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Posted: 4/23/2015 11:09:11 AM EDT
I saw a post earlier, but can't find it - I'm looking for an engraver that engraves inside the magwell.
Thanks.

Edit:
I got my lower back from Veritas Machining LLC yesterday.
I could not be happier with the engraving. My trust name is absurdly long, and they got it on the small magwell lip without any issue.
They also accommodated me by engraving the county, state and caliber on the opposing lip.
Stephanie at Veritas answered all my questions and concerns at lightning speed, and she was quite patient with me and made the changes I requested.
Phil is a class act as well, he emailed me a mock-up of the lower before engraving. Talk about going above and beyond.
The turn around time was lightning fast as well.
They're going to be my go to engravers from now on.

(My cell-phone camera potato pictures don't do the engraving justice)



Link Posted: 4/23/2015 11:17:41 AM EDT
I've also been looking for that thread, but can't find it, I think the company name started with a V.
Link Posted: 4/23/2015 12:05:46 PM EDT
www.veritasmachiningllc.com
Link Posted: 4/23/2015 12:45:30 PM EDT
They are who I used also - very good communication, and very fast service. It only took one week, door to door.




I'm very happy with their quality of work.

Take care,
Bob S.
Link Posted: 4/23/2015 12:45:54 PM EDT
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Quoted:
They are who I used also - very good communication, and very fast service. It only took one week, door to door.

http://people.virginia.edu/~rjs7m/NFA/Veritas-AR-2.JPG
http://people.virginia.edu/~rjs7m/NFA/Veritas-AR-3.JPG

I'm very happy with their quality of work.

Take care,
Bob S.
View Quote


Yes! That was your thread.
Thanks man.
Link Posted: 4/23/2015 12:46:04 PM EDT
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Quoted:
www.veritasmachiningllc.com
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Thank you!
Link Posted: 4/23/2015 7:13:10 PM EDT
I must say I used them and couldn't be happier. Great CS, awesome turn around time. And the quality of work is great!
Link Posted: 4/23/2015 8:07:50 PM EDT
Phil does a great job!
Link Posted: 4/23/2015 8:14:59 PM EDT
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
They are who I used also - very good communication, and very fast service. It only took one week, door to door.

http://people.virginia.edu/~rjs7m/NFA/Veritas-AR-2.JPG
http://people.virginia.edu/~rjs7m/NFA/Veritas-AR-3.JPG

I'm very happy with their quality of work.

Take care,
Bob S.
View Quote


That's nice!
Link Posted: 4/23/2015 8:55:42 PM EDT

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Quoted:


www.veritasmachiningllc.com
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I met Phil. He is a great person, and does excellent work.

 
Link Posted: 4/30/2015 11:43:34 AM EDT
Edited...VA-gunnut

Link Posted: 4/30/2015 12:34:25 PM EDT
Phil at Veritas  does excellent work...just got 3 back from him.
Link Posted: 4/30/2015 12:49:48 PM EDT

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Quoted:


Edited...VA-gunnut

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Is your lead time still 3 and a half years?





I actually used you for my first SBR engraving. You guys did great work.
 
Link Posted: 4/30/2015 12:51:27 PM EDT
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Quoted:
They are who I used also - very good communication, and very fast service. It only took one week, door to door.

http://people.virginia.edu/~rjs7m/NFA/Veritas-AR-2.JPG
http://people.virginia.edu/~rjs7m/NFA/Veritas-AR-3.JPG

I'm very happy with their quality of work.

Take care,
Bob S.
View Quote


Does the caliber need to be engraving?
Isn't it already engraved on the barrel?
Link Posted: 4/30/2015 1:49:08 PM EDT
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Quoted:


Does the caliber need to be engraving?
Isn't it already engraved on the barrel?
View Quote View All Quotes
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Quoted:
Quoted:
They are who I used also - very good communication, and very fast service. It only took one week, door to door.

http://people.virginia.edu/~rjs7m/NFA/Veritas-AR-2.JPG
http://people.virginia.edu/~rjs7m/NFA/Veritas-AR-3.JPG

I'm very happy with their quality of work.

Take care,
Bob S.


Does the caliber need to be engraving?
Isn't it already engraved on the barrel?


