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9/22/2017 12:11:25 AM
Posted: 1/23/2002 8:35:23 PM EDT
Did anyone read the review of the HiPoint Carbine in "Guns and Weapons of Law Enforcement" that urged departments on a budget to run right out and buy that POS "Tactical Pistol Caliber Carbine"?
Link Posted: 1/23/2002 8:43:29 PM EDT
YOU HAVE GOT TO BE KIDDING!!! What issue was that in?...Is G&WfLE taking article submissions from officer Barney Fife, Maybery Swat Team.
Link Posted: 1/23/2002 8:45:35 PM EDT
While I know nothing about the HiPoint Carbine, I have seen several people post positive comments about them here and on other gun boards. You might not want to "judge the book by the cover." It sounds like it is much better than the brand name would indicate.z
Link Posted: 1/23/2002 8:49:28 PM EDT
Hi point looks like plastic junk. Are you guys really serious ?
Link Posted: 1/23/2002 8:51:42 PM EDT
and the experts have spoken
Link Posted: 1/23/2002 8:53:49 PM EDT
The Mayberry Swat Team would have been better off if they had stuck with those old lever .30-30's that Andy had in the rack.

I have this picture in my ming of Barney, Opie, Andy and Otis the drunk in a Swat Stack armed with Kel Tec's and Highpoint Carbines.
Link Posted: 1/23/2002 9:27:18 PM EDT
There's got to be a Photoshop pic of the Mayberry swat team done!!!
Link Posted: 1/23/2002 9:31:19 PM EDT
Heheheh Reminds me of the "Bounty Hunter" that romes around town with a highpoint strapped to his belt. Makes me giggle evertime I see him.
Link Posted: 1/23/2002 10:41:26 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Fearandloathing37:
There's got to be a Photoshop pic of the Mayberry swat team done!!!



Her ya go.
www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?id=89133
Link Posted: 1/23/2002 10:56:36 PM EDT
Prepare to flame away. I read that article over a year ago and bought one. 2" groups at 75 yds. and have never had a problem in over 500 rnds. Yes it is ugly, but i would rather have it than a sidearm if i was up aginst a bad guy at over 50 yds anyday. It makes a great gun to keep in the trunk of the car and to take out in the rain. it's no ar-15 but its as good as a $200 ar-15 would be.
Link Posted: 1/24/2002 4:16:28 AM EDT
Howabout the gun review that recommends you get one, even though it jammed 3 times, and broke. "I'm sure we just had a lemon, its a good design"
Link Posted: 1/24/2002 5:38:57 AM EDT
Yeah Avtomat, I hate that too. But it's good info anyway because the writer isn't allowed to write anything really *bad* about the gun, but he does put in enough to give you a heads up. Same thing with the article where the writer has to send it back to the factory, but he's *sure* this is an anomaly.
Link Posted: 1/24/2002 6:27:14 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/24/2002 6:27:53 AM EDT by AR_BLACK]
I quit buying any gun mag, except for the occasional Shotgun News (Love Fred's).

Every other mag goes over and over guns with bias reviews, and they always use the word

"venerable" hen
It means - respected, esteemed, honored, admired, revered.

But it applies to every gun in any mag!

Just my rant, Blackie
Link Posted: 1/24/2002 6:45:04 AM EDT
Link Posted: 1/24/2002 7:51:58 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/24/2002 7:54:46 AM EDT by pogo]
What bugs me is that they reveiw and cheerfully recommend the 2-3000 dollar guns. What is worth "every penny" to them is decent accuracy and reliability. EDIT: To me that is the starting point.

If a Les Baer premium product (or such) does not deliver that and very much more, that is greater news to me - I don't want to hear that it is of acceptable quality.

How about the code phrase "acceptable combat accuracy?" That is the closest they will call something a POS.

All the articles look like infomercials. I don't read general circulation crap anymore, except when a really new gun or cartridge comes out.

A better question might be who the product pimps are: there are many who come to mind and I shouldn't pick out only one or two and let the rest go uncalled. I mean ad copy writers and magazines.
Link Posted: 1/24/2002 8:23:45 AM EDT
I owned a Hi-Point. It has advantages:

1) Super Accurate for a 9mm
2) Quick Target Aquisition
3) Compact for a full stock and 16" Barrel
4) The barrel ends just far enough after the handgaurds to mount a brake.

It also has downsides:

1) No Hi-Caps.
2) No Folding Stock. Now that would be nice.


Not sure if it is good or bad, but the Bolt Carrier is enormous.

I know the Palatka SWAT Team supposedly uses Hi-Point 9mm Carbines.

