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9/22/2017 12:11:25 AM
Posted: 9/15/2005 4:45:37 PM EDT
I've heard a lot about them.

Surplus places have them now. AIM has 4 different kinds I think.

I know nothing about them. How powerful is .303? .30-06 class or a little hotter?

I think I might need one. I heard the work really smooth.
Link Posted: 9/15/2005 4:50:39 PM EDT
Yeah, I'd say 30-06 is a good comparasion. These guns are fun to shoot but with rudimentary sights, you won't win any Camp Perry matches. They would make a great camp or truck rifle though, IMO.

My .o2
Link Posted: 9/15/2005 5:23:18 PM EDT
If you have to ask the question you probably need 2 of them.

They are rugged things.
Link Posted: 9/15/2005 7:28:29 PM EDT
A Lee Enfield Nimber 4 Mark 1 was my deer rifle for many years.

If you've never shot one ,then you won't believe how fast these
bolts are to chamber a fresh round.

Mine was made in Vermont in 1942 ,Lend leased to the Brits ,and sent back
to a US warehouse in 1946 .

It sat in the crate from 46 to 86 ,at which point the crate was opened at
a gunshow and I bought it.

Shots around 2 MOA .Better with better sights or a scope.

Link Posted: 9/15/2005 9:10:19 PM EDT
Very fun rifles. The Garand was the best rifle of WWII, the Enfield was #2. Have to have one of each.
Link Posted: 9/15/2005 9:14:14 PM EDT
The #4 Mark 1 was chambered in 7.62 NATO ammo should be less an issue. I was told look for Savage manufactured.
Link Posted: 9/16/2005 1:54:55 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Mattl:
The #4 Mark 1 was chambered in 7.62 NATO ammo should be less an issue. I was told look for Savage manufactured.



The No4 rifle was never manufactured in in 7.62 Nato....only .303.

There were Enfields in .308, namely the No8, the L39A1, the L42A1 & some commercial variants like the Enforcer, the Envoy and the Parker Hale T4 but all I mentioned are rare and pricey.

The DCRA (District of Columbia Rifle Association) did .308 conversions on No4 guns for match use, but they are even less common.

The only Enfield guns on the affordable end in .308 are the Ishapore 2 & 2A1's, which are based on the No1 action and chambered in 762 nato. They can be had for $150 or so.

There are some reworks in .308, such as Gibbs conversions, but these are not authentic military issues....just parts guns built up into shooter's guns.



As for Savage being desirable, that's mostly a value thing (and only in this country). US collectors like them because, well, they're US made. They are not rare, by any means and all of the other makers (Fazakerly, BSA, Longbranch) made their No4's equally well. There are those that say Savage guns were made with more care because their factories weren't being bombed, but in all honesty I've never seen any examples of Savage No4's that were better built, fit and finish wise, than a Longbranch or Faz gun.
Link Posted: 9/16/2005 2:00:01 AM EDT

Originally Posted By BobCole:
These guns are fun to shoot but with rudimentary sights, you won't win any Camp Perry matches.



Ever heard of Bisley? The shooters there dominated the line for a number of years with No4 Enfields, topped off with AJ Parker sights. The .303, out of a No4 action, is well known for long range accuracy and exhibits a peculiar stabilizing effect that makes it exponentially more accurate when it gets moving out around 600 to 800 yards.

Some of the No4 actions in .308, notably the L39A1 were used by the British national teams when they were at their competitive zenith.

Even a stock No4 is a very accurate gun with good ammo and some know-how on the stock. I've got a couple that will hang right there with a K-31 or M38 Swede, and that's saying something.

Link Posted: 9/16/2005 2:03:58 AM EDT
Enfield Replicas

This company makes enfield replicas in .308, and they make some in 7.62 x 39 that use AK mags.
Link Posted: 9/16/2005 3:10:04 AM EDT
A.J. Parker 4/47 target sights? nope never heard of one of those :)










well ,1940 till now is covered
Link Posted: 9/16/2005 4:46:46 AM EDT
Before you buy one check the price on ammo. I thought of getting one from AIM but the ammo in .303 is more than I could afford.
Link Posted: 9/16/2005 8:27:07 AM EDT

Originally Posted By tpsh:
Before you buy one check the price on ammo. I thought of getting one from AIM but the ammo in .303 is more than I could afford.



??

Granted, there's not alot of surplus out there at the moment, but 50's Radway Green is cheap right now.

It's worth remembering that 15 years ago, the price of 8mm was pretty high, very little coming into the country. Now, it's uber cheap. Same thing with .303 in reverse. 10 years ago HXP & South African was all over the place for what we pay for .308 now.

Surplus markets fluxuate...it's best to hoard while it's around, learn to reload, but buy the gun that interests you and figure out ammo later because you can't control what's surplused in, or guarantee it'll always be cheap.
Link Posted: 9/16/2005 8:32:56 AM EDT

Originally Posted By pillbox:
A.J. Parker 4/47 target sights? nope never heard of one of those :)

img228.imageshack.us/img228/9156/0425050269dq.jpg


img64.imageshack.us/img64/7044/200502070047kx.th.jpg


img147.imageshack.us/img147/7241/200502070036ow.th.jpg


well ,1940 till now is covered
img172.imageshack.us/img172/3941/guns040156ym.jpg



Nice collection! I have a DCRA No4 in .308, with AJ Parkers on it...very nice sights!

I'm especially envious of the SA-80...I've shot one and it was very nice. Always wanted to get my hands on one.

Since you've made me jealous, I'll send this back atcha....cause I bet you don't have one yet...