The wording from the BATFE is... (and please remember, YOU are the "Maker" in the eyes of the BATFE)

"If the caliber or gauge was not identified or designated (e.g., marked “multi”) on the firearm, the manufacturer, importer, or maker must legibly and conspicuously mark the frame, receiver, barrel, or pistol slide (if applicable) with the actual caliber/gauge once the caliber or gauge is known. "

It's the "conspicuously" that is the worry for some. Being under a handguard and not visible *might* be viewed as NOT being conspicuous. My feeling is that if you have to remove parts, it could become an issue.

Has anyone been jacked up on this issue - none that I've heard of, but it's easy to avoid - the extra engraving cost less that I just spent at Subways for lunch today.

I did what made ME feel better about the potential problem.

Take care,
Bob S.




Link Posted: 4/30/2015 5:25:22 PM EDT
I just had a lower engraved yesterday. Myself and my friend both went to a great laser engraver in Western North Carolina. Tarheel State Firearms. I can't say enough good things about them. While I was there, the topic of engraving the magazine well came up. She said she can engrave anywhere with her equipment but their ATF rep specifically told them that area would not fly.
Link Posted: 4/30/2015 5:32:33 PM EDT
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Quoted:
I just had a lower engraved yesterday. Myself and my friend both went to a great laser engraver in Western North Carolina. Tarheel State Firearms. I can't say enough good things about them. While I was there, the topic of engraving the magazine well came up. She said she can engrave anywhere with her equipment but their ATF rep specifically told them that area would not fly.
View Quote


Not a bad idea I suppose.
I emailed them about engraving the same for me.
Link Posted: 4/30/2015 5:43:02 PM EDT
Link Posted: 4/30/2015 6:00:14 PM EDT
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Quoted:
The argument "for" the magwell lip being considered conspicuously placed is that the person would never hand an ATF agent a firearm with the magazine inserted. That's just not a contingency I'm willing to bet on, especially when there are other places that are easily engraved.
View Quote


The front of the magwell is nearly as invisible on casual observation, and I can't imagine anyone saying that it was not easily visible.
Link Posted: 4/30/2015 6:12:57 PM EDT
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Quoted:
In this regard Tar Heel State will work a lot like ADCO. They'll give you recommendations, but they'll do exactly as you ask...and engrave in any location, at the depth and size you request. You'll be responsible for it being legal.

The argument "for" the magwell lip being considered conspicuously placed is that the person would never hand an ATF agent a firearm with the magazine inserted. That's just not a contingency I'm willing to bet on, especially when there are other places that are easily engraved.
View Quote


I asked Phil from Veritas about that and his response was something like ATF had assured him multiple times that as long as you didn't need a tool to remove something in order to see it that it is legal. That being said, the engraving on the magwell flares both my Double D Armory and DDLES lowers that he did for me is visible with mags in place. I'd say it is no less conspicuous than under the trigger guard. You need to hold the gun upside down and view it from an angle to see it either way.

Veritas does great work with a fast turnaround. He even emailed mock up photos for approval before performing the work. Use with confidence.

ETA: It's not so easy to get a good pic of it though.


Link Posted: 4/30/2015 6:15:30 PM EDT
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Quoted:
In this regard Tar Heel State will work a lot like ADCO. They'll give you recommendations, but they'll do exactly as you ask...and engrave in any location, at the depth and size you request. You'll be responsible for it being legal.

The argument "for" the magwell lip being considered conspicuously placed is that the person would never hand an ATF agent a firearm with the magazine inserted. That's just not a contingency I'm willing to bet on, especially when there are other places that are easily engraved.
View Quote


I agree. I had a billet lower and she was able to get it inside the trigger guard. I know I am good there. I specifically created a second trust for my SBRs with a trust name that is short and that I like so I didn't mind if I even had to put on side of magwell as I am defiantly going to make sure I am within regs. Sad thing is I have a local gun shop that is telling people, us included, to take it to this jewelry shop down the road for engraving. He is suggesting you put engraving on tang where grip goes. When you put the grip on it disappears. When my friend went to the engraver, he suggested the same placement and friend opted for trigger guard. When he picked it up, it wasn't deep at all. It defiantly did not meet the requirement for depth and he plans to refinish lower and this one would disappear with one coat of cerakote or duracoat. So he had to get his re-engraved with me from Tarheel.
Link Posted: 5/1/2015 12:33:45 AM EDT
Trevor K in Auburn WA does this also, just did two last weekend
Link Posted: 5/1/2015 12:55:37 AM EDT

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Quoted:


Edited...VA-gunnut

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I wish I had known about the magwell!





