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Posted: 11/18/2001 12:40:59 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/18/2001 12:35:14 PM EDT by Bushmaster_223]
Is the G-3 Rifle any good?
Link Posted: 11/18/2001 12:47:25 PM EDT
Unless you plan on going Class 3, I think you are refering to the HK91. Yes it is a good battle rifle. They are expensive, and unless you want an original HK for collection purposes it would probably be good idea to get a clone gun for a shooter.
Link Posted: 11/18/2001 12:48:41 PM EDT
Nope. That's why the Germans ripped it off from the Spanish CETME and issued it as their standard issue. ;)

The G3 is a well made rifle. Are you thinking about getting one? I've heard many complain about it's recoil.
Link Posted: 11/18/2001 12:49:34 PM EDT
Thanks...What is the price range for a good clone?
Link Posted: 11/18/2001 12:51:49 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Fallschirmjager:
Nope. That's why the Germans ripped it off from the Spanish CETME and issued it as their standard issue. ;)

The G3 is a well made rifle. Are you thinking about getting one? I've heard many complain about it's recoil.



What dose recoil matter?? i mean i shoot 7.62x54R and if it is too much they make recoil pads
Link Posted: 11/18/2001 12:57:10 PM EDT
Well, some complain it has a very sharp recoil. Some people who are into military harware don't like adding recoil pads on their rifles. It's all shooter preference, but I'd suggest shooting one before you go out and buy one.
Link Posted: 11/18/2001 1:01:31 PM EDT
You can get some good info here, and check their forum for WTS rifles...

http://www.hkweaponsystems.com/

Hope this helps.
Link Posted: 11/18/2001 1:16:51 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Fallschirmjager:
You can get some good info here, and check their forum for WTS rifles...

www.hkweaponsystems.com/

Hope this helps.

Link Posted: 11/18/2001 1:43:32 PM EDT
I like mine:
- HK-91 (IB date code)
- Swarovski ZFM 10x42T scope
- PSG1 stock
- PSG1 trigger-group in fake SEF clipped/pinned grip-frame
- PSG1 pistol-grip
- claw scope mount with rings and inserts
- Knights RAS
- Harris LM bipod
- paddle mag release
- 1200 meter sight
- carry handle
- port buffer
- barrel stabilizer
albums.photopoint.com/j/View?u=258760&a=10577068&p=56095335
albums.photopoint.com/j/View?u=258760&a=10577068&p=56095338
albums.photopoint.com/j/View?u=258760&a=10577068&p=56095339
albums.photopoint.com/j/View?u=258760&a=10577068&p=56095340
Link Posted: 11/18/2001 2:00:41 PM EDT

Originally Posted By drfcolt:
I like mine:
- HK-91 (IB date code)
- Swarovski ZFM 10x42T scope
- PSG1 stock
- PSG1 trigger-group in fake SEF clipped/pinned grip-frame
- PSG1 pistol-grip
- claw scope mount with rings and inserts
- Knights RAS
- Harris LM bipod
- paddle mag release
- 1200 meter sight
- carry handle
- port buffer
- barrel stabilizer
albums.photopoint.com/j/View?u=258760&a=10577068&p=56095335
albums.photopoint.com/j/View?u=258760&a=10577068&p=56095338
albums.photopoint.com/j/View?u=258760&a=10577068&p=56095339
albums.photopoint.com/j/View?u=258760&a=10577068&p=56095340



Dose it have "Sharp" Recoil?
Link Posted: 11/18/2001 2:01:39 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Fallschirmjager:
You can get some good info here, and check their forum for WTS rifles...

http://www.hkweaponsystems.com/

Hope this helps.




Thanks
Link Posted: 11/18/2001 2:20:09 PM EDT
The HK91 DOES have sharp recoil...unless you buy a good buffer tube. I have the G3 Heavy buffer in mine, and it just feels like a good push. Nowhere near as bad as a SAR8 I recently shot. The 91's are a lot of fun to shoot, and you can find good, factory HK mage for $10 or less. I just bought 10 for $80. Most were still in the wrapper.
Link Posted: 11/18/2001 2:36:11 PM EDT
Do they take a straght clip or a bent one?
Link Posted: 11/18/2001 3:15:25 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/18/2001 3:09:38 PM EDT by drfcolt]

Originally Posted By Bushmaster_223:

Originally Posted By drfcolt:
I like mine:
- HK-91 (IB date code)
- Swarovski ZFM 10x42T scope
- PSG1 stock
- PSG1 trigger-group in fake SEF clipped/pinned grip-frame
- PSG1 pistol-grip
- claw scope mount with rings and inserts
- Knights RAS
- Harris LM bipod
- paddle mag release
- 1200 meter sight
- carry handle
- port buffer
- barrel stabilizer
albums.photopoint.com/j/View?u=258760&a=10577068&p=56095335
albums.photopoint.com/j/View?u=258760&a=10577068&p=56095338
albums.photopoint.com/j/View?u=258760&a=10577068&p=56095339
albums.photopoint.com/j/View?u=258760&a=10577068&p=56095340



Dose it have "Sharp" Recoil?



