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Posted: 1/1/2004 6:47:40 PM EDT
I thought I knew but now I'm not sure. What kind of configuration(s) did it come in?

Flash hider?
Barrel length?
Handguard type?
Takedown pins?
FCG pins?
Receiver style?
Upper style?
Stock?
Anything else?
Link Posted: 1/1/2004 7:27:38 PM EDT
No forward assist.

5sub
Link Posted: 1/1/2004 8:42:03 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/1/2004 8:43:49 PM EDT by ybh_613]
As list ordered:
yes
Mine 20"
tri-angle
rear large, front large
small
slab side, no fence
no foreward assist, no shell def, fixed carry handle, a1 sights
a-1
preban Colt
1968
Cost: 1 army 1911 .45, 1 .30 carb and $50.00
Link Posted: 1/1/2004 9:17:52 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/1/2004 9:18:24 PM EDT by norman74]
[url]http://www.100megsfree2.com/deadeye/specials/realgunpics/ar-15_sp1.jpg[/url]

[url]http://www.biggerhammer.net/ar15/uppers/[/url]
Link Posted: 1/2/2004 4:56:28 AM EDT
Thanks all.

What type of flash hider? Certainly not an A2 style.

Were there any carbine SP-1s w/telecoping stocks?
Link Posted: 1/2/2004 5:26:34 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/2/2004 5:31:40 AM EDT by M4Madness]
[img]http://www.biggerhammer.net/ar15/variants/sp1_rightside_159.jpg[/img]

Pictured above (not mine) is a Colt R6000 (SP1). They came with a 20" barrel on an A1 upper with triangular handguards and 3-prong flash suppressor. The upper also lacks the shell deflector and forward assist. Note that the delta ring is also straight instead of the tapered one currently in use. The lower has large-hole pivot and small-hole takedown pins. The lower lacks the fence (slabside) and the pivot pin is a two-screw type, not a captive pushpin. It has small firecontrol pins. The stock and pistol grip are also A1 style.

As for any SP1 rifles coming out with telestocks, the Colt R6001 did. It also added an A1 birdcage flash suppressor (slots all the way around) instead of the 3-pronged.
Link Posted: 1/2/2004 7:03:46 AM EDT
Originally Posted By bigsapper:
Thanks all.

What type of flash hider? Certainly not an A2 style.

Were there any carbine SP-1s w/telecoping stocks?
View Quote


Early SP1s had the early three prong suppressor. Later models had the early bird cage type, not the current A2 style.

Yes, they started building a collapsible stock carbine, w/a 16 inch barrel, around 1974 or 75.
I've owned one since 1978 [:D].

Two position slider, with a plastic covered metal stock piece.  Basically, the piece was a civilianized version of the XM177s used in Viet Nam.  
Link Posted: 1/2/2004 7:52:30 AM EDT
Thanks again all. I saw an SP-1 Carbine for sell in the EE and the pic showed an A2 style flash hider on what looked like a LW barrel with A2 style handguards. Guy says it's just as it came from Colt in the '70s.

[url]http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=7&f=21&t=192174[/url]

Doesn't look legit to me unless I'm not understanding something.
Link Posted: 1/2/2004 7:58:58 AM EDT
Originally Posted By bigsapper:
Thanks again all. I saw an SP-1 Carbine for sell in the EE and the pic showed an A2 style flash hider on what looked like a LW barrel with A2 style handguards. Guy says it's just as it came from Colt in the '70s.

[url]http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=7&f=21&t=192174[/url]

Doesn't look legit to me unless I'm not understanding something.
View Quote


I think it's legit, you gotta remember this part
Early SP1s had the early three prong suppressor. Later models had the early bird cage type, not the current A2 style.
View Quote
Link Posted: 1/2/2004 8:18:19 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/2/2004 9:12:29 AM EDT by bigsapper]
Originally Posted By norman74:

Early SP1s had the early three prong suppressor. Later models had the early bird cage type, not the current A2 style.
View Quote
View Quote


Ah, but that one [b]does[/b] have an A2 style cage. The A1 style cage has slots around the entire circumference. Plus, while the delta ring looks correct, the handguards are clearly the A2 style. Looks to me like an SP1 lower on ??? upper or at least the FH and HG were changed out. Which is no big deal except he's states that it's original.

