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Posted: 8/31/2012 7:42:32 PM EDT
thought on this new adaptor? https://halix.co/
kind of expencive thou.
Link Posted: 8/31/2012 7:52:29 PM EDT
Quoted:
thought on this new adaptor? https://halix.co/
kind of expencive thou.


tag
Link Posted: 8/31/2012 8:15:58 PM EDT


$50 more then a form 1 SBR ??? It's not even a question.
Link Posted: 8/31/2012 8:40:54 PM EDT
Talk about taking it on the chin.
Link Posted: 8/31/2012 8:44:55 PM EDT
Now I've seen it all !!  
Link Posted: 8/31/2012 9:19:59 PM EDT



 
Link Posted: 9/1/2012 2:39:43 AM EDT
Hey arfcommers, I'm the guy behind the NSN.

I know it's radical. But, seriously, it works.

Give me a little while to get video of other people using it. The new and veteran shooters that have used it so far have told me that they like it. Most asked question: does it hurt? Answer: not at all. I will even be testing it on a Remington 870 in the next few weeks. The polyurethane foam pads absorb recoil very well.

And give me whatever feedback you have. I can take it. There's an absolute shitstorm on Soldier Systems / AR15news / other sites about how this is an "omg! fail!". Just do one thing for me: watch this first and then watch this video, think about the benefits/drawbacks for a minute, and then post. I'm looking for your thoughts, but I'd appreciate it if they were based on all of the facts that I have presented.

Or just flame on.  I enjoy a good laugh.

Thanks, and S/F,
-Neal
Link Posted: 9/1/2012 3:16:04 AM EDT
Whether it works or not, the price point is going to turn away many potential buyers.  Seems like it could promote a bad case of TMJ. lol     Novel thinking out of the box.
Link Posted: 9/1/2012 3:19:54 AM EDT
Thanks for the suggestion. I've been hearing that a bit. I'm working with my manufacturer to see what we can do. -Neal
Link Posted: 9/1/2012 4:12:00 AM EDT
Quoted:

$50 more then a form 1 SBR ??? It's not even a question.


Price is in line with MSR for PRS, etc. stocks.          What does the tax on a SBR have anything to do with the cost of a stock?  
Link Posted: 9/1/2012 4:44:11 AM EDT
Considering the shit storm it has caused have any pre-orders been sold?.

How many so far are jumping on the band wagon?
Link Posted: 9/1/2012 4:48:39 AM EDT
Quoted:
Considering the shit storm it has caused have any pre-orders been sold?.

How many so far are jumping on the band wagon?


not me

I like my SBR's the way they are.

I do not want to put my face or part of my face on a Stock shooting a 458 SOCOM or any other weapon for that matter.

Link Posted: 9/1/2012 4:53:39 AM EDT
My jaw aches already just thinking about it.

Quoted:
Quoted:
Considering the shit storm it has caused have any pre-orders been sold?.

How many so far are jumping on the band wagon?


not me

I like my SBR's the way they are.

I do not want to put my face or part of my face on a Stock shooting a 458 SOCOM or any other weapon for that matter.



Link Posted: 9/1/2012 5:43:48 AM EDT
At least he's trying something new and innovative. Could be good for states that don't allow SBRs. (Michigan, I think, right?).

Why is everyone on the net and all these forums so knee jerk spiteful when something new like this comes along and they themselves don't think they'd buy it or they perceive it as too expensive,etc.?  Don't like it?  Don't buy it. Jeez.
Link Posted: 9/1/2012 6:13:51 AM EDT
That why I asked how many have been pre-ordered. Maybe the orders out weigh the comments.
Quoted:
At least he's trying something new and innovative. Could be good for states that don't allow SBRs. (Michigan, I think, right?).

Why is everyone on the net and all these forums so knee jerk spiteful when something new like this comes along and they themselves don't think they'd buy it or they perceive it as too expensive,etc.?  Don't like it?  Don't buy it. Jeez.


Link Posted: 9/1/2012 7:06:49 AM EDT
Has the ATF weighed in on this yet? I know a lot of people have been raising the point of a "3rd point of contact".
Link Posted: 9/1/2012 9:03:57 AM EDT



Quoted:


Has the ATF weighed in on this yet? I know a lot of people have been raising the point of a "3rd point of contact".


Interesting question. There is no "3rd point of contact" in the definition of any firearm. The design could however remove it from the pistol/handgun classification because it can be argued that the firearm is no longer "designed to be held and fired by use of a single hand."(Title 18 Part 1 Chapter 44 Section 921) or "A weapon originally designed, made, and intended to fire a projectile (bullet) from one or more barrels when held in one hand." (Title 27 Chapter II Subchapter B Part 478 Subpart B Section 478.11)



Depending on how the ATF decides, it could put it in the title 1 firearm classification if over 26"OAL or the AOW class if under 26"AOL.



