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Posted: 1/30/2011 7:17:29 AM EDT
I'm a relatively new shooter, and have put 2,000 rounds or so down range through my M4 (Daniel Defense M4, V1). Yesterday I tried something different with where I placed my trigger finger. Instead of using the pad of my finger, I wrapped my finger around the whole trigger. Wow, what a difference. I have pretty large hands and when I wrapped my finger around the trigger, I felt I had a much better grip on the rifle.

Also, for the first time, I could feel the trigger assembly moving and feel the trigger moving toward firing, if that makes sense. Before, with only pad of finger, I can't feel that.

I felt like I was squeezing the trigger much better and had better control.

I was shooting with my Aimpoint and had tighter groups.

So, based on what I have read many source say never wrap the trigger finger around the trigger, but I found it to work well for me. For rapid firing, I have to use the pad of my finger, but for more controlled "squeezed off" shots, this worked well for me.

Any observations or suggestions?

Thanks.

By the way, I notice the military indicates that for some the "wrap around" method works best, on this training video from the USMC.

See this video for what I'm talking about.
Link Posted: 1/30/2011 7:32:18 AM EDT
The follwing url probably sums up nicely how finger placement differs from person to person.
Link Posted: 1/30/2011 11:48:21 AM EDT
Reading a bit more on this I found references to pulling the trigger back with the second knuckle joint, which is stronger than the finger pad. This would explain why I'm actually able to feel the trigger moving back better. My M4 has, I suspect, a six pound pull on it.
Link Posted: 1/30/2011 2:24:14 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/30/2011 2:26:18 PM EDT by COSteve]
Long fingers and big hands mean a number of us can pull the trigger on our second joint. I found that doing so resulted in movement off the target so I rectified the issue by building up the pistol grip to fit my hand exactly. Not only a much more comfortable grip but also less tiring than holding my finger way out to keep the 1st pad on the trigger.

A stock G27 grip:



After I finished customizing it. Besides increasing the back strap distance, I also built up a finger pad and the thumb rest. The finished product works great for me:





Four years later and the paint is a bit shiny from use but it's still as comfortable as ever:


Link Posted: 1/31/2011 8:35:21 AM EDT
Too little finger and you could be pushing the weapon away from you, too much and you could be pulling it towards you. There is no standard, it's all shooter preference baby! It's good that you found your sweet spot.
Link Posted: 1/31/2011 9:31:19 AM EDT
Thank you for the input and replies, much appreciated
Link Posted: 1/31/2011 5:57:05 PM EDT
What did you use to build up the grip?
Link Posted: 1/31/2011 6:43:43 PM EDT
with the standard pistol grip,, i find that if i have the pad on the trigger, there will be a gap and thus not a good grip on the pistol grip. the way to solve this for me was to get the magpul miad. the bigger backstrap on the grip helps maintain a good grip and pad on the trigger.

there is a sniper's hide video where jacob explains how he has to maintain a loose grip in order to put the pad on the trigger. it is on youtube.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ytM_2PG6joU
Link Posted: 1/31/2011 6:55:55 PM EDT
Originally Posted By ptmccain: ... which is stronger than the finger pad. This would explain why I'm actually able to feel the trigger moving back better. My M4 has, I suspect, a six pound pull on it.


And there is part of the problem; to overcome that heavy trigger, you need the mechanical advantage of using the distal joint rather than the pad.
I'd consider a larger pistol grip, but I'd also consider improving that hernia-inducing trigger.
A two stage Geissele SSA is the way to go, IMHO. Two pounds on the takeup, two on the break. I find a decent, reliable trigger makes a huge difference, and you can slap thru' the SSA if you are in a hellfire hurry, or squeeze when you have more time and distance.
Moon

Link Posted: 2/1/2011 4:51:29 AM EDT
I know you are right. The trigger on my M4 is heavy! When I shoot my son's AK I always end up shooting it before I even feel myself pulling the trigger. It is so light compared to the M4 trigger I'm using.

Link Posted: 2/1/2011 8:10:29 AM EDT
One problem with too much finger on the trigger is that you can end up pulling shots. IME, this is more apparent during rapid fire versus slow fire.

That said, everyone is different. If what you're doing works for you, then keep doing it.

Products are available to help in this regard such as the aforementioned grips and fire control groups. It can certainly be problematic for a shooter with large hands to have to deal with a small grip.

Used grips abound on the EE. Buy a few and see what works for you. I have small hands and prefer the MIAD with the thin backstrap as well as the Tango Down BG-16 (Original Battle Grip).
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