With the PSG1 stock and buffer system along with the weight (22lbs unloaded), it has very little recoil. More like the gentle shove mentioned above.
Link Posted: 11/18/2001 3:21:03 PM EDT
I have a CETME and strongly dislike it. It is not a G3, but somewhat simular. If I would of paid the price of a G3, I would really be upset. Throwing away $425.00 isn't a great deal compared to loosing a $1000.

OSA
Link Posted: 11/18/2001 3:23:51 PM EDT
www.hecklerkoch-usa.com/Pages/rifles.html

I want a G-3 like in the pic.
And 22 pounds?? HOLY MONKEY!!!!!!
Link Posted: 11/18/2001 3:29:49 PM EDT
What about the HK33KA2?
Link Posted: 11/18/2001 5:04:17 PM EDT
this is ALL WRONG from the very beginnig, the G3 is the one that it's a clone, isn't it? saying G3 clone would be like not reconizing Spanish engeniers who made the CETME, therefor, i'm not even gonna vote.
HUNTER FROM ARGENTINA
OUT.
Link Posted: 11/18/2001 5:21:32 PM EDT
Here is the one I just recently built. I used a FMP reciever and all HK parts, except for the req. U.S. parts.
Link Posted: 11/18/2001 6:45:25 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/18/2001 6:49:00 PM EDT by Fallschirmjager]
"this is ALL WRONG from the very beginnig"

Hey Hunter223,

Can you please explain how you have enlightened us with this being wrong from the beginning when the third post says:

"That's why the Germans ripped it off from the Spanish CETME and issued it as their standard issue. ;)"

Doesn't look like it was wrong from the beginning, huh! Anyways, if you really want to pick a bone about it, a German designed the CETME anyways. To be more exact, the CETME rifle was designed by former Mauser engineer Ludwig Vorgrimmler, and the West German company Heckler and Koch (also former Mauser employees) had previously assisted CETME in preparing the Spanish production line for the rifle. So, HK played with the design and presto, the G3...
Link Posted: 11/18/2001 7:25:42 PM EDT
Here's my baby along side my Colt.

I also have a Hensoldt scope, HK Claw Mount, 40 mags (mixed aluminum and steel) bayonet, mag loader and unloader, etc. Ad Nauseum.


Link Posted: 11/18/2001 7:39:15 PM EDT
Here's my baby.

She's for sale, BTW...

Link Posted: 11/18/2001 7:45:16 PM EDT
but with only 23 mags?
Link Posted: 11/18/2001 7:47:56 PM EDT
Neither. It will take a $10,000 PSG1 to shoot as well as a stock out of the box Armalite AR10
Link Posted: 11/18/2001 7:53:59 PM EDT
HKocher, I'd take you up on your rifle in a heartbeat, but here in CT any rifle marked "HK91" is beleived to be built by Satan for killing babies. That must be why it is on our state ban, but not its clones...oh well.
Link Posted: 11/18/2001 7:56:14 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Bushmaster_223:
Do they take a straght clip or a bent one?



Do you mean magazine? Nothing greater than 20 round OEM mags that I'm aware of. Owned both at one time, an H&K 91 and Springfield SAR3 - which is a Greek copy. Both were of the same quality and trouble free. Recoil wasn't bad either.
Link Posted: 11/18/2001 8:21:57 PM EDT
I have a few 30 round mags...aftermarket pieces of crap (in looks) that actually funstion quite well. They are straight mags too.
Link Posted: 11/18/2001 8:23:01 PM EDT

Originally Posted By David_Hineline:
Neither. It will take a $10,000 PSG1 to shoot as well as a stock out of the box Armalite AR10



Or a $1500 M1A to really OUTSHOOT it.

And if it the HK wasn't banned, then it would cost just as much as the AR10.
Link Posted: 11/18/2001 8:53:05 PM EDT

Originally Posted By xsquid:

Originally Posted By Bushmaster_223:
Do they take a straght clip or a bent one?



Do you mean magazine? Nothing greater than 20 round OEM mags that I'm aware of. Owned both at one time, an H&K 91 and Springfield SAR3 - which is a Greek copy. Both were of the same quality and trouble free. Recoil wasn't bad either.




thanks
Link Posted: 11/18/2001 9:08:49 PM EDT

Originally Posted By HKocher:
Here's my baby.

She's for sale, BTW...





How much?
Link Posted: 11/18/2001 9:38:48 PM EDT
Here's the link to the ad.

www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?id=68650

The additional accessories are optional, at an extra cost of course.

