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Posted: 1/18/2011 5:09:36 PM EDT
[#1]
The Feb 2011 Special Weapons for Military and Police has an AUG A3 NATO on the cover. The article talks about AUG A3s with NATO stock in ACU being available soon...
 Also of particular note to you Silent... Page 86 ...the AUG/A3USA us now made right here in America. Produced on Steyr-Mannlicher tooling for Steyr USA by Sabre Defence Industries LLC, the AUG/A3 is made by the same maker of the highest quality AR-15/M16 variants in the world I know you had wanted a cite for that... |
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Posted: 1/18/2011 5:13:56 PM EDT
[#2]
Silent,
I agree that is a good sign. At least something positive. BR870, I too picked up that magazine and shook my head and laughed when I read that about the AUG still being made and available in ACU and NATO. LOL |
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Posted: 1/18/2011 5:57:02 PM EDT
[#3]
Jeez, how hard is to keep bullpups straight? The guy in the video seemed to have no clue what an AUG even is...come on people. ACU....  That's cool though that the tooling is here from Steyr Mannlicher and I bet you they haven't sent that stuff out yet at all. Probably all still at Sabre still just not being used until the market turns arounds and justifies the need to crank out more. I don't think Sabre is using Steyr tooling for the barrels though. Steyr did and still does cold hammer forged barrels. In fact, a lot of folks might not know this, but Steyr was one of the first to do polygonal rifling not for the AUG though. |
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Posted: 1/18/2011 6:15:13 PM EDT
[#4]
Quoted: No, they even say in the article that the barrels are button rifled. Still, Sabre made button rifled barrels are used in the M2, M60, and M134 minigun. If it can handle the rigors of fullauto machinegun use, I'm pretty sure they will stand up to semi-auto rifle use... Jeez, how hard is to keep bullpups straight? The guy in the video seemed to have no clue what an AUG even is...come on people. ACU.... That's cool though that the tooling is here from Steyr Mannlicher and I bet you they haven't sent that stuff out yet at all. Probably all still at Sabre still just not being used until the market turns arounds and justifies the need to crank out more. I don't think Sabre is using Steyr tooling for the barrels though. Steyr did and still does cold hammer forged barrels. In fact, a lot of folks might not know this, but Steyr was one of the first to do polygonal rifling not for the AUG though. |
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Posted: 1/18/2011 8:03:49 PM EDT
[#5]
I'm pretty sure I heard someone in the video saying that the AUG A3 was already discontinued. Funny move to draw attention to a discontinued rifle unless they're hopeful to start making them again...
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Posted: 1/18/2011 9:18:44 PM EDT
[#6]
Quoted: I'm pretty sure I heard someone in the video saying that the AUG A3 was already discontinued. Funny move to draw attention to a discontinued rifle unless they're hopeful to start making them again... Steyr has said that they do plan to make them again, and that they are NOT permanently discontinuing them... ETA: Yeah, at the very end of the video he says "They just discontinued it....<snip> They're gonna hold off until the economy picks back up" Starts at about 2:30 to the end |
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Posted: 1/18/2011 9:27:38 PM EDT
[#7]
The Guys in that video act like they have never seen a gun before...
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Posted: 1/19/2011 11:14:37 AM EDT
[#8]
Im always amazed when i see the light recoil of an AUG.
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Posted: 1/19/2011 1:48:38 PM EDT
[#9]
I guess SHOT gives a Broadcast Badge to anyone with a camera nowadays. If they are indeed video professionals in this industry, they should have a microphone setup capable of picking up the voices much better than what they walked away with, and they should be a little more familiar with what they are "covering." Oh, and what's with 7 yard ACOG shooting?
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Posted: 1/19/2011 8:38:20 PM EDT
[#10]
Steyr also had the .22 kit on display for the AUG at SHOT Show. A rep said it should be out later this year.
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Posted: 1/20/2011 7:26:42 AM EDT
[#11]
Quoted: Steyr also had the .22 kit on display for the AUG at SHOT Show. A rep said it should be out later this year. Wow... I was worried they had given up on the project |
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Posted: 1/20/2011 7:49:17 AM EDT
[#12]
Steyr pays SDI up front for every Aug that they build, box up, and ship back to Steyr.
