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Posted: 8/22/2010 1:57:23 PM EDT
The finishing piece to my build in the near future is the optic and I've started thinking up the choices and I've narrowed it down to three unless you guys have better recomendations that apply to the title

I was thinking:
trigicon ta33 green horseshoe
aimpoint comp m3
trigicon tr24 green triangle ret

input?
Link Posted: 8/22/2010 2:22:47 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/22/2010 2:24:02 PM EDT by N2CH_556]
What role? CQB / HD? Red-dot is king. Go Aimpoint.

ETA: I'd go with the TA33G-H for fun though.
Link Posted: 8/22/2010 2:23:55 PM EDT
Compact ACOG
Link Posted: 8/22/2010 2:33:21 PM EDT
conneticut ,urban setting aimpoint my vote
Link Posted: 8/22/2010 3:07:12 PM EDT
I had the TA-33 HG ACOG, and it's a great optic. But I decided that it was too slow up close, so I sold it, and replaced it with a Aimpoint ML3 instead.
Link Posted: 8/22/2010 4:08:20 PM EDT
Given that SHTF might mean more than shooting under 100 yards, I'd go with the TA33 if the scope is going on a 5.56/223 rifle. It might be marginally slower than a red dot under 100 yards, but it's going to be a HELL of a lot better at 600!

Link Posted: 8/22/2010 4:19:03 PM EDT


Aimpoint hands down.


Link Posted: 8/22/2010 4:48:36 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/22/2010 4:51:06 PM EDT by woode]
I think it depends on:

1. What is your definition of 'SHTF'? (world ending as we know it, localized natural disaster, world war, etc)

2. Where do you live? (urban environment, open farmland, woods, etc)

Protecting a farm in rural Illinois from the world ending vs a natural disaster in Manhatten would require two totally different optics.

I think the BEST would be the new S&B 1-8 Short Dot –– 1x Red Dot and 1x-8x mil-dot scope in one.
Link Posted: 8/22/2010 5:32:50 PM EDT
It honestly depends on what you consider shtf, and where your AO is.

For me, my vote goes towards the Aimpoint.
Link Posted: 8/22/2010 6:17:42 PM EDT
Get both. Use the TA33 with an Aimpoint T1 on a Larue offset mount. It is the best of both worlds.
Link Posted: 8/22/2010 6:28:27 PM EDT
Are you talking about a quick oh crap my home is getting invaded and I need to defend myself for a little while and then everything is back to normal or oh crap the world as we know it is now over. anything that requires batteries will be useless shortly after the end of the world because they will start dying and then replacements will get harder and harder to find. non battery powered optics and iron sights are the way to go in that situation.
Link Posted: 8/23/2010 6:54:00 AM EDT
For urban, I'd say an Eotech
Link Posted: 8/23/2010 7:01:39 AM EDT
Originally Posted By baxsom:
anything that requires batteries will be useless shortly after the end of the world because they will start dying and then replacements will get harder and harder to find.


An Aimpoint will last 5-8 years on one battery for the "end of the world" scenario. In 5-8 years ...

a. You will be dead like everyone else.
b. You have have an extensive arms collection taken off the bodies of dead looters.

Your bigger concern should be 5-8 weeks when the average joe sixpack runs out of food, cigarettes, and beer. They will be going door to door in small groups looking for what you socked away. You have to survive this initial onslaught to make it to the next level (5-8 years battery life on your Aimpoint).

Link Posted: 8/23/2010 11:03:58 AM EDT
Trijicon RX-30 - wicked fast.
Link Posted: 8/23/2010 11:12:23 AM EDT
Iron Sights?
Link Posted: 8/23/2010 11:19:42 AM EDT
I vote Aimpoint Comp M3 w/2 moa on a LaRue mount. It's tough, repeatable, and co-witness is perfect. No magnification needed for CQB, and still works well for area targets at longer range.
Link Posted: 8/23/2010 12:43:37 PM EDT
I live in a suburban/rural environment (suburban neighborhood surrounded by woods) I heard the ta33's bac is fast thats why i was turned on to it. as far SHTF is concerned it basically is just any situation that calls on my rifle for purposes outside of HD and practice. But for the sake of narrowing things down lets think long term, society has crumbled. This is my only rifle however and I'm only a 19y.o college sophomore so there is no "buy everything" option especially after the money I've dropped in it so far (girlfriend would kill me)
Link Posted: 8/23/2010 12:53:25 PM EDT
Originally Posted By fnslpmark112:
Originally Posted By baxsom:
anything that requires batteries will be useless shortly after the end of the world because they will start dying and then replacements will get harder and harder to find.


