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Posted: 1/24/2014 11:52:10 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/24/2014 11:52:45 AM EDT by jdhlg77]
For those who didn't catch it last time, this is a rhetorical question.  I have done some experimenting to test the durability of brass.  Last time it was .45 ACP which is very low pressure.  The result was, I gave up after 11 reloads.  Here is the link http://www.spokaneguntrader.com/viewtopic.php?f=27&t=69690

This time, I tried a little higher pressure round; The 9mm.  They run around 30,000 PSI.  Here is what I did.
First I started with 5 pieces of once fired brass of different manufacture.  I used the following head stamps:

FC
WIN
PMC
R-P
WCC Nato

I loaded the ammo near max and fired it.  I reloaded it and fired it again.  The brass was never tumbled between firings to ensure maximum wear on the brass.  They were fired from a 2nd Gen Glock 19.

The pictures are as follows:
Pictures 1 and 2 are once fired.
Pictures 3 and 4 are after 10 loading and firing sessions.
Pictures 5 and 6 are after 15 loading and firing sessions.
Pictures 7 and 8 are after 20 loading and firing sessions.

Here are the results:
The brass was .741 to .742 inches long.  After being reloaded and fired 20 times, the brass was .741 to .742 inches long.  Absolutely no growth in case length.  
After being fired 20 times, the brass was not cracked/split and showed no signs of fatigue.  The primers still seat with the same resistance as the first time loaded.  The only difference was the color of the brass which is due to not cleaning it between firings.  I believe the carbon was forced into the brass by the sizing die.

I will be testing even higher pressure cases in the future to include .223/5.56, .308 , and 7mm Mag.








Link Posted: 1/24/2014 12:03:41 PM EDT
Cool test!
Link Posted: 1/24/2014 12:09:21 PM EDT
Very neat, I wonder how many firings it would actually take then... I've never split a 9mm
Link Posted: 1/24/2014 12:15:43 PM EDT
Nice test.

It is funny that all brass seems to be once fired.

Lets see - I pick up range brass. Most shooters I know reload and pick up also.

My brass is somewhere between once fired and 500 times fired.

Of course I give the brass a good look as I reload. Still reject very few. Also very few problems with my own or most of the reloaders I know.

Now 308 match ammo is different. I start with good new brass and keep track of times fired and inspect when reloading.

Unknown range pick up for my 308 target rifle --- NO Way!
Link Posted: 1/24/2014 12:16:43 PM EDT
Link Posted: 1/24/2014 12:18:23 PM EDT
Fantastic! So it is safe to also assume, since this was tested in a G2 Glock 19, that there is no validity to the concern that Glock unsupported chambers reduce the number of times you can use a case?



Great test.
Link Posted: 1/24/2014 12:23:55 PM EDT
Link Posted: 1/24/2014 12:46:23 PM EDT
I did this test in about an hour's time so I literally shot it and reloaded it and shot it again minutes apart over about an hour.  I just got board after 20 reloads and figure I'd give the neighbors a break.
Link Posted: 1/24/2014 12:55:51 PM EDT
Great test!
Link Posted: 1/24/2014 6:17:05 PM EDT
Interesting. I knew .45acp has a nearly indefinite shelf life but thought 9mm wouldn't get past 10. Wonder how 10mm will hold up? Most mine have seen is 3 firings.
Link Posted: 1/24/2014 7:17:32 PM EDT
Good to know.

It would take me forever to replicate your test with my xd40.  I would be curious to hear how 40 brass holds up if you have a means for testing that as quickly as you did the 9mm.
Link Posted: 1/24/2014 7:36:55 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/24/2014 7:39:17 PM EDT by Wingman26]
Link Posted: 1/24/2014 8:59:53 PM EDT
Thank you for doing that.  Very interesting.
Link Posted: 1/24/2014 9:06:07 PM EDT
Link Posted: 1/25/2014 5:37:00 AM EDT
I've found a few split necked 9mm's in my little over a year reloading.  All has come in range pickups from USPSA matches.

I'm guessing these were reloaded a bunch of times (possibly at major power factor).  I have no qualms reloading 9mm major brass to minor even though some do.
Link Posted: 1/25/2014 5:57:01 AM EDT
I reload 45 and 9mm until I lose the brass at the range .
Link Posted: 1/25/2014 6:52:31 AM EDT
Proves you lose brass faster than it splitting or giving up the primer pockets.

