Warning

 

Close

Confirm Action

Are you sure you wish to do this?

Confirm Cancel
PSA
Member Login

Site Notices
9/23/2020 3:47:02 PM
Posted: 10/18/2008 3:22:00 AM EDT
I was thinking of the kinds of stuff I wanted to buy in the next few months, in case of another ban .etc, and my priority is utility and practicality.

One of the things I have been considering getting is an Ar-15 pistol for close quarters to use in unison with my Heavy Barrel Varmint rifle. I like the idea of having the same parts, magazines, and ammo, and the Ar Pistol would weigh a lot less than another smg and its ammo and mags.

Below is what I have to work with. Constructive Input and advice on these builds and options would be great. Also any advice on what I lack or need to buy. I’ve got ammo and mags covered. I’ve also got an Ak if that’s needed as well as good bolt guns and SKS .etc

I currently have the following options to work with for Daylight stuff. The far left rifle is my girlfriend’s build.



For night stuff I have the following. The Night Vision upper would be swapped between my Varmint or M4 lower. Unless I could find a way to swap scopes without losing my zero. I originally was going to use an m1 before I discovered the SSS ammo, but the scope prevented shells from ejecting, and the gun jammed every time.



Preferred:
For Day carry both the heavy varmint rifle and an Ar-15 Pistol for CQB
(Should I build an AR pistol or is there a better option?)

For Night carry the 20” upper with ATN night scope. Use Ciener Kit with 60Gr .22lr SSS (Sub-Sonic Sniper) ammo. Secondary Weapon: Smith and Wesson .40. (.223 Ar pistols flash would probably be blinding and very obvious at night so I rule it out unless I’ve got no other choice. I however, could also run a ciener kit in it as well and fix this problem. Suggestions?)

Thanks
Link Posted: 10/18/2008 3:43:30 AM EDT
Link Posted: 10/18/2008 3:50:45 AM EDT
Carry the pistol for SHTF. The others will get you shot as a threat.

It would suck to have some 80 year old man pop you with his 30-30 Winchester because you were sneaking around wearing tactical gear, & sporting a "machine gun" in his neck of the woods.

Unless the world goes "Road Warrior", you'd be better off looking as non-threatening as posssible.
Link Posted: 10/18/2008 3:55:02 AM EDT
 The very top carbine . Thats all you need. Back up is the M14 . But a Synthetic USGI stock would be  better for a SHTF . Lighter/ practical but still very durable. While fancy is  Tacticool. It isn't normally needed. A scope is something to have. You will want to keep distance between you and Zombies..  Never put your self at high risk... If your thinking building clearing just remember it's a high risk move that ends up with a lot of casualties. Don't be one. The carbine will do just fine. No need in a  pistol type  anything other than a Glock or 1911 on your hip. IMO Cheers WarDawg
Link Posted: 10/18/2008 3:55:40 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 10/18/2008 3:56:24 AM EDT by cerberus212]
I plan buying a good light eventually, which I hope I can always get even after a ban. I could duct tape one to it as well, and spend the saved $100+on something ban related.

Awhile back I asked about what type of slings I should get, still have not decided. I want something comfortable that will support the weight of the Varmint. If I get a pistol Ar I want a sling that will let it hang at my side, so I can use it right away without worrying about removing the sling from my shoulder.
Link Posted: 10/18/2008 4:00:55 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 10/18/2008 4:06:19 AM EDT by cerberus212]

Originally Posted By M4builder:
Carry the pistol for SHTF. The others will get you shot as a threat.

It would suck to have some 80 year old man pop you with his 30-30 Winchester because you were sneaking around wearing tactical gear, & sporting a "machine gun" in his neck of the woods.

Unless the world goes "Road Warrior", you'd be better off looking as non-threatening as posssible.


Agreed, I don't plan on being a wanderer unless it is Road Warrior world lol. I want to protect my land, family, and assists. I hope I would have a place to call home in which I could switch out stuff at night time or daytime. I plan on keeping distance at all cost, so I opt for the accuracy and the range of the Varmint.

The M14 doesn't have that great of accuracy. I'm getting around 1.5 - 2 m.o.a with it. The added range it has would seem pointless if I can't shoot accurately. I've tried Federal Gold ammo with no better luck. Probably could use a better scope, but pointless without good accuracy.
Link Posted: 10/18/2008 4:06:03 AM EDT

SBR that carbine and get a 10.5" upper. add a light and call it done.

