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Posted: 4/11/2017 1:34:34 PM EDT
That may sound a harsh, however, as a beginner to reloading I have much to learn.  I loaded my first cast lead "boolits" this past week.  They are .358 Hornady Frontier Lead SWC lubed boolits.  They shaved each time I pulled the lever to crimp the cases to the boolits.    Does anyone else experience this?  I am on my lunch break but will check for responses tonight.

edit to fix the excessive all caps. dryflash3
Link Posted: 4/11/2017 1:39:14 PM EDT
Had some issue with other brand. Opened up the case mouth a little more but there were the occasional out of spec bullet that would still leave shavings
Link Posted: 4/11/2017 1:43:31 PM EDT
Need to flare a little bit more since lead is usually a touch larger in diameter than jacketed bullets. I use Lyman M-Die's for expanding the necks for my cast "boolits".
Link Posted: 4/11/2017 1:46:08 PM EDT
I load bullets myself, and not boolits.
Link Posted: 4/11/2017 2:09:44 PM EDT
Shaving is all about mouth flare. When I used to shoot lubed (I powder coat them now) my mouth flare would sometimes drag the inside of the seat die. That's how large it was.

I never got shaving and I'm an old school single stage press user who ALWAYS seat and crimps pistol ammo in one step.

With powder coating I found any reasonable mouth flare will work but I probably still use a larger one than most people.

Motor
Link Posted: 4/11/2017 2:41:55 PM EDT
Try some Missouri bullet company bevel base bullets or bell your case mouth a little more.
Link Posted: 4/11/2017 2:45:41 PM EDT
Are you crimping and seating in the same die?

As said above - you likely need a bit more flair - I've had some trouble with taper crimping and seating lead bullets in the same die.  Roll crimping isn't too bad if your die is set up right.
Link Posted: 4/11/2017 2:49:02 PM EDT
Quoted:
That may sound a harsh, however, as a beginner to reloading I have much to learn.  I loaded my first cast lead "boolits" this past week.  They are .358 Hornady Frontier Lead SWC lubed boolits.  They shaved each time I pulled the lever to crimp the cases to the boolits.    Does anyone else experience this?  I am on my lunch break but will check for responses tonight.

edit to fix the excessive all caps. dryflash3
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Hornady Lead bullets are SWAGED, and thus they are softer than hard cast bullets.
You should be using Hornady data when working up a load
Link Posted: 4/11/2017 2:53:22 PM EDT
See if this helps.
Link Posted: 4/11/2017 8:56:32 PM EDT
Interesting enough, they fit a little loose in the casing.  There was enough tension to hold the bullet in place, however I could still push it into the case with my thumb.  I since crimped all of them in the case and they will not push into the case.  The brass is Federal once fired that I picked up after firing it new in the box.
Link Posted: 4/11/2017 9:03:20 PM EDT
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Quoted:


Hornady Lead bullets are SWAGED, and thus they are softer than hard cast bullets.
You should be using Hornady data when working up a load
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Yes. swaged like the soft little marshmallows they truly are. For background "swaged" bullets are cold formed from soft lead alloys by essentially being squished into a forming die. Cast bullets are made from molten lead, poured into a mould.

Regardless, you need to flare your case mouths to an appropriate diameter to allow the full diameter of the bullet to enter the case, slightly expanding the case as it is seated. Then the appropriate amount of crimp is applied to return the case mouth to its pre-flared diameter, and actually apply crimping as appropriate, necessary, or desired.
Link Posted: 4/11/2017 9:06:41 PM EDT
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Quoted:
Interesting enough, they fit a little loose in the casing.  There was enough tension to hold the bullet in place, however I could still push it into the case with my thumb.  I since crimped all of them in the case and they will not push into the case.  The brass is Federal once fired that I picked up after firing it new in the box.
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Get thee a set of calipers and measure the  the diameter of these bullets. Either your resizing dies are oversized, or your bullets are undersized. Undersized lead bullets are the work of the debil.
Link Posted: 4/12/2017 11:38:53 AM EDT
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Quoted:
I load bullets myself, and not boolits.
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"Boolits" is the term used for home cast lead projectiles ( even store bought lead ones), vs store bought jacketed ones.
Link Posted: 4/12/2017 12:02:58 PM EDT
If you're loading Hornady swaged lead bullets in 38 Special/.357 magnum, better have a good lead removal procedure.
Link Posted: 4/12/2017 12:47:38 PM EDT
Like you OP I was having the same problem with cast bullets and like it has been said already I just flare the end of the case a bit more.
Link Posted: 4/12/2017 12:48:42 PM EDT
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Quoted:
If you're loading Hornady swaged lead bullets in 38 Special/.357 magnum, better have a good lead removal procedure.
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Not necessarily.  I load the Hornady swaged swc when I don't have my own cast ready.  I load them in 357 Cases and I get little to no lead at target speeds of around 750-800 fps.
Link Posted: 4/12/2017 2:35:58 PM EDT
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Quoted:
If you're loading Hornady swaged lead bullets in 38 Special/.357 magnum, better have a good lead removal procedure.
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Kroil and a little piece of bronze wool on your cleaning jag makes for easy lead removal.
Link Posted: 4/12/2017 8:08:21 PM EDT
'M" die.