Thanks for the test
Link Posted: 1/25/2014 6:56:55 AM EDT
I forgot to say that there was not a single misfire or fail to feed. Every round after every reload, chambered and fired as normal.
Link Posted: 1/25/2014 12:21:45 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/25/2014 12:22:18 PM EDT by Danger6]
Something to watch for, in 9mm in some brass there may be limit on ability to grip the bullet, or the "neck tension".  Not saying I disagree, just something for reloaders to be aware of.
Link Posted: 1/25/2014 12:52:05 PM EDT
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By ANGST:
I reload 45 and 9mm until I lose the brass at the range .
View Quote

Same here.  

I also used to keep track of firings but stopped that long ago.  Now it all gets mixed together so no telling how many times it gets reloaded.  I still usually mark my cases just in case I need to identify mine from someone elses, but I don't even do that as often with 9mm anymore.
Link Posted: 1/25/2014 1:04:35 PM EDT
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Danger6:
Something to watch for, in 9mm in some brass there may be limit on ability to grip the bullet, or the "neck tension".  Not saying I disagree, just something for reloaders to be aware of.
View Quote


This right here!  Although reloadable for many firings I find that the rims get beat-up pretty bad and has difficulty in the shell holder, depending on load and gun.  My "extreme" accuracy tests with a carbine suggests my accuracy drops off between 5-10 reloads.  Once fired being the best.  Perhaps they need to be annealed, but what a pain by hand.  The accuracy from my carbine(camp 9) @ 50yds. is 5/8" for 13 shots/4xscope.  I suppose the 2 to the chest, one to the head @ 9yds. this quality of accuracy is a moot point.
Link Posted: 1/25/2014 2:07:50 PM EDT
Great test. I have lots of brass and dont track the number of reloads. I have found a few split 9mm cases, tho they are very rare.
Link Posted: 1/25/2014 2:15:46 PM EDT
How many licks does it take to reach the center of a tootsie pop? I think the answer is the same.

OP. Thanks for posting. It should be helpful information for the new guys who have doubt about the advice they normally get here. Nice work !
Link Posted: 1/25/2014 8:18:40 PM EDT
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By ANGST:
I reload 45 and 9mm until I lose the brass at the range .
View Quote



This is the correct answer.
Link Posted: 1/25/2014 8:25:09 PM EDT
I load nothing but brass I pick up at the range, if it splits or the primer pocket gets loose I toss it ,otherwise shoot it till you lose it
Link Posted: 1/26/2014 3:09:24 AM EDT
This is good to know. Based on the responses, can I assume this would likely apply to revolver brass as well? I am fairly new and just sort my revolver brass so it all stays on the same number of firings.



Thanks
Link Posted: 1/26/2014 4:39:19 AM EDT
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Landshark9025:
This is good to know. Based on the responses, can I assume this would likely apply to revolver brass as well? I am fairly new and just sort my revolver brass so it all stays on the same number of firings.

Thanks
View Quote

Pretty much the same...except you won't loose it, so you can load it until it splits.
Link Posted: 1/26/2014 7:00:22 AM EDT
Link Posted: 1/26/2014 10:31:09 AM EDT
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By dryflash3:
Thanks

As long as you keep the belling reasonable straight wall revolver brass lasts a long time.  

I have a box of nickle 357 Fed cases I've been loading since 1977. There are still about 30 survivors.


View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By dryflash3:
Originally Posted By Landshark9025:
This is good to know. Based on the responses, can I assume this would likely apply to revolver brass as well? I am fairly new and just sort my revolver brass so it all stays on the same number of firings.
Thanks

As long as you keep the belling reasonable straight wall revolver brass lasts a long time.  

I have a box of nickle 357 Fed cases I've been loading since 1977. There are still about 30 survivors.




For my revolver brass I often anneal JUST the mouth area and that seems to make a difference with the belled area.  I also "neck" size revolver brass and yes I index per cylinder FOR ACCURACY ONLY as it is a pita.   As a note, you will find that low pressure cartridges such as 45acp, will NOT stretch like bottle neck cartridges but will SHRINK..
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