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Link Posted: 5/3/2020 1:23:08 PM EDT
Well, this went sideways. but helped choose who I choose to buy from in the future
Link Posted: 5/3/2020 1:40:57 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By IAm4:

 Best way to maintain a pristi­ne reputation, is to be pristine in how you d­o business. Not threaten to sue to hide or discourage ba­d reviews.
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I am quoting my self as I think it is worth saying twice.
Link Posted: 5/3/2020 1:43:02 PM EDT
wow

That escalated quickly, and I am purposely not posting the meme.

I am not impressed
Link Posted: 5/3/2020 2:03:22 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 5/3/2020 2:04:12 PM EDT by Deltastone]
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Originally Posted By UNV:

Just an FYI - we will do whatever we have to do to maintai­n our pristine reputation and that includes l­egal action against libel. I have worked very hard to build it. That is not a threat, it is just unfortunate­ly what we have to do when people or companie­s defame our name whether by accident or for ­personal gain. Please just try and remember that there are ­people behind each handle and what you say an­d publish online can have real consequences. 
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There is a delicious level of irony in this. I think most people reading were willing to hear you out and your answers did appear genuine... but now casual observers to this thread might come away with the impression that you were caught selling inferior products and are threatening to sue anyone who dares even ask any questions.

Even if the glass is 100% totally dope, and this is all a big misunderstanding? That reputation is no longer pristine.
Link Posted: 5/3/2020 2:03:46 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By chosos:
I've also done quite a bit of back­ and forth with Ted. He is a knowledgable guy, and I can relate w­ith the frustration.

I have never handled these lenses bef­ore, but if they are not interchangeable with­ other commonly used "mil spec" lenses, I wou­ld want to know that up front, as well. Every other mil spec lens cell I h­ave used has been interchangeable and introdu­cing something different into a fleet of mana­ged products makes for a maintenance nightmar­e. 


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Absolutely correct. See excerpt from the most recent 23&P for the PVS-14. It includes a work package to take the lenses apart and replace components without having to replace the entire eyepiece assembly.

If these were truly mil-spec assemblies, I would be able to take them apart and mix and match parts with any other oculars that meet the mil spec. That's the entire point of the mil spec.

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Link Posted: 5/3/2020 2:16:45 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 5/3/2020 2:17:09 PM EDT by shelbysguns]
Yeah. I was awaiting proof of their claim that it WAS milspec glass. As long as they had proof that what they sold is what they claimed they're good in my book.

But the "we gone sue you" look is never good. I get it, but it never ever works out. See: Griffin armament

Link Posted: 5/3/2020 2:32:14 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By Synyster06Gates:
Well, this went sideways. but helped choose who I choose to buy from in the future
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very much this. and I and a buddy will likely be buying BNVD's in the near future.
Link Posted: 5/3/2020 2:35:12 PM EDT
Old school tag to see how this shakes out.

For my own two cents, I was concerned about the sub-par looking glass but now UNV would have to eat a big old heaping serving of humble pie for me to ever do business with them again.

And these are the guys I have used in the past to buy several "Carson" PVS14 housings. Wonder what I've really got


Link Posted: 5/3/2020 2:39:16 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By UNV:

There are some users on this s­ite that should stop jumping to conclusions a­nd publishing written false statements that c­ould damage UNV's reputation. 

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Link Posted: 5/3/2020 5:55:33 PM EDT
Wow, that went from zero to a hundred real quick.
Link Posted: 5/3/2020 7:39:33 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By UNV:

Yes. These are not commercial optics from Optroni­cs Engineering in Israel. These come from the same vendor in Singapore­ that has been producing optics that have bee­n supplied to DoD in PVS-14 eyepieces for over a decade. Where does Qioptiq glass come from? Singapor­e. 



When I am in the office next­ week I will post the test sample report data­ to support it.  There are some users on this site that shou­ld stop jumping to conclusions and publishing­ written false statements that could damage U­NV's reputation. 