 
Link Posted: 9/1/2012 9:17:03 AM EDT



Quoted:



Quoted:



$50 more then a form 1 SBR ??? It's not even a question.




Price is in line with MSR for PRS, etc. stocks.          What does the tax on a SBR have anything to do with the cost of a stock?  


So your calling this a stock? Then it has everything to do with the SBR tax.



My post was in reference to, as the OP suggests in the tile, a way to have a SBR without the tax. Reading is fundamental.





 
Link Posted: 9/1/2012 10:15:45 AM EDT
If you call it a stock it's an SBR and taxable. If you call it a tooth extractor then it's not taxable.
Link Posted: 9/1/2012 11:59:40 AM EDT
if it was priced better i would give it a shot. so far my caa cheak rest works great and looks good.
Link Posted: 9/1/2012 12:12:19 PM EDT
Quoted:
....
So your calling this a stock? Then it has everything to do with the SBR tax.

My post was in reference to, as the OP suggests in the tile, a way to have a SBR without the tax. Reading is fundamental.  

The functional word with NFA is "shoulder stock".....   Reading is fundamental....     You can call this product  a "chin stock", "chin rest" or whatever you wish to call it...   My post has everything to do with the cost of aftermarket add-ons and I never called this a "shoulder stock"....  I simply made reference to the price of a shoulder stock compared to this accessory...        You could spend the $200 on the tax and then still spend over $200 on a shoulder stock...

Link Posted: 9/1/2012 1:43:27 PM EDT
Edited...VA-gunnut
 
Link Posted: 9/1/2012 2:01:50 PM EDT
Seems like it could be bad for the neck or possibly even the brain.
Link Posted: 9/1/2012 3:33:49 PM EDT

Quoted:
Quoted:
....
So your calling this a stock? Then it has everything to do with the SBR tax.
My post was in reference to, as the OP suggests in the tile, a way to have a SBR without the tax. Reading is fundamental.  

The functional word with NFA is "shoulder stock".....   Reading is fundamental....     You can call this product  a "chin stock", "chin rest" or whatever you wish to call it...   My post has everything to do with the cost of aftermarket add-ons and I never called this a "shoulder stock"....  I simply made reference to the price of a shoulder stock compared to this accessory...        You could spend the $200 on the tax and then still spend over $200 on a shoulder stock...

Yep reading is fundamental, please post a link to any NFA, CGA, US Code or Title section, paragraph or subsection that uses the phrase "shoulder stock". Or any USC, ATF, GCA or NFA rifle or SBR definition  that includes the word "stock" in it anywhere.
Bet ya can't.
As a matter of fact I'll wager the only place you'll find the word "stock" at all in any codified federal firearm definition is in the definitions of a handgun and pistol.
 
Link Posted: 9/1/2012 3:38:54 PM EDT
Its a device so death and blind people can count their shots.     I have had my neck fused so Ill be passing on this one.
Just my bad !!  
Link Posted: 9/1/2012 3:46:47 PM EDT
No thanks
Link Posted: 9/1/2012 3:52:31 PM EDT

Quoted:


Edited...VA-gunnut






I would suggest you contact the proper people here to set up a Dealer account before you proceed any further in this thread before you wind up getting locked for unpaid advertising. They take it quite seriously here.





I STRONGLY advise you do not test it against yourself with an 870. Find somebody with the proper equipment to measure the recoil force at the contact point. Firing a 12ga shotgun off your chin is a good way to get hurt BAD, and a small amount of polyurethane is not going to do much to prevent a bad injury. Don't mess up your face, mouth, neck, brain, or other majorly important parts testing something, do it right so you can continue to live an enjoyable life.





In regards to .458 and the .50s, you KNOW someone will do it and NO AMOUNT OF WARNING WILL STOP THEM.





On to my personal opinions of it!





In my experience and the experience of many, yes, a shorter rifle is lighter and handier. That's why people use shorter rifles. I use a 16" carbine with a midlength gas system and a decent brake. It packs a punch inside 100, and I know my rifle will hold MOA or better out to 450m, at least. I do not think your 'notastock' would provide for accurate braced shooting out to 450m. There are gentlemen who can shoot accurate past 300 and 400 with a 10" 5.56, with a stock, holding the rifle properly. Your system may be okay inside of 25m, but I highly doubt its effectiveness to make a precise shot beyond that. I am a strong believer in the fact that Bullpup rifles are better than a straight SBR AR for CQ shooting or most other applications. A bullpup firearm such as an AUG allows for a 18" barrel in a package the length of a 12.5" AR with a good comp/brake attached and the stock extended to a a proper LOP for average height male shooters.
 
