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Posted: 7/25/2004 4:08:47 PM EST
[Last Edit: 8/22/2004 5:20:13 PM EST by WolfAR15]
EDIT When I first wrote this it was a hypothetical situtation dreamed up in boredom. I dont see it ever happening and Unless there was no alternative it would be a stupid thing to do. It has been confirmed that my walmart has buck and slugs and the 'trigger locks' are no problem. Still think of this as a hypothetical off the top of my head post. If you were forced into these circumstances (although highly unlikely) which would you use? Shotgun? what type? what type of shotgun ammo? Or would you use a rifle? If then what type, caliber and what type of ammo?

Another interesting question is: Which among the common bird/turkey/trap/skeet loads is the best tactical wise? Granted Buck and slugs would be much better if you were restricted to the types listed above which would be your choice and why? Also feel free to read the original topic below and post on that if you wish.

*************************************­***************
I recently took a Job at WalMart as an ICS (aka daytime stocker) from the hours of 11am to 8pm. Being the type of person that I am I plan ahead of time for every possible problem. From noting all of the exits in a building to carrying extra supplies on my person at all times. As soon as I turn 21 I plan to get a CCW and a handgun. maybe 2 but thats still a few months away so i will be going on the job each day armed with only a knife.

Now generally stores are peaceful places. Especially this walmart in town. But like I said I like to plan for every possible problem. The scenario Im thinking of is a robbery/shooting situation where armed men storm the store shooting at people while im at work. Now most sane people would head for an exit. But I would be heading straight for sporting goods. In this situation id be acting mostly defensive and aggresive only if the situation warranted it. IMHO the best gun for this job in the store is a shotgun. They have several shotguns but out of all of them i have narrowed my choice down to three. A remington 870 (cap 4) a Beretta 390 (cap 3 or 4) and a winchester 1300 (not a defender ) (cap 4 i think)


The 390 is however 20 guage instead of 12 so id probably leave it out and take either the 870 or the 1300. The major question in my mind is Ammo.

Walmart mostely sells birdshot where i live and on occasion will have turkey loads but right now its all birdshot. From handicap and super handicap to trap, skeet and light/heavy target loads. I have always used the kind in the large value packs.

Generally speaking none of this ammo is very "tactical" but i need to find the best of all that would work best in close quarters against an armed assailant.


thanx for any info.



P.S. I own a Mossy 590 and would LOVE to have it in a situation like this but you know how walmart is about stuff like that.
Link Posted: 7/25/2004 4:12:50 PM EST
Link Posted: 7/25/2004 4:18:52 PM EST
Link Posted: 7/25/2004 4:22:11 PM EST
I dont need decaf. its a hobby. Im not paranoid just i like to be prepared. Ive seen the trigger locks. that could be a problem. I dont know if this walmart sells buck and slugs or not. Theres alot of "gun stuff" that they dont have.
Link Posted: 7/25/2004 4:24:36 PM EST
Link Posted: 7/25/2004 5:00:30 PM EST
not tangos at wally world panicing refugees. just think if the world came to an end what place has almost everything you need?
Link Posted: 7/25/2004 5:05:58 PM EST
[Last Edit: 7/25/2004 5:08:15 PM EST by SinistralRifleman]
Link Posted: 7/25/2004 5:21:03 PM EST
The Tangos do use wallmarts. The boxcutter(s) used on at least 1 of the 9-11 skyjackings came from a wallyworld.

Evenso, if I worked there and the SHTF, you best not be standing between me and the back door, else there would be bootprints on your head.

If you have the awareness to the situation and layout you describe, your discription would be of great use to the dynamic entry team sent to stop the BG's. You don't want to end up as the first headless hostage on US soil.
Link Posted: 7/25/2004 5:31:02 PM EST
If the SHTF get the fuck otta there dont try to be a hero and get yourself killed
1
Link Posted: 7/25/2004 6:59:54 PM EST
[Last Edit: 7/25/2004 7:01:59 PM EST by shotgun]
Ditto Hydroshok

But he asked what if: They should have buck and slugs my man. Maybe behind the counter? If not go for the heaviest 3 inch shot you can find. Of course you may have to aim for a heavily vascular area. Groin and head/neck due to the shallow wound of bird shot.