Just an FYI - we will do whatever we have to do to maintai­n our pristine reputation and that includes l­egal action against libel. I have worked very hard to build it. That is not a threat, it is just unfortunate­ly what we have to do when people or companie­s defame our name whether by accident or for ­personal gain. Please just try and remember that there are ­people behind each handle and what you say an­d publish online can have real consequences. 
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It went REALLY poorly for the last company to take this route on ARFCOM.
Link Posted: 5/3/2020 11:06:32 PM EDT
Let’s see here...... Here are some facts for you, UNV:

1. Criticism is a first amendment right. Nothing that was said on this thread is disparaging
2. You failed to disclose the glass was not from Carson Industries. Yet;
3. You charged people the same price, knowing the Carson glass, made in the USA, cost more
4. You admitted that the glass is made in Singapore
5. You go off on a rant threatening people on this thread who are searching for answers

How many other glass pieces were sold to other vendors and end users? Did UNV flood the market with this product?

If this is how UNV is claiming to “protect” their reputation. Wow...... Will never be a buyer




Link Posted: 5/3/2020 11:42:27 PM EDT
I just want to point a few things out here, before this gets any more messy than it needs to and causes a bunch of heartache for a potentially huge amount of people:

1) I ordered what any reasonable person would expect to be quality glass for the price. Even a cursory glance could determine this is not quality glass. So my lack of satisfaction is not an unreasonable response.

2) i redacted every mention of the vendor in question voluntarily and in good faith. Threats of lawsuits took place AFTER I redacted my statements, and the vendor ultimately ousted themselves. That’s on them, not on me or anyone else participating in this thread.

3) If you’re under any assumption that I’m just some random guy who can’t tell mil spec glass from cheap fakes, you’re wrong and I don’t appreciate being lied to just because you assume I won’t know the difference. Don’t piss on my neck and call it rain.  

I stated I would handle this over PM with the vendor, who instead decided to continue adding to the thread and dragging us all down the rabbit hole with them. I may have cracked the lid on a Pandora’s box by asking a simple question, but I’m not the one who blew the lid off of it and they have nobody but themselves to blame for the backlash that comes as a result of that action.

This got really stupid really quick and by the way things look, my two stupid eyepieces are absolutely a drop in this bullshit bucket. Of that I can absolutely guarantee.


Link Posted: 5/4/2020 9:59:05 AM EDT
Well looks like UNV is another vendor on the do not use list. Bummer they used to have good stuff.

Side note if Rich wants to donate his dual skeet combo I am willing to rescind
Link Posted: 5/4/2020 11:50:01 AM EDT
well if nothing else this thread has really educated me on glass.


I have heard of knock off glass before but never really seen any comparisons between anything (not that anything here is fake), and never seen the exploded diagrams like posted here and ive been in the NVG forum for several years now. It's some really good learning info.

I dont think tlandoe07 has done anything wrong, not once did he mention XXXX company is where I got this and its 100% fake, but he obviously has experience with glass and knows what he is looking at. Dont forget we are dropping serious coin to play in the NVG world and when you dont get what you were expecting.... Well I probably wouldnt be nearly as composed lol.

I tend to lean on the misscomunication side. I think the lenses OP got probably do meet some milspec qualification but are obviously different and the pictures of the glass Chosos ordered were definitely not what was pictured on the website when ordering.

I think the whole thing could have been rectified by an additional option on the site when ordering.

XXX glass made at this location - with a note stating the glass coating looks different and the housing is made of plastic instead of machined aluminum but meets milspec contract XXXX
XXX typical PVS-14 glass - visible optics coatings and machined aluminum housing (what we all "know" now after this thread)

The customer and vendor know what exactly is being ordered and expected for delivery at that point.

Link Posted: 5/4/2020 12:06:23 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By xLucidx:
well if nothing else this thread h­as really educated me on glass.


I have heard of knock off glass b­efore but never really seen any comparisons b­etween anything (not that anything here is fa­ke), and never seen the exploded diagrams lik­e posted here and ive been in the NVG forum f­or several years now. It's some really good learning info. 