An Aimpoint will last 5-8 years on one battery for the "end of the world" scenario. In 5-8 years ...

a. You will be dead like everyone else.
b. You have have an extensive arms collection taken off the bodies of dead looters.

Your bigger concern should be 5-8 weeks when the average joe sixpack runs out of food, cigarettes, and beer. They will be going door to door in small groups looking for what you socked away. You have to survive this initial onslaught to make it to the next level (5-8 years battery life on your Aimpoint).



very well said, and i agree 100%

Link Posted: 8/23/2010 12:54:02 PM EDT
1. TR24
2. TA33
3. M3
Link Posted: 8/23/2010 2:27:13 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/23/2010 2:29:01 PM EDT by Judochop]
I have run all three of those mentioned in competition and the TR-24 green triangle is the one that stays!
Link Posted: 8/23/2010 3:13:30 PM EDT
Originally Posted By woode:
I think it depends on:

1. What is your definition of 'SHTF'? (world ending as we know it, localized natural disaster, world war, etc)

2. Where do you live? (urban environment, open farmland, woods, etc)

Protecting a farm in rural Illinois from the world ending vs a natural disaster in Manhatten would require two totally different optics.

I think the BEST would be the new S&B 1-8 Short Dot –– 1x Red Dot and 1x-8x mil-dot scope in one.




What if a series of natural disasters led to a world war and you were trapped in an urban environment trying to lead your loved ones to escape into the woods but had to first cross open farmland?
Could happen.


Link Posted: 8/23/2010 4:42:44 PM EDT
Originally Posted By TH-X15:
Originally Posted By woode:
I think it depends on:

1. What is your definition of 'SHTF'? (world ending as we know it, localized natural disaster, world war, etc)

2. Where do you live? (urban environment, open farmland, woods, etc)

Protecting a farm in rural Illinois from the world ending vs a natural disaster in Manhatten would require two totally different optics.

I think the BEST would be the new S&B 1-8 Short Dot –– 1x Red Dot and 1x-8x mil-dot scope in one.




What if a series of natural disasters led to a world war and you were trapped in an urban environment trying to lead your loved ones to escape into the woods but had to first cross open farmland?
Could happen.




EXACTLY lol some real travel shit

basically, what is the most anything goes ready to call to action optic for HD, firefight during SHTF / multiple targets stuff. I know a red dot is good an I know aimpoint is arguably king of red dots but I also know target acquisition is a must and so is toughness/ weight. I can't seem to figure out which of these is most important, I love the ta33 I think it looks great and from the pictures I've seen seems light. I've heard the tr24 isnt as durable as the other two, and 1x mag has its limitations. I have no experience with any of these optics and the only red dot experience I have is from my airsoft g36c
Link Posted: 8/23/2010 8:03:39 PM EDT
When shit hits the fan I'm running to an Aimpoint t-1 rifle with a fixed FSB and troy rear sights.
Link Posted: 8/23/2010 8:22:21 PM EDT
Aimpoint.......no doubt about it.
Link Posted: 8/23/2010 9:27:51 PM EDT
TA33.....tough, reliable, fast- almost as fast as my aimpoint at cqb, well worth the tiny bit in speed for the magnification/adversary ID.......

