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Posted: 8/3/2016 12:33:01 PM EDT
hey everyone, so i have a question regarding transfer of firearm (ar15 lowers) from California Resident to Arizona Resident (the lowers are leaving Cali and going to Arizona



may seem stupid but am I able to do a person to person transfer in AZ. The person giving them to me is a friend and I am AZ resident with CCW (so obvi not a felon) and just do a person to person transfer.




i guess im just not sure if state to state matters with gifting, I know you cant sell to out of state resident in your state but if they come to you can they just give them to you in your state?




one other thing is im actually im also a resident of Cali as well. As dumb as it is if we did the transfer in Cali it would require 10 day wait and FFL because cali and stupid laws. Even though I have a AZ and CA CCW as well as own many long guns. He is just giving me the lowers, no sale involved.






Link Posted: 8/3/2016 12:53:36 PM EDT
[#1]
I wouldn't be asking here.  

Proper way is to ship to a dealer and transfer.  Find a discount dealer.  I use one that does $15 for first and $5 for each one after.  

I also have friends in CA.  I won't dance around the Federal laws.
Link Posted: 8/3/2016 4:38:33 PM EDT
[#2]
It doesn't matter that it's a gift instead of a sale. The transfer rules are the same. It's still legally a transfer.











A transfer between two individuals residing in different states requires a recipient FFL to conduct the transfer within the transferee's (receiving party's) state. If you both reside in CA you must follow CA laws regarding a FTF transfer. I cannot answer your question regarding two people residing in the same state conducting a FTF transfer while standing in another state. That sounds like interstate commerce to me though, so I'm pretty sure you're back in FFL territory.





 
 
 
 
Link Posted: 8/4/2016 12:42:09 PM EDT
[#3]
Quoted:
hey everyone, so i have a question regarding transfer of firearm (ar15 lowers) from California Resident to Arizona Resident (the lowers are leaving Cali and going to Arizona
View Quote

An FFL in AZ will need to transfer them to the AZ resident; there is no "Friends and Family" exception to the 1968 GCA.
Link Posted: 8/4/2016 1:27:31 PM EDT
[#4]
Quoted:
I wouldn't be asking here.  

Proper way is to ship to a dealer and transfer.  Find a discount dealer.  I use one that does $15 for first and $5 for each one after.  
View Quote


Asking here is where you get the correct answer. There is no "proper way" There are multiple legal ways, as Bubbles pointed out.
Link Posted: 8/19/2016 3:21:02 AM EDT
[#5]
Not that I condone this in any way but I'm just curious.

If the op just brought over the lowers to AZ and let's say did a private party transfer without an FFL like we are allowed to in AZ (I mean as in the seller brought in the lowers, became an AZ resident and the did a private ftf)

Is that illegal in someway?

Let's say the seller just did a random private ftf to an az resident. No ids checked or anything. How is this like traced to be illegal?

I know the laws in ca which is pretty much FFL needed for any damn transfer.

I don't mean to hijack your thread OP just thought maybe could be chimed in here also.
Link Posted: 8/19/2016 4:13:42 AM EDT
[#6]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Not that I condone this in any way but I'm just curious.

If the op just brought over the lowers to AZ and let's say did a private party transfer without an FFL like we are allowed to in AZ (I mean as in the seller brought in the lowers, became an AZ resident and the did a private ftf)

Is that illegal in someway?

Let's say the seller just did a random private ftf to an az resident. No ids checked or anything. How is this like traced to be illegal?

I know the laws in ca which is pretty much FFL needed for any damn transfer.

I don't mean to hijack your thread OP just thought maybe could be chimed in here also.
View Quote

Yes it's illegal. You can only do person to person transfers if both parties are residents of the same state and you still have to comply with state law as well.

Transferor takes them to ffl and ffl transfers them to transferee. AR lowers can only be picked up in your state of residence.
Link Posted: 8/19/2016 3:58:45 PM EDT
[#7]
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Quoted:

Yes it's illegal. You can only do person to person transfers if both parties are residents of the same state and you still have to comply with state law as well.

Transferor takes them to ffl and ffl transfers them to transferee. AR lowers can only be picked up in your state of residence.
View Quote View All Quotes
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Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Quoted:
Not that I condone this in any way but I'm just curious.

If the op just brought over the lowers to AZ and let's say did a private party transfer without an FFL like we are allowed to in AZ (I mean as in the seller brought in the lowers, became an AZ resident and the did a private ftf)

Is that illegal in someway?

Let's say the seller just did a random private ftf to an az resident. No ids checked or anything. How is this like traced to be illegal?

I know the laws in ca which is pretty much FFL needed for any damn transfer.

I don't mean to hijack your thread OP just thought maybe could be chimed in here also.

Yes it's illegal. You can only do person to person transfers if both parties are residents of the same state and you still have to comply with state law as well.

Transferor takes them to ffl and ffl transfers them to transferee. AR lowers can only be picked up in your state of residence.