Good deal for SDI, not so good for Steyr. Steyr has to sit on them and hope for a small profit. Steyr pays SDI to manufacture several parts. Two of the Main parts, Receivers and Barrels. Bookkeeping and Fed Excise Tax on those Receivers. I don’t think Steyr will go this route again. When you really think about the double dip going on with the A3, it should probably sell at the very least ten to fifteen percent more than the FS2000. |
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Posted: 1/20/2011 8:05:34 AM EDT
[#13]
Quoted:
Steyr pays SDI up front for every Aug that they build, box up, and ship back to Steyr. Good deal for SDI, not so good for Steyr. Steyr has to sit on them and hope for a small profit. Steyr pays SDI to manufacture several parts. Two of the Main parts, Receivers and Barrels. Bookkeeping and Fed Excise Tax on those Receivers. I don’t think Steyr will go this route again. When you really think about the double dip going on with the A3, it should probably sell at the very least ten to fifteen percent more than the FS2000. So it would be cheaper for Steyr USA to have their own factory for the A3 ?? , their own employees ?, their own CNC machines ? etc.. then have to shut it all down when things get slow.. Didnt you see what happened to MSAR. The way Steyr is doing it now they can stop production anytime they want and control their inventory without shutting down a factory or lay employees off. Sabre Defence can still run the other Goverment /Civilian contracts they have. Bulpup rifles are a nich market , your not gonna sell a 100,000 a year to keep a full time factory running unless you have several other products to supplement a slow down. |
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Posted: 1/20/2011 8:31:36 AM EDT
[#14]
Quoted: Quoted: Steyr pays SDI up front for every Aug that they build, box up, and ship back to Steyr. Good deal for SDI, not so good for Steyr. Steyr has to sit on them and hope for a small profit. Steyr pays SDI to manufacture several parts. Two of the Main parts, Receivers and Barrels. Bookkeeping and Fed Excise Tax on those Receivers. I don’t think Steyr will go this route again. When you really think about the double dip going on with the A3, it should probably sell at the very least ten to fifteen percent more than the FS2000. So it would be cheaper for Steyr USA to have their own factory for the A3 , their own employees , their own CNC machines etc.. then have to shut it all down when things get slow.. Didnt you see what happened to MSAR. The way Steyr is doing it now they can stop production anytime they want and control their inventory without shutting down a factory or lay employees off. Sabre Defence can still run the other Goverment /Civilian contracts they have. Bulpup rifles are a nich market , your not gonna sell a 100,000 a year to keep a full time factory running unless you have several other products to supplement a slow down. Well, Steyr could do other products in the USA other than the AUG A3, but it's still easier to just subcontract out that work and keep importing the rest of their firearms. |
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Posted: 1/20/2011 8:48:20 AM EDT
[#15]
Quoted:
So it would be cheaper for Steyr USA to have their own factory for the A3 , their own employees , their own CNC machines etc.. then have to shut it all down when things get slow.. Didnt you see what happened to MSAR. The way Steyr is doing it now they can stop production anytime they want and control their inventory without shutting down a factory or lay employees off. Sabre Defence can still run the other Goverment /Civilian contracts they have. Bulpup rifles are a nich market , your not gonna sell a 100,000 a year to keep a full time factory running unless you have several other products to supplement a slow down. Why would you think it would be cheaper for Steyr to have their own factory here for the A3? If that were to happen it would already be running and pumping out their other models. When you think about how Steyr marketed their A3. you could say that they sold it to SDI. Purchased it back from SDI. Now they are trying to sell it again. To many hands reaching and eating that same piece of pie. |
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Posted: 1/20/2011 9:03:39 AM EDT
[#16]
anyone know how many AUGs were made by Sabre?
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Posted: 1/20/2011 9:29:32 AM EDT
[#17]
Quoted:
anyone know how many AUGs were made by Sabre? My A3 is in the # 1870's. I phoned Steyr and spoke with Jack inquiring about the same thing. He said that I had one of the last A3's manufactured, though, he stopped short with telling my how many or what the last S\N # was 
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Posted: 1/20/2011 11:38:33 AM EDT
[#18]
I wonderif steyr has tried to buy sdi? It seems rediculous they agreed to that back and forth silliness.