You guys did great on my trigger opening engraving, but that magwell thing is cool!
 
Link Posted: 5/3/2015 7:26:16 PM EDT
That's where do mine.


With a hand engraver.
Link Posted: 5/3/2015 7:53:41 PM EDT


Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
I asked Phil from Veritas about that and his response was something like ATF had assured him multiple times that as long as you didn't need a tool to remove something in order to see it that it is legal. That being said, the engraving on the magwell flares both my Double D Armory and DDLES lowers that he did for me is visible with mags in place. I'd say it is no less conspicuous than under the trigger guard. You need to hold the gun upside down and view it from an angle to see it either way.





Veritas does great work with a fast turnaround. He even emailed mock up photos for approval before performing the work. Use with confidence.





ETA: It's not so easy to get a good pic of it though.





http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u173/N6740S/engrave-dda-lower_zpscyxpmsex.jpg


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Quoted:





Quoted:


In this regard Tar Heel State will work a lot like ADCO. They'll give you recommendations, but they'll do exactly as you ask...and engrave in any location, at the depth and size you request. You'll be responsible for it being legal.





The argument "for" the magwell lip being considered conspicuously placed is that the person would never hand an ATF agent a firearm with the magazine inserted. That's just not a contingency I'm willing to bet on, especially when there are other places that are easily engraved.






I asked Phil from Veritas about that and his response was something like ATF had assured him multiple times that as long as you didn't need a tool to remove something in order to see it that it is legal. That being said, the engraving on the magwell flares both my Double D Armory and DDLES lowers that he did for me is visible with mags in place. I'd say it is no less conspicuous than under the trigger guard. You need to hold the gun upside down and view it from an angle to see it either way.





Veritas does great work with a fast turnaround. He even emailed mock up photos for approval before performing the work. Use with confidence.





ETA: It's not so easy to get a good pic of it though.





http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u173/N6740S/engrave-dda-lower_zpscyxpmsex.jpg


 





I would be really curious as to know just how specifically they define that phrase, "as long your didn't need a tool to remove something in order to see it," actually is.





A case could be made for engraving on the top of the lower, right by the rear take down pin, where the upper meets the lower.  All you have to do is pop the pin out with your finger and open it up...hmm...





 
Link Posted: 5/3/2015 8:08:11 PM EDT
Veritas just finished 3 for me and they came out better than expected.  They sent me photo proofs of my magwell for my approval prior to engraving. Phil called me direct to ask if i was ok with using a different font as my engraving would have been too long to fit with the Times font.  Total time from my post office back to my front door was 7 days. My Noveske and PWS both had flared magwells and I knew he could engrave inside rhe magwell lip, but my Colt 6933 did not.  Phil managed to get it done on the Colt magwell lip for me.  Kudos Phil  I highly recommend Veritas.
Link Posted: 5/3/2015 9:41:27 PM EDT
Link Posted: 5/11/2015 12:27:34 PM EDT
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Quoted:
Veritas just finished 3 for me and they came out better than expected.  They sent me photo proofs of my magwell for my approval prior to engraving. Phil called me direct to ask if i was ok with using a different font as my engraving would have been too long to fit with the Times font.  Total time from my post office back to my front door was 7 days. My Noveske and PWS both had flared magwells and I knew he could engrave inside rhe magwell lip, but my Colt 6933 did not.  Phil managed to get it done on the Colt magwell lip for me.  Kudos Phil  I highly recommend Veritas.
View Quote


Yeah he definitely goes out of his way to make you happy.
Great company.
Link Posted: 5/11/2015 7:41:33 PM EDT
Link Posted: 5/11/2015 7:57:57 PM EDT
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Quoted:
We can engrave in the magwell also.

