and take the girlfriend shooting with it.  Good practice for her and you too.  Even if this one does not work out, any future wife should be a shooter or at least experience some range time.  22's are the best way to accomplish that quickly, easily and cheaply.  Once you hook her, you can buy all the guns you want.  Plus it gets you in to handguns too.

You will also have a gun you can use at the indoor range on bad weather days.

Plenty of 22's between $200 and $300.

Otherwise, Remington 870 or Benelli Nova fit your budget.

Hmmm, the m870 sounds like it will fit the bill.  I'll have to check Big 5 and call around some of the local shops.

Zoub, it's not so much that she restricts what I buy, she just makes sure I don't eat up all my cash, specially since I'll be going to college in a month.  Besides, I'm slowly weening her into shooting with the AK which I got her to shoot today

I can't buy a handgun anyway, I am only 19, and my parents aren't gun friendly.

Would still like more responses though!

get either a Winchester 1300 defender, mossberg or a Rem 870. I've owned a winchester that has done snake duty for me for the last 15 years. Rides on the 4 wheeler.

Mossberg 590.  20 inch parkerized finish.  9 round capacity.  Speedfeed stock.

I like mine......

In My Not So Fucking Humble Opinion (IMNSFHO) the 870 is the best in your price range. Beware though. I have seen two of them jam up so bad that complete disassembly was required to get them back up. Other than that, thousands of rouns and no problems, not even any other jams. I dont think a Mossberg could claim that.

 My mossberg 500 can, and at a cheaper price than the Rem 870.  

I say you should just shop around, check the local papers, fun shows, etc., and get whichever is the best buy.  

 Safety on the mossberg is on top, which is better for lefty shooters, as well as r-handers who don't like the garand-style, or push-button style safety.  

 Winchester is probably the fastest action, but the least available aftermarket parts.

 Weigh your options, but don't buy anything until you've looked at at least 3 different shotguns.  18.5" in. bbl is also a good choice- you're in the right direction.  

PS- regarding the handgun purchase...if AZ is like FL, you can buy a pistol through private sale.  I bought my first when I was 18- (S&W 442 .38spl +p stainless revolver)

Check your laws, but I can't see Arizona being more liberal than FL on this.   Packing.org may be a good place to start, as well as asking at local ranges, gun shops, etc.  Then, make sure you cross-check this with some sort of COMPETENT legal authority.  

Quoted: PS- regarding the handgun purchase...if AZ is like FL, you can buy a pistol through private sale.  I bought my first when I was 18- (S&W 442 .38spl +p stainless revolver) Check your laws, but I can't see Arizona being more liberal than FL on this.   Packing.org may be a good place to start, as well as asking at local ranges, gun shops, etc.  Then, make sure you cross-check this with some sort of COMPETENT legal authority.

uuuuuuuummmmmm, I think it is FEDERAL law about Being 21 to purchase a handgun

Zoub, This is your first and last warning! I am sorry to have to say this but if you ever recommend the purchase of a handgun over  a shotgun I will have no choice but to lock your account. I will then send the local authorities to remove your shotguns and deliver them to me for safekeeping until your reeducation is over. I hope that this was just an aberration, liquor might be involved, I hope we never have to talk about this again.  

Just when you think you know a guy!

MIKE.

PS: 870, 500, 1300 is the answer in that order.

The 870 still sounds like the best deal so far.  I'll have to do some shopping around today and see what's available and at what prices.  I'll try to see if I can handle a few different brands too.

Get the 870 and don't look back!

Ok, found the 870 for $290 at a local gun shop, but will have to be ordered.  

Also found it at Big 5 for $320, but they also have the Winchester on sale for $260, which was looking good at the moment, especially w/ 8 shell capacity.

So should I pay $290 for the 870 and wait, or just get the Winchester now for $260?

Quoted: Zoub, This is your first and last warning! I am sorry to have to say this but if you ever recommend the purchase of a handgun over  a shotgun I will have no choice but to lock your account. I will then send the local authorities to remove your shotguns and deliver them to me for safekeeping until your reeducation is over. I hope that this was just an aberration, liquor might be involved, I hope we never have to talk about this again.   Just when you think you know a guy! MIKE. PS: 870, 500, 1300 is the answer in that order.