Link Posted: 10/18/2008 5:22:27 AM EDT
Link Posted: 10/18/2008 6:01:04 AM EDT

Originally Posted By M4builder:
Carry the pistol for SHTF. The others will get you shot as a threat.

It would suck to have some 80 year old man pop you with his 30-30 Winchester because you were sneaking around wearing tactical gear, & sporting a "machine gun" in his neck of the woods.

Unless the world goes "Road Warrior", you'd be better off looking as non-threatening as posssible.


LOL...so true
Link Posted: 10/18/2008 6:08:14 AM EDT

Originally Posted By cerberus212:

Originally Posted By M4builder:
Carry the pistol for SHTF. The others will get you shot as a threat.

It would suck to have some 80 year old man pop you with his 30-30 Winchester because you were sneaking around wearing tactical gear, & sporting a "machine gun" in his neck of the woods.

Unless the world goes "Road Warrior", you'd be better off looking as non-threatening as posssible.


Agreed, I don't plan on being a wanderer unless it is Road Warrior world lol. I want to protect my land, family, and assists. I hope I would have a place to call home in which I could switch out stuff at night time or daytime. I plan on keeping distance at all cost, so I opt for the accuracy and the range of the Varmint.

The M14 doesn't have that great of accuracy. I'm getting around 1.5 - 2 m.o.a with it. The added range it has would seem pointless if I can't shoot accurately. I've tried Federal Gold ammo with no better luck. Probably could use a better scope, but pointless without good accuracy.

2 MOA is more than adequate to hit a torso at 500-600 yards....  Consider a torso being 20 inches wide, even at 800 yards your "bad" 2 MOA grouping is 16 inches.  Its not made for match shooting- its made for bad guy shooting.
Link Posted: 10/18/2008 7:17:30 AM EDT

Originally Posted By QUIB:

Originally Posted By M4builder:
Carry the pistol for SHTF. The others will get you shot as a threat.

It would suck to have some 80 year old man pop you with his 30-30 Winchester because you were sneaking around wearing tactical gear, & sporting a "machine gun" in his neck of the woods.

Unless the world goes "Road Warrior", you'd be better off looking as non-threatening as posssible.



+1

I believe in a true SHTF scenario it’ll be your neighbors you’ll have to defend yourself from. The guy trying to steal the BBQ cylinder from your backyard. Or the guy siphoning gas from your vehicle.  

With gas approaching $4 per gallon, there was lots of siphoning going on around my neighborhood, as well as vehicle break-ins.

Look at the looting during Katrina, and multiply that.

That is why I always get a kick out of these SHTF scenarios where folks have these fantasies about “Red Dawn”. It makes me wonder if they really give any thought to these situations. Any serious thought.  


It's all fantasy, in fact there have never been few if any situations that would warrant civilians to own assault weapons, but that doesn't mean im going to turn mine in. I guess we all these things to fullfill our fantasies. However, if you are going to buy the toys, you might as well by the ones that are useful in worst cause fantasy situations.

I'm from the state that brought you the Jena 6, and I've seen some crazy stuff as a result of that, that got me thinking. I've never been to Jena, nor really heard of it for that matter, but we still people running through Brookshire Brothers grocery store acting like animals. The police had to remove 100's from the parking lot. Still trying to understand what a grocery store had to do with it lol. I majored in Psychology, so I know a good bit about how people can get when they get in herds. Africa and Burma are good examples.

I pray that the world will find some way to improve itself, but with the population growing beyond control, and resources dwindling I think we will see a lot of desperation in the next 50 years, if not the emergence of a socialist government. The rifles I buy today may be the best thing my grandchildren will have.
Link Posted: 10/18/2008 7:23:03 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 10/18/2008 7:24:31 AM EDT by cerberus212]

2 MOA is more than adequate to hit a torso at 500-600 yards....  Consider a torso being 20 inches wide, even at 800 yards your "bad" 2 MOA grouping is 16 inches.  Its not made for match shooting- its made for bad guy shooting.


My .223 Varmint shoots .5 moa and can reach out about that far. Just need to be sure I have the extra practice for compensating for Wind, since the smaller round will see more deviation.

