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Posted: 8/13/2004 1:53:44 PM EST
[Last Edit: 9/1/2004 10:52:42 AM EST by CSGunWorkscom]
Link Posted: 8/13/2004 2:08:19 PM EST
They're big and ugly and expensive.

I really wish I could afford one.

CHRIS
Link Posted: 8/13/2004 2:31:15 PM EST

Originally Posted By Cixelsyd:
They're big and ugly and expensive.

I really wish I could afford one.

CHRIS



Very well said.
Link Posted: 8/13/2004 2:33:23 PM EST
depends on what you want... if your comparing them to an ACOG... buy an acog...

i guess it depends on your setup...

if your weapon is sort of light weight... get an acog

if you have a 24" SS barrel... get the us optic... or a leupy!
Link Posted: 8/13/2004 2:47:36 PM EST
I'm a firm believer... but the SN-4 is very heavy, especially with the USO mount! I would bet the SN-12 would be good for carbines and the SN-3 good for precision rifles. It seems that the problem with being a stocking USO dealer would be the seemingly unlimited number of variants and configurations available for the different models.

Mine is a SN-4 Mark III Illuminated Parvin Reticle in the Posa-Slide and Lock MKV mount... would you stock that? They are great scopes...

Link Posted: 8/13/2004 4:04:48 PM EST
Link Posted: 8/13/2004 4:38:23 PM EST


Here's my USO SN-3, 3.2-17x44mm, 90 click EREK knob, ERGO objective. I also went with the MOA reticle, and LOVE IT!!

Front focal plane reticle placement as well. This scope, IMHO is the best scope in the world bar none!

The Schmidt and Bender PMII is awesome, but not a CUSTOM SCOPE like the SN-3.

You get what they give you. Which aint bad!!

USO is about options, fellas. Nobody offers the options that USO offers. That cannot be argued.

Link Posted: 8/13/2004 4:53:20 PM EST
Originally Posted By double_r76:
t seems that the problem with being a stocking USO dealer would be the seemingly unlimited number of variants and configurations available for the different models.

Well said.

USO is a custom scope maker. Not a "off the rack scope".
I know a few USO dealers and they would probably concur with what double_r76 said.

Unless you wanted to stock the ST-10. This scope is incredible, and blows away any fixed scope in it's class. This scope is semi massed produced and can be had for around a grand. That would be a good niche I think...FWIW
Link Posted: 8/13/2004 5:22:23 PM EST
[Last Edit: 8/13/2004 5:24:10 PM EST by CSGunWorkscom]
Link Posted: 8/13/2004 5:28:25 PM EST

Originally Posted By CSGunWorkscom:
cheaptrick the scope you show above is one that we will have in stock. The SN-10 would be a good scope to stock. The thing is we will sock some of the most come in setups or what we feel is the best setup and you can do special orders through CS GunWorks also.

www.csgunworks.com
mike@csgunworks.com



Good luck to ya!! .....
Link Posted: 8/13/2004 6:02:58 PM EST
That's cool, I would like an SN4 someday for my SPR.....funds needed at the moment.
Link Posted: 8/13/2004 6:26:38 PM EST


I like mine
Link Posted: 8/14/2004 3:05:32 AM EST
Nice rig, Duffy. Is that a SN-2??
Link Posted: 8/14/2004 4:10:30 AM EST
[Last Edit: 8/14/2004 4:14:56 AM EST by Duffy]
Thanks cheap, it's an SN3
Boys are you going to have fun with US Optics! Before I talked to US Optics I thought all I got to do is tell them which magnification, as is the case with most optics companies, but US Optics emailed me this rather comprehensive options list, they will make precisely what you want in terms of finish, magnification, front or rear focal, flip up covers, tube size, objective size, turrets, illuminiated reticle, etc.. just to name a few. It's the difference between buying a tailored suit and buying one already made in a store.
Link Posted: 8/14/2004 4:53:59 AM EST
Duffy, that's a SN-3 without the ERGO adjustment. Got ya!!
Link Posted: 8/14/2004 9:37:24 AM EST
Link Posted: 8/14/2004 12:11:51 PM EST
I've got 2 ST-10's and an SN-12 right now and love them...I've also had the SN-4. I only sold it because I was out of work and needed the money...
I think they are a excellent scope...but like everything else, it's boils down to whatever makes you happy....
Link Posted: 8/14/2004 12:44:58 PM EST
[Last Edit: 8/14/2004 12:45:39 PM EST by SailorDude]
John Williams sent me one of the original SN-4's many years ago, before the illuminated reticle. I got rid of it because the eye relief was so hyper-critical that it seemed like an all day job to get my cheek weld just exactly right before each shot. Very frustrating for up close and fast stuff.