"Reeducation"?  Commie talk!!  Et tu, Mikeee?

Well I have been in some intense pain since Saturday (ribs), and due to that not much sleep.  Under a lot of pressure at work, working a lot of hours and I did sneak a couple of hydrocodones of my wife's.  So....yeah I could chalk it up to a moment of weakness or influence of substance, but my thought was invest now and own lots of shotguns later.  After careful consideration, I still stand by my advice.

One other thing.  If you keep ALL of your guns clean and in good shape, your wife can not tell when you have added another gun to the "collection".  But you have to own more than 5 or 6 for this trick to work.  So for now any long gun is a good gun.

Buy a used 870 at a gun show, spend the rest on a surefire foregrip.  You could do that for close to $350 and have the base for a great gun.  Most used shotguns have been shot less than 50 to 100 times. My favorite 870 is built up from a used cop gun trade in from a pawn shop in NC.

In 25 years I had one true failure with an 870, it was ammo related.  Since it is your first go main stream.  Remington or Mossberg.

Quoted: Quoted: PS- regarding the handgun purchase...if AZ is like FL, you can buy a pistol through private sale.  I bought my first when I was 18- (S&W 442 .38spl +p stainless revolver) Check your laws, but I can't see Arizona being more liberal than FL on this.   Packing.org may be a good place to start, as well as asking at local ranges, gun shops, etc.  Then, make sure you cross-check this with some sort of COMPETENT legal authority.   uuuuuuuummmmmm, I think it is FEDERAL law about Being 21 to purchase a handgun

 Uhhhmmmm yeah, sherlock- did you even read my post, or do you not understand what I am saying?  

 I said PRIVATE SALE.  Note that there is one law regarding OWNERSHIP of a pistol, and another regarding BUYING of a pistol.

 Federal law says that an FFL cannot sell you a handgun until you are 21.  FEDERAL law says NOTHING about age requirements (beyond 18), for private transactions and ownership of pistols.

 Hence, this is left to state regulation, and why I told him to check his local laws.  

Glad we got that cleared up for you.  Drop the lesson fee in my im box on your way out.
 

 Sorry for the brief hijack to clarify one assclown's member's statement.  Good luck finding a nice shotgun.  I'm sure you'll find something nice.  

Get the 870.  It's much easier to find aftermarket/upgrade parts for.

I'm starting to wonder if the Mossberg vs Remington 870 are kinda like Apple vs PC or when it comes to .22 pistols, Ruger vs Browning.

Just a thought that escaped.

And will be hunted down and executed like any other mutinous pig-dog.

Damn, I'm really undecided now.  I think I am still leaning towards the 870, but I am not totally sure now.  

Help push me over the edge one way or another, and do it quick, I want to buy this gun before the weekend is out!

What are you wondering about?  Which shotgun to get or too maybe get a handgun instead.  Lets see how long before Mike finds this.

You need a push, well here it is AZ.  Back before I was even your age, I am 39 now, Remington was THE FIRST to design a pump gun with dual action slide bars.  Now everyone has them.  Every pump shotgun maker in the WORLD coppied that idea.  The slide bars are on each side of the foregrip and guide the action back in to the reciever when you pump it.  You will see 2 of them, that is thanks to the guys at Remington, not Mossberg, Winchester, Ithaca, Benelli, Savage, Beretta, Browning, Ruger or the Chinese in general.

Guns with one slide bar could be twisted and bound up, or worse.  An old Winchester model 12 or it's mate in 410 the model 42 are good examples of a single slide bar.

On a final note I think it is generally understood that Mossberg owners are accepted, but are also to be pittied, for they know not what they do.  Now go buy an 870 and take your Mom shooting.  Welcome to the 870 club.

In equipment exchange.  Somewhere in AZ

ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=7&f=93&t=173356&w=searchPop

Go somewhere and hold a benelli nova.....you will fall in love.

Quoted: In equipment exchange.  Somewhere in AZ ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=7&f=93&t=173356&w=searchPop

Crap!  Right after I get back from Big 5 with a Winchester, I see this

Oh well, I know you all wanted me to get the 870, but no one had them in stock for a decent price, and the 1300 was on sale.  I also like the feel of it a little better than the 870.  Besides, no wating to go shooting

There may be more aftermarket stuff for the 870 too, but chances are, this gun will be stock for a long time, as I have a precision AR and an AK to accesorize first.