I havn't weighed the varmint and m14, but they fill about the same empty. Counting extra mags and ammo the varmint should be a bit lighter.
Link Posted: 10/18/2008 7:53:09 AM EDT
I think your all set the only thing I would add is a 12 gauge shotgun.
Link Posted: 10/18/2008 8:04:24 AM EDT

Originally Posted By cerberus212:
For Night carry the 20” upper with ATN night scope. Use Ciener Kit with 60Gr .22lr SSS (Sub-Sonic Sniper) ammo. Secondary Weapon: Smith and Wesson .40. (.223 Ar pistols flash would probably be blinding and very obvious at night so I rule it out unless I’ve got no other choice. I however, could also run a ciener kit in it as well and fix this problem. Suggestions?)

Thanks


Am i the only one who sees a problem here? Why use 22lr? In shtf i'm using 75gr hpbt then all of my 55gr 5.56! By the time i have to go to 22lr i'll probably be dead.
Link Posted: 10/18/2008 8:51:14 AM EDT

Originally Posted By cerberus212:

Originally Posted By QUIB:

Originally Posted By M4builder:
Carry the pistol for SHTF. The others will get you shot as a threat.

It would suck to have some 80 year old man pop you with his 30-30 Winchester because you were sneaking around wearing tactical gear, & sporting a "machine gun" in his neck of the woods.

Unless the world goes "Road Warrior", you'd be better off looking as non-threatening as posssible.



+1
       I personaly dont think the world is coming to an end in my life time.How ever I WISH IT WOULD if nothing else just to prove a point to my wife about all my fine weapons (LOL)

I believe in a true SHTF scenario it’ll be your neighbors you’ll have to defend yourself from. The guy trying to steal the BBQ cylinder from your backyard. Or the guy siphoning gas from your vehicle.  

With gas approaching $4 per gallon, there was lots of siphoning going on around my neighborhood, as well as vehicle break-ins.

Look at the looting during Katrina, and multiply that.

That is why I always get a kick out of these SHTF scenarios where folks have these fantasies about “Red Dawn”. It makes me wonder if they really give any thought to these situations. Any serious thought.  


It's all fantasy, in fact there have never been few if any situations that would warrant civilians to own assault weapons, but that doesn't mean im going to turn mine in. I guess we all these things to fullfill our fantasies. However, if you are going to buy the toys, you might as well by the ones that are useful in worst cause fantasy situations.

I'm from the state that brought you the Jena 6, and I've seen some crazy stuff as a result of that, that got me thinking. I've never been to Jena, nor really heard of it for that matter, but we still people running through Brookshire Brothers grocery store acting like animals. The police had to remove 100's from the parking lot. Still trying to understand what a grocery store had to do with it lol. I majored in Psychology, so I know a good bit about how people can get when they get in herds. Africa and Burma are good examples.

I pray that the world will find some way to improve itself, but with the population growing beyond control, and resources dwindling I think we will see a lot of desperation in the next 50 years, if not the emergence of a socialist government. The rifles I buy today may be the best thing my grandchildren will have.
Link Posted: 10/18/2008 8:55:59 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 10/18/2008 8:59:24 AM EDT by cerberus212]

Am i the only one who sees a problem here? Why use 22lr? In shtf i'm using 75gr hpbt then all of my 55gr 5.56! By the time i have to go to 22lr i'll probably be dead.


Why wouldn't I want sub-sonic ammo for night time? I doubt my night scope would be much use beyond 200 yards, so I wouldn't want to shoot anything super-sonic and have the flash and sound make it obvious where I am at.

A 60gr .22lr bullet packs more punch than a 55gr .223 bullet if they are both traveling sub-sonic. A 75gr bullet isn't going to cause much more damage at those speeds either since it probably will lack the velocity to expand and fragment. Might as well save on the weight and ammo cost, and use something I can hunt small critters with.

Thats just based on my limited experience, so correct me if my logic is wrong. I also don't think my 1/9 rifles can stabilize the 75gr stuff you are shooting.
Link Posted: 10/18/2008 9:12:08 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 10/18/2008 9:14:40 AM EDT by Uni-Vibe]

Originally Posted By QUIB:

Originally Posted By M4builder:
Carry the pistol for SHTF. The others will get you shot as a threat.

It would suck to have some 80 year old man pop you with his 30-30 Winchester because you were sneaking around wearing tactical gear, & sporting a "machine gun" in his neck of the woods.

Unless the world goes "Road Warrior", you'd be better off looking as non-threatening as posssible.