But I set up a good package: it comes with the port buffer, light bipod on wide forearm, the A2 stock has an HK21 MG buffer in it, the rear sight is replaced with an HK21 1200M sight (original drum sight also included), leather sling, manual, and 2 20 round HK german mags.

All for $2300 plus shipping to FFL in a non-banned state.
Link Posted: 11/18/2001 9:47:16 PM EDT

Originally Posted By HKocher:
Here's the link to the ad.

www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?id=68650

The additional accessories are optional, at an extra cost of course.

But I set up a good package: it comes with the port buffer, light bipod on wide forearm, the A2 stock has an HK21 MG buffer in it, the rear sight is replaced with an HK21 1200M sight (original drum sight also included), leather sling, manual, and 2 20 round HK german mags.

All for $2300 plus shipping to FFL in a non-banned state.




$2300? Too much i am not gonna buy anything over $500
Link Posted: 11/19/2001 3:44:35 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Bushmaster_223:

$2300? Too much i am not gonna buy anything over $500



No offense, but that pretty much rules out any genuine HK91...
Link Posted: 11/19/2001 5:39:11 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/19/2001 5:37:53 AM EDT by drfcolt]

Originally Posted By brouhaha:

Originally Posted By David_Hineline:
Neither. It will take a $10,000 PSG1 to shoot as well as a stock out of the box Armalite AR10



Or a $1500 M1A to really OUTSHOOT it.

And if it the HK wasn't banned, then it would cost just as much as the AR10.



I doubt that it.

PSG1's are tested with 50 (yes 5-0) rounds at 500 yards and all shots must be with in a 10" group.

Still WAY over priced, though.

Could probably build a stock M1A or AR10 up to do the same thing for a heck of alot less money.
Link Posted: 11/19/2001 12:34:39 PM EDT
How much is a clone?
Link Posted: 11/19/2001 5:25:17 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Fallschirmjager:
"this is ALL WRONG from the very beginnig"

Hey Hunter223,

Can you please explain how you have enlightened us with this being wrong from the beginning when the third post says:

"That's why the Germans ripped it off from the Spanish CETME and issued it as their standard issue. ;)"

Doesn't look like it was wrong from the beginning, huh! Anyways, if you really want to pick a bone about it, a German designed the CETME anyways. To be more exact, the CETME rifle was designed by former Mauser engineer Ludwig Vorgrimmler, and the West German company Heckler and Koch (also former Mauser employees) had previously assisted CETME in preparing the Spanish production line for the rifle. So, HK played with the design and presto, the G3...



good point newbie, but i was talking about the "G3 clone" expression, get the difference?
In other words, what i was saying was that, there is no such a thing as a G3 clone, but maybe, a CETME clone.
HUNTER FROM ARGENTINA
OUT.
Link Posted: 11/19/2001 5:37:38 PM EDT
My only beef is the high prices of mags.
Link Posted: 11/19/2001 5:41:28 PM EDT
Does anyone have an answer to this question? I have read that the CETME magazines will work int the G-3 rifles, but will the G-3 mags work in the CETME's? I really would hate to buy one just to find out that it won't work.

Vulcan94
Link Posted: 11/19/2001 7:00:34 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Bushmaster_223:
[$2300? Too much i am not gonna buy anything over $500



Get a CETME and have about $100 left over to buy ammo. Wholesale Guns-n-Ammo is running a sale on these for just under $400 and they pay shipping. That is where I bought mine. I have heard people posting that they have had trouble with the CIA made CETME, but mine worked flawlessly after a complete field-stripping and cleaning.

It's a good rifle...........I just like my AR10 and FAL a little better.

OSA

Link Posted: 11/19/2001 9:27:14 PM EDT

Originally Posted By SS109:
My only beef is the high prices of mags.



Of G3's? You gotta be joking. Mags are often less than $10. It's only the mags at gunshows that are expensive. They seem to think they are rare or somthing. I recently got 20 mags for $160...75% were still in the wrapper.

So, your excuse above is not valid.


www.aimsurplus.com
www.tapco.com
Link Posted: 11/20/2001 1:39:01 AM EDT
Try www.whatacountry.com, they have 30 round HK91 mags, South African Military new for 44.95, high but good mags, I have had no problems.
Link Posted: 11/20/2001 1:42:15 AM EDT
About recoil, the recoil on my HK91 is about the same as the recoil on my AR15, it is nothing.
Link Posted: 11/20/2001 2:20:16 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/20/2001 2:16:32 PM EDT by Fallschirmjager]
Hunter223,

"saying G3 clone would be like not reconizing Spanish engeniers who made the CETME, therefor, i'm not even gonna vote."

Good point newbie, but I was saying that since the CETME was developed by a German, and the production lines ended up being set up by HK, I wouldn't give too much thought to all the Spanish engineers who "designed" the CETME. Get the difference?