Link Posted: 9/1/2012 4:05:39 PM EDT
Hey, I'll stop posting. I wanted to answer questions after the OP started this thread, but if that's not allowed, then no worries. Is there an admin that can confirm that I should stay away?
Link Posted: 9/1/2012 4:05:47 PM EDT
interesting concept
i give designer props for thinking outside the box

price point is too high for me to consider though,
i'll stick w/ stamps for now

ETA:
Neil
if your going to advertise, email [email protected]  & inquire
Link Posted: 9/1/2012 4:08:15 PM EDT
Quoted:
Hey, I'll stop posting. I wanted to answer questions after the OP started this thread, but if that's not allowed, then no worries. Is there an admin that can confirm that I should stay away?


You need to contact JLA on this forum, through E-mail, regarding setting up a Dealer account. Unpaid advertising is a pretty big offense on these boards. I have seen several people have their accounts locked until the issue is resolved.
Link Posted: 9/1/2012 4:20:03 PM EDT





Quoted:



Edited...VA-gunnut



Oh no, now you've done it.





 
Link Posted: 9/1/2012 5:41:06 PM EDT
I suppose credit is due for ingenuity and creativeness if nothing else.  It would be interesting to try but being that I'm able to own SBRs, this is a little unneeded for me personally.  I am all for inventiveness and R&D when it comes to things like this though.  

Regardless of how well this is accepted I hope the creator of it continues to be innovative as it appears he is definitely thinking outside the box, which we all can agree is not a bad thing.
Link Posted: 9/1/2012 5:58:53 PM EDT
Quoted:
I suppose credit is due for ingenuity and creativeness if nothing else.  It would be interesting to try but being that I'm able to own SBRs, this is a little unneeded for me personally.  I am all for inventiveness and R&D when it comes to things like this though.  

Regardless of how well this is accepted I hope the creator of it continues to be innovative as it appears he is definitely thinking outside the box, which we all can agree is not a bad thing.


I agree...personally, I don't want to have to wear a mouth guard when I shoot  If you shoot a lot, I imagine this will cause some serious physical problems over time.
Link Posted: 9/1/2012 6:29:55 PM EDT
Link Posted: 9/1/2012 6:30:22 PM EDT

That is absolutely brilliant.

IM sent.

John
Link Posted: 9/1/2012 7:27:32 PM EDT
Interesting idea. Might make for a good review item.
Link Posted: 9/1/2012 8:59:07 PM EDT
I hope he user spits out any tobacco before using this.
Link Posted: 9/2/2012 7:33:17 AM EDT
Quoted:
As a matter of fact I'll wager the only place you'll find the word "stock" at all in any codified federal firearm definition is in the definitions of a handgun and pistol.  

So what you are trying to say is that it is OK to call this item a chin stock because it is not designed to be fired from the shoulder and the term “handgun” means—
(A) a firearm which has a short stock and is designed to be held and fired by the use of a single hand; and
(B) any combination of parts from which a firearm described in subparagraph (A) can be assembled.
.....
Link Posted: 9/2/2012 3:40:47 PM EDT



Quoted:



Quoted:

As a matter of fact I'll wager the only place you'll find the word "stock" at all in any codified federal firearm definition is in the definitions of a handgun and pistol.  


So what you are trying to say is that it is OK to call this item a chin stock because it is not designed to be fired from the shoulder and the term "handgun” means—


(A) a firearm which has a short stock and is designed to be held and fired by the use of a single hand; and

(B) any combination of parts from which a firearm described in subparagraph (A) can be assembled.
.....


Now your starting to see the light. Now try and find the word stock in the rifle or SBR definition.



 
Link Posted: 9/2/2012 6:05:58 PM EDT
I will pass on it
doesnt look like a good idea to me but what do I know
Link Posted: 9/2/2012 7:38:02 PM EDT
nice effort, but I am sure many feel like I do for $200 I can get a stamp and keep my jaw from dislocating or cracking teeth. good luck in your endeavor sir.
Link Posted: 9/2/2012 9:11:50 PM EDT
Quoted:
Hey arfcommers, I'm the guy behind the NSN.

I know it's radical. But, seriously, it works.

Give me a little while to get video of other people using it. The new and veteran shooters that have used it so far have told me that they like it. Most asked question: does it hurt? Answer: not at all. I will even be testing it on a Remington 870 in the next few weeks. The polyurethane foam pads absorb recoil very well.

