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Posted: 12/21/2004 6:56:22 PM EDT
I have a j&t ds-4 kit I just built on a stag lower ,now I just got to build another one. I am very pleased with the j&t kit ,it was my first build.my question is who has the better kit ? I was planing on building a 20 inch gun . from model 1 you can get one with a crome barrel,chamber,bolt for less than 500.from j&t it would be closer to 625 for what I want. I have read nothing but good about both.
Link Posted: 12/21/2004 7:07:25 PM EDT
Personally I prefer J&T and go there for most of my parts.  Though admitedly, all of my barrels are Colts.  The rest are parts ordered from J&T.  I just go straight to them, but that is just me.  I have nothing but good experienced with them.  Unless something goes very wrong in the future, I see no reason to stray from what has worked before.
Link Posted: 12/21/2004 8:12:19 PM EDT
Model 1 has never done me wrong. I have gone to them 5 times now.
Link Posted: 12/21/2004 9:25:46 PM EDT
J&T for me as well.  I just finished a SPR clone with a RRA lower parts kit. Had to replace the RRA bolt catch with one from J&T.  RRA one was several thousands too thick.  Wouldn't even fit in the groove.

Their LPK's are some of the best I have used.

Note: I can't say anything bad about M1.  No experience with them.
Link Posted: 12/22/2004 2:18:52 AM EDT
I had good luck with Model 1 Sales in the past.
I should have another UPS package from them show up today
Link Posted: 12/22/2004 3:18:58 AM EDT
+1 For J&T. I've got a DS-4 kit inbound for Christmas.  I called them to see if they could get in on the road by Tuesady and they stood on there heads to make it happen. I've had such good quality and service from them I'm a little afraid to go any place else.
Link Posted: 12/22/2004 5:31:58 AM EDT
I was torn between J&T and DSG Arms.

I finally just ordered all the parts separately and built it myself.
Link Posted: 12/22/2004 5:49:03 AM EDT
jt
Link Posted: 12/22/2004 6:51:45 AM EDT
I have no experience with J&T, besides surfing their web-site.  I like everything so far about the M1S CAR15 I've built, and received awesome service from them.  (delivered to my door in 18 hours).  I currently have a 7.5 pistol kit on order from them, and should get it early next week.  (darned Christmas holiday and all.)
Link Posted: 12/22/2004 10:03:32 AM EDT
You could click on the Industry forum and look at the feedback for J&T and Model 1 Sales...OOPS!  Model 1 Sales isn't on there, they don't support this site or want feedback publicly viewable about their customer service.  I believe that says a lot about their service, that's why I ordered my most recent upper from J&T!  
Link Posted: 12/22/2004 10:57:05 AM EDT
I hope you didn't take logic in high school or college, because what you said wasn't particularly logical.  Whether they advertise here or anywhere else doesn't lead to any conclusion about their customer service.  Have they ever done anything that you personally know of, or do you just like to talk smack without anything to back it up.

Inquiring minds want to know.hinking.gif
Link Posted: 12/22/2004 11:20:32 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Wingman26:
You could click on the Industry forum and look at the feedback for J&T and Model 1 Sales...OOPS!  Model 1 Sales isn't on there, they don't support this site or want feedback publicly viewable about their customer service.  I believe that says a lot about their service, that's why I ordered my most recent upper from J&T!  


Rock River is not listed in the Manufacturer's, so you are telling me they don't make good guns?  
Link Posted: 12/22/2004 11:27:28 AM EDT
JT!!!!! Model 1 is a part of the IL conspiracy.
Link Posted: 12/22/2004 1:34:51 PM EDT
Best post to date.

I just received my M1S 7.5 inch pistol kit, much earlier than promised, as usual, and am generally pleased with it.  I went to the range, and could only get it to single-shot, but it helps if someone puts everything in the buffer assembly correctlyhen
It looks really mean, and can't wait to see what else I didn't put together right when I go back to the range.  tomorrow I will get my M231 buffer assy from DPMS, and try again.

Link Posted: 12/22/2004 2:42:05 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/22/2004 2:45:35 PM EDT by Wingman26]

Originally Posted By j-fonz:
Rock River is not listed in the Manufacturer's, so you are telling me they don't make good guns?  


The question is about kit vendors, the choice is between Model 1 Sales and J&T, not manufacturers!


Link Posted: 12/22/2004 6:25:53 PM EDT

Originally Posted By 1Gunner:
JT!!!!! Model 1 is a part of the IL conspiracy.



what is the IL conspiracy?
Link Posted: 12/22/2004 7:19:06 PM EDT
I have assembled both in the past week (J&T for me, Model 1 for my Father) and both were fine.  The lower parts were not quite as nice on the Model 1 kit, but everything works and the upper to lower fit is fantastic.

I wouldn't hesitate to buy Model 1 after building one.

That being said, I am totally happy with my J&T build.

Either one is fine.
Link Posted: 12/22/2004 8:17:01 PM EDT
Is the chrome bolt assembly on the JT model worth the 70$ upgrade?