Chances are though, I will probably end up buying an 870 later on anyway.  Thanlks for all the great advice, and I will post a range report sometime in the next couple of days.

And Zoub, I'll probably be gettin a .22 rifle for my g/f to shoot later on, so don't you worry.

Well, with all of the brand-partisanship going on, I figured I would weigh in on the issue.

In a different string, Fedgunner offered data of VERY extensive shooting tests that indicated that Mossbergs were superior than Remintons and Benellis in the category of pure durability.  I can offer the following, purely anecdotal, evidence of the reliability-under-shitty-conditions of the Mossberg M500 / M590 series.

My gun club (Ashland Lake Gun Club, OH) holds a very big riot gun match every year.  Seven of the last 10 of those matches have been held in our swamp and muddy woods.  The environment is more of a challenge than most civilian shooters (and their shotguns) will ever face.  At times, shooters must kneel or shoot from prone in the mud, wade through thigh deep water, and generally eat swamp muck while shooting.  One very wet year, I was actually submerged to my armits (I'm 6' 3")

I've shot either a Mossberg M500 or M590 in all of these matches, and have never had a problem of any type.  Bear in mind that there have been years that I actually had to hose the gun off with a garden hose to get the mud off, before I could attempt to detail strip and clean it.  I've fed these guns the filthiest, muddiest ammo, and they just keep chugging along.  Sure, the force required to pump the action has been difficult on occasion, but the guns never failed to deliver.  I guess I was turning little rocks into even smaller rocks, inside that nice, sloppy and forgiving action.

In 6 of these 7 matches, shooters with Mossbergs have claimed top honors, over and above all other brands and action-types.  Generally, auto-loaders don't do so well in the swamp.  Our only serious malfunction this year was with a Remington 11-87, where the shooter took a dive in the mud, getting his ammo dirty.  His gun couldn't handle it and jammed.  I don't blame this on the gun's brand, I blame it on the action type.  Auto-loaders are nice for hunting and target practice, but bring one into my swamp and I'll turn it into a single shot.  Almost every serious malfunction I've ever witnessed in the swamp matches has involved an autoloader, most of the culprits being Benelli's and Remingtons.

This little story isn't meant to put down Remingtons or Benelli's, but merely to present one shooter's very extensive (and happy) experience with the cheap and ugly, but very reliable Mossberg M500 / M590 series.  An earlier post disparaged the reliability of Mossbergs, and I felt compelled to defend their proven reliability.

The bottom line:  pick up a Remington tactical shotgun.  Pick up a Mossberg tactical shotgun.  Decide which one you like (because of looks, feel, "coolness", whatever) and buy it.  For all practical purposes, these guns are functionally identical.  If you like the Remington more and can afford the extra money, buy it.  If you like the Mossberg more, buy it. Either way, you'll probably be satisfied.

p.s.:  Chicks dig guys with Mossberg M590's more.  Honest to God, some technician guy did a test :)

AZ, Well you got your gun! Now the most important thing to buy is ammo, lots and lots of ammo. Like someone said before, the only thing shotguns need are shells. Enjoy, MIKE.

PS: Z, Dual action bars! Very Good! I will have to remember that one! Ok, the reeducation crack might have gone to far, my most humble apology. MIKE.

870's come in 20 guage too, right?  If so, I think my g/f may need a shotgun

There's no such thing as only buying one shotgun you know

Remington 870's come in 12 gauge super mag 3 1/2", 12 gauge 3" mag, 16 gauge 2 3/4", 20 gauge 3", 28 gauge 2 3/4" and .410 bore 3". I should know I have all gauge's except 16 gauge. ECS is right this is just the beginning of a long, long road. MIKE.

::chuckling::
Hoss.... you made my day.

edited to add:

All your threads are belong to us!

Quoted: 870's come in 20 guage too, right?  If so, I think my g/f may need a shotgun

YES, this thread lives!  Your anti-gun Mom could get her one as a Xmas gift from her "future in-laws"  Whoa!