And give me whatever feedback you have. I can take it. There's an absolute shitstorm on Soldier Systems / AR15news / other sites about how this is an "omg! fail!". Just do one thing for me: watch this first and then watch this video, think about the benefits/drawbacks for a minute, and then post. I'm looking for your thoughts, but I'd appreciate it if they were based on all of the facts that I have presented.

Or just flame on.  I enjoy a good laugh.

Thanks, and S/F,
-Neal


Nice concept, shitty pricepoint.

You're welcome.
Link Posted: 9/3/2012 2:26:53 PM EDT
I used it today and can safely say "I loved it!". It is lighter and more maneuverable than the traditional AR-15. Plus, I loved how quickly I could get on target. I am a BELIEVER!!!!

RenegadePete
Link Posted: 9/3/2012 3:07:42 PM EDT
Quoted:
I used it today and can safely say "I loved it!". It is lighter and more maneuverable than the traditional AR-15. Plus, I loved how quickly I could get on target. I am a BELIEVER!!!!

RenegadePete


Nope, no credibility gap from the first post of an account created today about the product.
Link Posted: 9/3/2012 3:30:30 PM EDT
Maybe . . Maybe not
Link Posted: 9/3/2012 3:48:23 PM EDT
This. Subtlety. You don't has it.

Quoted:
Quoted:
I used it today and can safely say "I loved it!". It is lighter and more maneuverable than the traditional AR-15. Plus, I loved how quickly I could get on target. I am a BELIEVER!!!!

RenegadePete


Nope, no credibility gap from the first post of an account created today about the product.


Link Posted: 9/3/2012 4:06:10 PM EDT
How do you talk while shooting?

Link Posted: 9/3/2012 4:29:46 PM EDT
Quoted:
Quoted:
I used it today and can safely say "I loved it!". It is lighter and more maneuverable than the traditional AR-15. Plus, I loved how quickly I could get on target. I am a BELIEVER!!!!

RenegadePete


Nope, no credibility gap from the first post of an account created today about the product.


Meh. Probably just a troll. I would hope no one is that stupid.
Link Posted: 9/3/2012 5:18:08 PM EDT
[Meh. Probably just a troll. I would hope no one is that stupid.]

First, thanks for such a nice welcome to the blog!  Second, I was one of the people filmed in the company's video today (you might want to go check it out).  Third, you guys need to loosen your sphincters a bit and be a little more open to new ideas!  

No troll here, just a gun enthusiast, collector, and open-minded AR-15 owner.  I guess you have to post 1000 times before your opinion counts.  Well, I really don't care.

I shot it today and feel it creates a lot more excitement around shooting AR-15's.  I again would strongly recommend you try it out before you provide such lame comments to new members of the blog.

Pete
Link Posted: 9/3/2012 5:49:36 PM EDT
Quoted:
[Meh. Probably just a troll. I would hope no one is that stupid.]

First, thanks for such a nice welcome to the blog!  Second, I was one of the people filmed in the company's video today (you might want to go check it out).  Third, you guys need to loosen your sphincters a bit and be a little more open to new ideas!  

No troll here, just a gun enthusiast, collector, and open-minded AR-15 owner.  I guess you have to post 1000 times before your opinion counts.  Well, I really don't care.

I shot it today and feel it creates a lot more excitement around shooting AR-15's.  I again would strongly recommend you try it out before you provide such lame comments to new members of the blog.

Pete


no you do not

it is just very suspicious that you just registered and come here to just to post in this thread for the 1st and 2nd time.

we have seen this many times

in addition you did not purchase this stock is my guess since you where part of the filming so it is easy to give a good review

Link Posted: 9/3/2012 6:01:09 PM EDT
Quoted:
[Meh. Probably just a troll. I would hope no one is that stupid.]

First, thanks for such a nice welcome to the blog!  Second, I was one of the people filmed in the company's video today (you might want to go check it out).  Third, you guys need to loosen your sphincters a bit and be a little more open to new ideas!  

No troll here, just a gun enthusiast, collector, and open-minded AR-15 owner.  I guess you have to post 1000 times before your opinion counts.  Well, I really don't care.

I shot it today and feel it creates a lot more excitement around shooting AR-15's.  I again would strongly recommend you try it out before you provide such lame comments to new members of the blog.

Pete


I'm going to be careful in my wording since this is not GD.

Firstly, your post comes across strongly as a shill.

Secondly, as being filmed in the video by the company your point is moot.

Thirdly, this website is a forum and community, not a blog.
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