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9/22/2017 12:11:25 AM
Posted: 8/4/2003 12:29:53 PM EDT
Any one know what it cost.?
Link Posted: 8/4/2003 1:17:25 PM EDT
Good luck getting a straight answer about anything to do with 6.8 out of anybody around here. I'll bet it costs just about an arm and a leg.
Link Posted: 8/4/2003 2:03:56 PM EDT
I hope not. Price of ammo will make the difference between the 6.8 or staying 5.56
Link Posted: 8/4/2003 2:18:47 PM EDT
Were you around when M855 first hit the market? $400 or $500 per thousand. You still have to pay a premium. If I had to guess I'd say 6.8 x 43 will be just as bad. Will civilians even be able to find mil-spec ammo with crimped primers and cannalures? Will our mags work? There are alot of questions I need answered before I'm on the band wagon. Gel tests would be cool too. Brouhaha and Tat started posting info a while back and somebody shut them up. I have been hiding and watching. I was going to put on a 1/7 barrel and go with the 75 otms but now I don't know. I'm in a holding pattern. But I bet the whole thing gets cost prohibitive for me.
Link Posted: 8/4/2003 3:46:54 PM EDT
Most of what I have heard has been rumors so far. While I am aware of the development of this new round, I am yet to see a single round of it. Are uppers chambered in that caliber even available as of now? The one rumor that I heard that sounded the most reasonable seemed to indicate that the military ammo would use some sort of armor piercing 100 gr bullet. I have no idea if this is true or whether the bullet is actually more like SS109 bullets with a penetrator core. It's supposed to be up near 3000 fps in velocity. Within the same rumor, I heard Remington named as the commercial supplier with 120 SP's (I assume the Core-Lokt}. Again, I have no idea if any of this is true as the source I heard this from isn't on my top ten list of most reliable, so take this info with a grain of salt. And in regards to ammo availability, we won't be getting any US mil-spec ammo most likely. US surplus is no longer available to the civilian market. The only way we could get it would be if a company like Talon de-milled it first and reprocessed it. And even if that happened it would likely be a few years until any is demilled. Added to this is the relatively small quantities than will exist compared to 5.56mm. So I would say that for civilians, commercial will be the way to go. And depending on how the 6.8mm catches on with the civilian market, commercial ammo may be hard to come by. But a 120 gr SP driven at decent velocities should make a decent self defense or whitetail deer combo. -Charging Handle
Link Posted: 8/4/2003 4:29:22 PM EDT
Again just rumors and speculation but I bet we are a very short time away from ammo and barrels/botls available to the public. G.P. and Black Hills seem to have come through with mil spec 75 grm OTM's So they might be able to do the same for 6.8 x 43. But I bet thick wallets would be required.
Link Posted: 8/4/2003 6:13:07 PM EDT
I've been hearing that for a month now.
Link Posted: 8/5/2003 4:57:58 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/5/2003 7:15:01 PM EDT by mach6]
I think what we have to keep in mind is that everyone in the biz has either a dog in this fight or wants to enter one. It is for this reason that USASOC has been extremely "proprietary" about the 6.8mm SCAR round. What I am most often quoted by officials at both USASOC and USSOCOM is that they "don't want to get inundated with unsolicited proposals" (e.g. USP in USSOCOM acquisition parlance). Therein lies the rub -- allegedly. There is a fundemental fear that any one of a number of weapons designers having pockets of any depth, will get the ear of one or more members of Congress and thus put pressure on the Command. Having said that, I suspect that certain favored vendors (we know who they are) are already working the issue with the commands at Bragg and MacDill to ensure their products most closely align with the soon-to-be-released JORD for the SCAR. The upshot of this situation 6.8mm is the proverbial Hobson's Choice. Simply put, better mousetraps come from industry -- not governments. In my experience, the folks at Picatinny and Crane are interested in milking projects for as long as they can, while stealing the ideas of entrepreneuers and then placing them into production. Mike Rock, LMT, GEMTECH, KAC and Smith Enterprise are some of the victims that come to mind. What is needed is more light on the subject and a release of the TDP on the new round. When this happens, a thousand ideas will bloom, to borrow a phrase. It will not take Colt, HK/ATK or FN to develop a winning formula. Perhaps that is the problem from certain perspectives. As to the round itself, Remington, which has already produced 100K 6.8mm rounds for RDT&E, will do nothing to risk losing any potential forthcoming contract. In sum: be patient or just work on your HUMINT skills.