I have both and would ALWAYS choose the ACOG.
Link Posted: 8/23/2010 9:59:31 PM EDT
Originally Posted By sweet87supra:
Originally Posted By TH-X15:
Originally Posted By woode:
I think it depends on:

1. What is your definition of 'SHTF'? (world ending as we know it, localized natural disaster, world war, etc)
2. Where do you live? (urban environment, open farmland, woods, etc)
Protecting a farm in rural Illinois from the world ending vs a natural disaster in Manhatten would require two totally different optics.
I think the BEST would be the new S&B 1-8 Short Dot –– 1x Red Dot and 1x-8x mil-dot scope in one.


What if a series of natural disasters led to a world war and you were trapped in an urban environment trying to lead your loved ones to escape into the woods but had to first cross open farmland?
Could happen.

EXACTLY lol some real travel shit

basically, what is the most anything goes ready to call to action optic for HD, firefight during SHTF / multiple targets stuff. I know a red dot is good an I know aimpoint is arguably king of red dots but I also know target acquisition is a must and so is toughness/ weight. I can't seem to figure out which of these is most important, I love the ta33 I think it looks great and from the pictures I've seen seems light. I've heard the tr24 isnt as durable as the other two, and 1x mag has its limitations. I have no experience with any of these optics and the only red dot experience I have is from my airsoft g36c



This question is asked all the time, and respectfully, it is a little like asking "In a SHTF situation, what are the best size shoes to wear?"
The Jews in the Warsaw ghetto uprising might have been better served with Aimpoints. While the Resistance in the countryside might have been better served with Acogs. The Korean store owners during the L.A. riots? Aimpoints and Eotechs probably would be "best" (depending on just what anyone means by that term). In a situation such as in The Road (meaning having to make a long journey in an attempt to put distance between yourself and danger), I can imagine something with magnification might come more in handy.

Lately I have read posts here and there of people switching back to full size Aimpoints because they said they get on target a little quicker. Clearly that is a very important consideration. However if you think the circumstance may arise where you have to haul a rifle around 24/7, you are really going to feel every extra ounce you've slapped on it.

The little quip in my op was only mostly tongue in cheek. Who is to say in a SHTF one will not be trying to escape an unban environment to some wooded countryside and will need to cross lots of wide open terrain to get there?

The best advice I can give is this, if you in fact are an 'airsofter', in the name of all that is good and decent, never actually admit to it.


Link Posted: 8/23/2010 10:03:31 PM EDT
SHTF = practical = Aimpoint Comp M2/M3/M4 on a good sturdy mount.

4MOA is plenty accurate for this situation, only real question is how much battery life are you comfortable with...
Link Posted: 8/24/2010 2:52:53 AM EDT
TA31F for me. Non-urban environment.
Link Posted: 8/24/2010 6:32:43 AM EDT
I would go with a Leupold CQB. I think it's a much better solution than a Aimpoint + magnifier.
Link Posted: 8/24/2010 6:38:51 AM EDT
aimpoint comp m3

You probably won't live longer than the battery will in a real shtf world ending situation.
Link Posted: 8/24/2010 9:03:07 AM EDT
Originally Posted By fnslpmark112:
Get both. Use the TA33 with an Aimpoint T1 on a Larue offset mount. It is the best of both worlds.


This! AZHONKY
Link Posted: 8/24/2010 11:56:25 AM EDT
Ive heard the T1 is almost irrelevant when paired with the ta33 though from other forums as the ta33 is fast itself.
Link Posted: 8/24/2010 12:29:29 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/24/2010 12:31:09 PM EDT by fnslpmark112]
That is what I used to think. The TA11 or TA33 are great scopes. Even on close targets, they are amazingly fast. HOWEVER, the problem occurs when close targets are moving or you are moving. The ACOG is also much slower on multiple close targets (moving and stationary). Lighting can also cause a problem.

Having the T1 on the Larue offset mount is cheap insurance. My opinion is that you will never 100% know where your bad guy will appear. He could be a few feet away on a dead run or 200 yards hiding behind cover. The combination of the TA + T1 allows you to handle whatever comes your way hands-free and instantly without flipping a magnifier in place or adjusting your magnification manually (1-4x).