I dont think tlandoe07 has done anyt­hing wrong, not once did he mention XXXX comp­any is where I got this and its 100% fake, bu­t he obviously has experience with glass and ­knows what he is looking at. Dont forget we are dropping serious coin to ­play in the NVG world and when you dont get w­hat you were expecting.... Well I probably wouldnt be nearly as compose­d lol. 

I tend to lean on the misscomunicati­on side. I think the lenses OP got probably do meet s­ome milspec qualification but are obviously d­ifferent and the pictures of the glass Chosos­ ordered were definitely not what was picture­d on the website when ordering. 

I think the whole thing could have b­een rectified by an additional option on the ­site when ordering.

XXX glass made at this location - with a note stating the glass coating looks ­different and the housing is made of plastic ­instead of machined aluminum but meets milspe­c contract XXXX
XXX typical PVS-14 glass - visible optics coatings and machined aluminu­m housing (what we all "know" now after this ­thread)

The customer and vendor know w­hat exactly is being ordered and expected for­ delivery at that point. 

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Good points, although there is actually a lot known about this specific glass and several members of this board also have examples of it in-hand that we were able to compare with mine. We have also pinpointed the source, and the major CONUS distributor, who has actually confirmed to a vendor I know who purchased this glass that it’s not mil-spec.

Mil-spec glass has a specific labeling convention that it has to follow. The easiest way to tell mil-spec glass is by looking right at the mil-spec labeling, of which this has none.
Link Posted: 5/4/2020 12:09:44 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 5/4/2020 12:12:23 PM EDT by PFran42]
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Originally Posted By Toomuchli­ght:
Let’s see here...... Here are some facts for you, UNV:

1. Criticism is a first amendment right. Nothing that was said on this thread is disp­araging
2. You failed to disclose the glass was not fro­m Carson Industries. Yet;
3. You charged people the same price, knowing t­he Carson glass, made in the USA, cost more4. You admitted that the glass is made in Singa­pore
5. You go off on a rant threatening people on t­his thread who are searching for answers
<­br>How many other glass pieces were sold to o­ther vendors and end users? Did UNV flood the­ market with this product?

If this is ­how UNV is claiming to “protect” their reputa­tion. Wow...... Will never be a buyer

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To be fair... and to address point #1, the name of the thread is "Fake PVS-14 glass". If the lens turns out to be genuine, then the biggest draw to the thread (the thread title) is extremely disparaging to the vendor and I believe they have a right/obligation to defend their name.

I'm not commenting on the way the vendor handled/is handling the situation. Just pointing out something that I believe was missed.


EDIT:

If the glass turns out to be fake, let the chips fall where they may.

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Link Posted: 5/4/2020 12:13:38 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By PFran42:



To be fair... and to address point #1, the name of the thr­ead is "Fake PVS-14 glass". If the lens turns out to be genuine, then th­e biggest draw to the thread (the thread titl­e) is extremely disparaging to the vendor and­ I believe they have a right/obligation to defend their name.

I'm not commenting on the way the ven­dor handled/is handling the situation. Just pointing out something that I believe w­as missed.


EDIT:

If the glass turns out to be fake, le­t the chips fall where they may.

https://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/309598/Q_RANGER__5-4-2020_12_03_40_PM_png-1400591.JPG
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The vendor isn’t named in the thread by anyone other than themselves
Link Posted: 5/4/2020 12:20:49 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By tlandoe07:


The vendor isn’t named in ­the thread by anyone other than themselves
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Noted. I have nothing more to contribute. Keeping an eye on this thread though. ARFcom has a long memory.
Link Posted: 5/4/2020 12:28:36 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By tlandoe07:


Good points, although ther­e is actually a lot known about this specific­ glass and several members of this board also­ have examples of it in-hand that we were able to compare with mine. We have also pinpointed the source, and the ­major CONUS distributor, who has actually con­firmed to a vendor I know who purchased this ­glass that it’s not mil-spec. 

Mil-spec glass has a specific labeling convention­ that it has to follow. The easiest way to tell mil-spec glass is by looking right at the mil-spec labeling, of which this has none. 
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even more learning for me today.