Then again...ditto Hydroshok! (Of course with better spelling.)
Link Posted: 7/25/2004 9:33:13 PM EST
Let me get this straight,

Your working minimal wage, people come in to rob the store, and your planning on having a fire fight with them in the store.

First off, Wal-Mart is going to fire you for breaching their personnel rules, which is that you singly jeopardized not only yourself, but others.

Next will be the lawsuits from the traumatized people that were in the store (the reason that you were fired in the first place so Wal-Mart can cover there own ass).

If anyone was harmed during the robbery, then you will face charges since your action lead to it (you were never hired as security).

Bottom line is anyone ever robs the store; get the hell out of there. If you can’t and are confronted by them, be polite and offer to carry the cash register to their car. Remember, the store has it’s own security personal, and if there making tracks out the back door, then way the hell are you not right behind them.


IIRQ, Where the fuck do you guys come up with some of your ideas, and don't you stop to think them threw?
Link Posted: 7/26/2004 5:02:36 AM EST
Well, the internet is an inviting place for EVERYONE!

Seriously, don't worry about EOTWAWKI in regards to your workplace. Unless your LE (and even hen if your off duty prob best to not act.....) GET AWAY!! You could get lost quickly in all those aisles. A short sprint and you'd be darned near impossible to locate especially when they ain't looking for you....unless you were a Navy SEAL or CIA previously and took down their leader, or brother, or best friend....oh wait. Thats a movie premise.
Link Posted: 7/26/2004 8:19:41 AM EST
there sure is alot of hostility here. And for no reason. Im not seeing where all of it is coming from. I dont work minimum wage and i consider my job to be better than alot of others. My dad works at an assebly plant i.e. what most people would consider a REAL job. yet i have a 401K, he doesnt. I have stock options, he doesnt. you want me to go on?

I was a boy scout so naturally im in a world all my own as far as "what if?" In the case of a shooting/robbery I probably WOULD haul ass out an exit. But im thinking of the what if of "what if all of the exits are guarded? What if this is a killing spree?" Once again I dont want to be a "hero" or anything. I couldnt care less about that crap. I dont want to "save the store" or anything like that. Im thinking in the worst case scenario that i hope NEVER happens.

That is the case where you can either run and hide and hope to God you can get to safety without being shot or you can stand and fight. And frankly when it comes to my life id sure as hell rather take a gun and defend myself and deal with wallyworld later than to be all PC about it and get killed or maimed.

This isnt a "mall ninja" thread. I dont want golf carts and automatic weapons etc. As far as i can remember this walmart has NEVER even been robbed nor has anyone attempted it. But I have found out the hard way that in life there is ALWAYS a first time for everything.


If you want to help me out, then fine. Do it. But check your attitude at the door cause I didnt come in here to get harrassed. I get that enough in the less serious areas of the board. And if you come in this thread just to ridicule me then save it! You are wasteing mine and your time that could be better spent doing something else.


Thanx for any serious replies.
Link Posted: 7/26/2004 12:46:37 PM EST
Link Posted: 7/26/2004 1:02:53 PM EST
good point. point taken.
Link Posted: 7/26/2004 1:10:28 PM EST
[Last Edit: 7/26/2004 1:20:11 PM EST by WolfAR15]
thats wierd. brass "upgraded" me but all i have is the avatar and title/sigline. I didnt want tit anyway and i chose for the gift to go to someone else. I hope the person i picked doesnt get a gag membership too.
Link Posted: 7/26/2004 5:19:37 PM EST

Originally Posted By WolfAR15:
I dont want golf carts and automatic weapons etc.



Why the hell not! Sounds like fun.