Ben
Link Posted: 12/23/2004 4:29:12 AM EDT

Originally Posted By arhunt576:

Originally Posted By 1Gunner:
JT!!!!! Model 1 is a part of the IL conspiracy.



what is the IL conspiracy?



I'll email you when I get a
chance.
Link Posted: 12/23/2004 8:32:41 AM EDT
FWIW I have built two Model 1 kit rifles, a 20 inch varmit and 20 service rifle.  Both kits were delivered as scheduled and have thus far worked flawlessly.  Accuracy is at a par with any other AR 15 I have seen.  If you read the posts long enough you will see every mfg trashed one time or another by someone who says they own that brand.  Many of the parts used by the mfg are built by some subcontractor, often the same subcontractor.  Quality control is the issue and so is human error.  

The bottom line is that until someone does an exhaustive survey of actual owners and compares them to other mfg, its all opinion.  What is not opinion is that (1  name brand mfg. generally cost more and are worth more at resale and (2 mfg. that have lousy customer support don't stay in business long.  Warren at Ameetec Arms has been a real gem at helping me with a RRA two stage trigger I bought. There are lots of other testimonies of excellent customer support, but that is the one which comes at the top of my list.  (3 there are several good mfg.  

My choice for Model 1 was based on (1 I bought the gun to shoot, not as an investment, 2) brand name is not important to me, especially since many of the mfg use the same sub-contractors.  

Either rifle mfg. you are considering will serve you well.  You can't make a bad choice on either.
Link Posted: 12/23/2004 9:17:49 AM EDT
I have used m1 2 Times Both Times Were a Failure My Firs build There Upper was Nice till you looked at the FSB It was so canted It would have took a a Food of Windage to hit the paper I sent that one back At my Cost Which i think sucks, They Sent me a new one Well looky Here Same damn thing just not as bad. Well for the price of me shipping it back to them i will have a gunsmith Properly fix it So now i only run Bushmaster on my lower But hey I got a spare upper New never used Not for sale though.

But i have the worst luck in the world when it comes to me, So i expect this stuff. But hey i may still buy from them Third time is a charm Right.  
Link Posted: 12/23/2004 9:34:26 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Superfly:
I have used m1 2 Times Both Times Were a Failure My Firs build There Upper was Nice till you looked at the FSB It was so canted It would have took a a Food of Windage to hit the paper I sent that one back At my Cost Which i think sucks, They Sent me a new one Well looky Here Same damn thing just not as bad. Well for the price of me shipping it back to them i will have a gunsmith Properly fix it So now i only run Bushmaster on my lower But hey I got a spare upper New never used Not for sale though.

But i have the worst luck in the world when it comes to me, So i expect this stuff. But hey i may still buy from them Third time is a charm Right.  



Don't forget the owner of M1S, assaulted a Texan at a gunshow a few weeks ago...keep that in mind.

Ben
Link Posted: 12/23/2004 10:13:38 AM EDT
I purchased a 16" J&T kit at Knob Creek in the fall.  I however put it together using dpms lower parts and was quite happy. The other night I tried putting the J&T parts fro  my kit on a good dpms lower.  the J&T lower parts are crap.  My bolt catch wouldn't come close to fitting, the safety never locked up right with the detent and a few other things need hand fitting.  I've built a few lowers so I know what I'm doing.  I doubt model  is much better but it's a hassle to call J&T and have them replace almost all of your lower parts.

The trigger hammer and trigger and hammer springs were good but most everything else was trash.
Link Posted: 12/23/2004 1:06:32 PM EDT
my j&t lpk was nice it went together with no problems every thing works just fine it was to easy.
Link Posted: 12/23/2004 1:26:29 PM EDT
Model1 is hostile towards their customers and pulls answers out of their ass.  I've seen it inperson at the fun show and seen many, many negative things posted about them.  
Link Posted: 12/23/2004 8:11:05 PM EDT
jtd
Link Posted: 12/24/2004 8:21:46 PM EDT
I have two J&T kits, a barrel, and two upper rx's from them.  All are just fine, and reside on DPMS lowers.  Am very happy with all of them.
Link Posted: 1/8/2005 8:58:51 PM EDT

Originally Posted By fadedsun:
Don't forget the owner of M1S, assaulted a Texan at a gunshow a few weeks ago...keep that in mind.

Ben


Dudr wasn't that M&A?  Or is this all getting back to the vast conspiracy, that they're really kinda one and the same?
Link Posted: 1/8/2005 10:36:00 PM EDT
I had two kits from M1S, a 16" and 20", both "post ban", the 20" allways had a crooked front sight base, so after the AWB expiered I bot two new barrels (with bayo-lugs & flash hiders), SO NOW the 16" has a crooked sight base! I meen I have to crank the rear sight ALL THE WAY OVER, WTF! Other than that, once they forgot the disconecter, but no other major problems.M1S, whats up with those darned front sight bases????
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