http://www.ar15.com/forums/t_7_118/1408993_NFA_Engraving.html
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Got any pictures of your magwell work?
Link Posted: 5/11/2015 8:10:37 PM EDT
Link Posted: 5/12/2015 12:02:16 AM EDT
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Quoted:
If you scroll through the thread, there is one I did on a personal rifle. I'll engrave up a 80% lower in the morning and post pictures.
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Ah, I didn't realize that was a magwell -
It's huge.
Link Posted: 5/12/2015 10:43:29 AM EDT
I got my lower back from Veritas Machining yesterday.
I could not be happier with the engraving. My trust name is absurdly long, and they got it on the small magwell lip without any issue.
They also accommodated me by engraving the county, state and caliber on the opposing lip.
Stephanie at Veritas answered all my questions and concerns at lightning speed, and she was quite patient with me and made the changes I requested.
Phil is a class act as well, he emailed me a mock-up of the lower before engraving. Talk about going above and beyond.
The turn around time was lightning fast as well.
They're going to be my go to engravers from now on.
I'll post pictures once I get a chance.


(The cell-phone camera potato pictures don't do the engraving justice)


Link Posted: 5/15/2015 12:11:29 AM EDT
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Quoted:

And you'd also have to get a definition of this:

The above regulations require markings that legibly identify each item or package and require that such markings are conspicuous. ATF has consistently taken the position that "legibly" marked means using exclusively Roman letters (A, a, B, b, C, c, and so forth) and Arabic numerals (1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, and so forth), and "conspicuous" means that all required markings must be placed in such a manner as to be wholly unobstructed from plain view. These regulations apply to licensed manufacturers and licensed importers relative to firearms, armor piercing ammunition, and large capacity ammunition feeding devices, and to makers of National Firearms Act firearms.
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Quoted:
Quoted:
I would be really curious as to know just how specifically they define that phrase, "as long your didn't need a tool to remove something in order to see it," actually is.

A case could be made for engraving on the top of the lower, right by the rear take down pin, where the upper meets the lower.  All you have to do is pop the pin out with your finger and open it up...hmm...

And you'd also have to get a definition of this:

The above regulations require markings that legibly identify each item or package and require that such markings are conspicuous. ATF has consistently taken the position that "legibly" marked means using exclusively Roman letters (A, a, B, b, C, c, and so forth) and Arabic numerals (1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, and so forth), and "conspicuous" means that all required markings must be placed in such a manner as to be wholly unobstructed from plain view. These regulations apply to licensed manufacturers and licensed importers relative to firearms, armor piercing ammunition, and large capacity ammunition feeding devices, and to makers of National Firearms Act firearms.


So would under the trigger guard be considered "plain view"?

I have one of my engravings and I just noticed it gets covered up by the dust cover when it's open. I don't think it's a problem but still makes me a bit nervous.
Link Posted: 5/15/2015 1:41:40 AM EDT
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Quoted:


So would under the trigger guard be considered "plain view"?

I have one of my engravings and I just noticed it gets covered up by the dust cover when it's open. I don't think it's a problem but still makes me a bit nervous.
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Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
I would be really curious as to know just how specifically they define that phrase, "as long your didn't need a tool to remove something in order to see it," actually is.

A case could be made for engraving on the top of the lower, right by the rear take down pin, where the upper meets the lower.  All you have to do is pop the pin out with your finger and open it up...hmm...

And you'd also have to get a definition of this:

The above regulations require markings that legibly identify each item or package and require that such markings are conspicuous. ATF has consistently taken the position that "legibly" marked means using exclusively Roman letters (A, a, B, b, C, c, and so forth) and Arabic numerals (1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, and so forth), and "conspicuous" means that all required markings must be placed in such a manner as to be wholly unobstructed from plain view. These regulations apply to licensed manufacturers and licensed importers relative to firearms, armor piercing ammunition, and large capacity ammunition feeding devices, and to makers of National Firearms Act firearms.


So would under the trigger guard be considered "plain view"?

I have one of my engravings and I just noticed it gets covered up by the dust cover when it's open. I don't think it's a problem but still makes me a bit nervous.


Yes it is.
It's in plain sight, and not obstructed.

