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Posted: 12/29/2013 3:20:06 PM EDT
Doing my first form 1 and want to make sure I have everything done correctly.

For the firearm this is the information I have entered:



For the documentation I have uploaded my Declaration and my First Amendment (which lists trustees).  Do I need to upload an Assignment sheet?

I just want to get this right the first time.
Link Posted: 12/29/2013 3:40:47 PM EDT
I always use Caliber for unit of measure.

They need your whole trust. So schedule A, B, etc.
Link Posted: 12/29/2013 3:41:51 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By carbonfly:
I always use Caliber for unit of measure.

They need your whole trust. So schedule A, B, etc.
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Thanks.  I don't have any schedules so I'm not sure what you mean there.
Link Posted: 12/29/2013 3:42:48 PM EDT
Caliber would be correct if he chose .223 instead of 5.56.
Link Posted: 12/29/2013 3:44:07 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By BigWaylon:
Caliber would be correct if he chose .223 instead of 5.56.
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I guess, but my form got approved when using caliber for 5.56.
Link Posted: 12/29/2013 3:44:12 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By nismofun:


Thanks.  I don't have any schedules so I'm not sure what you mean there.
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Originally Posted By nismofun:
Originally Posted By carbonfly:
I always use Caliber for unit of measure.

They need your whole trust. So schedule A, B, etc.


Thanks.  I don't have any schedules so I'm not sure what you mean there.



In most cases you have to have a schedule. Most states don't allow a trust to be created empty, so most people start with $1, or the $200 to be used as stamp, etc.
Link Posted: 12/29/2013 3:49:56 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By BigWaylon:
Caliber would be correct if he chose .223 instead of 5.56.
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This
Link Posted: 12/29/2013 3:50:01 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By BigWaylon:
In most cases you have to have a schedule. Most states don't allow a trust to be created empty, so most people start with $1, or the $200 to be used as stamp, etc.
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It's mentioned in the declaration of a $10 transfer to the trustee, but nothing further.
Link Posted: 12/29/2013 3:50:38 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By carbonfly:

I guess, but my form got approved when using caliber for 5.56.
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Originally Posted By carbonfly:
Originally Posted By BigWaylon:
Caliber would be correct if he chose .223 instead of 5.56.

I guess, but my form got approved when using caliber for 5.56.



For whatever reason I don't think they are that picky on this particular matter. I could be wrong though.
Link Posted: 12/29/2013 3:53:00 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/29/2013 3:57:17 PM EDT by GreenGoose]
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Originally Posted By carbonfly:
I always use Caliber for unit of measure.

They need your whole trust. So schedule A, B, etc.
View Quote


I use what is listed on the lower unless it says 'Multi' then you should pick a caliber.  My Noveske lowers all say 5.56 mm so that's what my Form 1's state. I chose MM for unit of measure and it was approved.  
Link Posted: 12/29/2013 4:11:51 PM EDT
5.56 has worked for me a couple times now
Link Posted: 12/30/2013 8:28:12 AM EDT
Caliber does not matter as long as one is listed. "Multi" is not acceptable, 5.56mm or .223 is fine. I used 5.56x45mm for my last one.
Link Posted: 12/31/2013 3:08:33 AM EDT
5.56mm is fine and you do NOT need the schedule A
Link Posted: 12/31/2013 4:16:12 AM EDT
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Originally Posted By JesseCJC:
5.56mm is fine and you do NOT need the schedule A
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Yes you do. If it's part of the trust then you need it. They have kicked back forms before for not having schedule A.
Link Posted: 12/31/2013 8:08:01 AM EDT
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Originally Posted By JesseCJC:
5.56mm is fine and you do NOT need the schedule A
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Absolutely wrong.  Send everything including the Schedule A.
Link Posted: 12/31/2013 2:16:18 PM EDT
Thanks for all the help.

I'll be paying when I get home to my plastic.

Happy New Year's.
Link Posted: 1/1/2014 8:04:08 AM EDT
If your trust has a Schedule A, B, or any other schedules, it needs to be included.  Many trusts use Schedule A as a list of all the trust property.  However, there's no legal requirement to do things this way, and doing so would constitute de facto registration of all your non-NFA guns if you put them in the trust (since you're then sending that list to ATF).  David Goldman's "Gun Trusts" do not use schedules for the trust property--he instead gives you an assignment page to fill out.  If you're using one of his trusts, or another following the same model, he recommends you fill out the assignment page for the single item you're applying for, and including that page as part of the trust documents with your Form 1/4 filing.  Even that is kind of legally silly, but apparently ATF wants to see something stating that the trust owns the item.
Link Posted: 1/1/2014 8:20:01 AM EDT
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Originally Posted By danb35:
If your trust has a Schedule A, B, or any other schedules, it needs to be included.  Many trusts use Schedule A as a list of all the trust property.  However, there's no legal requirement to do things this way, and doing so would constitute de facto registration of all your non-NFA guns if you put them in the trust (since you're then sending that list to ATF).  David Goldman's "Gun Trusts" do not use schedules for the trust property--he instead gives you an assignment page to fill out.  If you're using one of his trusts, or another following the same model, he recommends you fill out the assignment page for the single item you're applying for, and including that page as part of the trust documents with your Form 1/4 filing.  Even that is kind of legally silly, but apparently ATF wants to see something stating that the trust owns the item.
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So either way it's a de facto registry. Wether you give the whole list on schedule A or one at a time on the list of assets with each application. They still have a list of every NFA item you own.
Link Posted: 1/2/2014 10:04:18 AM EDT
The NFA registry is by law.  The difference between using individual assignment sheets to transfer items to the trust, and listing all the trust assets on a schedule (whether that's called "Schedule A" or something else) arises if you're adding Title I (non-NFA) firearms to the trust.  If you use a Schedule A, and list your Title I guns on it, ATF is going to get a list of all your Title I guns the next time you apply for an NFA transfer.  They'll get this because Schedule A is part of the trust, and must therefore be included as part of the trust documents with your Form 1/4.