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Posted: 1/20/2011 12:14:04 PM EDT
[#19]
Quoted: anyone know how many AUGs were made by Sabre? Going off the top of my head I think they came in at around 2,600 to 2,800 or so before they haulted. Definitely less than the 3K they originally planned on doing back in 08'. |
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Posted: 1/20/2011 12:15:17 PM EDT
[#20]
We need to serious ask ourselves?
Has any other firearms manufacture gone this route? Importing 90% of the goods with all Govt fees associated? Ask Kent, TPD –– Gone. How can it be worth it, why bother. Unless of course the goods are flying out the door 24/7, like Steyr may have envisioned early on. In our present economy, Steyr has no doubt learned their lesson. Unless we go into another Obama purchasing frenzy, I really doubt That Steyr will even "think about'" picking up the phone to SDI anytime soon. |
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Posted: 1/20/2011 12:15:38 PM EDT
[#21]
Quoted: I wonderif steyr has tried to buy sdi? It seems rediculous they agreed to that back and forth silliness. I don't think Steyr is in a position to acquire SDI they've scored some recent mil contracts and I'm guessing the price would be pretty high to buy them out right now. |
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Posted: 1/20/2011 12:20:08 PM EDT
[#22]
Quoted: We need to serious ask ourselves? Has any other firearms manufacture gone this route? Importing 90% of the goods with all Govt fees associated? Ask Kent, TPD –– Gone. How can it be worth it, why bother. Unless of course the goods are flying out the door 24/7, like Steyr may have envisioned early on. In our present economy, Steyr has no doubt learned their lesson. Unless we go into another Obama purchasing frenzy, I really doubt That Steyr will even "think about'" picking up the phone to SDI anytime soon. I don't think Steyr holds that view point since they've been continuing to market the A3 recently. The A3 sold for around $1,800 and that's not a horrible price point during normal market conditions for a high-end EBR it's just not a good price point right now. Steyr pulled the MA1 and SA1 pistols from the market because they were deemed too high in price to be competitive at the time and now they've brought them back. This is what Steyr does and it's just par for the course. When they think they can sell they put the product on the market and when they think they can't they don't. This recession can't last forever sooner or later the economy will stablize or we'll just end up like Greece. If we end up like Greece buying A3s will be the least of our worries.
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Posted: 1/20/2011 12:45:46 PM EDT
[#23]
No kidding.
Receiver. Barrels. QC check on every gun that ships. Shipping cost. Fed Taxes. Steyr subbing out the American made 30rd magazines. Steyr Paying SDI for every S\N that they stamp.. Steyr should hand over the whole shit load to SDI, over see their QC, then take a cut for every gun that SDI builds and be done with it.. Let SDI hold the ball and stock the Aug. Give SDI the rights to build the Aug, keep an eye on them, let them stock and sell it. |
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Posted: 1/20/2011 12:47:44 PM EDT
[#24]
Quoted:
Quoted:
So it would be cheaper for Steyr USA to have their own factory for the A3 , their own employees , their own CNC machines etc.. then have to shut it all down when things get slow.. Didnt you see what happened to MSAR. The way Steyr is doing it now they can stop production anytime they want and control their inventory without shutting down a factory or lay employees off. Sabre Defence can still run the other Goverment /Civilian contracts they have. Bulpup rifles are a nich market , your not gonna sell a 100,000 a year to keep a full time factory running unless you have several other products to supplement a slow down. Why would you think it would be cheaper for Steyr to have their own factory here for the A3? If that were to happen it would already be running and pumping out their other models. When you think about how Steyr marketed their A3. you could say that they sold it to SDI. Purchased it back from SDI. Now they are trying to sell it again. To many hands reaching and eating that same piece of pie. I was asking you the question and i edited my original reply with ?. Steyr has a small market in the US for their firearms and the bullpup rifle is an even smaller niche market. They probably dont see the value in building a huge factory right now. The only reason SIG, Glock , HK and Beretta have factories in the US is due to Military and Law Enforement contracts and requirements. You could ask the same question of why many Italian shotgun makers dont build factories here in the US. |
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Posted: 1/20/2011 2:17:39 PM EDT
[#25]
Quoted:
Steyr also had the .22 kit on display for the AUG at SHOT Show. A rep said it should be out later this year. Now that would be really good news. |
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Posted: 1/20/2011 5:02:18 PM EDT
[#26]
Only 1860 AUG A3s Have Been Produced From pjs website. Guy oughta know.