Has this changed with recent models?

SD
Link Posted: 8/14/2004 6:16:43 PM EST
Looked briefly at the U.S. Optics before deciding on the ACOG. Main reasons for going with ACOG were cost and size/weight plus the fact that they were accepted for military use.

The U.S. Optics looked interesting; but if I went that route and that expense I would definitely want one customized to my tastes (so stocking them as a retailer may not work so well unless you are good at guessing the popular options). If I was going to spend that kind of coin on an illuminated variable without the customized options, I would probably just save a few dollars more and go with the Schmidt and Bender.
Link Posted: 8/14/2004 6:41:28 PM EST
My shopping list has on it an

SN-4 MK III

My wallet however has lint in it.

I know where there is an SN-4 with my name on it too.. anyone need a kidney?

My M1A wants the SN-4!

BTW there is a new SN-4 in the works, the slim-line

Comparison photo
Slim-line is to the rear
Link Posted: 8/15/2004 4:14:37 AM EST
[Last Edit: 9/10/2004 11:45:41 PM EST by gs430]
Not only does U.S. Optics make the best scopes I've ever run across, they also have excellent customer service in my experience. Quick turn around times for any sort of modification you want to do ('in-house' modifications of course...)

I really want a MST-100 but the $2500 price tag is killing me....but damn I want one...



[edit: fixed image link]
Link Posted: 8/15/2004 5:01:19 AM EST

Originally Posted By gs430:
Not only does U.S. Optics make the best scopes I've ever run across, they also have excellent customer service in my experience. Quick turn around times for any sort of modification you want to do ('in-house' modifications of course...)

I really want a MST-100 but the $2500 price tag is killing me....but damn I want one...

usoptics.fishing-va.com/images/usom40lg.jpg



Amen, brother!! That's a hoss!!!
Link Posted: 8/15/2004 3:08:56 PM EST
[Last Edit: 8/15/2004 3:10:32 PM EST by CSGunWorkscom]
Link Posted: 8/15/2004 3:26:02 PM EST
MST 100...Every Marine Scout/Sniper's wet dream!!! ....
Link Posted: 8/15/2004 3:28:38 PM EST
SN4 looks to be THE SHIT. I figured the IORs are a good substitute and DIRECT competitor to US OPTICS.
Link Posted: 8/15/2004 4:25:31 PM EST
[Last Edit: 8/15/2004 8:38:26 PM EST by SAICO]
Love my USO's; SN-3 3.2x 17 and ST-10 10x. I also use their scope mounts and rings. Yeah, they're spendy, but IMHO, they're worth every dollar.

USO's customer service is sterling and JW3 and staff are first class.

I have a AGOG NSN on my M4gery. It's a nice scope, but not too keen on the short eye relief.

I almost bought their demo SN-12 at this year's SHOT, even visited their Buena Park storefront- maybe at the next show.

Link Posted: 8/15/2004 4:32:44 PM EST
No way the IOR scope can directly compete with the SN4. I've looked through one, the sight picture is yellowish and small, nowhere near anything that can challenge the SN4 or ACOG.
Link Posted: 8/15/2004 4:39:51 PM EST

Originally Posted By chapperjoe:
SN4 looks to be THE SHIT. I figured the IORs are a good substitute and DIRECT competitor to US OPTICS.



I'm pretty sure that you could take an SN-4 and use it to beat an IOR into pieces and the SN-4 would still be usable.

SN-4 is about $1200

IOR 1.1-4x26 is about $700


There aren't too many choices in the normal eye relief 1.x-4 power though.
Link Posted: 8/15/2004 4:55:03 PM EST

Originally Posted By Phil_in_Seattle:

Originally Posted By chapperjoe:
SN4 looks to be THE SHIT. I figured the IORs are a good substitute and DIRECT competitor to US OPTICS.



I'm pretty sure that you could take an SN-4 and use it to beat an IOR into pieces and the SN-4 would still be usable.

SN-4 is about $1200

IOR 1.1-4x26 is about $700


There aren't too many choices in the normal eye relief 1.x-4 power though.



I had a slight issue with my SN-3. When I got it, it had a minute piece of lint at the 11:00 position.
you couldn't see it at the lower power settings. Only at 8x and up.

