Warning

 

Close

Confirm Action

Are you sure you wish to do this?

Confirm Cancel
Member Login
Site Notices
9/22/2017 12:11:25 AM
Posted: 11/6/2003 10:14:58 PM EDT
Why are Stoners so expensive? Are they different mechanically from the M16? As an aside the Knights Armamaments web site is one of the ugliest least informative sites I have ever seen.
Link Posted: 11/7/2003 3:34:44 AM EDT
Your right about the Knights web site. I called them up to get more information on their rifles and I bitched about the site while I had them. As far as the rifle goes (I just purchased one off of the EE) people on this board usually say they make a very good rifle but they are over priced. I think when you add it up you'll see that they really arn't. It comes with a KAC RAS rail system ($300 value). It also comes with the KAC 2 stage triggers ($300 value). Take into account those two features right there and it explains the price. The cheapest that I have seen a new SR-15 M4 for sale for was $1400, subtract the $600 above and your at $800 which is cheaper than the Colt or the Bushmaster. The Knights also comes with a Remington match grade barrel, they say that is why they don't have the barrels chrome lined, for accuracy. It also comes with a chrome bolt and carrier. The upper and lower are made together and go through the factory together for the best fit. They also told me that they use higher standard parts when it comes to all of the pins, springs and other small parts. Add it all up and it sounds to me like a good deal and a better rifle if you want the RAS and the top of the line two stage trigger. The rifle I purchased came with several other really nice additional items that made it a deal that I couldn't pass up.
Link Posted: 11/7/2003 4:58:48 AM EDT
Im sorry to ask this but what type rifle are yall talking about?? I know what a Robinson Arms m96 is.Its based off of the Stoner 63 ( I believe ). Is this the same type of rifle?? Got a link? Thanks WarDawg
Link Posted: 11/7/2003 5:20:36 AM EDT
I attended a precision rifle course recently put on by Tiger Valley near Waco Texas. One of the students had a Stoner SPR. It never fired more than 3 shots in row without some kind of malfunction. The poor guy spent half his time trying to get it to run. Finally put it in the trunk and went to his Remington PSS.
Link Posted: 11/7/2003 7:11:08 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/7/2003 7:11:36 AM EDT by 5subslr5]
If Eugene Stoner followed the trend he had followed for most of his life, the only thing KAC has that's really Stoner designed is the SR-25. Stoner simply did not believe the 5.56mm cartridge was adequate for military use. Whywork's SR-15 M4: The best price I've seen was $1200 + shipping. The RAS on the SR-15 M4 is NOT FF. Still, at around $1200, I think it's a fairly good deal. (Really good trigger.) tthiel: KAC has just gotten a web site of their own and it is pretty worthless. KAC really cares little for civilian business and their web site reflects that disinterest. 5sub
Link Posted: 11/7/2003 7:21:58 AM EDT
If you happen to be talking about the Stoner 63...the reason the Model 63 is so expensive is due to it's mystique coupled to 10 to the 5th power by the fact that there are only about 68 in private hands. This makes it an investment grade firearm..not just a collector.
Link Posted: 11/7/2003 8:53:53 AM EDT
Local shop here sold a couple of SR-15s to a Healthsouth CEO Richard Scrushy's security guys. Somthing like $3k for 'em. Course, they came with all the goodies already on them (AimPoint, SureFire, and bipod).
Link Posted: 11/7/2003 8:57:04 AM EDT
Originally Posted By desertmoon: If you happen to be talking about the Stoner 63...the reason the Model 63 is so expensive is due to it's mystique coupled to 10 to the 5th power by the fact that there are only about 68 in private hands. This makes it an investment grade firearm..not just a collector.
View Quote
desertmoon, the Stoner 63 is another 5.56 that Stoner did not design. Stoner designed the Stoner 62 in 7.62 but when Cadillac Gage wanted to move to the 5.56 caliber Jim Sullivan and Bob Fremont came in and did the Stoner 63 design. Excepting something called the FARC and the Stoner 86 LMG, Stoner simply wouldn't design anything for the 5.56. Neither of the 5.56 guns mentioned above were ever produced. 5sub
Link Posted: 11/7/2003 3:32:43 PM EDT
I purchased a Knights SR-15M4 in August from Impact guns for $1250.00. All I can say is WOW! This is a first class weapon. I currently have 600 rounds thru it with no problems. Equiped with the Aimpoint it is awsome. Wish I knew how to post a picture.
Link Posted: 11/7/2003 6:28:38 PM EDT
Apparently there is a pirate web site and their real site is at http://www.knightarmco.com/knightshome.htm. The price for the M4 doesn't look bad to me when you consider they have the (overpriced) Knights rail system and two stage trigger. No chrome lined barrel? I dunno about that one...
Link Posted: 11/7/2003 7:43:34 PM EDT
Originally Posted By tthiel: Apparently there is a pirate web site and their real site is at http://www.knightarmco.com/knightshome.htm. The price for the M4 doesn't look bad to me when you consider they have the (overpriced) Knights rail system and two stage trigger. No chrome lined barrel? I dunno about that one...
View Quote
tthiel, 'some' of the SR-15 M4's do have a chrome lined barrel. 5sub
Link Posted: 11/8/2003 4:39:23 AM EDT
I agree with whywork40 that the extras that come with them kind of make up for the price. I just got an sr15 match, and it comes with a FF ras, KAC trigger, and Kreiger barrel. For the price, you really cannot find another AR with those features!
Link Posted: 11/8/2003 5:21:05 AM EDT
Originally Posted By 5subslr5:
Originally Posted By desertmoon: If you happen to be talking about the Stoner 63...the reason the Model 63 is so expensive is due to it's mystique coupled to 10 to the 5th power by the fact that there are only about 68 in private hands. This makes it an investment grade firearm..not just a collector.
View Quote
desertmoon, the Stoner 63 is another 5.56 that Stoner did not design. Stoner designed the Stoner 62 in 7.62 but when Cadillac Gage wanted to move to the 5.56 caliber Jim Sullivan and Bob Fremont came in and did the Stoner 63 design. Excepting something called the FARC and the Stoner 86 LMG, Stoner simply wouldn't design anything for the 5.56. Neither of the 5.56 guns mentioned above were ever produced. 5sub
View Quote
I only replied in simplified fashion because the user did not specify the weapon...most people think he also designed the 180 which he didn't....but other than guys like you and me...most folks don't care......sadly......
Link Posted: 11/8/2003 6:14:20 AM EDT
When I called Knights before I purchase a SR15 M4 and they said that starting next year they will put chrome lined barrels on the M4 model. They also said that the reason that they don't use chome lined barrels is because on the M4 they use a Remington match grade barrel. They are going for the best accuracy.
Link Posted: 11/8/2003 6:17:02 AM EDT
Originally Posted By desertmoon:
Originally Posted By 5subslr5:
Originally Posted By desertmoon: If you happen to be talking about the Stoner 63...the reason the Model 63 is so expensive is due to it's mystique coupled to 10 to the 5th power by the fact that there are only about 68 in private hands. This makes it an investment grade firearm..not just a collector.
View Quote
desertmoon, the Stoner 63 is another 5.56 that Stoner did not design. Stoner designed the Stoner 62 in 7.62 but when Cadillac Gage wanted to move to the 5.56 caliber Jim Sullivan and Bob Fremont came in and did the Stoner 63 design. Excepting something called the FARC and the Stoner 86 LMG, Stoner simply wouldn't design anything for the 5.56. Neither of the 5.56 guns mentioned above were ever produced. 5sub
View Quote
I only replied in simplified fashion because the user did not specify the weapon...most people think he also designed the 180 which he didn't....but other than guys like you and me...most folks don't care......sadly......
View Quote
DM, I knew you that you were aware of the facts. Just used your posts in case a couple of others might not be aware. Tom
Link Posted: 11/8/2003 6:23:13 AM EDT
Originally Posted By whywork40: When I called Knights before I purchase a SR15 M4 and they said that starting next year they will put chrome lined barrels on the M4 model. They also said that the reason that they don't use chome lined barrels is because on the M4 they use a Remington match grade barrel. They are going for the best accuracy.
View Quote
w.work, one of the KAC guys posted here maybe a month ago and the subject of chrome lined barrels came up. He said some of the SR-15M4's already produced had chrome lined barrels. That's all I know.
Link Posted: 11/8/2003 7:47:40 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Nick710: I attended a precision rifle course recently put on by Tiger Valley near Waco Texas. One of the students had a Stoner SPR. It never fired more than 3 shots in row without some kind of malfunction. The poor guy spent half his time trying to get it to run. Finally put it in the trunk and went to his Remington PSS.
View Quote
If you are talking about an SR15 Match, I find that hard to believe. More than likely it was a parts gun, where anything is possible. In any case, anyone who brings an unproven rifle to a class is an idiot.
Link Posted: 11/8/2003 8:20:58 AM EDT
Originally Posted By jercdevil: I purchased a Knights SR-15M4 in August from Impact guns for $1250.00. All I can say is WOW! This is a first class weapon. I currently have 600 rounds thru it with no problems. Equiped with the Aimpoint it is awsome. Wish I knew how to post a picture.
View Quote
If you want a pic posted, email it to me at sniper_wolfe@ar15.com and I'll get it up for you.
Link Posted: 11/8/2003 12:21:09 PM EDT
5subslr5, I wasn't trying to say that they havent in the past, I was talking about my SR15 that I was going to purchase. I called ahead of time because the Knights site was information poor. After he told me that my rifle was the Remington match grade rifle he also said that starting next year they would be using chrome lined barrels (he was refering to the M4 model). We never talked about the Knights rifles having chrome lining in the past. Sorry for the confusion.
Link Posted: 11/11/2003 8:17:37 AM EDT
Originally Posted By 5subslr5:
Originally Posted By desertmoon:
Originally Posted By 5subslr5:
Originally Posted By desertmoon: If you happen to be talking about the Stoner 63...the reason the Model 63 is so expensive is due to it's mystique coupled to 10 to the 5th power by the fact that there are only about 68 in private hands. This makes it an investment grade firearm..not just a collector.
View Quote
desertmoon, the Stoner 63 is another 5.56 that Stoner did not design. Stoner designed the Stoner 62 in 7.62 but when Cadillac Gage wanted to move to the 5.56 caliber Jim Sullivan and Bob Fremont came in and did the Stoner 63 design. Excepting something called the FARC and the Stoner 86 LMG, Stoner simply wouldn't design anything for the 5.56. Neither of the 5.56 guns mentioned above were ever produced. 5sub
View Quote
I only replied in simplified fashion because the user did not specify the weapon...most people think he also designed the 180 which he didn't....but other than guys like you and me...most folks don't care......sadly......
View Quote
DM, I knew you that you were aware of the facts. Just used your posts in case a couple of others might not be aware. Tom
View Quote
Totally cool!
Top Top