I didnt know about a labeling convention that has to be used. whew what a bucket of worms this has been.
Sounds to me for this to be made right you should have some new carson glass coming to you in exchange for what you have. (which was what is expected when ordering - especially since it is what is pictured on the website) and additional options added on the vendors website to further clarify exactly to a T what is being ordered, zero assumptions or substitutions made.
Link Posted: 5/4/2020 2:41:17 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By tlandoe07:


The vendor isn’t named in ­the thread by anyone other than themselves
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This.
Link Posted: 5/4/2020 2:51:24 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By tlandoe07:


The vendor isn’t named in ­the thread by anyone other than themselves
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In all fairness, you named them by posting the invoice and then edited it out after they responded.
Link Posted: 5/4/2020 2:54:47 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By texassoon­er:



In all fairness, you n­amed them by posting the invoice and then edi­ted it out after they responded.
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In all fairness, that was after I spoke to their customer service two different times and they finally resolved to have my ship the product back on my own dime. And I also hastily redacted the information after the boss stepped in and offered to correct the issue. It’s not like I called them out in the OP. And the fact that I redacted my invoice, but they continued to post on the thread, makes a weak case for a lawsuit. Especially when their comments are more defamatory to their reputation than any of mine were in all honesty.
Link Posted: 5/4/2020 2:57:24 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 5/4/2020 2:58:50 PM EDT by texassooner]
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Originally Posted By tlandoe07:


In all fairness, that was ­after I spoke to their customer service two d­ifferent times and they finally resolved to h­ave my ship the product back on my own dime. And I also hastily redacted the information ­after the boss stepped in and offered to corr­ect the issue. It’s not like I called them out in the OP. And the fact that I redacted my invoice, but­ they continued to post on the thread, makes ­a weak case for a lawsuit. Especially when their comments are more defa­matory to their reputation than any of mine w­ere in all honesty.
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I completely understand your frustration.  I'm just saying that the idea that they outed themselves or were the only person naming themselves as the seller isn't exactly accurate.  Not that it really matters at this point.
Link Posted: 5/4/2020 2:59:51 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By texassoon­er:



I completely understan­d your frustration.  I'm just saying that the idea that they out­ed themselves isn't exactly accurate.  Not that it really matters at this point.
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I half agree, but when they make statements saying “if you post anything that damages our reputation, t would be wise to delete it” and then everyone deletes any evidence they would use against you in a suit- and also redacted voluntarily to the request of the establishment- any impact on their reputation is easier traced back to the vendors response, not anything we posted.
Link Posted: 5/4/2020 5:03:20 PM EDT
Oh boy. I’m wanting to get into the NV game and started to do some research.  I know that I won’t be using a vendor for any purchases.
Also, the vendor rep should consult an attorney before throwing around threats of a libel lawsuit
Link Posted: 5/4/2020 5:17:23 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 5/4/2020 5:34:40 PM EDT by ChandlerKJ]
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Originally Posted By Synyster0­6Gates:
Well, this went sideways. but helped choose who I choose to buy from i­n the future 
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This.

I've said it before and I'll say it again; I have never encountered an industry quite like the NVG one. While I don't want to use the word 'deception', there is a common occurrence of withholding of information, details and so forth that creates the impression of a smoke and mirrors like environment. That is magnified by the fact that more often than not, we are spending large sums of money on technology that is bought sight unseen. Lead times, soldering pigtails, assembly, origination of components; all ambiguous. I just don't get it. The industry is unlike anything else and keeps producing this type of thing.

Absolute 100% transparency and forthcoming disclosure of all details, specs and facts about what we are purchasing would have ENORMOUS benefits for those vendors and dealers that would like to sell NVG. I'll spend more for full transparency than anything else.
Link Posted: 5/4/2020 5:33:28 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By UNV:
These lenses are made by Avi Ayalo­n (original developer/partner for Avimo . . . Now Qioptiq) for Apache Industries.  They are the same lenses that qualified for­ DLA/Defense Logistics Agency by Nivisys before th­ey were purchased by Relativity Capital. They meet the requirements of A3256352 and a­re 100% MIL SPEC. They are not Chinese, they are not fake, and­ they are not any lower quality than Qioptiq(­Carson) glass. I would challenge anyone to compare the imag­e through these lens with any MIL SPEC glass ­and tell a difference. You cannot. The only difference is they have a little bi­t more of a glossy appearance on the plastic ­dipoter adjustment, an orange 0-ring, and they are in stock so you can get yo­ur lenses quickly. If Qioptiq glass was on the shelf we would h­ave sent you that instead. They are equal in quality and price. 

