I have never heard anyone talk about this, nor do i have the desire to try it, but... Has anyone ever had the SHTF occasion where under water fire was neccessary. Is this even possible or practical with an AR-15/M-16. What are your thoughts on the subject.

if the bullet makes it out of the bbl sucessfully, which is doubtful, it will fragment within a few feet

you can fire underwater. after about 1-3 inches max of coming out of the barrel the bullet will fragment into tiny useless pieces. there was tests done with diff calibers fired into water. a .50 was fired into water and fragmented in tiny pieces within a few inches. another words if u are underwater and a .50 is shot at you, as long as you are submerged atleast a foot under water you are pretty much bullet proof.

lol, you guys msut have missed the guyfrom az who bumpfired hsi ar underwater........ umm not good.

AGNTSA........
As per US military TM guidelines, it's wise to let the weapon drain for
a few seconds, muzzle down after being submerged.........not that
I pop out the brine with an M4gery on a regular basis or anything.
Other than that, it would be nice if a team member could possibly
repost the infamous "Bump firing under water" thread from the archives.
Appearently, this genius got a couple rounds off before
totally "busticating" his Bushmaster.

height=8

Quoted: height=8 Quoted: lol, you guys msut have missed the guyfrom az who bumpfired hsi ar underwater........ umm not good.he notice the myth busters only came up with the jacket from the .50?

aqua bumping?

Quoted: Quoted: lol, you guys msut have missed the guyfrom az who bumpfired hsi ar underwater........ umm not good. ......or the Myth Busters episode!

+1.  They fired several guns underwater... the only one that was damaged was the shotgun.  All the others functioned, and handguns appeared to be lethal out to a few feet.

I too saw that mythbusters, it will fire but the bullet will not travel far, less than 10 feet. It would only penetrate if the target was within an inch or two the muzzel. Pistols fared better they penetrated at 3 feet or so. DO NOT SHOOT A SHOTGUN UNDERWATER! IT WILL COME APART! Those mythbusters have a pretty sweet job. hope this helps.

I've submerged a Sig P226(Rubbermaid tub), let it drain briefly, then fire off 15
rounds with no problems. Water flys everywhere.

I've submerged one of my M4geries(Rubbermaid tub), let it drain as per US mil SOP,
than fire off 30 rds with no problems. Water flys everywhere.

A first gen. Glock 17(minus underwater cup thingy) was all I had the balls to fire underwater in a buddys ghetto pool.
I only fired one FMJ round and the bullet didn't travel more than a few feet. Water splashed up
and the report was an audible dull "poomp".


Jbombelli- But did they bumpfire an AR underwater?

Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: lol, you guys msut have missed the guyfrom az who bumpfired hsi ar underwater........ umm not good. ......or the Myth Busters episode! notice the myth busters only came up with the jacket from the .50?

I'm glad I'm not the only one that noticed that. Someone has a hole in the bottom of their pool...

You could send an IM to 47, but you probably wouldn't get an answer because I believe he got himself banned from this site within the past month or so. He authored a thread a couple years back about something like this. Blew his rifle apart and posted pics.

Quoted: You could send an IM to 47, but you probably wouldn't get an answer because I believe he got himself banned from this site within the past month or so. He authored a thread a couple years back about something like this. Blew his rifle apart and posted pics.

Don't tell Me he got banned......................................................for Aqua bumping!
Seriously, I think I'd at least smack one of my buddies upside the back of His head for doing some
down syndrome-assed shit like that.

That thread has still Gotta' be in the archives somewhere!


PS: I fired the Glock 17 underwater only ONCE(FMJ no HPs), But just because
others have came before Me and and have successfully
popped off a few rounds. I wanted to believe the hype first hand.
Plus, it's a beater and only cost me $300.

Quoted: Quoted: You could send an IM to 47, but you probably wouldn't get an answer because I believe he got himself banned from this site within the past month or so. He authored a thread a couple years back about something like this. Blew his rifle apart and posted pics. Don't tell Me he got banned......................................................for Aqua bumping! Seriously, I think I'd at least smack one of my buddies upside the back of His head for doing some down syndrome-assed shit like that. That thread has still Gotta' be in the archives somewhere! PS: I fired the Glock 17 underwater only ONCE(FMJ no HPs), But just because others have came before Me and and have successfully popped off a few rounds. I wanted to believe the hype first hand. Plus, it's a beater and only cost me $300.