I hope you didn't take my post as trashing you. I just have to CYA so someone doesn't sue me for something I wrote on the net. I did mean what I said and if some guy was executing checkers, I would want to stop it if I could too.
Link Posted: 7/26/2004 5:26:02 PM EST
My walmart has 00 buck shot !!!
Link Posted: 7/26/2004 6:43:45 PM EST
just found out today that they have buck and slugs. Thanx guys.
Link Posted: 7/28/2004 2:16:03 AM EST

Originally Posted By SinistralRifleman:
"Name's Ash, Housewares"

www.dvdtown.com/media/screenshots/small/2924.jpg

"SHOP SMART, SHOP S-MART!"


you had to have seen that coming...


If you worked in sporting goods, I'd say that's a half way valid plan.....if you don't work there, get the hell out of the store.



"This is my boomstick!"

"Good, bad, I'm the guy with a the gun."

That movie rules.
Link Posted: 7/29/2004 7:25:02 PM EST
Shotgun+turkey loads+crowded store=bad situation.

I would skip the shottie and grab the Mini-14 or the Marlin 30-30 and a box of soft points.
Link Posted: 7/30/2004 10:47:52 PM EST
man, unless they came in shooting the place up and started to execute people, I wouldn't do anything. It isn't your money and you'll probably end up going to jail.
Link Posted: 8/1/2004 4:17:43 AM EST
Those Beretta AL390s are good shotguns and tough as nails. I have one in 12 guage and THOUSANDS of rounds thru it on skeet and sporting clays fields.

Don't discount the 20 guage either, they throw lead just as fast as the 12.....ECS
Link Posted: 8/3/2004 5:04:15 PM EST
[Last Edit: 8/3/2004 5:04:57 PM EST by hoss622]
I, for one, applaud this young man for realizing that it is the DUTY of able-bodied men to protect those who can't protect themselves. Walmart's are filled with people who fit this category.

I know that the world is a scary place, filled with scary people. It is the DUTY of able-bodied men to become SCARIER to the scumbags of the world.

This "get out of there" mentality is what is dooming the western world. How many times have we heard "experts" say "Cooperate with robbers, your money isn't worth your life." That may be the case, but if you do completely cooperate, you've now helped a violent criminal become successful and continue to ply his trade. Maybe next time he'll give his victim a bullet in the head for their trouble, just for fun. A million different things can happen in a robbery, but if you CAN stop it, you SHOULD.

WolfAR15, I hope you continue to hold the healthy attitude that you have. I encourage you to seek professional training in the use of the shotgun for defense. With a few days of professional training and several hundred rounds down-range, you would probably have skills that far outmatch those of the typical criminal.
Link Posted: 8/7/2004 4:33:45 PM EST
I'd be too busy shopping for reasonably priced housewares and dodging 'falling prices' to interfere with the Tangos looking for free orange soda.

As was said above, unless you heard a PA announcement indicating that judgement day for infidels has been bumped up, anything you do to brandish a weapon makes you a threat. If the greeter doesn't properly do his/her job and intervene, I'd be stripping the blue (Hi, I know where the money/Nsync albums/orange soda is!) vest off and making liking a sheeple. Be cognizant that having a weapon in hand makes you a target for first responder LEO's also, especially if you're in a primary response area with a direct to threat SOP...

When pressed to make for a Red Dawn remake in the pets aisle, I'd be interested in how an 870 SuperMag would do with heavy bird loads. For true accuracy in portrayal you really couldn't beat a nice lever Marlin in whatever they have, just please remember the lines!

As always, YMMV...
Link Posted: 8/7/2004 10:07:16 PM EST

Originally Posted By hoss622:
I, for one, applaud this young man for realizing that it is the DUTY of able-bodied men to protect those who can't protect themselves. Walmart's are filled with people who fit this category.

I know that the world is a scary place, filled with scary people. It is the DUTY of able-bodied men to become SCARIER to the scumbags of the world.

This "get out of there" mentality is what is dooming the western world. How many times have we heard "experts" say "Cooperate with robbers, your money isn't worth your life." That may be the case, but if you do completely cooperate, you've now helped a violent criminal become successful and continue to ply his trade. Maybe next time he'll give his victim a bullet in the head for their trouble, just for fun. A million different things can happen in a robbery, but if you CAN stop it, you SHOULD.

