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Posted: 6/13/2009 10:40:44 AM EST
I want to load some precision varmint rounds for dogging but do not know what best to go with. I'm looking into these two options (Hornadys for longer range), but from the best I can tell, I will not be able to load the Hornadys for my AR unless I want to hand feed each round. Can anyone point me in the right direction for loading info on both of these (COAL, charges, etc.). I'd like to use Varget for both if possible. Thanks.

TJ
Link Posted: 6/13/2009 1:15:28 PM EST
Jon, I have used the 75 A-Max in a Colt 6724 and found the accuracy to be amazing at long ranges. Longer than anyone on this forum would believe. That said you are very correct about loading them one at a time into the AR platform. Sinclair International offers a single shot follower which greatly expidites this process. I also recomend that you start the cartridge into the chamber before dropping the bolt carrier group.

The loaded round length for my Colt's is 2.515 inches... yes 1/4 inch longer than magazine length... And they don't even reach the origin of the lands! The blessings of a 5.56 chamber I guess. Regardless the accuracy potential is better than 1/2 MOA with tuned handloads. I recomend any of the better medium burn rate propellants for this application. Varget, R15, H or IMR 4895, the VV 140 and 540 are also top choices.

Hope it helps thin the dogtowns.
Link Posted: 6/13/2009 2:08:19 PM EST
I was tinkering woth some 55gr CT Silvertips last year in my Armalite 20" Hbar (1/9 twist) & it seemed to like 27.0 through 27.5 grains of Varget. I was using Federal 205 primers with this combo, but quit when I found out that the cups are to soft for use in a semi auto.

I haven't gotten any of the harder primers to replace them yet either, so my tinkering ended there.

And I wish I could tell you how they grouped, but I misplaced the targets that I used for those rounds. I seem to remember that they hovered (roughly) around .75 to 1.5 inches at 100 yards, depending on the wind (it blows alot here in NW Minnesota), the load varation & me just plain screwing up the shot.
Link Posted: 6/13/2009 3:26:25 PM EST
[Last Edit: 6/13/2009 3:27:27 PM EST by TigerJon]
Thanks for the advice guys. The only reason I bought the A-Max bullets was that the CMMG 16" I have on order has a 1 -7" barrel. I admit I did not do my homework when picking them out (especially the Horns). I know if I jump 55 gr. FMJ up to 3000 fps+, the round will rip apart upon exiting the barrel (according to several sources including Speer #14). Do you know if this same effect will happen with the 55 gr. Silvertips? I'll probably need to stick with something around 62 - 69 gr. I'm just afraid 55 gr. bullets won't stabilize in my barrel, even at 2800 fps. Hand feeding won't bee too bad, it'll just give the little bastards more time to congregate.

TJ
Link Posted: 6/13/2009 3:46:48 PM EST
You'll have no problems with a 1/7 twist with 55 fmj's or most spire point 55 grain bullets at 3000 fps or more. Possibly thin jacketed varmint bullets like the Hornady SX varmint bullets would have problems coming apart in flight. I've shot Winchester 40 grain SP's, 50 grain Hornady V-Max bullets in 1/9 and 1/7 twist barrels and they shot fine. A load I shoot a lot of is Hornady's 55 grain Spire Point and I've not had any issues in more than one 1/7 twist barrel. You shouldn't have any problem with the 55 silver-tips either. I'd recommend loading Hornady's 75 bthp rather than the A-Max if you want to feed them from a magazine or Sierra's 77 SMK or Nosler's 77 Custom Competition or any of the 68-69 grain match bullets.
Link Posted: 6/13/2009 4:05:04 PM EST
I'm not 100% sure, but I think that the silver tips have a heavier jacket than your standard varmint bullets.
Link Posted: 6/13/2009 4:21:44 PM EST
Link Posted: 6/14/2009 3:49:00 AM EST
Thanks everyone, I feel better about having the box of Horns now. I think in the future I will stay away from the heavier bullets like the 75 gr. A-Max.

TJ
Link Posted: 6/14/2009 3:56:48 AM EST
Link Posted: 6/14/2009 8:00:12 AM EST
[Last Edit: 6/14/2009 8:00:39 AM EST by TigerJon]
Aero,
Do you know if there is a website(s) or something like a PDF that gives loading data on various bullets? I need to print off or make a chart on min & mac OAL, various bullet weights, different charge weights & powder types, etc. for the popular .223 bullets, especially the varmint bullets (Blitzking, V-Max, Silver Tip, etc.).

Thanks.

TJ
Link Posted: 6/14/2009 12:47:57 PM EST
Link Posted: 6/14/2009 1:52:04 PM EST
I have the Speer manual(vol #14), The Hodgdon Basic Reloaders Manual 2008, and the Alliant Reloaders Guide (2008). I like the Speer manual the most because it's objective on the powder type, however, there are several .223 bullets (weight and type) left out. Also, it does not differentiate between bolt action and AR loading. The Hodgdon manual only shows loads up to 55 gr., and the Alliant manual is nice because it shows several bullet weights, however, it is subjective on the powder type as well. I'll check out the Reloading Resources. The only powder I've used for .223 thus far is Varget. I may try to score some Reloader 10x or 15. I use Bullseye on all of my 9mm reloads. Any opinions on Alliant powder. Thanks.

TJ
Link Posted: 6/14/2009 3:25:13 PM EST
I agree with AeroE, the Hornady 75gr BTHP-M is my long range bullet of choice for the AR platform. Try it with ~24.0 grains of Varget and and OAL of 2.25" so you can load them in AR mags. If you work up from 23.0 grains of varget you should be able to find a great load for your rifle. I load my Hornady 75gr BTHP-M rounds with 25.0 grains of Varget but that is near max load and I carefully worked up to that trying to get the most fps possible to match the BDC strata of my ACOG. The most accurate loads tend to be in the neighborhood of 24.0 grains of Varget for many people.
Link Posted: 6/14/2009 3:52:00 PM EST
http://accurateshooter.net/Downloads/sierra223ar.pdf

The above is Sierra's information for AR's.

Believe that you can cause bullets to fail with fast ywist or high speeds (Hornady SX) I have seen it with my own eyes.

The Silvertips will not be a problem for you, and do not be concerned about your twist rate, it will stabalize all bullets for you.
Link Posted: 6/14/2009 6:07:43 PM EST
[Last Edit: 6/14/2009 6:17:18 PM EST by AeroE]
Link Posted: 6/15/2009 4:08:11 PM EST
I talked to my uncle today; Lyman 49 is what I need to get my hands on. Too bad Borders can't order it, I have a $35 gift card. Received my Wilson headspace gauge from Midway today. Looking at some of my previously re-sized cases, I see I need to adjust my die. What will happen if I try shooting some of my loads? Can I potentially damage my rifle, or worse yet, myself? Will I simply run the risk of feed problems? Thanks again.

TJ
Link Posted: 6/16/2009 8:07:00 AM EST
75 A-Max's at distance: Range 405 yards, dead calm I thought!

Jon, the second load was a max charge of VV 540 powder was a 1990's lot#. F205M, Winchester commercial brass. "Borg is also the man to chat with.

D



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