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Posted: 1/21/2011 6:04:17 AM EDT
[#27]
Quoted:
Only 1860 AUG A3s Have Been Produced From pjs website. Guy oughta know. Steyr's first shipment of Augs started at 1USA001 to 999. Then they changed the prefix to 2USA001 up to ? My A3 is in the 2USA870's which should make it over 1860 manufactured correct? What do we have on the forum for a high number? Anyone? |
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Posted: 1/21/2011 9:21:43 AM EDT
[#28]
Only 1860 made.
thanks for the info |
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Posted: 1/21/2011 11:56:40 AM EDT
[#29]
Quoted: Only 1860 AUG A3s Have Been Produced From pjs website. Guy oughta know. Wow. Thought it was a lot more than that. Steyr missed the Obama bubble. They had like the worse timing in the world for a new product release. They showed the A3 at SHOT 2009 and they really didn't get them to Pete until I think around early Spring when they started coming in and those sold to folks on waiting lists. The bottom dropped out though around fall of 2009 and the market was flooded when Steyr really hit full stride with the A3. By 2010 the economy was firmly in the shitter and there was no panic left of an AWB. If Steyr had released the AUG A3 Spring of 2008 I think they could have sold another 500 to 1,000 rifles easy. |
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Posted: 1/21/2011 8:14:20 PM EDT
[#30]
Quoted:
If Steyr had released the AUG A3 Spring of 2008 I think they could have sold another 500 to 1,000 rifles easy. I'd bet more like 5,000 or 10,000. If they had come out before, or at least closer to the STG don't you think they would have stolen most of those customers due to name recognition? |
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Posted: 1/21/2011 8:48:19 PM EDT
[#31]
Quoted:
I'd bet more like 5,000 or 10,000. If they had come out before, or at least closer to the STG don't you think they would have stolen most of those customers due to name recognition? Yeah, but I think MSAR was Steyr's wakeup-call that there was pent-up demand for an AUG-alike in the US. |
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Posted: 1/27/2011 9:06:20 AM EDT
[#32]
Quoted: Quoted: If Steyr had released the AUG A3 Spring of 2008 I think they could have sold another 500 to 1,000 rifles easy. I'd bet more like 5,000 or 10,000. If they had come out before, or at least closer to the STG don't you think they would have stolen most of those customers due to name recognition? I remember before the Obama panic the STG's were selling down around $1500 with some reports of STG's in the $1400 range, but when the Obama panic hit they shot back up in price to around $1700 to $1800 and frankly they wouldn't have sold for that if the A3s were out and selling at $1800, but I'm guessing the A3s would have been more at $2K during the panic or even $2,300. Needless to say Steyr just couldn't get their rifles to market fast enough to enjoy the insane buying frenzy of the Obama panic. |
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Posted: 1/27/2011 10:45:40 AM EDT
[#33]
Steyr has consistently been about three steps behind on the the AUG game...
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Posted: 1/27/2011 4:59:29 PM EDT
[#34]
How is that ? they were the ones that designed it. At least their guns work. Also they are the only company that builds an AUG.
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Posted: 1/27/2011 5:10:06 PM EDT
[#35]
Quoted: How is that ? they were the ones that designed it. At least their guns work. Also they are the only company that builds an AUG. My STG-556 works just fine and has worked fine going on three years now. |
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Posted: 1/27/2011 5:27:18 PM EDT
[#36]
Quoted: guys we've done this a million times...Quoted: How is that ? they were the ones that designed it. At least their guns work. Also they are the only company that builds an AUG. My STG-556 works just fine and has worked fine going on three years now. |
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Posted: 1/27/2011 5:44:15 PM EDT
[#37]
I think Dawg180 was talking about Steyr's marketing and distribution timing. Which always seems a bit off. Not the gun itself. I agree and I also own a Steyr A3.
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Posted: 1/28/2011 4:18:23 AM EDT
[#38]
They are a lot like HK with their MR556. They waited until they had a product that met their high standards and were not going release the AUG A3 until those standards were met. Unlike other companies that have no history or reputation or set of standards to live up to.
