Warning

 

Close

Confirm Action

Are you sure you wish to do this?

Confirm Cancel
Member Login
Site Notices
9/22/2017 12:11:25 AM
Posted: 7/10/2005 4:20:20 PM EDT
I ordered 2 boxes of Hornady .223 REM 75 gr. TAP For Personal Defense

And 2 boxes of Hornady .223 REM 75 gr TAP Urban

FPD= Part# 80268
Urban= Part# 80265
Now, the question. What is the difference? I know the FPD has a Black casing.

I'll kick myself in the ass if the casing is the only difference.
Link Posted: 7/10/2005 4:25:44 PM EDT
I'm glad you posted this, I was wondering the same thing.

Burl1
Link Posted: 7/10/2005 4:47:24 PM EDT

Originally Posted By burl1:
I'm glad you posted this, I was wondering the same thing.

Burl1



Come on all you Ammo experts. Whats the difference? I want to know is if I buy the For Personal Defense stuff is it the same as the Urban stuff. It looks like others would like to know. I know there is a 5.56 TAP, but I think thats different all together.
Link Posted: 7/10/2005 4:50:51 PM EDT
Is it in the ammo oricle?
Link Posted: 7/10/2005 4:52:09 PM EDT

Originally Posted By die-tryin:
Is it in the ammo oricle?



Thanks for the heads up.
Link Posted: 7/10/2005 5:16:25 PM EDT
I can't find anything describing the differences in the AMMO ORACLE .

So the question still stands.

What the difference between the 2 rounds..
Link Posted: 7/10/2005 5:55:52 PM EDT
I don't think there is much of a difference betwwen the 2. The only one I know of which is the obvious one is FPD has black nickel cases and Urban has brass cases. I pretty sure they are loaded the same.

what does each box say for velocity?
Link Posted: 7/10/2005 6:05:25 PM EDT

Originally Posted By WMHM4:
I don't think there is much of a difference betwwen the 2. The only one I know of which is the obvious one is FPD has black nickel cases and Urban has brass cases. I pretty sure they are loaded the same.

what does each box say for velocity?




I'll find out when I receive them this week.
Link Posted: 7/10/2005 6:35:30 PM EDT
Chronograph them and the answer will be revealed. I don't say that to be a smart ass, I too would like to know and there's no better judge than the clock.
Link Posted: 7/11/2005 9:10:41 AM EDT
You would have to crono, section bullets, ect to find preformance differences. Might want to just send out an e-mail to hornady and ask them.
Link Posted: 7/11/2005 9:14:21 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 7/11/2005 9:14:58 AM EDT by TexasSIG]
Difference appears to be marketing other than case color.. I've shot both, run both through the chrono, I can't tell
any difference other than the brass. Haven't done anything crazy like saw the bullets in half
or weigh components.

It seems to be a marketing thing pretty much unless someone can show otherwise.
Link Posted: 7/11/2005 1:16:09 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 7/11/2005 1:16:30 PM EDT by PocketG]

Originally Posted By TexasSIG:
Difference appears to be marketing other than case color.. I've shot both, run both through the chrono, I can't tell
any difference other than the brass. Haven't done anything crazy like saw the bullets in half
or weigh components.

It seems to be a marketing thing pretty much unless someone can show otherwise.



TexasSIG,

Tanks alot. Now if they have the same speed and the same head and the only difference is the case color I really think they should give us several case color choices. how about red, maybe camo green, OD Brown. I purchase several boxes of the stuff so this is what I'm going to do. I'm going to load 1 30 round magand shoot the rest up just to make sure my AR fires them and site the rifle for CloseQuarterCombat. You know, self defense.....Now where can I get the 5.56 TAP?
Link Posted: 7/11/2005 6:31:46 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 7/11/2005 6:32:03 PM EDT by Sparky357]
IIRC I read somewhere that the TAP FPD also used a low flash signature powder.
?????
Link Posted: 7/11/2005 6:56:00 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Sparky357:
IIRC I read somewhere that the TAP FPD also used a low flash signature powder.
?????



low flash signature powder Is that good or bad?

I bought the 75 gr. TAP Urban also. Anything special about that load?
Link Posted: 7/12/2005 2:00:26 PM EDT

Originally Posted By PocketG:

Originally Posted By Sparky357:
IIRC I read somewhere that the TAP FPD also used a low flash signature powder.
?????



low flash signature powder Is that good or bad?

I bought the 75 gr. TAP Urban also. Anything special about that load?


My understanding is the Urban is intended for LEO only, and they don't have to pay Federal Excise Tax on it.

The FPD is also marketed to civilians, with the FET being factored in. That and the nickel cases are one of the few differences. Granted, all of this info is second hand, picked up here and there, so no gurantee of how accurate it really is.

Dave
Link Posted: 7/12/2005 2:23:15 PM EDT
If I remember correctly one(Urban) is frangiable or extremely fragile to prevent over penetration in city settings and the other is a standard HP. I many be wrong....
Link Posted: 7/12/2005 2:52:29 PM EDT

Originally Posted By PocketG:

Originally Posted By Sparky357:
IIRC I read somewhere that the TAP FPD also used a low flash signature powder.
?????



low flash signature powder Is that good or bad?

I bought the 75 gr. TAP Urban also. Anything special about that load?



it does have a low flash signature and that is good
Link Posted: 7/12/2005 2:53:34 PM EDT

Originally Posted By 308FAN:
If I remember correctly one(Urban) is frangiable or extremely fragile to prevent over penetration in city settings and the other is a standard HP. I many be wrong....