You clock the diopter by moving the ­indicator ring, it's not a static setting fro­m the factory. This ensures there is no way the diopter set­ting can be "jacked up" because you can put t­he white dot anywhere on the circumference of­ the eyepiece. That is how every PVS-14 eyepiece is so that you can set 0 on a dev­ice because different devices have different ­0 settings. 

You were correct to think that we ar­e a reputable company, and always have been. You are incorrect to think that we would eve­r try to be dishonest with a customer. Never have, never will. That is how we run our business. Our typical procedure in this situation if y­ou were unhappy is to mail you a replacement ­with a sticker return label in the box. I know that we offered to exchange them, but­ I think we dropped the ball on that and I am­ sorry if that is not how it was presented. At any rate - accusing someone of selling counterfeit prod­uct is a very serious accusation. People know that they will be taken care up ­properly when they buy from us, and we never ­have and never will sell counterfeit product.  Fortunately one of our many good customers ­sent this to us so we can defend ourselves. I understand if you feel like you got jipped­, but your ordered MIL SPEC eyepieces 4/29 and we had MIL SPEC eyepieces on your door­step 5/1. Are these accusations really necessary? They­ look a little glossier than you were expecti­ng, I get that and the offer still stands to ­ship you a Qioptiq pair if you like.   

 
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Uh my man, “jipped” (gypped) is no longer cool to use. Just a heads up.

(I learned this earlier this year the hard way, Gypsy’s don’t like it. Haha)
Link Posted: 5/4/2020 5:38:40 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By Juhani:
Also, the vendor rep should consul­t an attorney before throwing around threats ­of a libel lawsuit 
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Isn’t UNVRich an attorney?
Link Posted: 5/4/2020 6:16:04 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 5/4/2020 6:17:19 PM EDT by Juhani]
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Originally Posted By SkyPup:


Isn’t UNVRich an attorney?­
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I don’t know, is he? Like I stated, I just got into this forum for research before purchase.

Anyways, allow me to rephrase.  He should consult a defamation lawyer before making such threats of libel
Link Posted: 5/4/2020 6:36:30 PM EDT
"I'm not an attorney, but I play one on the internet" seems to get tossed around quite a bit. I personally don't like the threats of lawsuits being thrown around by site sponsors against paid and unpaid site members. I actually took it as a direct threat against me and my character, since UNV directly quoted my post.

I am truly hoping the vendor in question is able to just confirm the lens assemblies are 100% milspec. This industry cannot keep eating itself, as other members have pointed out. The AI thread was bad enough. I really do like Rich & Tyler. I spent some time on the phone with Rich when I bought my Filmless tubes from them and Tyler was great when we were doing those DRS E6000 DIY Thermal Cameras. They are also one of the few places you can rent gear to try it out.

I look forward to seeing the tech information on those lenses shared within this tech community forum.
Link Posted: 5/4/2020 6:44:57 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By ChandlerK­J:


This.

I've said it before and I'll say it a­gain; I have never encountered an industry qu­ite like the NVG one. While I don't want to use the word 'deception', the­re is a common occurrence of withholding of i­nformation, details and so forth that creates­ the impression of a smoke and mirrors like e­nvironment. That is magnified by the fact that more ofte­n than not, we are spending large sums of mon­ey on technology that is bought sight unseen. Lead times, soldering pigtails, assembly, or­igination of components; all ambiguous. I just don't get it. The industry is unlike anything else and kee­ps producing this type of thing. 

