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11/24/2017 4:44:23 PM
11/22/2017 10:05:29 PM
Posted: 8/31/2004 6:29:59 AM EST
I've seen some posters mention that the Vortex FH has been known to mushroom open due to it's open ended design. Any details on this? Would this happen during firing?
Link Posted: 8/31/2004 7:18:52 AM EST
That sounds like liberal nonsense to me. I've had the prongs bend on one I have, but that was from banging into somthing, not from shooting.
Link Posted: 8/31/2004 7:22:19 AM EST
That was a bad batch several years ago. I haven't heard of any problems in a while.

Yes the problem occured when firing.
Link Posted: 8/31/2004 7:27:48 AM EST
I had one do it. All four tines gradually opened up. I sent it back to Smith Ent. and they replaced it. They stood behind it.
They said that they had a bad batch a few years ago. I believe they wernt properly heat treated. The new ones have no issues that I'm aware of.

There also have been threads years ago of the same thing happening with pics etc. Get the new style and you will be "Good to go".
Link Posted: 8/31/2004 7:44:45 AM EST
[Last Edit: 8/31/2004 7:47:42 AM EST by Tweak]
Link Posted: 8/31/2004 12:30:43 PM EST

Originally Posted By FRO:
I had one do it. All four tines gradually opened up. I sent it back to Smith Ent. and they replaced it. They stood behind it.
They said that they had a bad batch a few years ago. I believe they wernt properly heat treated. The new ones have no issues that I'm aware of.

There also have been threads years ago of the same thing happening with pics etc. Get the new style and you will be "Good to go".



+1

I had a Vortex mushroom out on me and Smith Enterprises replaced it free of charge with the new style.
Link Posted: 8/31/2004 12:41:20 PM EST
I have them on all my AR's, and have had no problems.

I dont want an AR without one, as they are the very, very best at what they do.
Link Posted: 8/31/2004 3:26:02 PM EST
We'll have to see how well they handle the flash on the .458 SOCOM....
Link Posted: 8/31/2004 9:08:39 PM EST
Link Posted: 8/31/2004 9:42:22 PM EST
In the .458 SOCOM group buy that should be wrapping up here in a few weeks, we are investigating having smith ent. make us some custom .458 sized vortexs. I'm really looking forward to it. It'll be unique, thats for sure.
Link Posted: 9/1/2004 1:29:44 AM EST
Link Posted: 9/1/2004 2:35:29 AM EST
Here is couple of pics of mushroomed votex. It was on 11.5" and was bought from Brownells about 5- 6 years ago. It still works fine but you never know when those prongs go snap.

MN



Link Posted: 9/1/2004 3:42:13 AM EST
Link Posted: 9/1/2004 4:10:32 AM EST
Just put a hose clamp on that piece of shit and quit complaining!
Link Posted: 9/1/2004 4:13:23 AM EST

Originally Posted By markm:
Just put a hose clamp on that piece of shit and quit complaining!



Link Posted: 9/1/2004 5:07:03 AM EST

Originally Posted By Tweak:
M4,

Very cool, can you get a pic from the front showing the internal geometry of the tines? A pic of the tines near the point that they tie into the threaded section (the base) would be most illustrative.

That is what was changed on the bad batch, The bad tines do not maintain a triangular cross section for their entire length. Instead, the bad ones gradually transition in shape from a triangle to a parallelogram. The bad tines are thinner at the bottom than on the end.





Pics as requested.
MN


Link Posted: 9/1/2004 5:24:20 AM EST
[Last Edit: 9/1/2004 8:44:11 AM EST by M4A2_L073754]

Originally Posted By markm:
Just put a hose clamp on that piece of shit and quit complaining!


I´m not, Vortex ain´t mine. I´m using Phantom or A2 in my rifles. However, I´m guy who likes to try something new and I made my own "vortex" with straight tines to my .300 Whisper.

MN



Link Posted: 9/1/2004 5:27:09 AM EST
[Last Edit: 9/1/2004 8:45:08 AM EST by M4A2_L073754]
WTF!? I can´t get those links to work .

MN
Link Posted: 9/1/2004 9:05:24 PM EST
[Last Edit: 9/1/2004 9:47:43 PM EST by Tweak]
Link Posted: 9/1/2004 10:16:09 PM EST
That area is much more easier to see when you are holding Vortex in your hands. I tried to take pics from every possible angle and that is best got.

That tine is pretty damn thin at that area.

Now those pics should work, I made some clean up....

MN

Link Posted: 9/1/2004 11:24:07 PM EST
Link Posted: 9/2/2004 4:52:14 AM EST

Originally Posted By Tweak:

Originally Posted By M4A2_L073754:
I made some clean up....



What was causing the lack of linkage?


I´m not sure, I just deleted some old pics from server and after that problems dissapeared. I´m not expert on computers.


Can you confirm that the tine there is undercut compared to the rest of the tine?

Roger that, the tine is undercut.

The pic is more than enough since I can now point people to it and say "look there for this" instead of trying in vain multiple times to describe the area.


Thanks again M4.