He got bannned for trolling the brothers of the shield forum, he was an idiot. im glad he is gone.

Quoted: I've submerged a Sig P226(Rubbermaid tub), let it drain briefly, then fire off 15 rounds with no problems. Water flys everywhere. I've submerged one of my M4geries(Rubbermaid tub), let it drain as per US mil SOP, than fire off 30 rds with no problems. Water flys everywhere. A first gen. Glock 17(minus underwater cup thingy) was all I had the balls to fire underwater in a buddys ghetto pool. I only fired one FMJ round and the bullet didn't travel more than a few feet. Water splashed up and the report was an audible dull "poomp". Jbombelli- But did they bumpfire an AR underwater?

Not that I saw.  I think only *certain* people are capable of that special maneuver.

Quoted: you can fire underwater. after about 1-3 inches max of coming out of the barrel the bullet will fragment into tiny useless pieces. there was tests done with diff calibers fired into water. a .50 was fired into water and fragmented in tiny pieces within a few inches. another words if u are underwater and a .50 is shot at you, as long as you are submerged atleast a foot under water you are pretty much bullet proof.

You can certainly fire INTO the water, but firing UNDER or IN the water may be very hazardous to your health.

Quoted: Quoted: you can fire underwater. after about 1-3 inches max of coming out of the barrel the bullet will fragment into tiny useless pieces. there was tests done with diff calibers fired into water. a .50 was fired into water and fragmented in tiny pieces within a few inches. another words if u are underwater and a .50 is shot at you, as long as you are submerged atleast a foot under water you are pretty much bullet proof. You can certainly fire INTO the water, but firing UNDER or IN the water may be very hazardous to your health.

Round deflection can and will occur when firing into water. That also could be very hazardous to anyone dowrange's health,
unless there is an adequate backstop behind said body of water.

Spearguns are made for underwater.

Here's some fun reading for Team Members.

The thread where the term AQUABUMP originated.

Enjoy

WIZZO

Here is what the military teaches:

- pull rifle out of water, point muzzle down for 10-12 seconds, fire
- pull rifle out of water, pull bolt back half-way, point muzzle down 5-7 seconds, close bolt, fire
- pull rifle out of water, pull bolt entirely open, point muzzle down 3-5 seconds, close bolt, fire

The Russians have some pistols (SPP) and rifles (APS) that were specifically designed to fire underwater and are effective against man/marine life from 10-30 meters - verrry long slugs are used.

H&K also has a pistol (P11) designed to be fired underwater although they wont admit it.

I shot two rounds out of my G23C while I was rafting down the river.

I made sure it was full of water before I let it rip. The gun still functions fine.

Edit: LOL just figured out this is the AR section.

Quoted: Here's some fun reading for Team Members. The thread where the term AQUABUMP originated. Enjoy WIZZO

Definitely one of the best threads in ARFCOM history.

Ballistically speaking it's the transition between mediums of different density that destabilizes and fragments the bullet.

Theoretically if the barrel were fully flooded at the time of firing, you'd get better perfomance as that transition would not occur.

But on the downside, the bullet would then also have to push a substantial slug of water in front of it when fired and that would cause some truly impressive chamber pressures.  With a pistol, the pressure isues would be less severe due to the shorter lenght and lighter weight of the water slug that has to be forced from the barrel and lower aspect ratio of the bullet would lend it much improved stability.

It makes you wonder though...If you loaded a reduced charge that took into account the weight of the water in the barrel, you could get the round to fire safely under water and expect at least a minimal degree of short range performance from a rifle.  

Then again taking it one step farther, you could also mill or even cast little fin stabilized penetrators, enclose them in a sabot and combine them with your reduced charge. Water is still something like 800 times denser than air, but with a fin stabilized projectile and a decent MV, you could get an effective range perhaps equal to the 50-100 visibility you'd encounter in good conditions most places.

Now...if I can just get a legislator freind of mine to change the wording in the definition of "speargun" I could have some serious fun spearfishing.