If you use assignment sheets to transfer items to your trust, those pages aren't part of your trust.  Therefore, they don't all have to be sent in to ATF when you file a Form 1/4--you only send in the sheet for the item you're applying for.  They thus never need to see the assignment pages for your Title I firearms (or anything else you might put in the trust).  That's the de facto registry that can be avoided.
Link Posted: 1/2/2014 3:55:50 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By GreenGoose:


Absolutely wrong.  Send everything including the Schedule A.
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Originally Posted By GreenGoose:
Originally Posted By JesseCJC:
5.56mm is fine and you do NOT need the schedule A


Absolutely wrong.  Send everything including the Schedule A.


If your trust is done correctly, you absolutely do not need to include the schedule A.
http://www.myguntrust.com/schedule-a-question.html
Link Posted: 1/2/2014 4:00:07 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By JesseCJC:


If your trust is done correctly, you absolutely do not need to include the schedule A.
http://www.myguntrust.com/schedule-a-question.html
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Originally Posted By JesseCJC:
Originally Posted By GreenGoose:
Originally Posted By JesseCJC:
5.56mm is fine and you do NOT need the schedule A


Absolutely wrong.  Send everything including the Schedule A.


If your trust is done correctly, you absolutely do not need to include the schedule A.
http://www.myguntrust.com/schedule-a-question.html

Wrong again. If the trust has a schedule A, then it MUST be included. That link you attached is basically talking about making a trust without a schedule A. If there is no schedule A then there is nothing to attach with the trust.
Link Posted: 1/2/2014 4:20:34 PM EDT
well then I have provided the wrong information and I apologize for the confusion.
Link Posted: 1/23/2014 3:55:16 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/23/2014 5:43:54 PM EDT by Willi6]
In the "State Why You Intend to Make Firearm" box, I state "ANY LAWFUL PURPOSE."  In the "Caliber" and "Unit of Measure" box, I type in the information engraved on the receiver by the manufacturer.
Link Posted: 1/23/2014 5:07:27 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By Willi6:
In the "Caliber" and "Unit of Measure" box, I type in the information engraved on the the receiver by the manufacturer.
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That doesn't work so well when the manufacturer has engraved "MULTI" on the receiver.
Link Posted: 1/23/2014 6:14:16 PM EDT
If your trust references a Schedule you must include it. The schedule does not however have to include everything currently in its inventory. Mine says simply it contains $10.
This is good enough for a valid trust. Although no trust will fail for want of a trustee, a valid trust must have a corpus (something in it) as well as have a trustee who is not the sole beneficiary.
Link Posted: 1/23/2014 6:19:26 PM EDT
If so, in the "Caliber" and "Unit of Measure" box, I type in the information engraved on the barrel by the manufacturer or listed in the manufacturer's specifications for the barrel intended to be used.

By the way, one of my clients sent me a copy of an ATF Form 1 tax stamp, which was filed on September 30, 2013, and which issued on January 13, 2014.  The lower receiver was engraved "MULTI," the "Caliber" box on eForms allowed the entry of "MULTI," and the client attached a photograph of the lower receiver illustrating the engraving of "MULTI" on the lower receiver.  The approved ATF tax stamp states "MULTI."  This is probably an anomaly, because I have also seen ATF examiner's reject the same applications and require the applicant to select a specific caliber.
Link Posted: 1/23/2014 6:48:23 PM EDT
I advise my clients to provide a complete, accurate copy of the NFA gun trust, which includes all amendments (if any) and all schedules (if any), when they submit a Form 1 or Form 4 application to the ATF.  On both ATF Form 1 and ATF Form 4, an applicant must declare under penalty of perjury that the applicant has examined the application, including accompanying documents (i.e, the NFA gun trust), and that to the best of the applicant's knowledge and belief, the application is true, accurate, and complete.  I would not advise any applicant to commit perjury by knowingly filing an incomplete or outdated Schedule A.
Link Posted: 1/26/2014 9:13:03 AM EDT
I have just AR-15 listed on mine regardless of what unique model number may be on side of receiver.
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