BTW, I'd watch who you call newbie, newbie. I've been on this board longer than what my "new" username would imply. Had to change it when they disallowed special characters in the username, such as Fallschirmjäger, and I just haven't been around lately. Too busy shooting and riding my CBR929RR...
Link Posted: 11/20/2001 3:11:10 PM EDT

Originally Posted By HUNTER223:
this is ALL WRONG from the very beginnig, the G3 is the one that it's a clone, isn't it? saying G3 clone would be like not reconizing Spanish engeniers who made the CETME, therefor, i'm not even gonna vote.
HUNTER FROM ARGENTINA
OUT.



The CETME was based upon the Mauser factories' prototype assault rifle, the Stg-45(M). At the end of WW2, Mauser engineers went to Spain with the design for the Stg-45(M), and to my knowledge, they designed the CETME. H&K did step in to help Spain out with the production of stamped sheet steel, which is how they got involved . . .
Link Posted: 11/20/2001 3:29:10 PM EDT


Mags are cheap again! Besides HK mags you can get the Thermolds for $20 again too.
Link Posted: 11/20/2001 7:21:54 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Fallschirmjager:
Hunter223,

"saying G3 clone would be like not reconizing Spanish engeniers who made the CETME, therefor, i'm not even gonna vote."

Good point newbie, but I was saying that since the CETME was developed by a German, and the production lines ended up being set up by HK, I wouldn't give too much thought to all the Spanish engineers who "designed" the CETME. Get the difference?

BTW, I'd watch who you call newbie, newbie. I've been on this board longer than what my "new" username would imply. Had to change it when they disallowed special characters in the username, such as Fallschirmjäger, and I just haven't been around lately. Too busy shooting and riding my CBR929RR...



haha, chill out rookie, i didn't mean anything by calling you newbie,nothing personal, and just like you (an old timer) i've been a member to AR15.com from the very beggining, the first old AR15.com, remember about it?, so once AGAIN, i'm sorry if i offended ya by calling ya newbie, man. Oh and BTW ROOKIE, that's a mean bike you got there, take care.
HUNTER FROM ARGENTINA
OUT.
Link Posted: 11/20/2001 7:44:06 PM EDT
Hunter223,

I read you lickey chickey cherry boy. And yea, the 929RR is one bad bike. I was thinking of getting a CETME a while back from Aim Surplus, but alas, they are all gone. Besides, I'm spoiled with what my Bushy does at 100m, so the thought of paying $500 for a rifle that may shoot 2 MOA doesn't appeal to me. After all, I already have a Mini-14 that can shoot that bad...

BTW, since you are in Argentina, how about those SAS troops!
Link Posted: 11/21/2001 5:23:34 PM EDT
hahahahahahaha
SAS? if yer talking about FALKLANDS (MALVINAS) war, let met tell ya something rookie, SAS didn't do SHIT here, the only thing they did do is crashing a helicopter against an iceberg killing some of those SASs and the chopper crew, on the other hand, the PARA and the MARINES did do A GREAT "WAR", having to walk almost 100 miles to get to Argentinian positions, they faught like well trained and equiped profesional SOLDIERS, hey a question, do you think the VIET CONGS or the NVA were as well trained and equiped as the english soldiers? i don't think so
HUNTER FROM ARGENTINA
OUT.
aaaaaaaa we didn't that bad after all.
Link Posted: 11/21/2001 7:41:36 PM EDT
Gee Hunter, I didn't realize the NVA and VC were helping the Argentines out down there. Thanks for the history lesson. Another interesting footnote for the books from Hunter223. The Spanish designed the CETME, and the VC and the NVA fought in the Falklands. Wow!

What's your problem with the SAS? Did they manage to infiltrate your position and butt rape you while you were molesting sheep?

Oh yea, keep including the rookie thing, it's really cool, like that "Hunter from Argentina, OUT" thing you got going. Real impressive, almost makes you seem like you were in the military. What you could do instead is maybe hit that little spell check button right under the text area so you don't look like a complete moron...
Link Posted: 11/21/2001 7:55:10 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Fallschirmjager:
Oh yea, keep including the rookie thing, it's really cool, like that "Hunter from Argentina, OUT" thing you got going. Real impressive, almost makes you seem like you were in the military...


Hey! I like Hunter's facetious jab at that corny "Ranger out" crap! He's got that Imbrogl|o thing going on.

- Green Skinned Geek Out!
Link Posted: 11/21/2001 8:25:37 PM EDT
Prefer my G3 clone ($600 INDEP/FMP clone asssembled by Century arms and sold by SOG) to my ARs

clone has a muzzle brake and not that much more recoil than my AR in my opinion...
but .308 packs way more wallup than .223

i find good surplus ammo is cheaper as well
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