+1

I believe in a true SHTF scenario it’ll be your neighbors you’ll have to defend yourself from. The guy trying to steal the BBQ cylinder from your backyard. Or the guy siphoning gas from your vehicle.  

With gas approaching $4 per gallon, there was lots of siphoning going on around my neighborhood, as well as vehicle break-ins.

Look at the looting during Katrina, and multiply that.

That is why I always get a kick out of these SHTF scenarios where folks have these fantasies about “Red Dawn”. It makes me wonder if they really give any thought to these situations. Any serious thought.  


For once I have to disagree with the Quib-meister about the nature of the threat.  Depending of course on the quality of your neighbors.  LA riots start--neighbors banded together to block streets, let in only people that lived there, defended themselves with what guns were (then) allowed them.  Few shots were fired.

Hurricane Ike--neighbors banded together, vigilance was heightened, watched their 'hoods, no shots as far as I know were fired.


But I agree that all this afrcom stuff about a hundred mags loaded with TAP is Walter Mitty fantasy.  One AR with one magazine is all you'll ever need.  Riot comes up your street?  You think they're going to stick around while you fire 30 or 3000 shots?  Nah.  They see an armed man, they go the other way.  If you ever have to fire more than 30 rounds, you're in a lot more trouble than one solitary arfcommer can handle, anyway.

After Ike--a bona fide natural disaster that briefly paralyzed one of the Nation's largest cities--the big worry was not how much ammo you had stashed, or how many different guns you had, it was could you find generator fuel, who had a pharmacy open, whose phone worked so you could check on relatives, etc.  
Link Posted: 10/18/2008 9:20:52 AM EDT
If the S ever really does HTF, you are not going to be able to deploy multiple rifles. It just isn't practical or logical. Pick one, set it up correctly and then build\buy another one just like it as a backup.

Looking at what you have, assuming the top AR in the top photo is a quality AR that has proven to be reliable, I would focus on that one. Remove the carry handle and cheap optics and install a quality optic with a quality mount. Then get a good BUIS (Troy would be my choice) and a good sling (Vicker's 2 point is my choice here). As a final touch, install a good weapon light. After that is done (and assuming your are GTG ammo and mag wise), I would direct my money towords training and building another AR just like it.

That's my $.02 anyway
Link Posted: 10/18/2008 9:23:22 AM EDT

Originally Posted By cerberus212:





It's all fantasy, in fact there have never been few if any situations that would warrant civilians to own assault weapons......
.




Ummm how about the second ammendment.  This statement sounds like something a gun grabber uses to support confiscation.  See the beauty of having the U.S. Constitution, is we are not required to justify the ownership of our firearms, even "assault weapons".

o.k. I'm off my soap box...
Link Posted: 10/18/2008 10:14:14 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 10/18/2008 10:24:07 AM EDT by cerberus212]

Originally Posted By cbr954:

Originally Posted By cerberus212:





It's all fantasy, in fact there have never been few if any situations that would warrant civilians to own assault weapons......
.




Ummm how about the second ammendment.  This statement sounds like something a gun grabber uses to support confiscation.  See the beauty of having the U.S. Constitution, is we are not required to justify the ownership of our firearms, even "assault weapons".

o.k. I'm off my soap box...


Couldn't see the sarcasm and irony in that lol? Might be preaching to the choir :-).
Link Posted: 10/18/2008 10:19:16 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 10/18/2008 10:23:37 AM EDT by cerberus212]

Remove the carry handle and cheap optics and install a quality optic with a quality mount. Then get a good BUIS (Troy would be my choice) and a good sling (Vicker's 2 point is my choice here).


The top is a Bushmaster HBAR
I don't hear many reviews about the Redfield ESD, I guess because it is older, but it isn't exactly a cheap sight. They cost more than $300 even today. Is there something I should know about it?
Why should I get a flip BUIS when the Carry handle already has one? I don't exactly like the idea of changing out the front sight post on my KISS factory gun unless theres some serious reason for going with a different setup.

Thanks for all the input thus far, keep it coming, really enjoying the education.
Link Posted: 10/18/2008 11:53:55 AM EDT
Link Posted: 10/18/2008 12:07:52 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 10/18/2008 12:15:13 PM EDT by Foxnews_FTW]

Originally Posted By cerberus212:

Am i the only one who sees a problem here? Why use 22lr? In shtf i'm using 75gr hpbt then all of my 55gr 5.56! By the time i have to go to 22lr i'll probably be dead.