No, buy the handgun.  Why does she need a shotgun?.........Oh I get it, the "old, I think she needs this trick". Don't tell my wife but soon I will be buyig her a Beretta CX4 and a Glock 26.  She needs both.

The 870 20 gauge youth model is a good choice for smaller framed people.  It is a great carry all day hunting gun for any ADULT to use. To be fair Mossberg has one too blah blah blah....

By the way I am glad you ignored those Mossberg guys with all their facts and stuff.  They were lying, they just wanted you to buy Mossberg.  There are no facts in shotgunning, just emotions, rumors, legends, myths and lies.

FYI, if I was putting together a tactical 20 gauge for a woman, not that I would, it would be the Benelli semi-auto M1 20 gauge with optional 4 shot mag extension making it 7+1 capacity and the 24 " barrel.  You can tell I have not put any thought in to this.  My wife may need this gun some day too.  But she needs the other guns first.

PS  most shotgun guys have a lot of different makes and models in their vault or closet.  I have Remington, Mossberg, Beretta, Winchester, Savage and will be adding Benelli in next 12-24 months.  Once I even gave my Brother a Mossberg as a gift, all though we don't really talk about that anymore.

Quoted: p.s.:  Chicks dig guys with Mossberg M590's more.  Honest to God, some technician guy did a test :)

If this is true, this could be important for our single members.  Could you please post the statistical analysis of this experiment?

PS  also, please define "Chicks".

870's are swell.

Quoted: Quoted: 870's come in 20 guage too, right?  If so, I think my g/f may need a shotgun YES, this thread lives!  Your anti-gun Mom could get her one as a Xmas gift from her "future in-laws"  Whoa! No, buy the handgun.  Why does she need a shotgun?.........Oh I get it, the "old, I think she needs this trick". Don't tell my wife but soon I will be buyig her a Beretta CX4 and a Glock 26.  She needs both. The 870 20 gauge youth model is a good choice for smaller framed people.  It is a great carry all day hunting gun for any ADULT to use. To be fair Mossberg has one too blah blah blah.... By the way I am glad you ignored those Mossberg guys with all their facts and stuff.  They were lying, they just wanted you to buy Mossberg.  There are no facts in shotgunning life, just emotions, rumors, legends, myths and lies. FYI, if I was putting together a tactical 20 gauge for a woman, not that I would, it would be the Benelli semi-auto M1 20 gauge with optional 4 shot mag extension making it 7+1 capacity and the 24 " barrel. You can tell I have not put any thought in to this.  My wife may need this gun some day too.  But she needs the other guns first. PS  most shotgun guys have a lot of different makes and models in their vault or closet.  I have Remington, Mossberg, Beretta, Winchester, Savage and will be adding Benelli in next 12-24 months.  Once I even gave my Brother a Mossberg as a gift, all though we don't really talk about that anymore.

Watch it, buddy...  the 500 or 590 may reach out and touch you..
Oh, BTW, Can I use that "no facts in shotgunning(life)" quote, as long as I give you "credit" when due?

U B 1 funny mofo....



Edited to hijack this thread from it's recent turn and say "Congrats on your Winchester, az-ar!!!"

Actually, now that I think about it, my g/f needs an XD-9, a 16" lightweight upper for the AR, a Serbu .50 bmg, an 870, an SAR-1 and SAR-2, a Marlin 45-70, a Dillon 550, lots of ammo, a subscription to the porn channels........

Quoted: Actually, now that I think about it, my g/f needs an XD-9, a 16" lightweight upper for the AR, a Serbu .50 bmg, an 870, an SAR-1 and SAR-2, a Marlin 45-70, a Dillon 550, lots of ammo, a subscription to the porn channels........

I will say this, for a 19 year old you have potential because you learn fast!  Here are 2 more tricks.

1)  Start now with a policy of at least one gun a year.  It can be small or cheap, but buy at least one gun a year

2) This trick I learned fom my wife.  Early in our relationship, I realized she would always tell me how much she saved when she went shopping.  Sure she would save a ton, a real power shopper, but she may have spent $1000 in the process.  I learned not to ask how much she actually spent if I wanted to be happy. Ignorance is bliss.

I have now developed this same skill and will tell her how great a deal I got on some mags or a particular gun.  She can relate to that and is usually excited for me because I saved so much money.  Pretty soon I am going to "save" a whole bunch of money.

