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9/22/2017 12:11:25 AM
Posted: 8/11/2005 10:58:01 AM EDT
I am looking at getting some scrap steel for my 20 inch Bushmaster. It is just scrap steel lying around at my grandpas work place. We are thinking of welding some steel together so that we can shoot it. How thick does it need to be? How far away should it be when shooting at it? Is this safe?

Thanks for all the input and help!
Link Posted: 8/11/2005 11:01:22 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/11/2005 11:24:36 AM EDT by _DR]

Originally Posted By Death_005:
I am looking at getting some scrap steel for my 20 inch Bushmaster. It is just scrap steel lying around at my grandpas work place. We are thinking of welding some steel together so that we can shoot it. How thick does it need to be? How far away should it be when shooting at it? Is this safe?

Thanks for all the input and help!



1/2 inch if it's just plain steel - I would put it at least 100yards away to avoid ricochet.
I have seen M855 ball go though 1/4" mild steel plate.
Link Posted: 8/11/2005 11:08:27 AM EDT
M193 and M855 will zip thru 1/4" mild steel.

Your answer depends on the hardness of the steel. Even a 1/2" piece of mild steel will crater badly at 100 yards.

Shooting steel is pretty safe. Just keep it out at 100 yards. I sometimes shoot as close as 50 yards with carbean due to the lower velocities. But be sure to wear eye protection.

w00t!
Link Posted: 8/11/2005 11:13:37 AM EDT
Mild steel sucks IMO.....

I hate getting cut up from rifle rounds at 50-75yds.

I use a high grade AR500, but I'm not sure you would just have that lying around.

You will need thick steel for AR's and you will need > 100yds spread to be safe.

HTH....
Link Posted: 8/11/2005 11:28:11 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/11/2005 11:40:53 AM EDT by _DR]
Anybody ever experimented with a mitigating layer, like adding a spaced layer of steel or wood, so that the velocity is slowed and the projectile deformed before hitting the second and final layer?
Link Posted: 8/11/2005 12:34:34 PM EDT

Originally Posted By _DR:
Anybody ever experimented with a mitigating layer, like adding a spaced layer of steel or wood, so that the velocity is slowed and the projectile deformed before hitting the second and final layer?



I think there was some company that had rubberized steel gongs to catch all the splash. I can't remember if it was body armor plates or targets.

I've tried blocks of glued 2X4s that were out in the desert. My 9 millie went right thru them and still pancaked the bullet on the gong.
Link Posted: 8/11/2005 12:43:17 PM EDT
I cut out some 1/4" T1 steel targets at work for handgun use. If I get them up this weekend I'll try my AR out on one of them.
Link Posted: 8/11/2005 12:53:09 PM EDT
A local member of my range fab'd my plate and stand. IIRC it is a 12' sq of 1/4 in 500 Brinnel(sp?) steel. I regularly place it at 100yrds when using my AR's. It will slightly mar the surface of the steel(no sign on the back of the plate) but no dents/holes.

I wouldn't shoot at a plate inside that distance. Scrap steel will prob be pretty well Holed regardless. Might be worth trying to find some tougher plate locally.

Good luck, Be safe.

Blitz
Link Posted: 8/11/2005 1:05:53 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/11/2005 1:06:17 PM EDT by magnum_99]
My MGM (armor plate) steel target is now mildly cratered because I shot it with xm-193 at 75 yards.

Wolf doesn't do that.

100 yards minimum for even 500 brinell steel.

Anything less will be swiss cheese or torn to hell in no time.
Link Posted: 8/11/2005 1:13:37 PM EDT
Amazing how that little bullet will penetrate.
Link Posted: 8/11/2005 1:19:31 PM EDT

Originally Posted By magnum_99:
My MGM (armor plate) steel target is now mildly cratered because I shot it with xm-193 at 75 yards.

Wolf doesn't do that.

100 yards minimum for even 500 brinell steel.

Anything less will be swiss cheese or torn to hell in no time.



Maybe MGM's 500 Brinell.....

The stuff I use is good to go at nearly any range. For safety sake I've never shot it closer than 25yds....

Link Posted: 8/11/2005 5:55:04 PM EDT

Originally Posted By _DR:
Anybody ever experimented with a mitigating layer, like adding a spaced layer of steel or wood, so that the velocity is slowed and the projectile deformed before hitting the second and final layer?



Kind of. I was going straight through the 5/16" mild steel @ 50 yrds. Welded 1/4"strips of Kromite steel (very hard---destroys sheer blades) on the back. It held up for two mags before finally giving up.

I've got some AR 500 that I will try out when some more scrap becomes available.

There is a guy that I work with that used some T1 @ 100 yrds for an AR. Held up really well. I'm not sure what kind of ammo he was using though.