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Posted: 1/28/2011 4:46:31 AM EDT
[#39]
Manufacturers drop items from their line up all of the time.
Steyr has a whole garden of vegetables that make them money. Their new Aug A3 Vegetable isn't making the same money that their other veggies are. To Steyr, it's not worth the time and effort to grow them anymore. Nothing unusual. |
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Posted: 1/28/2011 10:24:33 AM EDT
[#40]
Quoted: Steyr has NOT dropped the A3 from the line up though. They continue to market it including at SHOT, they continue putting articles in magazines, its still up on their website and in their 2011 catalogue, and they continue developing the product line for as seen by the 22LR conversion displayed at SHOT. All they did was halt production temporarily... Manufacturers drop items from their line up all of the time. Steyr has a whole garden of vegetables that make them money. Their new Aug A3 Vegetable isn't making the same money that their other veggies are. To Steyr, it's not worth the time and effort to grow them anymore. Nothing unusual. |
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Posted: 1/28/2011 1:13:09 PM EDT
[#41]
Steyr used the two words Dropped and Until when I spoke with them.
Dropped Until the climate changes. Us thirsty Aug Owners and Want To Be Aug Owners will have to read into this Until we actually see them shipping again. |
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Posted: 1/28/2011 3:51:29 PM EDT
[#42]
Quoted:
I think Dawg180 was talking about Steyr's marketing and distribution timing. Which always seems a bit off. Not the gun itself. I agree and I also own a Steyr A3. Yes, my comment was referring to the marketing and distribution timing. Steyr wouldn't have been competing with clones of their own guns if they had been timely in re-introducing the AUG. |
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Posted: 1/28/2011 5:12:27 PM EDT
[#43]
The STEYR AUG is never going to be a big selling item. They start at $2000 for the A3 and they have very stiff competition. People watch the Iraq and Afg wars on tv and see the M4, AK and M16 rifles and want them. And those are a LOT cheaper and much more abundent. The AUG will always be outsold and if they come back into production, there still wont be many. Besides, when Obama got elected, it was the AR that sold like crazy. Also, I talked to 2 guys I know who are looking to buy their first assault rifles and they dont know much about the things. I recommeded the AUG but they are dead set on AR's.
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Posted: 1/28/2011 8:09:07 PM EDT
[#44]
here is what I dont get, I always hear about much it costs to make molds and machined parts and all that. Yet I see all this stuff like SBR shells for glocks, the 20th variation of an all new AR or AK mag, and so on. How can they possibly make their money back I dont know.
To mfg the critical US parts for an in production assault rifle like an AUG: You need to make the receiver, barrel and magazine. The magazine is probably the hardest part because if Century can source new mfg receivers and barrels and put them on $599 retail guns assembled by drunk and blind monkeys, jesus, surely Steyr can do it for a substantially less than $1800 street price. Maybe make a cocking handle or other random part determined by ATF in the US and you will be at your US part count or pretty damn close. For everything else, pull parts of the Steyr line in some far away land and ship them to the US. Find a small building, hire a few dozen guys for assembly and off you go. Bushmaster was only around 80 people and Im sure they made a lot more bushmasters than Steyr and that probably included mfg some parts in house. People talk about the difficulty of mfg guns in America like we were a banana republic living in the stone age. If FN can make a FS2000 in Belguim, import them here and sell them now for $1500, surly a bunch of Austrians can figure it out. Although based on the debacle of the Sig556, maybe Americans can't make anything decent. All I can say is that if the US can't make the best guns in the world, what the hell can we mfg? |
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Posted: 1/29/2011 5:55:57 AM EDT
[#45]
If FN can make a FS2000 in Belguim, import them here and sell them now for $1500, surly a bunch of Austrians can figure it out.
Where do you see FS2000 rifles at $1500.00? 