I understand the law.

My question was more geared toward like HOW is it tracked to be an illegal transfer etc?
Sorry shoulda been more clear.

I was just saying suppose some out of state fool sells someone in AZ face to face and no one checks ID. How can it be found out down the line?

I only ask because of the few person to person transfers I've done in AZ I've always got a bill of sale to protect myself. (AZ private transfers don't require anything really just that the seller and buyer confirm each other are AZ residents )

But there was so many times when the seller flat out refused and actually got mad I asked for one.

Honestly I understand it's not required but I MUST protect myself and lotta times your "word " don't mean shit  

I'm sure several people will say I'm an asshole for wanting a bill of sale but I don't care. My freedom and my family come first.
Link Posted: 8/19/2016 4:14:44 PM EDT
[#8]
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Quoted:
I'm sure several people will say I'm an asshole for wanting a bill of sale but I don't care. My freedom and my family come first.
View Quote


No you are just misguided and a victim of bad info.

BOS has never protected anyone, anywhere, ever, but many folks have gone to jail because of having a BOS (or some other form of receipt). We have written on this and documented many of these cases on this forum over the years.
Link Posted: 8/19/2016 11:39:32 PM EDT
[#9]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:


No you are just misguided and a victim of bad info.

BOS has never protected anyone, anywhere, ever, but many folks have gone to jail because of having a BOS (or some other form of receipt). We have written on this and documented many of these cases on this forum over the years.
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Quoted:
I'm sure several people will say I'm an asshole for wanting a bill of sale but I don't care. My freedom and my family come first.


No you are just misguided and a victim of bad info.

BOS has never protected anyone, anywhere, ever, but many folks have gone to jail because of having a BOS (or some other form of receipt). We have written on this and documented many of these cases on this forum over the years.



Care to explain?

If I have an actual bill of sale from someone I bought a firearm from ftf and that firearm turns out to be stolen or used in a crime atleast I have SOME kind of information on the asshole who duped me.

Please tell me how someone with w bill of sale (buyer) went to jail over having a receipt as opposed to NOT having one.

Isn't having a paper trail on where you got it and when better than having NOTHING and let's say you get caught in someway with a dirty gun then it's just your word on where you got it and when.

Keep in mind this is FTF in AZ that requires almost nothing really.

Edit.... I tried searching on what you posted but I haven't found anything.
Link Posted: 8/19/2016 11:48:21 PM EDT
[#10]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:



Care to explain?

If I have an actual bill of sale from someone I bought a firearm from ftf and that firearm turns out to be stolen or used in a crime atleast I have SOME kind of information on the asshole who duped me.

Please tell me how someone with w bill of sale (buyer) went to jail over having a receipt as opposed to NOT having one.

Isn't having a paper trail on where you got it and when better than having NOTHING and let's say you get caught in someway with a dirty gun then it's just your word on where you got it and when.

Keep in mind this is FTF in AZ that requires almost nothing really.

Edit.... I tried searching on what you posted but I haven't found anything.
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
I'm sure several people will say I'm an asshole for wanting a bill of sale but I don't care. My freedom and my family come first.


No you are just misguided and a victim of bad info.

BOS has never protected anyone, anywhere, ever, but many folks have gone to jail because of having a BOS (or some other form of receipt). We have written on this and documented many of these cases on this forum over the years.



Care to explain?

If I have an actual bill of sale from someone I bought a firearm from ftf and that firearm turns out to be stolen or used in a crime atleast I have SOME kind of information on the asshole who duped me.

Please tell me how someone with w bill of sale (buyer) went to jail over having a receipt as opposed to NOT having one.

Isn't having a paper trail on where you got it and when better than having NOTHING and let's say you get caught in someway with a dirty gun then it's just your word on where you got it and when.

Keep in mind this is FTF in AZ that requires almost nothing really.

Edit.... I tried searching on what you posted but I haven't found anything.

For one if it was a illegal transaction the bill of sale is proof of that
Link Posted: 8/20/2016 3:23:22 PM EDT
[#11]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:

For one if it was a illegal transaction the bill of sale is proof of that
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
I'm sure several people will say I'm an asshole for wanting a bill of sale but I don't care. My freedom and my family come first.


No you are just misguided and a victim of bad info.

BOS has never protected anyone, anywhere, ever, but many folks have gone to jail because of having a BOS (or some other form of receipt). We have written on this and documented many of these cases on this forum over the years.



Care to explain?

If I have an actual bill of sale from someone I bought a firearm from ftf and that firearm turns out to be stolen or used in a crime atleast I have SOME kind of information on the asshole who duped me.

Please tell me how someone with w bill of sale (buyer) went to jail over having a receipt as opposed to NOT having one.

Isn't having a paper trail on where you got it and when better than having NOTHING and let's say you get caught in someway with a dirty gun then it's just your word on where you got it and when.

Keep in mind this is FTF in AZ that requires almost nothing really.