Why wouldn't I want sub-sonic ammo for night time? I doubt my night scope would be much use beyond 200 yards, so I wouldn't want to shoot anything super-sonic and have the flash and sound make it obvious where I am at.
Then get an SBR. Most guys with their ARs say you're not very likely to shoot at anything over 300 yards. As for flash? It's called a flash hider for a reason . No really though, if you want to be a secret squirrel, get a suppressor, and don't bother with a round that has terrible ballistics. If you're shooting at someone at 200 yars with a .22lr- if you make those hits? They most likely won't put the target down. If .22lr was good at that, We'd probably be issuing that to troops. Now make the .22lr subsonic- and you have a round that has no place being used on something bigger than a raccoon.


A 60gr .22lr bullet packs more punch than a 55gr .223 bullet if they are both traveling sub-sonic. A 75gr bullet isn't going to cause much more damage at those speeds either since it probably will lack the velocity to expand and fragment. Might as well save on the weight and ammo cost, and use something I can hunt small critters with.

Thats just based on my limited experience, so correct me if my logic is wrong. I also don't think my 1/9 rifles can stabilize the 75gr stuff you are shooting.
Then use the other flavors of TAP- or other 5.56 stuff, they all work


Don't bother with the subsonic or the .22lr.  Using .22lr will most likely get you killed. Odds are- if you're shooting  at someone ELSE who is armed, you are out gunned with the neutered .22lr. It's still going to be loud enough to attract attention. Maybe your location will be less discernable from the lower noise- if that concerns you THAT  much get suppressor. Either way at night, if this is an end of days situation- they can't see you. They'll be too panicked from noise- and seeing their fellow tango down next to them to wonder where the flash is- then return fire to something they can't see- full well knowing what their opponent can do. To use .22lr, and then go subsonic... You might as well throw rocks if you want to be quiet and do as little damage as possible.


I don't understand using subsonic .22lr at ALL.

I mean, 5.56/.223 gets a bad rap for being an underpowered caliber- but your'e opting for .22lr which is just so much less powerful, and then you're going to for the subsonic flavor Dude, really, I mean I'm trying not to sound like a dick here- but I don't want you to get killed should you ever need to use your rifle to save your life!

Ideally, use a .308. "Whatever he hits? he destroys!"
Link Posted: 10/18/2008 12:10:54 PM EDT

Originally Posted By cerberus212:

2 MOA is more than adequate to hit a torso at 500-600 yards....  Consider a torso being 20 inches wide, even at 800 yards your "bad" 2 MOA grouping is 16 inches.  Its not made for match shooting- its made for bad guy shooting.


My .223 Varmint shoots .5 moa and can reach out about that far. Just need to be sure I have the extra practice for compensating for Wind, since the smaller round will see more deviation.

I havn't weighed the varmint and m14, but they fill about the same empty. Counting extra mags and ammo the varmint should be a bit lighter.


Lets put it this way: there is a reason why the military has redeployed M14s in the sandbox, and it isn't for superior accuracy.  

Link Posted: 10/18/2008 12:18:10 PM EDT
I say keep the M4 and start making M14s again and no need to find a replacement weapon.
Link Posted: 10/18/2008 12:20:05 PM EDT
I think your top 16" carbine would be the best.  I would remove the sight you have on now and stick with iron sights or buy a back-up rear sight and an Aimpoint CompM2.
Link Posted: 10/18/2008 1:24:31 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Uni-Vibe:

Originally Posted By QUIB:

Originally Posted By M4builder:
Carry the pistol for SHTF. The others will get you shot as a threat.

It would suck to have some 80 year old man pop you with his 30-30 Winchester because you were sneaking around wearing tactical gear, & sporting a "machine gun" in his neck of the woods.

Unless the world goes "Road Warrior", you'd be better off looking as non-threatening as posssible.



+1

I believe in a true SHTF scenario it’ll be your neighbors you’ll have to defend yourself from. The guy trying to steal the BBQ cylinder from your backyard. Or the guy siphoning gas from your vehicle.  

With gas approaching $4 per gallon, there was lots of siphoning going on around my neighborhood, as well as vehicle break-ins.

Look at the looting during Katrina, and multiply that.

That is why I always get a kick out of these SHTF scenarios where folks have these fantasies about “Red Dawn”. It makes me wonder if they really give any thought to these situations. Any serious thought.  