For $169 you can have a decent shooter. Mine rarely jams and that was only because the magazine wasn't properly seated. Same thing would happen if you didn't properly smack the bottom of your AR-15s Magazine before trying to shoot it.
Link Posted: 1/24/2002 8:29:48 AM EDT
Come to think of it... a Marlin 336 in .30-30 is not that bad an idea for a police rifle... better than a pistol caliber... none of that nasty assault rifle image, not expensive, good capacity, no mags, reload on the fly, will function with minimal upkeep, and a heafty round. I think if a PD was REALLY on a tight budget, a lever gun is not a bad option at all.
Link Posted: 1/24/2002 8:30:46 AM EDT
anyone got a picture or a webpage about these things, I would like to understand what everyone is talking about.
Link Posted: 1/24/2002 8:40:05 AM EDT
And what if I said that M-1 carbines were available to LEA's for $160.00. How does your Hi-Point look compared to that??
Link Posted: 1/24/2002 9:10:50 AM EDT

Originally Posted By A_Free_Man:
a Marlin 336 in .30-30 is not that bad an idea for a police rifle


I'll agree. Lever actions have been around for along time for a reason. Why limit yourself to a 336? My dream rifle is a 1895CB. It holds nine rounds of 45/70. If you're going to go to the trouble of putting holes in someone, you might as well make large holes.z
Link Posted: 1/24/2002 9:14:39 AM EDT
Here are some cool ads I found at the VPC. Deep linked to work their server better: href=www.vpc.org/hipoint.htm

http://www.vpc.org/graphics/hipoint3.jpg

Of course, don't believe anything on the VPC web site, it's just a branch of Sara Brady. h
But, some cops won't have a gun that looks classic and "not-tactical".... [tactical = another term much overused, saving this for another rant later]

Blackie
Link Posted: 1/24/2002 10:38:37 AM EDT

Originally Posted By A_Free_Man:Come to think of it... a Marlin 336 in .30-30 is not that bad an idea for a police rifle... better than a pistol caliber... none of that nasty assault rifle image, not expensive, good capacity, no mags, reload on the fly, will function with minimal upkeep, and a heafty round. I think if a PD was REALLY on a tight budget, a lever gun is not a bad option at all.


That's why I carry one of those in the truck at all times. I'm using a Weaver 4x scope with quick-detach rings, a 10-round butt cuff, and it has a teflon-moly matte black finish on it.
Link Posted: 1/24/2002 12:53:42 PM EDT

Originally Posted By OLY-M4gery:
And what if I said that M-1 carbines were available to LEA's for $160.00. How does your Hi-Point look compared to that??


Tell me more...
Link Posted: 1/24/2002 12:54:38 PM EDT
What I loved reading (can't remember if it was in American Handgunner or American Rifleman) was an evaluation of a $1500 pistol that shot like 4" groups at 25 yards and they had to send the pistol back to the factory. I think it was a Les Bauer, could have been a Wilson. The custom service was great though
Link Posted: 1/24/2002 12:58:14 PM EDT

Originally Posted By ILove2Shoot:
I had a buddy of mine break his, it was at the botton of his truck when he moved and the stock broke, but I will bet that if a CAV arms lower had that much weight on it, it would crack also, and I would not consider that a cheap inferior weapon because it is plastic.



The CAVarms has been torture tested to include being run over by a truck. It has not failed. I'm not disagreeing with you on the Hi-point, just making it clearer that the CAV is a superior product.
Link Posted: 1/24/2002 1:47:33 PM EDT
I think I'll buy the "Chrome model" and bring it to a range where a match shoot with M-1 Garands is going on, just for laughs...
Link Posted: 1/24/2002 1:54:30 PM EDT
30/30 for police work? Hmm, guess they aren't concerned about over-penetration. I'd hate for that swat team to get in a shoot out in my neighborhood!
Link Posted: 1/24/2002 2:42:04 PM EDT
March Issue of "Combat Handguns", Page 17.

The author is demonstrating a "One Hand" cycling of a Glock using the "Snag the rear sight on your pants" method. For anyone that has practiced this, you know how firm you have to grip the gun to not drop it.

His finger is in the trigger guard!!!! Can you say "BANG????

Gave up on the rags a long time ago.
Link Posted: 1/24/2002 4:05:48 PM EDT

Originally Posted By OLY-M4gery:
And what if I said that M-1 carbines were available to LEA's for $160.00. How does your Hi-Point look compared to that??


Shhh dont spill the beans... why would anyone want an M1 Carbine?...its light its fast its accurate at intended distances it has inexpensive 30 and 20rd mags plentifully available and it shoots a cartridge of 357 mag velocities and you can even get FMJ ammo for it cheap.....and no recoil...a great little gun for kiddies and grandma!
Link Posted: 1/24/2002 4:26:16 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Gun-fan:

Originally Posted By OLY-M4gery:
And what if I said that M-1 carbines were available to LEA's for $160.00. How does your Hi-Point look compared to that??


