I have a 14in contender thats chambered for a wildcat round,that is a 445 supermag necked done to .41. It is an extremly accurate and powerfull round, as i have taken deer out to 180yards with it. My problem is after 3-4 loads on the case a ring devolps around the middle of the case, which after 1-2 more loads ends in a split. i have been reloading for 15yrs, but mostly revolers and rifles, this is my first conteder. Is thie normal for a T.C. or is it a sizing issue?

Quoted: I have a 14in contender thats chambered for a wildcat round,that is a 445 supermag necked done to .41. It is an extremly accurate and powerfull round, as i have taken deer out to 180yards with it. My problem is after 3-4 loads on the case a ring devolps around the middle of the case, which after 1-2 more loads ends in a split. i have been reloading for 15yrs, but mostly revolers and rifles, this is my first conteder. Is thie normal for a T.C. or is it a sizing issue?

Cases have a lifespan.  It could be just that round is hard on cases, but it almost sounds to me as if you are moving the should back, the brass is stretching & eventually failings.

Thats kinds what I was thinking, it just seems odd that they all fail at the exact same spot. The load is 35grns of ww296 with a 210grn speer gold dot. That load averages around 2350, and will put 3 shot at 100yards in less than 2in, usally 1.5-1.75.

Quoted: Thats kinds what I was thinking, it just seems odd that they all fail at the exact same spot. The load is 35grns of ww296 with a 210grn speer gold dot. That load averages around 2350, and will put 3 shot at 100yards in less than 2in, usally 1.5-1.75.

It's easy enough to check.  Take a fired case, and a sized case. Compare the length at the shoulder.  If the fired case is longer, adjust your sizing die so you're not moving the shoulder back.

.445 Supermag is a .44 Mag lenghtened a bit.  As a rimmed case, it headspaces on the thickness of the rim.  Since your wildcat is also a bottlenecked case, the only way for such a split to happen is for the shoulder to be set-back too far.

I've had the same thing happen in my .22 Hornet which also headspaces on the rim.  Backing off the sizing die stopped this problem.  

Being a wildcat, check the chamber dimensions by making a chamber cast (Cerrosafe, Brownells) and compare with one made from the sizing die.  I bet the die is designed for use with a revolver.  Bottlenecked cases in revolvers tend to blow the shoulder forward so sizing dies are designed to push the shoulder back more, otherwise chambering issues arise.

Back off the sizing die.

Thanks guys I will back off the sizing die and go from there. I had thought abt backing off so that it just basically sizes the neck and just leavr the shoulder fireformed. I have another cat that is a 44 necked down 2 .41 that is in a redhawk haven't had any problems out of it, which made me think it was a contender thing.

Your Contender's chamber is not your Redhawk's chamber.

This is the precise reason why I'm against case gauges. Sole reliance on a case gauge will eventually lead to something like this, except a modern high power round will wreak more havoc due to the higher pressures.

I know the contender and redhawk are different, but they are both bottleneck cases formed the same way, one is longer than the other. This being my first single shot pistol, i didn't know if this was normal for contenders with bottlenecked rounds. Again thanks for all the help will load sum more tonight and play around with the sizing die and see what i get.

Hi jay,

Contenders are extremely picky about headpace.  It is sounding like you are re-sizing too much.

Casisc Contender procedure is to take a full load fired case, back the size die out, run the case up & lower the die to touch the case.  Then begin lowering the die in 1/16th of a turn steps trying the case in your gun after each step.  When the receiver/bbl fully locks up with a firm closing action (moderate force), your die/headspace is properly set.

If your contender closes too easy, you have a chance of excessive headspace but it should not take excessive pressure to close the action because then you are forcing the under headspaced cartridge into the chamber.  Just a good firm closing action, not a massive slam it shut action.

With the proper headspace, your cart life should go up to a more reasonable number and accuracy should show improvement too.

MLG

Thanks mlg, will give it a try tonight. This is my first contender, and it didnt take me long to figure the are alot more picky the my other handguns.

Quoted: I know the contender and redhawk are different, but they are both bottleneck cases formed the same way, one is longer than the other. This being my first single shot pistol, i didn't know if this was normal for contenders with bottlenecked rounds. Again thanks for all the help will load sum more tonight and play around with the sizing die and see what i get.

You miss the point.

You can induce case head seperation by as little as .005" in headspace error. Even two identical firearms made by the same person may have a .005" difference in headspace. It's all about QC.

See, everything has tolerances. Your chamber, your reamer, your headspace gauges, and your sizing die are subject to toleramces. You can't assume that any old sizing die will size correctly for your chamber without proper adjustment. Some may, others may not.

Just size your brass enough so you just bump the shoulder back slightly.
I use graphite used for lubricating door locks to "soot" the case.
This should increase your case life.
Good Luck.

Quoted: Hi jay, Contenders are extremely picky about headpace.  It is sounding like you are re-sizing too much. Casisc Contender procedure is to take a full load fired case, back the size die out, run the case up & lower the die to touch the case.  Then begin lowering the die in 1/16th of a turn steps trying the case in your gun after each step.  When the receiver/bbl fully locks up with a firm closing action (moderate force), your die/headspace is properly set. If your contender closes too easy, you have a chance of excessive headspace but it should not take excessive pressure to close the action because then you are forcing the under headspaced cartridge into the chamber.  Just a good firm closing action, not a massive slam it shut action. With the proper headspace, your cart life should go up to a more reasonable number and accuracy should show improvement too. MLG

This is preaty much right. When you form cases you do it a little at a time so the shoulder comes in contact with the forward part of the chamber. In contenders, unlike other guns, rimmed cases do not headspace on the rim. They headspace on the shoulder. This is why you adjust your sizing die down a little at a time. Your cases must fit your chamber.

And, yes I have a contender. In .357 herrett.

jaytee450:

You already have a headspace guage and may or may not know it.  What I mean is that you can remove the barrel from the frame, remove the extractor, insert a fired case in the chamber and measure how far the case protrudes from the barrel using a caliper.  Set the die by trial and error til this measurement is one or two thousandths less.

With the barrel on the frame you might be able to use a feeler guage to measure the barrel-to-frame gap and get an idea of how much your resized case can hang out of the chamber.  It probably needs to be less than the gap measurement  to function the action properly.  If you don't have feeler guages, you can get by with aluminum foil which is usually .003" thick.  Close the action and barrel on one piece of foil.  If the foil binds the gap is probably less than .003".  If the foil pulls out close the action on two pieces of foil.  If the two pieces of foil binds, the gap is somewhere between .003"-.006".  I think you can see the idea here.

I've found TC firearms to have loose chambers compared to my other firearms.  I've been unable to get brass fired in my friends TC barrels to size properly to fit in my non-TC firearms.  

This isn't a problem if you re-use in a TC, unless you're resizing too much.

Wow! thankd for all the replies, right now the shell holder is about .015 from the bottom of the die. My cases slide in and out of the gun pretty easy now after firing, im not using a max load, about 1grn under, Last night I backed the die all the way out and ran a case in and started to adjust the die down. Thats how i got the .015 gap betweem the shellholder and the die. Loaded 10 rounds and bout to go out and make sum noise. Btw this is a rechamber 41mag barrel by Gary Reeder. The origianal chamber was so tight the only thing that would close on was factory ammo, but i bought the barrel for this rechambering so i wasn,t worried about that. Gary does great work as i have 2 of his wildcats, and planning to get more. Will give an aar later. Thankds guys!!