Well, it bugged me some. I emailed JW3 and he told me to, and I quote, "Beat the scope against a hard surface like THE EDGE OF A TABLE, real hard until the lint drops out." How many scope makers will tell you to beat the shit out of your scope like that??

Folks, I beat the snot out of that scope, knowing that USO would fix it if it broke. The lint didnt drop out, and JW3 told me to send it in and they would fix it. And they did. Took 5 days to get my scope back. Perfect!!!!
Link Posted: 8/15/2004 5:13:01 PM EST
I don't think the IOR scope will even get to Romania in 5 days
Link Posted: 8/16/2004 2:40:43 AM EST

Originally Posted By Duffy:
I don't think the IOR scope will even get to Romania in 5 days



Actually, Val at IOR replaced my scope in about 8 days or less. I dont remember. That was from the time I sent it from the east coast, to Colorado and back. I can't complain..

I have had them all fail, one way or anougher. Almost every scope I have ever owned went back to the factory.
I never really cared if they failed so much, just how fast the company responded and how we resolved the issue.

I think the longest turn around on a scope for me was Zeiss. 10 days.
Link Posted: 8/16/2004 4:36:48 AM EST
Good to hear cheap, that they are prompt with their service. I'm not knocking IOR scopes, I might get one someday, but their "tactical" model is in a different class than the SN4.
Link Posted: 8/16/2004 6:37:48 AM EST

Originally Posted By Duffy:
Good to hear cheap, that they are prompt with their service. I'm not knocking IOR scopes, I might get one someday, but their "tactical" model is in a different class than the SN4.



Duffy, I have cooled off a little on IOR, due in part with the RFP reticle placement on the tactical scopes with mildots , and eye relief issues on high recoil rifles.
I don't believe the eye relief is 3.75", as stated in their literature.
Link Posted: 9/1/2004 11:01:51 AM EST
Link Posted: 9/1/2004 2:47:34 PM EST
What is the going price on an SN4?
Link Posted: 9/1/2004 6:50:16 PM EST

Originally Posted By hispeedal2:
What is the going price on an SN4?



2nd that, Mike any input...will it be the same price for your choice of reticle?
Link Posted: 9/2/2004 11:26:20 AM EST
[Last Edit: 9/2/2004 12:46:55 PM EST by CSGunWorkscom]
Link Posted: 9/2/2004 1:52:24 PM EST
[Last Edit: 9/2/2004 1:56:09 PM EST by CSGunWorkscom]
Link Posted: 9/9/2004 7:19:14 PM EST
SAICO,
On your TRG, does your ST-10 have a 30mm tube? Is that the 44 mm objective?
It looks like you are using the USO picatinny rail and Screw Lock rings. What is the height of your rings on the TRG.
On your AR does the SN-3 have a 30mm tube and a 44mm objective? What height are the screw lock rings on the AR?
I am getting ready to order an SN-3 with a 58mm objective and I want to try and order the screw lock rings the correct height the first time. I also have a TRG and AR that I want to use the SN-3 on.
Thanks for the help.
Link Posted: 9/9/2004 8:19:17 PM EST
guys..

I love my IOR scope on my tactical setup...


clear as day...front focal plane and great reticle... and I would love to try out the IOR 1.1-4....


THAT BEING SAID....

US Optics makes the best glass in the world- I've had more then a few chances to play with them... and also other high end- own some loopies, have used S&B, Zeiss, Nightforce....
The USO scopes are just amazing... Yea, butt ugly- and pretty damn heavy... but at the same time damn near bomb proof and you can get them pretty trim if you go with the right options... When I save up the cash you can be sure that I'll be getting a USO scope... but yea, expensive also...

Mike...Good Luck with this- like was said, USO's are a custom deal... I'm used to talking to JBW#3 on snipershide and that's how I'd see myself doing business.... but from what you say it looks like your idea would work out on the most popular models... again good luck...they're great scopes...

-Roth
Link Posted: 9/9/2004 8:39:28 PM EST
[Last Edit: 9/9/2004 8:43:16 PM EST by SAICO]

Originally Posted By greaper:
SAICO,
On your TRG, does your ST-10 have a 30mm tube? Is that the 44 mm objective?
It looks like you are using the USO picatinny rail and Screw Lock rings. What is the height of your rings on the TRG.
On your AR does the SN-3 have a 30mm tube and a 44mm objective? What height are the screw lock rings on the AR?
I am getting ready to order an SN-3 with a 58mm objective and I want to try and order the screw lock rings the correct height the first time. I also have a TRG and AR that I want to use the SN-3 on.
Thanks for the help.



greaper,

Yes, the ST-10 on my TRG has the 30mm tube and 44mm objective with ERGO. I used the MKIII M&P/P6M-3000-XL @ 0.880.