Tell me more...



I don't know too much more, apparently they are being sold off by the military and are in pretty good shape.
Link Posted: 1/24/2002 4:43:33 PM EDT
you guys dont sell Mayberry short......Some of us actually live there..........
Link Posted: 1/24/2002 6:27:18 PM EDT
I don't even glance at gun rags anymore because most of the so-called "experts" who do the reviews can't f*cking shoot. The Ruger PC9 they said would shoot 2.5 to 3 inch groups at 25yds. Mine does 1/2 groups. Ruger 10/22 magnum? The say 1.75 inches at 50 yds. Mine will do .75 inches at 50. Non-shooting morons........
Link Posted: 1/24/2002 7:07:47 PM EDT
I second that. I look in some of these rags and they have guys at 50 yards witha scoped bolt-action .30-06 and they are getting 6" groups. OK, so I'm exagerrating a little. But, still their groups are pathetic and actually make the guns look bad/inaccurate.


Originally Posted By Zardoz:
I don't even glance at gun rags anymore because most of the so-called "experts" who do the reviews can't f*cking shoot. The Ruger PC9 they said would shoot 2.5 to 3 inch groups at 25yds. Mine does 1/2 groups. Ruger 10/22 magnum? The say 1.75 inches at 50 yds. Mine will do .75 inches at 50. Non-shooting morons........

Link Posted: 1/24/2002 7:33:45 PM EDT

Originally Posted By cc48510:
I second that. I look in some of these rags and they have guys at 50 yards witha scoped bolt-action .30-06 and they are getting 6" groups. OK, so I'm exagerrating a little. But, still their groups are pathetic and actually make the guns look bad/inaccurate.


Originally Posted By Zardoz:
I don't even glance at gun rags anymore because most of the so-called "experts" who do the reviews can't f*cking shoot. The Ruger PC9 they said would shoot 2.5 to 3 inch groups at 25yds. Mine does 1/2 groups. Ruger 10/22 magnum? The say 1.75 inches at 50 yds. Mine will do .75 inches at 50. Non-shooting morons........




I'm glad I'm not the only one that noticed this. If it's not tested from a ransom rest, I don't trust their results with handguns. As far as rifles, I've seen some rifles that have a rep for accuracy get the shaft by some shaky handed guy who "was interested in practical offhand accurracy rather than silly bench rest shooting". Come on, how can you say how accurate a gun is if you don't REALLY test it for accuracy.

Ever read the gun tests in Guns & Ammo? Take a look at how different the groups from the various testers are.

I got pissed when I would read Gun Tests magazine. What a joke. None of the testers there could shoot worth a damn. I read a test of AR's and was surprised to see my beloved bushy shooting horrible groups. Made me laugh when these dopes shot reloads that were horribly inaccurate.

As far as their tests on pistols, they have crumby testers too. Complaining that the sig they tested mysteriously would not lock open after the last shot really made me laugh. Sheesh, I wonder if it even crossed their mind that their untrained thumbs were hitting the slide release.
Link Posted: 1/24/2002 7:49:55 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/24/2002 7:51:51 PM EDT by pyro0021]
ive heard these names for the high point

poormans mp5
columbine special and pos

have heard these things about it the majority of the time

cheap
good design
never fails to function

sounds like something that would be good to shoot full of clp wrap in trash bags and bury someplace with a couple extra mags and 1000 rds of ammo. put a grid quardnant into the plgr and hope your never in a situation where you have to go dig it up. jmo

reminds me of the 45 acp liberator pistols. some gun is better than no gun
Link Posted: 1/24/2002 8:04:25 PM EDT
I consider myself a function over form kinda guy example, mossberg 500, flatblack 73 Z-28 that doesn't look like much but runs like a scalded cat old beat up truck that runs good and gets the job done, but damn that gun be ugly, I still wouldn't mind having it for $169 but does it come in 45 and is it legal in CA? probebly answer is NO, NO!
Link Posted: 2/6/2002 7:20:01 AM EDT
I too got tired of the glowing reviews in the gun mags and got a subsciption to Gun Tests. It's much better, and coincidently they just tested the Highpoint carbine and it beat the snot out of the Ruger PC-9. In defense of the Mayberry jokes, Don Knotts is reputedly one of the toughest drill instructors the Marine Corps has seen.
Link Posted: 2/6/2002 10:30:08 AM EDT
Hmmmmm, which handgun manufacturer is the most prolific advertiser?