It has better alignment with the case and a more shallow expander profile.
Link Posted: 4/12/2017 9:54:14 PM EDT
Whatever.
Link Posted: 4/12/2017 10:09:15 PM EDT
Like it or not "boolits" is accepted here. The mods have no problem with it. Could it be maybe he's a boolit user himself.

Motor
Link Posted: 4/12/2017 10:49:28 PM EDT
Doesn't mean I'll use that silly, incorrect term.

Belling is your answer, OP.
Link Posted: 4/12/2017 10:53:23 PM EDT
Link Posted: 4/12/2017 10:59:56 PM EDT
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Quoted:
Doesn't mean I'll use that silly, incorrect term.

Belling is your answer, OP.
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You mean like "pills" ?

Motor
Link Posted: 4/13/2017 9:00:03 AM EDT
deleted
Link Posted: 4/13/2017 11:48:05 AM EDT
In order to be 100% successful at seating lead bullets without shaving lead, the seating and crimping operations must be separated.  That's why all good quality pistol die sets have separate seating and crimping dies.

If you try to seat and crimp in one step, you'll sometimes be successful and sometimes not.  That's because of slight variations in case length, smoothness of case mouth, and the presence -- or not -- of any burrs on the entrance to the case.
Link Posted: 4/13/2017 12:26:23 PM EDT
This is only true if you are roll crimping bullets that don't have a crimp groove. Any bullet with a crimp groove can be seated and crimped in one step.

If you are taper crimping you only need to crimp a little less. Taper crimping after all is actually mouth flare reducing and not actually crimping.

Learn your tools and the processes they perform and how those processes completed. Then the myths will go away.

I seat and roll crimp non groove plated bullets in one step very successfully.

Motor
Link Posted: 4/13/2017 4:20:15 PM EDT
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Quoted:
This is only true if you are roll crimping bullets that don't have a crimp groove. Any bullet with a crimp groove can be seated and crimped in one step.

If you are taper crimping you only need to crimp a little less. Taper crimping after all is actually mouth flare reducing and not actually crimping.

Learn your tools and the processes they perform and how those processes completed. Then the myths will go away.

I seat and roll crimp non groove plated bullets in one step very successfully.

Motor
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I agree it's possible, but I run a progressive with enough stations to crimp in a separate step and that works best for me.  YMMV.
Link Posted: 4/13/2017 6:47:10 PM EDT
Right on Scott.  I usually include that in my normal spill about one step seating and crimping but forgot to this time.

I'm actually not 100% single stage anymore since my brother moved all his stuff to my house. So yes I do seat and crimp in separate steps when I use his progressive.
Link Posted: 4/14/2017 8:50:37 PM EDT
I am using the RCBS .38 .357 cal dies.  The seating die is also the crimping die, however, the design neccessitates two separate steps.  I seat the round and when ready, I unscrew the seating portion out while screwing in the lower part of the die until it touches the case mouth.  I then take the round out of the die and adjust about a quarter turn further to crimp.  The rounds I loaded are now all crimped.  Each one is loaded with 4.7 grams of Titegroup and small pistol magnum primers.
Link Posted: 4/14/2017 10:03:32 PM EDT
Link Posted: 4/15/2017 2:22:43 AM EDT
I don't know what you mean by "design"? I also use RCBS dies for 38/357 I seat and crimp in one step. Even smooth sided Berry's plated.

If by design you mean there is only one die and you want to do separate steps then do like dryflash3 says and add a Lee FCD to your set.

Motor
Link Posted: 4/15/2017 8:31:06 PM EDT
Link Posted: 4/16/2017 12:42:24 PM EDT
Hey Dano any idea how fast you run those bullets?  I've got a 38 special load that runs about 810fps with a 4" barrel.  5.0 of Power Pistol.  Nice and accurate but you mentioned leading.  I've only shot about 50 of them so far and haven't noticed it yet.
Link Posted: 4/16/2017 11:05:16 PM EDT
Link Posted: 4/17/2017 12:35:13 AM EDT
Link Posted: 4/17/2017 8:06:34 AM EDT
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Quoted:
I chamfer the mouths of all pistol cases one time in order to minimize shaving of all bullets.  

Edit:  I should mention I only bell to a very minimal degree so as to extend case life.  Chamfering the mouth works with this to avoid problems of the type which is the topic of this thread.
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No WAY I'd do that. 
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