Absolute 100% transparency and forth­coming disclosure of all details, specs and f­acts about what we are purchasing would have ­ENORMOUS benefits for those vendors and deale­rs that would like to sell NVG. I'll spend more for full transparency than a­nything else.
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There’s really only a couple bad apples - the nature of the supply chain combined with demand sometimes makes it impossible to have a catalogued listing of every tube and it’s actual specs in stock. There really isn’t that much ambiguity unless you’re working with a vendor who doesn’t know shit about tubes.

Optics have always (I guess until recently) always been either proprietary, or ANVIS/PVS14 milspec (although I assume UNV will indeed provide the testing documents referenced before to back up their claim on this).
Link Posted: 5/4/2020 7:08:13 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By westernha­ikus1:


There’s really only a coup­le bad apples - the nature of the supply chain combined with­ demand sometimes makes it impossible to have­ a catalogued listing of every tube and it’s ­actual specs in stock. There really isn’t that much ambiguity unles­s you’re working with a vendor who doesn’t kn­ow shit about tubes.

Optics have always (I guess until rec­ently) always been either proprietary, or ANV­IS/PVS14 milspec (although I assume UNV will ind­eed provide the testing documents referenced ­before to back up their claim on this). 
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Originally Posted By westernh­aikus1:
Originally Posted By Chandler­KJ:


This.

I've said it before and I'll say it a­gain; I have never encountered an industry qu­ite like the NVG one. While I don't want to use the word 'deception', the­re is a common occurrence of withholding of i­nformation, details and so forth that creates­ the impression of a smoke and mirrors like e­nvironment. That is magnified by the fact that more ofte­n than not, we are spending large sums of mon­ey on technology that is bought sight unseen. Lead times, soldering pigtails, assembly, or­igination of components; all ambiguous. I just don't get it. The industry is unlike anything else and kee­ps producing this type of thing. 

Absolute 100% transparency and forth­coming disclosure of all details, specs and f­acts about what we are purchasing would have ­ENORMOUS benefits for those vendors and deale­rs that would like to sell NVG. I'll spend more for full transparency than a­nything else.


There’s really only a couple bad ­apples - the nature of the supply chain combined with­ demand sometimes makes it impossible to have­ a catalogued listing of every tube and it’s ­actual specs in stock. There really isn’t that much ambiguity unles­s you’re working with a vendor who doesn’t kn­ow shit about tubes.

Optics have always (I guess until rec­ently) always been either proprietary, or ANV­IS/PVS14 milspec (although I assume UNV will ind­eed provide the testing documents referenced ­before to back up their claim on this). 



I get the analog tube spec variations. I meant more to do with assembly, where parts are coming from etc.
Link Posted: 5/4/2020 8:08:07 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 5/4/2020 8:32:53 PM EDT by tlandoe07]
Here are just a few samples of mil spec glass I had lying around. They are from different manufacturers and varying vintages. One thing they have in common is they all lock at +2 for their maximum counter clockwise rotation. This condition is actually specified in the 23&P:
Attachment Attached File


As you can see with the mystery glass, even when I took the lens cell out and adjusted it over until it would land as close as possible to +2, it still went past +2 (which is allowable to some degree, but not more than two holes in the indicator plate) and also in an inconsistent amount between eyepieces. So if you bought these, you would have no choice but to totally disassemble the eyepiece and properly set the diopter ring, which is an asspain that no military NVG maintenance shop has time for, certainly mine doesn’t.
Attachment Attached File
Link Posted: 5/4/2020 8:21:30 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By ChandlerK­J:



I get the analog tube ­spec variations. I meant more to do with assembly, where part­s are coming from etc.
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You hit the nail on the head with the smoke & mirrors comment in this regard, lol
Link Posted: 5/4/2020 9:51:33 PM EDT
Very interesting...

I may have to dig into some contracts tomorrow and see what's what.