KIMBER

They are a perfect example of how a middle-of-the-road gun becomes an "AWESOME" gun...advertising dollars! You've heard my rants in the past, no more here.
Link Posted: 2/6/2002 10:43:12 AM EDT

Originally Posted By 1911greg:
I consider myself a function over form kinda guy example, mossberg 500, flatblack 73 Z-28 that doesn't look like much but runs like a scalded cat old beat up truck that runs good and gets the job done, but damn that gun be ugly, I still wouldn't mind having it for $169 but does it come in 45 and is it legal in CA? probebly answer is NO, NO!



Why not look for the Marlin Camp 9 or .45ACP? They use common pistol magazines, have plainish wood (birch?) stocks, and look a lot better. They are not $180 guns, but they are not extremely expensive, either.
Link Posted: 2/6/2002 10:46:27 AM EDT

Originally Posted By A_Free_Man:
Come to think of it... a Marlin 336 in .30-30 is not that bad an idea for a police rifle... better than a pistol caliber... none of that nasty assault rifle image, not expensive, good capacity, no mags, reload on the fly, will function with minimal upkeep, and a heafty round. I think if a PD was REALLY on a tight budget, a lever gun is not a bad option at all.



Instead of a lever-action, why not the Marlin Camp .45 Carbine (or the camp 9 in 9mm)? Pistol ammo, semi-auto , and Marlin quality. Only drawback in 7-round mag. I have one and is also fun to shoot. Now one can carry common ammo for the rifle and the pistol.
Link Posted: 2/6/2002 2:04:27 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/6/2002 2:08:09 PM EDT by mk1iii]
What I remember as the most stupid thing I ever read in a gun rag was old Mas Ayoob saying "That you can't use your gun just to get out of an ass beating" in Combat Handguns.
What a fucking idiot! All physical volience can turn lethal or life long disfiguring in a split second. This isn't High School anymore. I can't think of any situation where an armed adult will need to go toe to toe with somebody to protect themself. I either walk away, or somebody will be shot and most likely be dead.
Link Posted: 2/7/2002 7:17:26 AM EDT
I've got a subscription to gun tests, and I'm not going to renew, ever notice how they test handguns? at ranges of 7-15 yds? What, they can't see any farther than that? or when bumbling about testing mil-surp rifles, they've NO idea how to adjust windage on a mauser, and then call it inaccurate,These Butt-heads can't shoot!! period! And I really wish they'd quit fooling around with mil-surps that they don't have a clue how to shoot,adjust the sights for,or even use ammo with the right weight bullet that the rifles sights were calibrated for, Dumb Bastards!! While they may not take any money from the Mfg's, in the form of advertising, I wonder how much they take in the form of CASH from the Mfg's? Gun tests is just too f@#king dumb for me to read anymore....
Link Posted: 2/7/2002 9:28:24 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/7/2002 9:32:47 AM EDT by alive45acp]

Originally Posted By Schnert:
Did anyone read the review of the HiPoint Carbine in "Guns and Weapons of Law Enforcement" that urged departments on a budget to run right out and buy that POS "Tactical Pistol Caliber Carbine"?



I can top this. There was a picture in our local paper a few years ago of a city SWAT officer in full mall ninja gear, crouching behind a car....holding...
..you won't believe it...
...a tec-9...
...the funny thing was that he was trying to use the sights.

I wish I had saved that picture, but that was before I knew about AR-15.com
Link Posted: 2/7/2002 10:03:33 AM EDT

Originally Posted By A_Free_Man:
Come to think of it... a Marlin 336 in .30-30 is not that bad an idea for a police rifle... better than a pistol caliber... none of that nasty assault rifle image, not expensive, good capacity, no mags, reload on the fly, will function with minimal upkeep, and a heafty round. I think if a PD was REALLY on a tight budget, a lever gun is not a bad option at all.



amen to that.


about the HI POINT. looks like shit, thats not even upfor discussion. reliablity and function, it seems to go both ways, but 10rd mags. comeone, give me a friggin break. it it took beretta mags and didnt look like shit maybe it could be considered.
Link Posted: 2/7/2002 3:09:48 PM EDT

Originally Posted By alive45acp:

Originally Posted By Schnert:
Did anyone read the review of the HiPoint Carbine in "Guns and Weapons of Law Enforcement" that urged departments on a budget to run right out and buy that POS "Tactical Pistol Caliber Carbine"?



I can top this. There was a picture in our local paper a few years ago of a city SWAT officer in full mall ninja gear, crouching behind a car....holding...
..you won't believe it...
...a tec-9...
...the funny thing was that he was trying to use the sights.

I wish I had saved that picture, but that was before I knew about AR-15.com

u could probly find it on microfilm in the local library
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