I have seen a few models at CDNN " CDNN A Close out online Dealer whom purchases pallets of firearms that do not sell very well ". The FS2000 sells for $2100.00 and up. ( Unless the dealer needs to pay his bills, or it is previously owned ) Ask any FFL to show you their wholesale pricing on the FS2000. The FS2000 is only a few pennies under 2K wholesale. It costs a dealer MORE money for the FS2000 than it does for an Aug A3. FN is rumored to be dropping the FS2000 STD and USG PS90 models because of poor sales and interest. 2K for an Aug A3 is more than fair. |
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Posted: 1/29/2011 6:49:33 PM EDT
[#46]
The AUG A3 got clobbered by MSAR. It was a limited market to start. MSAR probably expanded the market, but by this point, Steyr could not compete.
Even the FS2000 is sold in pretty limited numbers.
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Posted: 1/29/2011 6:52:14 PM EDT
[#47]
Quoted: If FN can make a FS2000 in Belguim, import them here and sell them now for $1500, surly a bunch of Austrians can figure it out. Where do you see FS2000 rifles at $1500.00? I have seen a few models at CDNN " CDNN A Close out online Dealer whom purchases pallets of firearms that do not sell very well ". The FS2000 sells for $2100.00 and up. ( Unless the dealer needs to pay his bills, or it is previously owned ) Ask any FFL to show you their wholesale pricing on the FS2000. The FS2000 is only a few pennies under 2K wholesale. It costs a dealer MORE money for the FS2000 than it does for an Aug A3. FN is rumored to be dropping the FS2000 STD and USG PS90 models because of poor sales and interest. 2K for an Aug A3 is more than fair. The FS2000 is kind of pointless product for FN considering that they have the SCAR now. I honestly keep forgetting that the build the fishgun still. The PS90 I don't see going anywhere. I do think it is overpriced. If they got it down to $1100 or so, it would be great. The thing needs an optic bad, so you almost have to figure in an aimpoint or something into the price and what folks are willing to pay.
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Posted: 1/29/2011 7:54:42 PM EDT
[#48]
Quoted:
If FN can make a FS2000 in Belguim, import them here and sell them now for $1500, surly a bunch of Austrians can figure it out.
Where do you see FS2000 rifles at $1500.00?
I have seen a few models at CDNN " CDNN A Close out online Dealer whom purchases pallets of firearms that do not sell very well ". The FS2000 sells for $2100.00 and up. ( Unless the dealer needs to pay his bills, or it is previously owned ) Ask any FFL to show you their wholesale pricing on the FS2000. The FS2000 is only a few pennies under 2K wholesale. It costs a dealer MORE money for the FS2000 than it does for an Aug A3. FN is rumored to be dropping the FS2000 STD and USG PS90 models because of poor sales and interest. 2K for an Aug A3 is more than fair. to yourself. Ever see what LE/Govt pay for these guns? $2k for anything that isn't a precision match rifle without optics should be a cash cow. As far as $1499 FS2000, see links below and that doesnt even consider all the rebates being offered for police and military service.
http://www.hkspecialiststore.com/product_detail.php?Category=29&Page_Number=1&Index_Seq=706&Home_Page= http://www.hkspecialiststore.com/product_detail.php?Category=29&Page_Number=1&Index_Seq=8&Home_Page= |
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Posted: 1/30/2011 6:41:20 AM EDT
[#49]
Quoted:
Ever see what LE/Govt pay for these guns? $2k for anything that isn't a precision match rifle without optics should be a cash cow. As far as $1499 FS2000, see links below and that doesnt even consider all the rebates being offered for police and military service. http://www.hkspecialiststore.com/product_detail.php?Category=29&Page_Number=1&Index_Seq=706&Home_Page= http://www.hkspecialiststore.com/product_detail.php?Category=29&Page_Number=1&Index_Seq=8&Home_Page= LE/Govt pay a lower price, because they are exempt from FET. Firearms Excise and Manufacturing Tax. FET is included in the purchase price of every Firearm that comes out of Steyr. Let’s just say that LE is paying $1500.00 for a Steyr Aug, FET Exempt. You and I are paying $1900.00 for the same gun with mandatory FET included. If Steyr were to sell you and I the gun at the LE price of $1500.00 they are no longer exempt from paying the $400.00 FET. Now, Steyr has just sold you that same gun at $1100.00! $400.00 less than LE or Military. Do you understand now? Regardless if the firearm is sold to a civilian at $1900.00 or to a LEO at $1500.00 Steyr still makes the exact same profit on the gun. You should not be comparing the two prices. |
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