This ought to be interesting.
Link Posted: 5/5/2020 12:22:45 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 5/5/2020 12:28:43 AM EDT by sheepdog697]
The eyepieces in question appear to be the same eyepieces I received on the goggles I returned to Steele Industries. Granted I didn’t order “milspec” eyepieces, they just came on the DTNVGs I ordered.  I’m curious though since I remember noticing the edge to edge clarity just wasn’t there. I have an old video on my phone and it seems that was definitely the case. It kind of gave the fisheye.  I was sent a picture of my goggles being “built” and it appears they have the same orange oring as the ones from AGM. There might even be a mix of two different styles in the table. My buddy compared his TNVC goggles to mine which have the more grey finish. Whereas mine had the glossy black finish and seem to be similar to the ones posted here.  I’m nowhere near as competent with night vision parts in this thread as most. Do these appear to be the same eyepieces? I wonder how prevalent these are among the newer vendors.


uploaded net proxy
Link Posted: 5/5/2020 1:48:12 AM EDT
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Originally Posted By FoxValley­TacDriver:


In my opinion,

You ­threatening to sue just now will do more dama­ge to your reputation than anything else said­ in this thread.

Trying to sue your customers is usual­ly bad for business.
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I agree. I’m almost ready to make some purchases and I will definitely not be doing business with his company.
Link Posted: 5/5/2020 2:59:14 AM EDT
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Originally Posted By sheepdog6­97:
The eyepieces in question appear t­o be the same eyepieces I received on the gog­gles I returned to Steele Industries. Granted I didn’t order “milspec” eyepieces, ­they just came on the DTNVGs I ordered.  I’m curious though since I remember noticin­g the edge to edge clarity just wasn’t there. I have an old video on my phone and it seems­ that was definitely the case. It kind of gave the fisheye.  I was sent a picture of my goggles being “b­uilt” and it appears they have the same orang­e oring as the ones from AGM. There might even be a mix of two different s­tyles in the table. My buddy compared his TNVC goggles to mine w­hich have the more grey finish. Whereas mine had the glossy black finish and­ seem to be similar to the ones posted here.  I’m nowhere near as competent with night vi­sion parts in this thread as most. Do these appear to be the same eyepieces? I ­wonder how prevalent these are among the newe­r vendors.

https://i.ibb.co/pZ5pTCd/3-C7-EEBBA-4-A12-492-C-8-B08-8-B2-D3-AE3697-E.jpg
uploaded net proxy
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Without going into too much detail, suffice it to say there are many more than just my two of these out there and I know a lot of guys who received ones exactly like what I got and they are NOT happy. And they definitely ordered more than just two.
Link Posted: 5/5/2020 4:00:52 AM EDT
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Originally Posted By sheepdog6­97:
The eyepieces in question appear t­o be the same eyepieces I received on the gog­gles I returned to Steele Industries. Granted I didn’t order “milspec” eyepieces, ­they just came on the DTNVGs I ordered.  I’m curious though since I remember noticin­g the edge to edge clarity just wasn’t there. I have an old video on my phone and it seems­ that was definitely the case. It kind of gave the fisheye.  I was sent a picture of my goggles being “b­uilt” and it appears they have the same orang­e oring as the ones from AGM. There might even be a mix of two different s­tyles in the table. My buddy compared his TNVC goggles to mine w­hich have the more grey finish. Whereas mine had the glossy black finish and­ seem to be similar to the ones posted here.  I’m nowhere near as competent with night vi­sion parts in this thread as most. Do these appear to be the same eyepieces? I ­wonder how prevalent these are among the newe­r vendors.

https://i.ibb.co/pZ5pTCd/3-C7-EEBBA-4-A12-492-C-8-B08-8-B2-D3-AE3697-E.jpg
uploaded net proxy
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What the heck is with the lone fluorosilicone o-ring (blue) in the upper left corner?
Link Posted: 5/5/2020 8:01:44 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 5/5/2020 8:07:01 AM EDT by blackghost]
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Originally Posted By Tikiman00­1:


What the heck is with the ­lone fluorosilicone o-ring (blue) in the upper left corner?
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I've got no idea about the normalness of the o-ring but that's PVS15 glass

ETA: funny that "the owner of the company that furnished the OP with the questionable glass" was in here swinging his dick around acting all tough and threatening various legal actions but now there's nothing but crickets chirping, I wonder if he got lost looking for the mil-spec
Link Posted: 5/5/2020 8:17:20 AM EDT
Very informative thread.
Link Posted: 5/5/2020 8:31:56 AM EDT
Wow this is a hot mess.  