I wouldn't call your engraving obstructed either, considering a simple lift of the cover reveals it.
I wouldn't worry about it.
Link Posted: 6/15/2015 12:52:02 AM EDT
Looks good!
Link Posted: 6/15/2015 8:52:17 AM EDT
very cool place to engrave as its technically not covered up yet no one will ever notice.
Link Posted: 6/15/2015 11:11:50 PM EDT
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Quoted:
very cool place to engrave as its technically not covered up yet no one will ever notice.
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Yup, all mine are going to be engraved there now.
Link Posted: 6/16/2015 8:25:46 AM EDT
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Quoted:
That's where do mine.


With a hand engraver.
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So...there is no problem doing the engraving myself?
Link Posted: 6/16/2015 8:46:37 AM EDT
Link Posted: 6/16/2015 2:37:13 PM EDT
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Quoted:

There's no legal problem, as long as it meets the minimum .003" depth. Aesthetics are the main concern.
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Quoted:
Quoted:
So...there is no problem doing the engraving myself?

There's no legal problem, as long as it meets the minimum .003" depth. Aesthetics are the main concern.


It would seem that doing the engraving myself shouldn't be too difficult.  Not hard to measure .003" and you could always use a stencil to do the engraving.
Art stores have plastic clear stencils that come in many fonts and shouldn't be hard to find the correct size lettering.

Just a thought.
Link Posted: 6/16/2015 2:45:57 PM EDT
Link Posted: 6/19/2015 8:43:42 PM EDT
Local option for guys in Houston, TX... Laser Edge Engraving in Spring. They did an outstanding job! And I even got to watch / video the process...really cool!

Link Posted: 6/21/2015 12:31:14 PM EDT
+1 for Veritas.  Great people
Link Posted: 6/21/2015 10:04:50 PM EDT
They got my lower on 6/16 and they said they won't be engraving until 06/23. Took 5 days to get there from Florida so not experiencing super fast service per say. They do good work from what I've seen but going through be at least a week turn around time. Seems a little long to me to do a little engraving but the price is right
Link Posted: 6/24/2015 4:55:10 PM EDT
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Quoted:
 

I would be really curious as to know just how specifically they define that phrase, "as long your didn't need a tool to remove something in order to see it," actually is.

A case could be made for engraving on the top of the lower, right by the rear take down pin, where the upper meets the lower.  All you have to do is pop the pin out with your finger and open it up...hmm...
 
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Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
In this regard Tar Heel State will work a lot like ADCO. They'll give you recommendations, but they'll do exactly as you ask...and engrave in any location, at the depth and size you request. You'll be responsible for it being legal.

The argument "for" the magwell lip being considered conspicuously placed is that the person would never hand an ATF agent a firearm with the magazine inserted. That's just not a contingency I'm willing to bet on, especially when there are other places that are easily engraved.


I asked Phil from Veritas about that and his response was something like ATF had assured him multiple times that as long as you didn't need a tool to remove something in order to see it that it is legal. That being said, the engraving on the magwell flares both my Double D Armory and DDLES lowers that he did for me is visible with mags in place. I'd say it is no less conspicuous than under the trigger guard. You need to hold the gun upside down and view it from an angle to see it either way.

Veritas does great work with a fast turnaround. He even emailed mock up photos for approval before performing the work. Use with confidence.

ETA: It's not so easy to get a good pic of it though.

http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u173/N6740S/engrave-dda-lower_zpscyxpmsex.jpg
 

I would be really curious as to know just how specifically they define that phrase, "as long your didn't need a tool to remove something in order to see it," actually is.

A case could be made for engraving on the top of the lower, right by the rear take down pin, where the upper meets the lower.  All you have to do is pop the pin out with your finger and open it up...hmm...
 


Well for that matter you don't need a tool to remove the magazine either, so the large flats inside the mag well should be fair game (but they're not).
Link Posted: 6/29/2015 6:49:33 PM EDT
Had mine done by LEO armory under the trigger guard. Pretty happy.
Link Posted: 6/29/2015 7:30:38 PM EDT
Looks good - what's the height of text on the trigger guard?
Link Posted: 6/29/2015 8:25:07 PM EDT
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Quoted:
Looks good - what's the height of text on the trigger guard?
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It's NFA specific laser engraving to reach required depth. This is a direct quote from LEO armory "We typically engrave greater than .003" into the firearm at a text height greater than or equal to 1/16"."
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