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11/22/2017 10:05:29 PM
Posted: 10/7/2004 10:24:03 AM EST
i don't understand the reasoning for this. why not just get a 16" with a regular FS or does the 5.5" FS kill all of the muzzle flash? won't this short barrel kill ballistics? accuracy? the overall length is still 16" so what are you ganing?

enlighten me...
Link Posted: 10/7/2004 10:29:12 AM EST
a cool factor of "11"

a 14.5 with a vortex eliminates all muzzle flash, so it ain't that.

kill ballistics? yup. a great deal.

lose accuracy? yup. a bit.


but an 11" gun looks so COOL!
Link Posted: 10/7/2004 10:33:39 AM EST
I love mine and it has been very accurate for a short carbine at 100m with quality ammo (2moa), although I usually shoot it at 50m with a red dot (Comp ML2). I know some will say the 5.5" is a waste that could better be used for additional barrel length, but I really like mine.

Why a 11.5"? It's a personal thing I guess.
Link Posted: 10/7/2004 10:35:54 AM EST
I've never understood the attraction either.

A fake suppressor? I can see it on a Krink, Uzi, or MP5 clone, as the skinny barrels just look silly.

But on an AR?

It seems silly.

But hey, ymmv.
Link Posted: 10/7/2004 10:36:49 AM EST
In my narrow view, its looks only and because you can. Muzzle flash is increased with the shorter barrels and it does lessen the ballistic capabilities of the weapon. Accuracy is not affected by barrel length. You gain nothing and lose velocity with increased flash. A 16" with either the Phantom or Vortex would be an overall good choice. Some will say to get a 14.5" with permanently installed FH. That's fine if you will never get a suppressor or you don't live in a Class 3 state. Some will choose the 14.5" with permanently installed Bilock FH. That's fine too, if you want to go with just the option of 2 suppressor manufacturers.
I personally went with the 16" barrel with Vortex, and will mate that with a Soundtech or XXX can.
Link Posted: 10/7/2004 10:37:35 AM EST
Link Posted: 10/7/2004 10:46:15 AM EST
thanks for the replies, i just wasn't sure if i was missing something other than a persoanl preference.
Link Posted: 10/7/2004 10:52:16 AM EST
[Last Edit: 10/7/2004 10:52:31 AM EST by Mulliga]
Is it any easier to take off the welded FH when you SBR such a rifle? If so, that might be a motivation.
Link Posted: 10/7/2004 10:52:48 AM EST
[Last Edit: 10/7/2004 10:53:55 AM EST by _DR]

Originally Posted By bob332:
thanks for the replies, i just wasn't sure if i was missing something other than a persoanl preference.



Well there is the advantage of easier conversion to an 11.5 SBR if that is an aspiration. I hope to register mine at some point, at which time I can take out the pins in the 5.5" FH, throw it away and put on a $40 vortex FH, where if I had a 16" barrel I would have to either buy a new barrel for $150-$200 or cut down the existing barrel (not something I would enjoy doing), after the approval was received from the BATF.

I have always had the SBR option in mind, so that is another notable factor IMHO.
Link Posted: 10/7/2004 11:35:22 AM EST
Why are there people that wear baseball hats that don't play baseball?

Why are there people who wear basketball/tennis sneakers not play tennis?

Why buy a sports car when you can't go as fast as you want?

Why buy an SUV when you don't plan of going off roading?

Because you like it and you can.

Some people like the old CAR look. Who am I to judge?
Link Posted: 10/7/2004 12:02:38 PM EST

I'd love to hear one advantage the 11.5" + 5.5" FS barrels have over a 16".


Ballpark Launcher (TM)

insert a raw Ballpark hotdog into the 5.5 FH (the chicken franks are skinnier and fit better)

load carbine with blanks. I say again, "blanks"

gestimate elevation for launching ballpark at intended target

fire away*

The action should cycle, so reload hotdog from the Frank Pouch(TM) on your belt with ALICE clips

re-aim, adjust angle, whatever

Fire for Effect



(* note: Most likely all you'll end up with is a messy way to explode hotdogs in your FH, but try at your own risk.)


Disclaimer: Parody -- attempt only if you are a trained stunt hotdog shooter or a raving idiot.