I'll try what ever comes available first.
Link Posted: 8/11/2005 6:06:43 PM EDT
I have run 3 gun matches for 2 years at my local range. I welded up all of the steel targets we used, including 5 pieces of steel I used for rifle targets. The pieces are all 5/8" and 3/4" plain mild steel. The trick to not getting splatter is allowing it to move. If you have a piece of steel that is secured in such a way that it does not move when shot, you will get splatter back at you. Tatgets need to either be small enough or balanced in such a way as to allow them to move or fall when hit. I can send pictures of the ones I built, if you want.
Link Posted: 8/11/2005 6:09:50 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/11/2005 6:10:36 PM EDT by markm]

Originally Posted By magnum_99:
My MGM (armor plate) steel target is now mildly cratered because I shot it with xm-193 at 75 yards.

Wolf doesn't do that.

100 yards minimum for even 500 brinell steel.

Anything less will be swiss cheese or torn to hell in no time.



Yep. We've tore up some 3/8" Armorguard with 50 yard full auto bursts and such! It's good for armor, but repeated abuse like we give it will kill anything. ESPECIALLY with M193!!! Velocity is what does the most damage to the gongs.
Link Posted: 8/11/2005 6:18:19 PM EDT

Originally Posted By markm:

Originally Posted By magnum_99:
My MGM (armor plate) steel target is now mildly cratered because I shot it with xm-193 at 75 yards.

Wolf doesn't do that.

100 yards minimum for even 500 brinell steel.

Anything less will be swiss cheese or torn to hell in no time.



Yep. We've tore up some 3/8" Armorguard with 50 yard full auto bursts and such! It's good for armor, but repeated abuse like we give it will kill anything. ESPECIALLY with M193!!! Velocity is what does the most damage to the gongs.



Man!

I must have gotten some good stuff then.....
Link Posted: 8/11/2005 6:31:31 PM EDT

Originally Posted By _DR:

Originally Posted By Death_005:
I am looking at getting some scrap steel for my 20 inch Bushmaster. It is just scrap steel lying around at my grandpas work place. We are thinking of welding some steel together so that we can shoot it. How thick does it need to be? How far away should it be when shooting at it? Is this safe?

Thanks for all the input and help!



1/2 inch if it's just plain steel - I would put it at least 100yards away to avoid ricochet.
I have seen M855 ball go though 1/4" mild steel plate.



I have a scar on my leg to prove my stupidity.. Entry and exit... I no longer shoot steel at less than 100 yds.. I could easily be a one eyed idiot right now.
Link Posted: 8/11/2005 6:32:25 PM EDT
A buddy if mine and I used to shoot steel plate with 223/556 ammo. Distance was approximately 40-50 yards. it would usually punch holes in the steel (1/4") very easily. I have done this many times. We would usually prop the plates up against an old log or something and shoot at it. We thought it was pretty cool how a 223 would punch a hole in a steel plate like it was made there. Even the soft points would not have trouble defeating the plates.

Anyhow, one day we were squeezing off a few rounds and a fragment of the bullet ricocheted and hit me directly in the middle of the chest. It broke the skin pretty good, but thank God it did not punch through to my heart. (it could have very easily) This is the last time I shot at any hard surfaces.

We used to shoot the plates with 30-30, 7.62x39, and all kinds of other stuff. it always amazed me how the little 223 would punch a little hole through the plates every time. The 30-30 would just make a dent. It is really some interesting stuff, but way to risky for me any more.

If you are going to do this, research it. Be safe and wear eye protection.
Link Posted: 8/11/2005 10:14:17 PM EDT
Don't even bother if you use mild steel. For example, Wolf will punch through 1/4" at 100yards, and heavily crater 1" at 25 yards.
Link Posted: 8/12/2005 8:24:09 AM EDT
definatly over 100 yards, I've got a nice scar on my side from it at around 50 yards.
Link Posted: 8/12/2005 10:12:50 AM EDT
I also recommend AR500 steel it works the best, however, AR400 will also work with 223 and hand gun calibers but 30/30, 308 and 7.62x54R will rip right threw it ( both of my plates are 1/4).

I got 12x12 inch plates and had eye bolts from Lowe's welded on at Midas auto shop and use steel chains to swing them. ($20 added to what you paid for the steel plate) Never had problem with damage except for the 30 caliber rifle rounds on the AR400. With handgun or 223, I have had no splash back at 50 yards, but I almost never shoot 223 at 50 yards, and my handgun bullets are mostly lead or copper plated (both pretty soft).

I once got hit with a piece of lead when a guy next to me shot a 44 mag at a steel plate 12 yards away. it hurt like a bee sting but luckly did not break skin.
Link Posted: 8/13/2005 7:29:17 AM EDT
We use steel targets to qualify with; a richochet every now and then. Targets are usually no closer than 50 yards, though. Paper up closer. The steel is nice, as it gives a 'clang' when you hit it, plus using the targets that fall are good to show a solid hit. Eye protection is a must to be certain you can see after the course is done. The bullets crater the targets, but it's not like we expect them to remain unblemished.
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