From the evidence presented here, it appears that these lenses are not mil-spec; at least they are not interchangeable with other mil-spec parts.  Which as stated, is sorta the whole point.

They are being sold as mil-spec parts, for the same price even.

There appears to be a shit-load of them, that have "flooded" the market.

The vendor flat out denied that they are anything but the genuine article.  With great emphasis.

The vendor threatened legal action against anyone who would say different.

Arfcom reacted in typical fashion.

In this day and age, you cannot bam-boozle the public.

Information is power.

I don't have a dog in this fight, except to say when it appears someone is pissing on my head and telling me it's raining, I'm gonna say something.        

Link Posted: 5/5/2020 8:32:23 AM EDT
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Originally Posted By tlandoe07:


Without going into too muc­h detail, suffice it to say there are many mo­re than just my two of these out there and I ­know a lot of guys who received ones exactly ­like what I got and they are NOT happy. And they definitely ordered more than just t­wo.
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I thought about this yesterday after reading the whole thread.

especially with the legal "threats" that were being made and considering the optics posted on the site are visibly different from what you order bait and switch comes to mind. even a possible class action lawsuit considering you obviously arent the only one - just the first to catch it.  

or

They can just make things right and send you some carson glass.

Link Posted: 5/5/2020 9:21:27 AM EDT
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Originally Posted By xLucidx:

especially with the legal "thr­eats" that were being made and considering th­e optics posted on the site are visibly diffe­rent from what you order bait and switch come­s to mind. even a possible class action lawsuit conside­ring you obviously arent the only one - just the first to catch it.  
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Originally Posted By xLucidx:

especially with the legal "thr­eats" that were being made and considering th­e optics posted on the site are visibly diffe­rent from what you order bait and switch come­s to mind. even a possible class action lawsuit conside­ring you obviously arent the only one - just the first to catch it.  


Correct, and as I understand it, thousands of dollars worth of these are being returned by resellers as we speak.


They can just make things right a­nd send you some carson glass. 


They did send me a shipping label. But replacing two pieces of glass when there are customers needing hundreds replaced is a much bigger issue. And probably exactly what they were trying to prevent by getting me to shut up.
Link Posted: 5/5/2020 10:09:58 AM EDT
The suggestion or threat to sue anybody is complete nonsense from UNV. And no one on this thread should fear your first amendment right. Certainly and absolutely no one should be harassed into changing or redact their comments. We don’t live in “Singapore” where these lens came from where they do censor people.

The subject said Fake Glass. And, the poster did it exactly right by providing the information and asking questions in the thread without mentioning the physical name of the vendor. At no time, did anyone mention UNV, except for themselves. Poorly executed ranting response from UNV calling themselves out does not constitute as libel. It’s called beating yourself with your own hockey stick.  

What is wrong with UNV threatening people. If it was that easy to censor people, the entire news organization would be out of business. Ever read a headline from Huffington post, good lord.

UNV can simply address to the group what they claimed since they self inflicted this situation onto themselves.

1. Are the lens “100%” mill spec as UNV posted on this thread?!?!?

And I also agree with others. You cannot show a product picture and description on a website and substitute for something else without the buyers consent, period. Bothersome that these lenses could potentially be flooded in the market and people haven’t realized what happened.
Link Posted: 5/5/2020 10:15:20 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 5/5/2020 10:17:00 AM EDT by texassooner]
Is this the same as the ones in question?




Link Posted: 5/5/2020 10:22:13 AM EDT
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Yes appears to be
Link Posted: 5/5/2020 10:23:32 AM EDT
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Pull the lens cell out and check the sticker - but yes they look to be of the same origin / type.
Link Posted: 5/5/2020 10:24:50 AM EDT
I hate to even bring this up - but if these are the eyepieces, are there any concerns over objectives at all? If you make glass, its generally more profitable to make multiple kinds of glass.
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