You are welcome, Sir

MN
Link Posted: 9/2/2004 5:55:03 AM EST
I've seen a few different photos of mushroomed Vortex's (Vorteci?) and that's got to be the best, clearest photo detailing the problem.
Link Posted: 9/2/2004 8:01:04 AM EST

Originally Posted By Kisara:
I've seen a few different photos of mushroomed Vortex's (Vorteci?) and that's got to be the best, clearest photo detailing the problem.


Well, thanks.

MN
Link Posted: 9/2/2004 8:19:20 AM EST
I've seen three blossom over the years and they were of different vintage.

I like the Vortex but would not trust one enough to permanently attach it.
Link Posted: 9/2/2004 8:27:10 AM EST
I've heard of guys switching back to the old 3 prong flash hider cuz it's cheap and damned effective!
Link Posted: 9/2/2004 8:29:20 AM EST

Originally Posted By markm:
I've heard of guys switching back to the old 3 prong flash hider cuz it's cheap and damned effective!



Those guys must be in the know. Probably very high speed guys.
Link Posted: 9/2/2004 9:53:30 AM EST
I don't have any experience with the vortex, but from what they've advertised and what I've heard here, they eliminate flash 100%. Can't say the same for the 3-prong. I noticed when my friend fired his SP1(w/Xm193) with one on it there was a distiguishable flash about the size of a ping-pong ball just forward of the FS.
Link Posted: 9/2/2004 10:03:48 AM EST

Originally Posted By FNMI_Rifleman:
I noticed when my friend fired his SP1(w/Xm193) with one on it there was a distiguishable flash about the size of a ping-pong ball just forward of the FS.



That's huge!
Link Posted: 9/2/2004 12:41:27 PM EST

Originally Posted By FNMI_Rifleman:
I don't have any experience with the vortex, but from what they've advertised and what I've heard here, they eliminate flash 100%.



I do have and you are wrong, they eliminate 110% of all flash, in a dark room indoors!

Link Posted: 9/2/2004 1:06:14 PM EST
Last year SMGLee posted some pictures that showed a Browning M2 belt fed that looked like it had a big ass Vortex on it. Is Smith Entreprises experimenting with different platforms? The M2 and 1919 would benefit greatly with the use of a quality flash suppressor.
But, when you burn through about 600 rounds in the 1919, how do you hide the glowing red barrel end?
-Steve
Link Posted: 9/2/2004 1:33:58 PM EST
The scariest part of the Vortex is Sonja Sommers who designed it.

Link Posted: 9/2/2004 1:48:38 PM EST
[Last Edit: 9/2/2004 1:59:02 PM EST by Minuteman419]

Originally Posted By Tweak:
M4,


That is what was changed on the bad batch, The bad tines do not maintain a triangular cross section for their entire length. Instead, the bad ones gradually transition in shape from a triangle to a parallelogram. The bad tines are thinner at the bottom than on the end.





Darn, just my luck. I have one just as you describe.

I have to make a phone call.

EDIT: I just called, they said to send it to them and they will look and see what they can do. He said the bad batch happened about 10 years ago.


Danny
Link Posted: 9/2/2004 2:08:00 PM EST
[Last Edit: 9/2/2004 2:08:42 PM EST by new-arguy]
Link Posted: 9/2/2004 10:25:57 PM EST
Link Posted: 9/3/2004 2:06:49 PM EST
Mushrooming will not occur with the G6. At least it has not with mine after many thousands of rounds.
Link Posted: 9/8/2004 6:57:46 PM EST
[Last Edit: 11/5/2004 6:25:16 AM EST by mach6]
The mushrooming issues have been discussed ad infinitum. Furthermore, they are issues from the pst -- the distant past and were limited to a very small lot as discussed above. I have several of the latest model G6A2 types, and their variants to include the G6A2 5.56mm, the limited production G6A2 6.5mmG/6.8mm and the very new "Direct Connect" (DC) Vortex for use on the (EBR-14) M-14. A few versions for the M249 and M240 as well. None of these have mushroomed or shown any signs of fatigue after many, many thousands of rounds. In part, this should not be suprising since the surface hardness of the G6A2 is RC 58-60 (!) with a core hardness pushing RC 40. Tough enough for you. I know, because I saw the physical testing results at ARDEC last year.

Interestingly enough, but not entirely germane to this thread, the G6A2 M249 actually improves group size. BTW, the systemjust became available with an extremely robust BFA that works on the M-4 & M16 as well (USG only).

As an aside, I wish these forums had more in the way of technical discussions from people who use M-15-related components in their official capacity. DCD Ft. Benning used to have such a discussion board but it is no longer up. Too bad. Still, it is interesting, although frankly anecdotal to hear the observations of consumers at the retail level -- but only that. Every once in a while though, a forum contributor comes up with an observation that Force Developers/Modernizers can actually appreciate. An believe me -- they, we are listening.

When you use these items every day in real life siutations, these matters take on an entitrely different tone. Somehow commentary on how "cool" or "bad" something looks, without a critical discourse on on the technical merits is amusing at best to troops on the line.
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