On my .300 RSUM AR10T, the same as my ST-10. I used the same type of rings at 1.100 to clear the KAC 300mm rear BUIS. Without it, you could go 0.990, trimming the tabs on the Butlers to clear the FF tube or possibly 0.880 without the use of the front caps. I originally wanted a 3.6x22x58, but after talking to JW3, I had more than enough room to grow with a 3.2x17x44 with a 30mm tube.

Congrats on your SN-3 purchase. You've obviously done your research to take such a $$ plunge on JW3's fine optics. My next USO is going to be T-Pal version of the SN-3 above.


SN-3 T-Pal on USO's updated site
Link Posted: 9/10/2004 3:34:14 AM EST
It's probably true that in the last few years the overall quality of their glasses and their customers service are greatly increased because , otherwise , I could not believe that all of you can praise those scopes .

PP out
Link Posted: 9/10/2004 10:36:09 AM EST
Link Posted: 9/10/2004 11:32:26 PM EST
Chen,

you already know my long story with USO scopes , good to see you still have my opinion abt them.

PP out
Link Posted: 9/10/2004 11:59:33 PM EST
Hey guys, PLEASE share the "not-so-good" stories of your USO's....people need to hear both sides.

Based on my USO (and the ones my friends' own), every single unit has been 100% in every way, shape and form from performance and clarity to holding their zero and customer service.

Also, I think they make some of the best looking scopes because I know it's they were designed with FUNCTION in mind first. Design follows Function.

Now if their prices were closer to Leupolds and IOR's (especially for the variable magnification units), I would ONLY buy USO's but it's hard to scope every gun you have when the scopes are $1600 and up.

IOR does make some decent scopes. I have a buddy who has one and I have some time behind it...very good value IMO....
Link Posted: 9/11/2004 4:34:47 AM EST

Originally Posted By gs430:
Hey guys, PLEASE share the "not-so-good" stories of your USO's....people need to hear both sides.....



gs430,

before I 'll write down again my whole long story with USO pls just do a search here in the boards abt that , otherwise just tell me and I'll write it down again .

PP out
Link Posted: 9/11/2004 9:57:42 AM EST
[Last Edit: 9/11/2004 10:06:41 AM EST by CSGunWorkscom]
Link Posted: 9/11/2004 4:54:07 PM EST
[Last Edit: 9/11/2004 4:59:58 PM EST by SAICO]
Ciao Pinco Palla.

I am aware of Pinco Palla's issues with USO. He has actual first hand experience and it didn't turn out, no doubt about it. I have the utmost respect for Pinco Palla's experience and I took this into considerable consideration before making the purchase. After all, it's not like buying a Simmons scope for $75. A friend of mine bought a low mileage SN-6 from Stokes. He was sold on it and so was I when I first had experience with it; made the purchase 2 days later. My experience with JW2 and JW3 has been sterling and with unfortunate passing of JW2, I will not hesitate to deal with JW3 for future needs.

As far as my personal experience with JW3: I had a question regarding the correct ring height for my TRG. JW3 sent me two sets of $200 rings on my word that I'd return the ones that I didn't need. Enough said.

Pinco, going to SHOT 2005?
Link Posted: 9/13/2004 1:22:40 AM EST

Originally Posted By SAICO: I have the utmost respect for Pinco Palla's experience and I took this into considerable consideration before making the purchase. Pinco, going to SHOT 2005?


Hi Sai,
thanks for yr words.
Unfortunately in January I'm always so busy with my business here and I'' be not able to come oversea for the next SS , hope there'll be other good chances to meet in the future , who knows ?
Take care,ciao,
PP out
Link Posted: 9/13/2004 5:09:14 AM EST
Lets see......I have owned Leupold MK4's, NXS's, S&B's, and USO's. I have loved em all! I only shoot USO's on my SWS's now. For my requirements, USO is the best long range tactical optics company.


Jim
Link Posted: 9/13/2004 10:34:15 AM EST

Originally Posted By SMGLee:
Originally Posted By PincoPalla:
SN4 might be tough as a nail and it is build to look like a tank, but I would not consider them on the same level as the excellent Nightforce NSX. Since Nightforce is releasing mid range scope much like the SN4, I would wait for their 1-4x mid range scope that will be released soon with illuminated reticle and save some money.



Can you expand on the NF offering? Time frame? Model number? Specs?

Thanks
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