For once I have to disagree with the Quib-meister about the nature of the threat.  Depending of course on the quality of your neighbors.  LA riots start--neighbors banded together to block streets, let in only people that lived there, defended themselves with what guns were (then) allowed them.  Few shots were fired.

Hurricane Ike--neighbors banded together, vigilance was heightened, watched their 'hoods, no shots as far as I know were fired.


But I agree that all this afrcom stuff about a hundred mags loaded with TAP is Walter Mitty fantasy.  One AR with one magazine is all you'll ever need.  Riot comes up your street?  You think they're going to stick around while you fire 30 or 3000 shots?  Nah.  They see an armed man, they go the other way.  If you ever have to fire more than 30 rounds, you're in a lot more trouble than one solitary arfcommer can handle, anyway.

After Ike--a bona fide natural disaster that briefly paralyzed one of the Nation's largest cities--the big worry was not how much ammo you had stashed, or how many different guns you had, it was could you find generator fuel, who had a pharmacy open, whose phone worked so you could check on relatives, etc.  


I think less would turn the other way than you think. It is possible to panic and miss a whole lot, IMO reloads won't hurt. To assume only 30 rounds will be necessary is foolhardy. If you REALLY have to fight your way out of something, and you do have to blow through 150 rounds? Be glad you had the 150 rounds- you will have lived because you were prepared.

Imagine something like a large scale EMP... Electronics are OUT for miles, and you're near a city. What happens when a whole gang of starving and hungry people decide to raid your house?  They aren't armed, but they are determined and they know what they want- and you're not part of the plan. Having just 30 rounds, may get you killed in a situation you could have shot it out.

horrible and improbable? Absolutely. Impossible? No.
Link Posted: 10/18/2008 2:02:41 PM EDT
Horrid events do happen. Read some history about what went on in some of the Russian cities under siege from the Nazis, and vice versa, not to mention the other war atrocities that took place. People were eating wood, rats, and probably each other to survive. Many people are inherently evil so plan accordingly.

In natural disasters you usually have places you can go to protect yourself if things become that dangerous. Many people from Houston drove to Dallas for a few days during Ike, an unplanned vacation. No big deal. Once back home, it's good to be armed in case some idiot thinks he's going to steal something. But shooting it out with hordes of people after a storm is very unlikely. Criminals go for the path of least resistance, and looking down the barrel of a 12 gauge, or AR is definitely not the path of least resistance for Joe the Looter when he visits Joe the Plumber who is armed to the teeth.

Food, water, batteries, cash, fuel, temp shelter, firestarter,  maybe a power supply, medicines/first aid, cell phones, battery operated radio, and baby wipes will all likely be used more than your EOTWAWKI M4Gery autographed by Will Smith.
Link Posted: 10/18/2008 2:26:21 PM EDT
With Hawaii so isolated from the rest of the world that it could be dog eat dog if we wound be cut off from shipping barges and air shipments.  When 9/11 happened there was no shipments of any kind for about a week to Hawaii.  A few items like toilet paper, diapers, rice, etc were low because people were buying and hoarding.  In receint times, there was the earthquake that rocked Hawaii a few years ago that knocked out power for hours on some islands and blocked main access roads to and from some communities.

I've been working on my SHTF supplies for a while now.  The arsenal and ammo supply is adequate for me and my small tribe.  Food and water is a constant struggle to maintain especially with the prices in Hawaii.  A three day supply of food and water is what I have for now after that I would need to forage.  I definitely won't be able to carry a long gun so a pistol and a BUG would have to do.  I plan to stay put at the home front if all possible because it has all I need to survive and to be safe and confortable under the circumstances.  That is where my long guns would play a part in keeping things secure.
Link Posted: 10/18/2008 2:32:02 PM EDT

Originally Posted By jerz_subbie:

Originally Posted By cerberus212:
For Night carry the 20” upper with ATN night scope. Use Ciener Kit with 60Gr .22lr SSS (Sub-Sonic Sniper) ammo. Secondary Weapon: Smith and Wesson .40. (.223 Ar pistols flash would probably be blinding and very obvious at night so I rule it out unless I’ve got no other choice. I however, could also run a ciener kit in it as well and fix this problem. Suggestions?)

