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Posted: 12/12/2001 4:45:10 PM EDT
When the Carbon 15 first came out everyone I saw (about 4) were real peices of junk. Not a one of them would eat a mere 20rd mag w/o many failures. Question is ; Are the rifles they are putting out today any better? I am looking for input from buyers/owners that have aquired in the last year or so. The price has sure come down and they ARE so damm lite. Would make a great first AR for my 5 year old daugther. Thanks for all replys.
Link Posted: 12/12/2001 5:41:12 PM EDT
Link Posted: 12/12/2001 6:33:41 PM EDT
It is a hit and miss with the Carbon.
Link Posted: 12/12/2001 7:50:47 PM EDT
In the November issue of Gun Tests they LOVED the Carbon 15 ("Once they try one, we believe many shooters will find the Carbon 15 to be their first choice in an AR-15"). Then for the December issue where they named the Guns Of The Year there are pictures of it on the cover and on the front page of the article but no mention of it anywhere. According to Todd Woodard due to all the mail they received concerning the problems with this gun they pulled it from the list. However the "artwork" was already submitted and it was too late to change.

A few months ago I considered buying one of these but after spending about 10 minutes in the Professional Ordinance section of the Industry Forum on this site, I decided against it. It is a great concept unfortunately due to design or production problems it is hit and miss, mostly miss, as to whether or not it will work.
Link Posted: 12/12/2001 11:06:50 PM EDT
Don't do it man.
Link Posted: 12/13/2001 12:27:50 AM EDT
Charcoal 15
Link Posted: 12/13/2001 2:24:31 AM EDT
Forgive me. I am deeply sorry. I hate to tell you this. No. I am not a lier. No. I am not affiliated with Pro. Ord. Co. Yes I own a Carbon 15 type 97 rifle with quick connect muzzle brake, fluted barrel, weaver rail, and has sling package, and I want to get quick connect threaded muzzle adapter so I can screw any dam thing I want on the adapter and slap it on the barrel. NOW listen closely..... IT WORKS VERY RELIABLY. Don't ask me why, maybe I got a lemon, and thats just what happened. Or maybe I only shoot brass ammo in it, or maybe I use ONLY USGI mags in it, or maybe I keep it clean and lubed, or maybe I keep this VERY LIGHT gun tight against my shoulder so it can cycle properly. I believe that the following practices probably help the function of the rifle but I have learned that this gun hates 223 it will jam unless you shoot HOT ammo like SA and m193, also it hated Orlites so I only use USGI or Thermolds. So after over 2000 rds I am quite happy, And I know alot of other owners who are happy too. Sorry to be so positive but thats the way it is.
Link Posted: 12/13/2001 5:14:49 AM EDT
"Ya gotta ask yourself a question. Do ya feel lucky?"

I know one guy personally who bought one of these. It broke. A few people have had good luck. Even if you liked the rifle I would be wary of buying it because the resale on it would be tough if you later changed your mind.
Link Posted: 12/13/2001 7:34:03 AM EDT
No I don't work for ProOrd, and yes I am telling the truth but I have a C-17/97s that I love. It's been 100% percent reliable since it came out of the box. It was mainly their early guns that were so god awful I think.

Then again you do hear all those horror stories about them so I guess it's just either making sure you get a new production gun or luck of the draw.
Link Posted: 12/13/2001 8:15:42 AM EDT
I vote no go, I have no confidence in the company or their guns.
Link Posted: 12/13/2001 9:31:24 AM EDT
I had one. Don't do it.
Link Posted: 12/13/2001 8:58:01 PM EDT
Well, here I post again...

Last year, I had a type 21 rifle...(HAD)
To make a long story short, I couldn't get it to function AT ALL...First 2 mags were OK, after that, it never worked right again...
Prof.Ord. wanted me to ship it to them for repair, but I was still new to AR's and didn't want to fool with it, so I took it back to my dealer for store credit...(Got an AK instead)

I figured I must have just gotten a lemon, so a few months ago I decided to try them again...
This time I got a type 97 pistol...
I went right to the range after leaving the gunstore...

WooHoo!!!, I'm excited to shoot this badass looking pistol!!
I loaded the 30 round Thermold with Q3131A, and was ready for action...

2 shots later, I was packing it back in the box to go home...
The bolt snapped in two, after ONLY 2 SHOTS !!!
This was a BRAND NEW GUN !!!
I E-mailed POI asking for a replacement bolt, but they wanted the whole upper receiver AND all my warranty paperwork...
I replied to thier response with a picture of the broken bolt, and an angry commentary...
They again wanted my personal info on their warranty card, accompanied by the broken bolt...

I said forget it, I'll fix it myself, and I'll NEVER buy another POI product...

I modified a standard USGI bolt, opened up the ejection port to the same size as my Bushmaster, polished and de-burred the feed ramps and locking lugs on the barrel extension, radiused and polished the hammer ramp, for less drag on the carrier, and narrowed the trigger at it's pivot points, because it was sticking in the lower receiver... ALSO, the mag well is about .060" larger (front to rear) than my Bushmaster...This allows the USGI mags to rock back & forth in the receiver, causing the rounds to jam into the bottom of the barrel extension where it meets the top forward edge of the mag...
The ONLY mag that works in this gun is the Thermold that came with it...


After many hours of fooling with this thing, it runs much better, but I still wouldn't trust my life to it...

I have heard of other guys that never had any troubles with them, but for me, 2 for 2 is enough...

Link Posted: 12/14/2001 7:52:17 AM EDT
Thanks everyone for your replys. Message Received !!
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