ETA: Well it's academic now anyway. Looks like he sold it.
Link Posted: 1/2/2004 8:23:41 AM EDT
There was the SP1, and SP1 Carbine. The SP1 came as everyone described; triangle handguards, either a birdcage or 3-prong flash supressor, large front hole, no fences, mil-spec FCG pins, no forward assist or shell deflector on the upper.

The Carbine had the same features, except it had round handguards (Colt, or anyone else for that matter, NEVER sold a factory civilian AR15 with anything other than round handguards on thier carbine models), a 16" barrel instead of a 20", a metal 2-position collapsing stock covered in vinyl, and a birdcage flash supressor. Depending on when it was made, it might have an A2 cage. (Or, someone just stuck on an A2 cage, whatever...easily fixable)

They all had A1 sights.

So, yes, what the person is describing, is a Colt SP1 Carbine.
Link Posted: 1/2/2004 9:15:38 AM EDT
Thanks. "A day late and a dollar short." [:(]
Link Posted: 1/2/2004 9:27:47 AM EDT
Part of the problem with Colt especially was that they mixed-and-matched a lot of things in the 80's. I've seen rifles marked Sporter II AR15 (which was supposed to be their A2 version of the AR15) come with the tapered delta ring, the round handguards, the A2 cage...but built on an SP1 receiver (A1 rear sight, no FA, no shell deflector). This is their regular rifle, not the carbine, in this instance. I've seen the same thing, but with a proper A2 upper receiver...but with an A1 birdcage. Colt was less than exacting when they built the civilian rifles. Anything they had in the parts bin, they used.

There are other changes they've made, of course (no sear relief in the upper like almost every other manufacturer, etc)...but the external visibile ones are the ones that most often change depending on which person at the shop built it, which person dropped off which parts to the workbenches, etc.
Link Posted: 1/2/2004 12:28:34 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/2/2004 12:32:09 PM EDT by Colt-653]
Since I'm viewed by some as the Guru on Colt Sp1 carbines, XM177's and M16A1 carbines I'll chime in.

The Carbine in the Ad is not Factory original.  The A2 Flash hider is not correct nor are parts of the stock(Locking ring is not original and there's way too much paint on the stake job for it to be factory).  The Serial # 150*** was too early for Colt to have used any A2 parts.  

Colt did start to use some A2 parts(Hiders, A2 pistol grips) around serial # 212*** which was late 1984 early 1985 when the SP2/A2 series started.

The First 50 or so AR15A2 carbine had Vinyl Actate covered stocks.

Not just guessing here, I've collected and owned over 50 Colt Sp1 carbines since Colt started selling them in the Spring of 1978.

Any Colt Carbine with a serial # under SP85000 is a pieced together carbine.
Link Posted: 1/2/2004 4:14:33 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/2/2004 4:26:08 PM EDT by Derek45]
My  COLT SP-1 AR15

[img]http://www.hunt101.com/img/060427.JPG[/img]
Link Posted: 1/2/2004 9:07:18 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Colt-653:
The Carbine in the Ad is not Factory original.  The A2 Flash hider is not correct nor are parts of the stock(Locking ring is not original and there's way too much paint on the stake job for it to be factory).  The Serial # 150*** was too early for Colt to have used any A2 parts.  

Colt did start to use some A2 parts(Hiders, A2 pistol grips) around serial # 212*** which was late 1984 early 1985 when the SP2/A2 series started.

The First 50 or so AR15A2 carbine had Vinyl Actate covered stocks.

Not just guessing here, I've collected and owned over 50 Colt Sp1 carbines since Colt started selling them in the Spring of 1978.

Any Colt Carbine with a serial # under SP85000 is a pieced together carbine.
View Quote


I'll bow to your wisdom on Carbines; You're TOTALLY correct on the staking bit on the stock. I have an SP1 Carbine (I didn't look at *all* the photos)...that one looks like someone with a very large magic marker hit it. The normal SP1 Carbine staking marks are not that large.

So, I was was not completly correct. Now, had it been a long rifle and not a carbine...[:P] Regardless, I was incorrect. My apologies.

I'll take a closer pic of my SP1 carbine for a good look at what proper stock staking should be, when I get a chance...I don't have a good one at the moment.

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