It's a '44 BSA No4mkIT, all matching and minty. All brit rifle enthusiasts should have one, or 3, or 6.
Link Posted: 9/16/2005 9:01:14 AM EDT
The Enfield is a great rifle and it is built like a tank. The Ishapore Arsenal in India actually made them in 7.62 for awhile. Mine is a Gibbs Rifle Company conversion of an Ishapore 7.62 Enfield with a 12 round magazine:



I am not sure if Gibbs is in business anymore. I found mine in the used gun rack at the local gun shop and I got it for $280.00 + tax and DROS fee, so $327.00 out the door. That is a little high for an Enfield, but this was the first one I had seen in this configuration and it was exactly what I wanted, so I scooped it right up!

It makes a perfect rifle to carry in your truck or on your ATV.
Link Posted: 9/16/2005 2:55:35 PM EDT
Everybody needs at least one Enfield rifle. The best of the bunch would be the No4Mk1 or Mk ll rifles.

I just voted my No4Mk1 as the battle-rifle-I-would-trust-for-the-rest-of-my-life-if-I-could-have-only-one-rifle in another thread. I'm sure the semi auto guys are flaming me now.
Link Posted: 9/16/2005 4:29:06 PM EDT
I hate to say this word, but the Enfield is one of the only guns I can call gorgeous. Enfield's have always called me, and I personally think they are the best looking wood stocked guns ever made.

Of course you need an Enfield, the question is, do you know it yet.
Link Posted: 9/16/2005 4:35:57 PM EDT
The best ones I've ever seen were released from storage by the British government in 95-96 and sold here for $110.00 each. I bought two and other than a few nicks on the wood from storage they were new . The bores looked like they never had a round through them. They also had the nice long range rear sight on them.
Link Posted: 9/16/2005 7:38:31 PM EDT
Swingset, ya nuked me on that contest...somebody get me a mop, i seem to be drooling
allways wanted a "T".....
Link Posted: 9/16/2005 7:59:53 PM EDT
swingset, do you still think the K31 is more accurate, if you put a mint k31 next to a mint Mk4?
Link Posted: 9/16/2005 11:14:07 PM EDT
Your question is NOT a legitimate one!!! NEED should NEVER enter into the converstion!!! The only legitimate question you should ask is Do I WANT an Enfield.
I don't know why you would - I have a couple (Nr 1 Mk III & Nr 4 Mk 1) and am not terribly impressed, but then I guess I'm a K 43 & Garand type guy.
Sarge
Link Posted: 9/18/2005 9:48:31 AM EDT
Link Posted: 9/18/2005 10:18:12 AM EDT
yes
Link Posted: 9/18/2005 1:15:38 PM EDT

Originally Posted By MauserMark:
swingset, do you still think the K31 is more accurate, if you put a mint k31 next to a mint Mk4?



On average, the K-31's are much more accurate. They were strictly made, using only the best materials in 2 plants, under controlled and peaceful conditions, they were tailor made for a single ammunition and load, and that ammunition is nearly match grade.

The No4 CAN be as accurate, but its not as commonplace to see a MOA Enfield. I have No4's that are nearly new, and with a good handload will hang with a K31, but then I have some No4's that shoot minute of basketball....because of bedding and barrel issues.

It's also worth remembering when you compare the K-31 to ANY service rifle that the soldier who was issued that rifle was responsible for its condition. If it was rusty or the bore inspection showed abnormal wear from neglect, the SOLDIER paid for it! So, you can imagine how good the bore conditions stayed on K31's. Not so with an Enfield or many other battle rifles. Many of the Enfields you encounter have been through some wear and tear and a whole lot of them have been rebuilt during their lives. I have a 1909 LSA No1 that has evidence of at least 5 rearsenals! And, miraculously, it still shoots good.


Originally Posted By XM21Nick:
The best ones I've ever seen were released from storage by the British government in 95-96 and sold here for $110.00 each. I bought two and other than a few nicks on the wood from storage they were new . The bores looked like they never had a round through them. They also had the nice long range rear sight on them.



Those were the famous "Irish Contract" Fazakerly rifles. They were originally ordered by the Irish government, but unrest in Northern Island forced the MOD to cancel the contract, and they were put into stores around 1956 and sold in the early 90's. They are truly "new" Enfields, and were the last of the British built No4's....1956 being the last official year of production.

India continued Enfield production of the No1 clear up into the late 80's, believe it or not.

Here's my 1955 Fazakerly, originally "in the wrap":



You're right, they are pretty!
Link Posted: 9/19/2005 4:11:11 AM EDT
You fellas just reminded me I need to find a couple of No4s. Like all military surplus guns, get one while you can, they ain't making no more!



Link Posted: 9/19/2005 6:06:47 AM EDT

Originally Posted By swingset:

Originally Posted By tpsh:
Before you buy one check the price on ammo. I thought of getting one from AIM but the ammo in .303 is more than I could afford.



??

Granted, there's not alot of surplus out there at the moment, but 50's Radway Green is cheap right now.

It's worth remembering that 15 years ago, the price of 8mm was pretty high, very little coming into the country. Now, it's uber cheap. Same thing with .303 in reverse. 10 years ago HXP & South African was all over the place for what we pay for .308 now.

Surplus markets fluxuate...it's best to hoard while it's around, learn to reload, but buy the gun that interests you and figure out ammo later because you can't control what's surplused in, or guarantee it'll always be cheap.



I want some.

Who has it in stock?
Link Posted: 9/20/2005 3:52:21 AM EDT
I love my Enfield! I look at it as owning a little piece of history! That said, I would avoid the N0. 5 Jungle Carbine unless you like a rifle with a "robust" recoil.

Regards,
Gary
Link Posted: 9/24/2005 12:35:05 AM EDT
YES!!!
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