Quoted: Quoted: Actually, now that I think about it, my g/f needs an XD-9, a 16" lightweight upper for the AR, a Serbu .50 bmg, an 870, an SAR-1 and SAR-2, a Marlin 45-70, a Dillon 550, lots of ammo, a subscription to the porn channels........ I will say this, for a 19 year old you have potential because you learn fast!  Here are 2 more tricks. 1)  Start now with a policy of at least one gun a year.  It can be small or cheap, but buy at least one gun a year 2) This trick I learned fom my wife.  Early in our relationship, I realized she would always tell me how much she saved when she went shopping.  Sure she would save a ton, a real power shopper, but she may have spent $1000 in the process.  I learned not to ask how much she actually spent if I wanted to be happy. Ignorance is bliss. I have now developed this same skill and will tell her how great a deal I got on some mags or a particular gun.  She can relate to that and is usually excited for me because I saved so much money.  Pretty soon I am going to "save" a whole bunch of money.

Someone tack that!  That's the best advice I've ever seen on this site, or any other.

Right now I am at one gun every 2 months, but I am sure that will slow down.  I always tell my g/f how good of a deal I am getting too.

She's really good with the guns too.  As long as I treat her right, take her to dinner, and have extra cash, she is cool with whatever I buy.

Anyway, just got back from the range with the Winchester, and I am not the least bit disappointed.  Quick and easy pumps, blowing up clay pigeons left and right, and w/ the cheapy Wally World ammo too.  Very happy

Funny thing is, at the range i met a guy with the exact same gun who just came right from Big 5 with it.  He had just bought it.  Odd coincidence.

And for all you 870 fans, don't worry.  I'm sure that an 870 will be my next shotgun purchase.  probably in the next year or so I'll have one I'm sure, just to have a dressed up shotgun.  This one is going to stay plain-jane, with the possible exception of a light.

Oh yeah, right now I am "saving" a lot of money on some 75 round drums for the AK

Az-Ar if your ever over in the west valley I'll have to take you shooting so you can see what a Mossy can do! The Remington is a great shotgun but bang for the buck the Mossberg 590 cant be beat! After all thats why our military use them right? Awsome shotgun and if your ever out this way I'll even let you shoot it!

Quoted: Oh yeah, right now I am "saving" a lot of money on some 75 round drums for the AK

How much did you save?  If you can convince us you are saving money then she will go for it too.  Practice never hurts.  Lets hear your pitch. Just how do you intend to tell her you saved money on a ridiculous mag that holds 75 rounds?  Isn't that what bank robers and drug dealers use?

Good luck on your test, turn your paper over when you are done.

Hint: An "A" paper will often contain no actual facts or figures but rather general statements of fact or perhaps inflated percentages based on unverifiable sources. The message will be presented in a positive light and will also usually contain some misdirection and quickly move on to a new subject.

Example:  Damn I got a good deal at the gun show today.  I found some parts and things I have always wanted.  The issue has never been price, but rather that I just could not find these for sale anywhere.  Most guys who own these will not part with them.  You just can't find them anywhwere.  So today not only do I find some for sale, but they are in great condition and I probably saved 30% too.  God that was a good gun show.  What did you today while I was at the show?  Did you remember to call your mother back?  Oh I almost forgot Bob said Hi but he didn't have time to come in.

Romanian drums that hold 75 rounds.  i can buy them for $55 a pop and if I ever run low on cash, I could easily get $75 $90 each for them.  Must buy before stock is out.

And if the AWB goes awry in '04, the value will sky-rocket.  it's a wise investment sweetie

Anyway, I got enough cash left over for a good dinner and a movie.  Let's see that movie, [insert chick-flick here], so you'll quit bugging me about seeing it.

Quoted: Ok, found the 870 for $290 at a local gun shop, but will have to be ordered.   Also found it at Big 5 for $320, but they also have the Winchester on sale for $260, which was looking good at the moment, especially w/ 8 shell capacity. So should I pay $290 for the 870 and wait, or just get the Winchester now for $260?

Winchester

lol, little late response Doctor Chicago.  Got the Winchester a week ago now and love it, no regrets.  Thanks for the input anyway