In all seriousness, I have a civilian-legal XM-177 look alike, and its a lot of fun, but suffers balistically, and the 1-12 barrel really keyholes the cheap 62 gr. russian fodder even at 50 ft.

Cheers, Otto
Link Posted: 10/7/2004 12:19:39 PM EST
I have 6 AR's at this point. And that 11.5 with the 5 FH is probably my favorite. The accuracy at 100 yds is good enough. Its not the one I would take to shoot wood chucks. But if somebody goes sneaking around my house a 3am, that the gun I would grab. He would find a laser dot on his chest and lit up with lite I have on it. I think he would find it rather intimidating.
Link Posted: 10/7/2004 1:09:50 PM EST
[Last Edit: 10/7/2004 1:10:31 PM EST by El_Roto]

Originally Posted By bob332:
i don't understand the reasoning for this.



It's obvious....

They're compensating for something.


Link Posted: 10/7/2004 1:14:31 PM EST
Cuz it just looks cool

Link Posted: 10/7/2004 1:16:56 PM EST

Originally Posted By El_Roto:

Originally Posted By bob332:
i don't understand the reasoning for this.



It's obvious....

They're compensating for something.





In my case, compensating for the fact that I already had every other possible AR combination, and still had a couple of lowers left to build on 9/13. That said, it's really a novelty - just for fun. Since when did shooting something that is really loud and makes huge fireballs cease to be fun? And just who says you can't own an AR just for fun??
Link Posted: 10/7/2004 2:16:28 PM EST
It went right over his head.

<sigh>
Link Posted: 10/7/2004 3:02:12 PM EST

Originally Posted By El_Roto:
It went right over his head.

<sigh>



No it didn't - I just don't have to compensate for "something else" - all squared away on that front!
Link Posted: 10/7/2004 5:56:14 PM EST
I just put the XM-177 barrel on my Bushmaster, it's loud, it throws a huge flame out the muzzle.
Why did I want that? Simple. The same reason I run headers and dual glasspacks on my '77 chevy. Me like loud things! I am quite the show off.
Link Posted: 10/7/2004 6:02:21 PM EST
I think the best answer could be because they want to. Why question it? I don't have one like this but to each his own, I think they are cool looking.
Link Posted: 10/7/2004 6:09:30 PM EST
As for a defensive weapon...it makes NO SENSE! As for a collectors item...makes ok sense. As for the fact that it looks cool....it looks kinda bad but that is just my opinion. Maybe we should have a poll on whether or not it does look better than a standard M4...
Link Posted: 10/7/2004 6:13:59 PM EST

Originally Posted By ALPHA9000:
Maybe we should have a poll on whether or not it does look better than a standard M4...



And the results of this poll would be used how? Going to make me sit in the corner if folks dont like 11.5s?

Im going to start a poll and then kick everyone off the site if they dont agree with my opinion, yea thats the ticket, or make their siglines "Im an asshat"

Link Posted: 10/7/2004 6:41:10 PM EST

Originally Posted By Vinnie:
Why are there people that wear baseball hats that don't play baseball?



To keep the sun out of my eyes.



Why are there people who wear basketball/tennis sneakers not play tennis?



Because they are comfortable.



Why buy a sports car when you can't go as fast as you want?



Because they accelerate quickly, and handle well.



Why buy an SUV when you don't plan of going off roading?



Because I can fit 9 adults plus luggage in it.


Why get an 11.5" barrel with 5.5" FS?? No fricken reason. Weapon choice should be based on functionality, not "bling bling" factor. It's the same as the guy who hangs a fake grenade launcher on his AR. Why?? Ooh you look cool!! If it's for looks why not just buy Airsoft and make it look however you want.
Link Posted: 10/7/2004 7:09:43 PM EST
[Last Edit: 10/7/2004 7:10:10 PM EST by gmtmaster]
11.5" x 5.5" ?? I have that combo..

Floats my boat..
Link Posted: 10/7/2004 7:18:14 PM EST
Doesn't someone make a 5 " flash hider that fits over the 16 " barrel , hence giving it the "cool look" and not hurting accuracy?
Link Posted: 10/7/2004 7:23:52 PM EST

Originally Posted By sobekra70:
Doesn't someone make a 5 " flash hider that fits over the 16 " barrel , hence giving it the "cool look" and not hurting accuracy?