It is the perfect setup.
Link Posted: 8/24/2010 12:30:35 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/24/2010 1:22:00 PM EDT by JDJR]
ACOG or Aimpont M4-M3-M2

The 3.5 model ACOG is very fast unlike military issue one.

I am going ACOG with RMR on top or side...best of both worlds and I hate messing around with switches, power levels, flip mounts or other adjustments. Just raise and shoot as effortlessly as irons are the ACOG and RMR combo do that and are military grade.
Link Posted: 8/24/2010 4:35:54 PM EDT
I'm GTG with my Eotech.


Just ordered one of these from LaRue. It will do just fine as well.

TA-31RCO M4
Link Posted: 8/24/2010 5:18:11 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Pilk:
TA33.....tough, reliable, fast- almost as fast as my aimpoint at cqb, well worth the tiny bit in speed for the magnification/adversary ID.......

I have both and would ALWAYS choose the ACOG.


I agree with this. Money for only one, get the ACOG. I have the TA-33H. Amber horseshoe. Just as fast close up as my Aimpoint if you practice with it. Any my eyes aren't getting any younger. Need some magnification.
Link Posted: 8/24/2010 7:57:00 PM EDT
Link Posted: 8/25/2010 4:35:40 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/25/2010 5:06:17 AM EDT by DanTSX]
I'm in suburban CT, so I probably have the exact same SHTF scenario facing myself as well.

I just got yesterday an Aimpoint CompM2 (4 MOA) from SWFA's "sample list" for $430 shipped. It is the overruns from a kit that was being produced for the Army/Airforce exchange (AAFES). Not worried about the battery life. If SHTF and myself, last more than the 3 to 5 years that the batt does, I'll revert to my 20+ years of shooting irons. I'm more concerned about Katrina-length issues, so maybe 6 to 8 weeks of mayhem is my worst case scenario.

I think this has everything I'd need for a 5.56 gun in this state. Although SOME magnification would be nice to properly identify targets, I can always get a magnifier for this red dot. If I can't reach a target with this dot in CT, I need to step up to .308 at that point anyways.

As soon as my wallet recovers, I'll be buying up the first LaRue "po boy" magnifier that shows up on the EE. This is a neat little magnifier in a flip to side mount, that is actually a German Hendsholt (think Zeiss) optic that originally went with a recoilless rifle I think, or a rocket launcher or something, that LaRue had cut down, removed the reticle, and sold at a huge bargain with the only provision of it not having any warranty on the glass itself. They go for $75 to $150 on the EE when people give theirs up.


Link Posted: 8/25/2010 2:26:01 PM EDT


Two is one and one is none

Keep It Simple

Link Posted: 8/25/2010 3:38:30 PM EDT
my logic says aimpoint but my heart says ta33... tr24 pretty much ruled out btw
Link Posted: 8/25/2010 5:23:15 PM EDT
I would take my Trijicon TA31F.
Second choice would be my Aimpoint M2 4moa.
Link Posted: 8/25/2010 5:32:37 PM EDT

Originally Posted By TH-X15:
Originally Posted By sweet87supra:
Originally Posted By TH-X15:
Originally Posted By woode:
I think it depends on:

1. What is your definition of 'SHTF'? (world ending as we know it, localized natural disaster, world war, etc)
2. Where do you live? (urban environment, open farmland, woods, etc)
Protecting a farm in rural Illinois from the world ending vs a natural disaster in Manhatten would require two totally different optics.
I think the BEST would be the new S&B 1-8 Short Dot –– 1x Red Dot and 1x-8x mil-dot scope in one.


What if a series of natural disasters led to a world war and you were trapped in an urban environment trying to lead your loved ones to escape into the woods but had to first cross open farmland?
Could happen.