Link Posted: 8/5/2003 5:01:33 AM EDT
After its finalized, wanna bet on how long it will be before Black Hills is cranking it out?
Link Posted: 8/5/2003 10:23:35 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Lumpy196: After its finalized, wanna bet on how long it will be before Black Hills is cranking it out?
View Quote
A very long time. Black hills wants to sell military ammo to the military, and commercial ammo to varmit hunters and target shooters. They have little interest in selling rifle ammo for self defense to commercial buyers. Look how long it has taken GPSS to get a run of NATO pressure 77Gn OTM made.
Link Posted: 8/5/2003 4:49:12 PM EDT
Trust me, as big as the AR15 market is, if a new caliber is adopted, even if for special purposes, there will be a demand for uppers AND ammo and someone will fill that demand. BHs is probably one of the most likely to fill that.
Link Posted: 8/5/2003 4:51:59 PM EDT
This is supposed to released very, very soon. But i haven't heard any testing or field reports. I would like to see a picture or at least hear there aren't any magazine issues.
Link Posted: 8/5/2003 6:25:04 PM EDT
I am very interested in the concept, but will probably wait a few years to see how things pan out.
Link Posted: 8/5/2003 7:15:34 PM EDT
Wait a few years?? Man I am digging the change out of my couch cushions trying to figure out how I'm gonna pay for this thing as soon as it lands. But then I've always been a gear nut. I know if I buy the first upper to come to market, it will be obsolete in weeks, and I'll be lusting for the next "great innovation." A hide and wait approach would be wise but, I don't know if I have the will power.
Link Posted: 8/5/2003 7:20:03 PM EDT
Does anyone know when!!!!!!!! If i hear a couple more weeks one more time I'm gonna scream
Link Posted: 8/6/2003 8:22:36 AM EDT
Ok hows' about "In the very near future all will be revealed" hehe.............Sorry I just had to say it.
Link Posted: 8/11/2003 7:01:06 PM EDT
I will bend every ear or other available body part at the Infantry Conference next month to get these DCD guys, the JASOC staff weenies or the 5th SFG(A)guys who are deep into the project to spill something.
Link Posted: 8/11/2003 7:58:03 PM EDT
Mach6 Thanks again for candid info.
Link Posted: 8/11/2003 10:44:41 PM EDT
Just curious here? why would they want to spill something out-not trying to raise hackles here but why would they?
Link Posted: 8/13/2003 4:51:03 AM EDT
Originally Posted By KMFDM: Just curious here? why would they want to spill something out-not trying to raise hackles here but why would they?
View Quote
-------------- WHY? Ego, for one. Do a key word search on profile for another hint.
Link Posted: 8/13/2003 11:01:27 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/13/2003 11:03:08 AM EDT by Stickman]
I've been hearing about this for over a year. Wasn't this supposed to be developed and ready before Desert Storm II? It never quite made it. The push and rush seems to have been taken out of its sails from what I have heard. With no deadline around the corner, this could very well become another round that doesn't quite make it into the military. The orginal idea of a modular weapon series (5.56, 6.8., 7.62x39) hasn't panned out very well for the M4 variants. More than one comment has been made about just going with the 5.56/ 7.62 for options based off the availablity of ammo worldwide. Where are you going to pick up 6.8mm? The answer is SF supply, and that isn't always much help in far away lands.
Link Posted: 8/14/2003 2:30:55 AM EDT
[url]http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=3&f=12&t=166657[url] It while cost whatever Remington charges for a box of it's newest rifle ammo. Probubly at least $18.00 a box of 20 until other manufacturers start selling it too.
Link Posted: 8/14/2003 6:32:40 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/14/2003 6:37:34 AM EDT by danonly]
Originally Posted By AR15fan:
Originally Posted By Lumpy196: After its finalized, wanna bet on how long it will be before Black Hills is cranking it out?
View Quote
A very long time. Black hills wants to sell military ammo to the military, and commercial ammo to varmit hunters and target shooters. They have little interest in selling rifle ammo for self defense to commercial buyers. Look how long it has taken GPSS to get a run of NATO pressure 77Gn OTM made.
View Quote
I have to go with Lumpy on this one- Black Hills would probably have had our run done 6 months ago, if we had submitted it 7-8 months ago. They are in the business of making and selling ammo- if there is a demand for it, and they can do it, they will. here's the above link, [url]www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=3&f=12&t=166657[/url]
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