Aahhh!!! Dangit!! That's like putting fake 14" wheel-cover spinners on your car.
Link Posted: 10/7/2004 7:27:16 PM EST
[Last Edit: 10/7/2004 7:27:57 PM EST by shortcycle]

Originally Posted By El_Roto:

It's obvious....

They're compensating for something.





Yeah man, it gives me a whole 5.5" of compensating.

Who says chicks don't dig dudes that go "bang" and throw a big fireball when they pull the trigger?

Hell, I just got mine on an accident. It turns out it's pretty damn fun! It's even cooler when I stand in the garage and shoot out the door. Man, you want to talk about having a BLAST! Ear protection strongly recommended!
Link Posted: 10/7/2004 7:32:56 PM EST
At real world distances its plenty of legnth and I have to admit I got it for looks.If I had a license for an SBR it would be one but with a normal birdcage supressor to realy get the compact advantage the 11.5 offers in that configuration.In any event try this site www.isayeret.com and see how the IDF employs the 11.5 it will surprise you.
Link Posted: 10/7/2004 7:33:01 PM EST
[Last Edit: 10/7/2004 7:35:43 PM EST by MaverickMkii]
...Because they can? (+1 on the personal preferrence. I don't have 11.5" either...I think 14.5" is the bare minimum for 5.56mm based platform, but 11.5" with good ammo will still outperform SMGs anyway.)
Link Posted: 10/8/2004 1:43:58 AM EST
I have a new Bushy 11.5/5.5 FH. I got it because I liked the look; I used to carry a GAU in the Air Force. I know all about the ballistics etc. But I just like the look and balance of the carbine in this configuration. At 100yds and in you don't lose so much ballistics that the round won't be effective. I don't think I've lost that much. To each his own. Yes I will get an M4 upper at some point, but this works for me now. My 2 cents for what it's worth.
Link Posted: 10/8/2004 5:24:56 AM EST

Originally Posted By ALPHA9000:
As for a defensive weapon...it makes NO SENSE! As for a collectors item...makes ok sense. As for the fact that it looks cool....it looks kinda bad but that is just my opinion. Maybe we should have a poll on whether or not it does look better than a standard M4...



You know everyone thinks that a short barrel makes a rifle ineffective and I guess if you were shooting out at long distances you would be right. I agree that 11.5" barrel has accuracy and velocity loss but if I recall correctly SF Mike forces used 11.5" XM177E2's in Vietnam and they had a pretty good kill rate with them. I think for defensive reasons I would trust an 11.5" barrel out to at least 200M. I don't have one of these so there is no way for me to be sure of this, it is just a thought.
Link Posted: 10/8/2004 6:08:02 AM EST

Originally Posted By SNorman:

Originally Posted By Vinnie:
Why are there people that wear baseball hats that don't play baseball?



To keep the sun out of my eyes.



Why are there people who wear basketball/tennis sneakers not play tennis?



Because they are comfortable.



Why buy a sports car when you can't go as fast as you want?



Because they accelerate quickly, and handle well.



Why buy an SUV when you don't plan of going off roading?



Because I can fit 9 adults plus luggage in it.


Why get an 11.5" barrel with 5.5" FS?? No fricken reason. Weapon choice should be based on functionality, not "bling bling" factor. It's the same as the guy who hangs a fake grenade launcher on his AR. Why?? Ooh you look cool!! If it's for looks why not just buy Airsoft and make it look however you want.



I tend to agree with this analogy although, I still don't know what the hell "bling bling" is.
Link Posted: 10/8/2004 6:19:05 AM EST
From Dictionary.com


Main Entry: bling bling
Function: noun
Definition: jewelry, often gaudy or ostentatious
Etymology: from the sound it makes
Usage: slang


Link Posted: 10/8/2004 6:27:02 AM EST
I live in MI and I can't own an SBR, but I built an 11.5"/5.5" for 77gr SMK load development, should the ability to own an SBR come my way. That way, I'll have the load data immediately available when needed.
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