WolfAR15, I hope you continue to hold the healthy attitude that you have. I encourage you to seek professional training in the use of the shotgun for defense. With a few days of professional training and several hundred rounds down-range, you would probably have skills that far outmatch those of the typical criminal.



Negative. What's ruinging the Western world is the "we're going to fire you then sue the shit out of you for jeopardizing the lives of innocents" mentality.
Link Posted: 8/7/2004 10:14:18 PM EST
Just read a secret report that says Walmart is one of the key places for a terrorist attack.
Link Posted: 8/7/2004 10:27:01 PM EST

Originally Posted By RAMBOSKY:
Just read a secret report that says Walmart is one of the key places for a terrorist attack.



I bet the MI Militia favors Wallyworld, although I would say Sam's Club might be more appropriate. Hate to get stuck with 100 rolls of industrial TP in the bunker when Sam's probably has pallets of Charmin for $50.
Link Posted: 8/8/2004 2:47:11 AM EST
That's a secondary effect. The lawsuit phenomenon came AFTER the "experts" told us we should stop being men, and start behaving like helpless little girls. The people who are unwilling or unable to stand up to bad guys feel inadequate, so they become lawyers, and sue the people who personify everything that they aren't. These are the same jerks who advise employers to fire someone who would have the stones to stop a robbery and save lives.
Link Posted: 8/8/2004 9:02:22 PM EST
i dunno....

as of the last time i did any shopping at Walmart, i can definitely imagine a mass shooting spree in that place......
i've come close myself.
i wouldn't try to prevent anything....the gene pool needs some more "chlorine".
Link Posted: 8/22/2004 11:29:50 AM EST
My grocery store got robbed when I was a youngster they shot at the manager but missed and he lived they lined all the employees up threatening to shoot them all if he couldn't open the safe faster. After that robbery I've carried a Glock everyday since everywhere. "Would you like paper or plastic" while packing my polymer pistol. Yes I could have been fired, arrested or even called names if I would have acted but luckily nothing every happened to me since. But I made the decision that if someone was shooting or raping my co-workers(friends) bullets would begin flying regardless of the odds. All of my shots would be impacting bad guys. I often eat breakfast at a local resturant where years ago three employees were walked into the cooler and all shot in the head, executed like animals because they decided to cooperate with the robber.
As an opposite extreme I've had a overzelous citizen shoot at misdemeanor supect I was chasing there is a balance point in between.

The only thing necessary for evil to triumph is for good men to do nothing.

Go with a rifle and you can break the damn tirgger guard/lock off with a screwdriver. Hell you may have to make a 250 yard shot in some walmarts.
Link Posted: 8/22/2004 11:38:52 AM EST
[Last Edit: 8/22/2004 11:40:28 AM EST by TomJefferson]
Link Posted: 8/23/2004 4:26:03 AM EST
[Last Edit: 8/23/2004 4:26:58 AM EST by mike103]
Link Posted: 8/31/2004 4:30:47 PM EST
i have to stick my nose in here...

Wolf, you said you have a Mossberg? (incidently so do i...damn fine weapon) heres an idea, untill you have a CCW, load up that scattergun, keep in in the trunk of your car or behind the seat of your truck, and if some asshole dose start a Walmart shooting spree....run out for that scattergun, and come in the back door...also once you do get a CCW...get a .45 or .40 caliber automatic-springfield, para ord, colt (think small framed here!) or (i cant belive im suggesting it, but its small) a glock.
also for the trigger locks...get a small crowbar from hardwhere...
Link Posted: 9/2/2004 8:30:54 PM EST
FWIW, the Wal-mart by my house was robbed by some jack asses with "assault weapons". They only thing they shot were some ceiling tiles, but, with the way things are in this world today, it pays to think a head. And you are only pariniod if you if "they" are not out to get you. Before that psycopath in Kileen murdered all those people in the Luby's, most people said I was pariniod for wanting to carry a gun. Now my wife questions me if I DON"T take it with me. I have thought about this exact same thing. Although I don't plan on being a hero, my plan usually involves looking for the closest exit. The sad thing is, if terrorists do attack a Wal-mart, it will probably be with a bomb.With that said, your best defense is an observant eye.
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