Edit.... I tried searching on what you posted but I haven't found anything.

For one if it was a illegal transaction the bill of sale is proof of that


If you followed the follow and did as its required then how am I liable for it being illegal? If it is indeed illegal atleast I would have the info of the seller. If no bos then it's just my word and that don't go far at all.

If it's illegal(stolen etc) it's damn near impossible unless you go to the police first  to check it.
Stolen guns even show up and pawn shops and then a few days later they are found out to be stolen and the pawn shop has the info on the person who pawned it.

I'm just saying having proof you bought it from someone and didn't steal it etc yourself is better than no proof.


Link Posted: 8/20/2016 4:17:50 PM EDT
[#12]
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Quoted:


If you followed the follow and did as its required then how am I liable for it being illegal? I

View Quote View All Quotes
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Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Quoted:

For one if it was a illegal transaction the bill of sale is proof of that


If you followed the follow and did as its required then how am I liable for it being illegal? I



Well in the Texas case, the buyer was an illegal alien. So the seller had written proof he sold to an illegal alien. While the seller claimed he did not know that, the illegal alien was more than happy to testify the seller knew he was illegal. This was a few years ago in Austin.
Link Posted: 8/20/2016 6:05:26 PM EDT
[#13]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:


If you followed the follow and did as its required then how am I liable for it being illegal? If it is indeed illegal atleast I would have the info of the seller. If no bos then it's just my word and that don't go far at all.

If it's illegal(stolen etc) it's damn near impossible unless you go to the police first  to check it.
Stolen guns even show up and pawn shops and then a few days later they are found out to be stolen and the pawn shop has the info on the person who pawned it.

I'm just saying having proof you bought it from someone and didn't steal it etc yourself is better than no proof.


View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
I'm sure several people will say I'm an asshole for wanting a bill of sale but I don't care. My freedom and my family come first.


No you are just misguided and a victim of bad info.

BOS has never protected anyone, anywhere, ever, but many folks have gone to jail because of having a BOS (or some other form of receipt). We have written on this and documented many of these cases on this forum over the years.



Care to explain?

If I have an actual bill of sale from someone I bought a firearm from ftf and that firearm turns out to be stolen or used in a crime atleast I have SOME kind of information on the asshole who duped me.

Please tell me how someone with w bill of sale (buyer) went to jail over having a receipt as opposed to NOT having one.

Isn't having a paper trail on where you got it and when better than having NOTHING and let's say you get caught in someway with a dirty gun then it's just your word on where you got it and when.

Keep in mind this is FTF in AZ that requires almost nothing really.

Edit.... I tried searching on what you posted but I haven't found anything.

For one if it was a illegal transaction the bill of sale is proof of that


If you followed the follow and did as its required then how am I liable for it being illegal? If it is indeed illegal atleast I would have the info of the seller. If no bos then it's just my word and that don't go far at all.

If it's illegal(stolen etc) it's damn near impossible unless you go to the police first  to check it.
Stolen guns even show up and pawn shops and then a few days later they are found out to be stolen and the pawn shop has the info on the person who pawned it.

I'm just saying having proof you bought it from someone and didn't steal it etc yourself is better than no proof.






Yep!

Your opponent's got nuffin...



Link Posted: 8/21/2016 5:40:32 PM EDT
[#14]
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Quoted:

Well in the Texas case, the buyer was an illegal alien. So the seller had written proof he sold to an illegal alien. While the seller claimed he did not know that, the illegal alien was more than happy to testify the seller knew he was illegal. This was a few years ago in Austin.
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:

For one if it was a illegal transaction the bill of sale is proof of that

If you followed the follow and did as its required then how am I liable for it being illegal?

Well in the Texas case, the buyer was an illegal alien. So the seller had written proof he sold to an illegal alien. While the seller claimed he did not know that, the illegal alien was more than happy to testify the seller knew he was illegal. This was a few years ago in Austin.

So a criminal... lied?  Who woulda thought that would happen.
Link Posted: 8/22/2016 12:05:15 PM EDT
[#15]
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Quoted:

So a criminal... lied?  Who woulda thought that would happen.
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Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:

For one if it was a illegal transaction the bill of sale is proof of that

If you followed the follow and did as its required then how am I liable for it being illegal?

Well in the Texas case, the buyer was an illegal alien. So the seller had written proof he sold to an illegal alien. While the seller claimed he did not know that, the illegal alien was more than happy to testify the seller knew he was illegal. This was a few years ago in Austin.

So a criminal... lied?  Who woulda thought that would happen.



I was talking about buying. Not selling.

Considering private party transfers happen everyday in AZ
Link Posted: 8/22/2016 12:25:38 PM EDT
[#16]
Since OP is an AZ resident (he can buy pistols fromm an AZ ffl), selling to another AZ resident, in AZ, should be fine.

Only qualm, is if the sale is made at the time when OP is an AZ resident, not a special trip to AZ in the middle of his CA residency.
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