Thanks


Am i the only one who sees a problem here? Why use 22lr? In shtf i'm using 75gr hpbt then all of my 55gr 5.56! By the time i have to go to 22lr i'll probably be dead.

goonies never say die!
Link Posted: 10/18/2008 2:32:28 PM EDT
it depends on the situation your in . id go with the top one in the pic
and maybe do away with the carry handle add an aimpoint or eotech
and a good sling
Link Posted: 10/18/2008 2:42:44 PM EDT
Though more accurate, a fully loaded HBAR is too heavy for my SHTF plans.
Link Posted: 10/18/2008 3:12:54 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 10/18/2008 3:19:59 PM EDT by AtlantaFireman]
Link Posted: 10/18/2008 6:53:26 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 10/18/2008 6:56:59 PM EDT by cerberus212]

I don't understand using subsonic .22lr at ALL.


I've been thinking about this myself a lot, and I was thinking nighttime is going to be the safest time to hunt and find food. With the .22lr 60gr I can bring down a lot of game without anyone knowing I exist outside of 200 yards. With a suppressor the bolt and hammer make as much noise as the shots. There are some good youtube videos that demonstrate this. It’s a risky compromise, but with zero recoil and a full auto/burst AR, you can put a lot of .22lr lead on a target before it knows what hits it, the idea would be to place several shots to make up for less stopping power. Ideally I would have someone else with me with a more powerful night rifle strictly for defense, but I don’t see myself being able to afford one anytime soon. So my priority is hunting without being noticed.

Just having trouble with all of the pros and cons, the good thing is I could always go back to .223 in less than 1 minute.
Link Posted: 10/18/2008 6:58:07 PM EDT

Originally Posted By cerberus212:

I don't understand using subsonic .22lr at ALL.


I've been thinking about this myself a lot, and I was thinking nighttime is going to be the safest time to hunt and find food. With the .22lr 60gr I can bring down a lot of game without anyone knowing I exist outside of 100 yards. With a suppressor the bolt and hammer make as much noise as the shots. There are some good youtube videos that demonstrate this. It’s a risky compromise, but with zero recoil and a full auto/burst AR, you can put a lot of .22lr lead on a target before it knows what hits it, the idea would be to place several shots to make up for less stopping power. Ideally I would have someone else with me with a more powerful night rifle strictly for defense, but I don’t see myself being able to afford one anytime soon. So my priority is hunting without being noticed.

Just having trouble with all of the pros and cons, the good thing is I could always go back to .223 in less than 1 minute.


For night hunting, I could see 22lr. Legit.

However... can you get your gun back into SHTF configuration in less than a minute- during a massive adrenalin dump? Some argue that if this isn't perfectly programed and drilled into you- it won't happen. The last thing I want to do when I need to rock and roll? Is foll around with parts.
Link Posted: 10/18/2008 7:30:38 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 10/18/2008 8:05:36 PM EDT by cerberus212]
A lot are saying go with the 16”. The 16" Bushmaster HBAR was my first Ar Rifle, and I put a lot of lead through it and got fairly experienced. After awhile I got bored with what the red-dot EOTECH type sights had to offer. I wanted the ability to hit much farther out, or to hit small exposed areas behind cover. I built the Varmint in response to this, and also so that I could have a gun accurate enough to find all the flaws in my own shooting skills. I fell in love with it, and while its a bit heavier than carbines its about the same as an M14. So I got to thinking would I mind carrying an Ar pistol as well that I could quickly use once targets were to close for fast target acquisition with a scope. With that in mind I’m trying to decide if I should get the Ar pistol or some other ban type item. I’d put a 6-position stock on the pistol for accurate shooting, but only if there is no law left to send me to jail for an SBR. Another 5-6 pounds for the Ar pistol shouldn’t matter as long as I am staying on my own homefront with a home to resupply and rest at.

Ideally I would live long enough to find exactly what is best and most practical for me, but without actual field experience with these rifles that seems unlikely. However when I do find what is best I want to have the options available. The 16" would probably be the best combat rifle, but I plan on staying out of the range of those type rifles.
Link Posted: 10/18/2008 7:41:50 PM EDT
height=8
Originally Posted By STLTXN:


In natural disasters you usually have places you can go to protect yourself if things become that dangerous. Many people from Houston drove to Dallas for a few days during Ike, an unplanned vacation. No big deal....


That's if you can literally see the disaster coming from miles away, like a hurricane. But what about something inherently unpredictable like an earthquake? If/When the "big one" hits in the Los Angeles area there's no getting out by road. Probably far worse than katrina.
Top Top