EXACTLY lol some real travel shit

basically, what is the most anything goes ready to call to action optic for HD, firefight during SHTF / multiple targets stuff. I know a red dot is good an I know aimpoint is arguably king of red dots but I also know target acquisition is a must and so is toughness/ weight. I can't seem to figure out which of these is most important, I love the ta33 I think it looks great and from the pictures I've seen seems light. I've heard the tr24 isnt as durable as the other two, and 1x mag has its limitations. I have no experience with any of these optics and the only red dot experience I have is from my airsoft g36c



This question is asked all the time, and respectfully, it is a little like asking "In a SHTF situation, what are the best size shoes to wear?"
The Jews in the Warsaw ghetto uprising might have been better served with Aimpoints. While the Resistance in the countryside might have been better served with Acogs. The Korean store owners during the L.A. riots? Aimpoints and Eotechs probably would be "best" (depending on just what anyone means by that term). In a situation such as in The Road (meaning having to make a long journey in an attempt to put distance between yourself and danger), I can imagine something with magnification might come more in handy.

Lately I have read posts here and there of people switching back to full size Aimpoints because they said they get on target a little quicker. Clearly that is a very important consideration. However if you think the circumstance may arise where you have to haul a rifle around 24/7, you are really going to feel every extra ounce you've slapped on it.

The little quip in my op was only mostly tongue in cheek. Who is to say in a SHTF one will not be trying to escape an unban environment to some wooded countryside and will need to cross lots of wide open terrain to get there?

The best advice I can give is this, if you in fact are an 'airsofter', in the name of all that is good and decent, never actually admit to it.



then they are not using the sight correctly. you don't look through the aimpoint with one eye like a scope. you keep both eyes open and focus on the target. the smaller diameter of the aimpoint micro's body = less sight in the way. the micro is superior in every way except one.... NO ARD! actually you can rubberband a piece of womans nylon over the front and it will cut reflection.

Link Posted: 8/25/2010 5:42:49 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Deeeeviant:
It honestly depends on what you consider shtf, and where your AO is.


This. If you live in the rural southwest, then you may have chance of needing to make a 500-600 yard shot. Here in northeastern Georgia, open spaces over 250-300 yards are hard to come by.

Most bad guys won't be snipers; I suspect they'll be sneaky types who want to get close to you & your stuff before you know they're there. A red-dot like an Aimpoint or an Eotech would be ideal for such problems.
YMMV

Link Posted: 8/25/2010 5:45:09 PM EDT
This is simple:
Perimeter weapon - ACOG
Door kicker weapon - Aimpoint
Link Posted: 8/25/2010 5:47:27 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/26/2010 5:24:46 PM EDT by easy610]
Iron sights....easy to use, quite robust and battery life is fantastic.
Link Posted: 8/25/2010 5:47:29 PM EDT
I bought an Aimpoint.
Link Posted: 8/26/2010 9:39:52 AM EDT
I plan on an EOtech 512 with flip to side LaRue magnifier... Best of both worlds. I just hope it will be heavy duty enough to be abused when SHTF.
Link Posted: 8/26/2010 1:50:58 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/26/2010 1:53:57 PM EDT by Hokie]
Originally Posted By TheOtherDave:
Given that SHTF might mean more than shooting under 100 yards, I'd go with the TA33 if the scope is going on a 5.56/223 rifle. It might be marginally slower than a red dot under 100 yards, but it's going to be a HELL of a lot better at 600!



At 600....that .223 needs to be enlarged to a .308 I'd jump on a TA33 too if I wasn't surround by a typical <300 yard shooting venue.
Link Posted: 8/26/2010 1:52:28 PM EDT
Originally Posted By RabidMonkeyPox:
When shit hits the fan I'm running to an Aimpoint t-1 rifle with a fixed FSB and troy rear sights.


Wouldn't everyone? I know I would!
Link Posted: 8/26/2010 6:54:20 PM EDT
Link Posted: 8/26/2010 6:55:36 PM EDT
Personnally... I went with the Aimpoint M4s on a Bobro mount. Simple, easy to use, unbelievable battery life, tough as a tank (I beleive the company rep used to throw the optic across the demo range pick it up, dust it off and remount it and but for the scratches, it was fully functional) and a more commonly available battery( AA's are pretty much universal worldwide). and the 2moa dot allows you to turn down the intensity for reasonably good long distance accuracy.
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