40gr TAP is the one with the least penetration
Link Posted: 7/12/2005 9:13:47 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Buck_Naked:

My understanding is the Urban is intended for LEO only, and they don't have to pay Federal Excise Tax on it.



I'm not sure how this stuff keeps getting posted, but LEOs pay FET. Only departments don't have to pay FET. There is a big difference.
Link Posted: 7/13/2005 7:49:30 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 7/13/2005 7:51:08 AM EDT by Buck_Naked]

Originally Posted By Stickman:

Originally Posted By Buck_Naked:

My understanding is the Urban is intended for LEO only, and they don't have to pay Federal Excise Tax on it.



I'm not sure how this stuff keeps getting posted, but LEOs pay FET. Only departments don't have to pay FET. There is a big difference.


That was a mistake on my part, I think of LEO and an agency as pretty much the same thing, when they are different as you pointed out.
Link Posted: 7/13/2005 7:50:21 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Stickman:

Originally Posted By Buck_Naked:

My understanding is the Urban is intended for LEO only, and they don't have to pay Federal Excise Tax on it.



I'm not sure how this stuff keeps getting posted, but LEOs pay FET. Only departments don't have to pay FET. There is a big difference.



Gonna sound dumb here but, what does FET got to do with my original question of whats the difference between the two rounds? Anyways I got 2 boxes of the civvy stuff and two boxes of the LEO stuff coming this week.

What kind of testing should I do to see if there is any differences.
Link Posted: 7/13/2005 3:53:52 PM EDT

From the last time this came up, the main things I remember hearing (which have been echoed in this thread already to some degree) are:

1) TAP Urban is "LEO Only", meaning distributors/retailers are not supposed to sell it to civilians, although it's not illegal to do so, just a policy thing. Also there's a tax issue, the FET thing mentioned above. I'm not sure about how the whole tax issue works out, but I tend to doubt that the online resellers who are selling it by the 1000 to random civvies over the net are committing tax evasion.

2) TAP FPD is marketed for civ use, and is supposedly nearly identical, except for possibly...

3) Some claim that Urban uses a low-flash powder and FPD does not. I haven't heard of anyone actually testing this out and posting photos taken at night, so this may just be a rumor started by a distributor or something.
Link Posted: 7/13/2005 4:52:32 PM EDT
Hornady catalog lists 75grTAP-FPD as 2790 fps. TAP Urban is listed on its box as 2630 fps.
There is no indication as to what barrel length these figures relate to. FWIW, I bought 12 boxes of Urban TAP from Natchez. Also important is the bullet in the Urban TAP is crimped into the cannelure. I do not know if TAP-FPD is crimped, although I sure hope it is. No reason not to.

Dr.
Link Posted: 7/13/2005 5:44:24 PM EDT
I don't know if this is true for all TAP ammo, rifle and pistol but I recently read an article on the TAP FPD 40S&W pistol round and the author stated that the 40 S&W load doesn't use sealent on the primer or the bullet. I don't know if this is the case for all TAP ammo but I was a little bit suprised the read it, I guess they don't expect the ammo to be stored for a long time but to be used rather quickly.
Link Posted: 7/14/2005 2:56:01 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 7/14/2005 2:59:27 AM EDT by PocketG]

Originally Posted By DrLee:
Hornady catalog lists 75grTAP-FPD as 2790 fps. TAP Urban is listed on its box as 2630 fps.
There is no indication as to what barrel length these figures relate to. FWIW, I bought 12 boxes of Urban TAP from Natchez. Also important is the bullet in the Urban TAP is crimped into the cannelure. I do not know if TAP-FPD is crimped, although I sure hope it is. No reason not to.

Dr.




Alright, whos going to do a barrel flash test? Someone with experience with night time shooting modes. All I know is I got 2 @FPD and 2@ Urban of both being delivered today. I am really interested in the flash signature and If I could get someone with a camera and set up at night I will try . Who will be the first to submit clean and clean photos.
Link Posted: 7/15/2005 2:39:36 PM EDT
I came across this thread and it peaked my interest too so I sent Hornady an e-mail and this is what they responded with so far...


Hello,

I would like to know what the difference are between these two rounds...

.223 REM 75 gr TAP FPD= Part# 80268
.223 REM 75 gr TAP Urban= Part# 80265

Thank you



To which they responded with...


FPD stands for For Personal Defense. The other TAP Urban is for Law Enforcement. The Personal Defense rounds are loaded in black nickel coated cases, the TAP Urban is in regular brass cases. They use the same bullet and the same powder.

xxxxx xxxxxx, Customer Service
Hornady Mfg.



I've sent a response asking them about flash retardant, sealer, etc and the difference in listed FPS
Link Posted: 7/15/2005 3:59:44 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 7/15/2005 4:05:48 PM EDT by PocketG]
The 75 gr. TAP is Very very accurate. I like the accuracy very much and I have total confidence in it to use it as a true defense round.

I fired today 20 rounds of the civvy stuff and 20 of the LEO ammo. 1:7 twist. Today I shot 400 rounds XM193, 60 rounds 55gr Ultramax, 200 @Winnie q3131 no A.

I kept 31 rounds of the 75 gr. TAP LEO Urban for Home Defense...
Link Posted: 9/26/2005 1:06:27 AM EDT
Tagged
Top Top