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11/24/2017 4:44:23 PM
11/22/2017 10:05:29 PM
Posted: 10/9/2004 3:22:26 PM EST
Ive not seen anything about a possible shortage of military 5.56 ammo, like Q3131a, or US mauf.
I know that the US has put in orders to overseas makers to help replace the unexpected large amounts of ammo our troops are using -- how come us civilian users aren't seeing any shortages?
Link Posted: 10/9/2004 3:24:10 PM EST
Because we don't shoot 55 grain rounds.
Link Posted: 10/9/2004 4:00:36 PM EST
Link Posted: 10/9/2004 4:03:03 PM EST
Have you noticed how much the ammo has jumped in price lately? We are being affected.
Link Posted: 10/9/2004 5:35:41 PM EST
there are all kinds of factors in play...interesting side note...

we are contracting with israel for them to make a bunch of 5.56 for our troops

some democrat in the senate (a few weeks ago) said that this ammo should not be used in iraq because that would offend the muslims too much (to be shot with jew bullets i suppose), he wants them to ship 5.56 back to the US for use in training from israel (mideast) and send ammo made in US to iraq.....not very efficient....stupid dems
Link Posted: 10/9/2004 5:42:52 PM EST
Israel makes both M193 and M855. they use both also. Some of out NG units reportedly still use A1s and M193, but I think either those have been phased out or they got A2s before OIF.

US factories have been picking up some of the slack on M855, I have heard, which would mean they make less m193. That is why its more expensive now.
Link Posted: 10/9/2004 5:54:45 PM EST
XM193 and Q3131A are still $199/1000 rounds at Ammoman.com, which is what I paid last year and in 2002, so what's this price increase y'all are talking about?
Link Posted: 10/9/2004 6:53:17 PM EST
It was scarce in my neighborhood right after the Iraq War started, but I think that was just people hoarding worrying about possible shortages.

Now it is always available and fairly cheap.
Link Posted: 10/9/2004 8:35:25 PM EST
[Last Edit: 10/9/2004 8:35:38 PM EST by kensteele]
I guess I am hoarding because I had heard about a "shortage."
ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=3&f=16&t=203521
Picked up another 4K from the ammoman last week at the regular price.
Link Posted: 10/9/2004 9:44:58 PM EST
I just picked some up at Outdoor Marksman, which is even cheaper than Ammoman.
Link Posted: 10/10/2004 4:34:02 AM EST
[Last Edit: 10/10/2004 4:36:42 AM EST by bill1953]
STLRN: 5.56mm includes both 55 gr and 62 gr. I say this because I've been told, at least stateside some NG units are still using 55 gr.
Link Posted: 10/10/2004 8:17:41 AM EST
I am still sitting on a rain check from Bass-Pro for the $2.88 Q3131a stuff from their summer sale. 2 cases. Called yesterday, and they still don't have any in stock. I think they want me to forget about it. Lucky my rain check does not have an expiration date on it.

I don't understand how they can't get it, but Sports Authority has cases on their shelves.....
Link Posted: 10/10/2004 9:10:45 AM EST
We have already seen dips in the supply and price has risen to reflect that but you will not see it dry up barring some freak act of a mother* liberal. There is just too great an ability to crank out ammo, the problem is getting it where it needs to be fast enough.(Fuel costs are crippling to business)
Link Posted: 10/10/2004 10:11:24 AM EST

Originally Posted By natedogg42:
there are all kinds of factors in play...interesting side note...

we are contracting with israel for them to make a bunch of 5.56 for our troops

some democrat in the senate (a few weeks ago) said that this ammo should not be used in iraq because that would offend the muslims too much (to be shot with jew bullets i suppose), he wants them to ship 5.56 back to the US for use in training from israel (mideast) and send ammo made in US to iraq.....not very efficient....stupid dems




This is why we can never trust a Democrat to fight the war on terror. Always thinking of them over us.
Link Posted: 10/10/2004 1:52:45 PM EST
[Last Edit: 10/10/2004 1:54:49 PM EST by brillo]
Bass Pro online has been out-of-stock since their late summer Q3131A sale, but they are now back in-stock. Arundel Mills, MD, Bass Pro still out-of-stock.

Ammoman mass email today: We also have a new load of the 223 Lake City XM193 and green tip SS109 being delivered.

Wholesale Hunter XM193 expected to be back in-stock by end of October.
Link Posted: 10/10/2004 4:05:50 PM EST
My local dealer source for XM193 was out for the first time in a long time when I visited him Saturday. When I inquired, he said his distributor was out and had no ETA on more stock. He was also low on .223 (FAE, UMC & PMC), but that due to his customers buying it as an alternative to XM193.

Price doesn't matter if he has no stock.
Link Posted: 10/10/2004 8:14:55 PM EST
My guess is most of the posters to this board have burned more ammo this year than most of the guys on the ground in Iraq. Although the military probably did a lot of predeployment training using a lot of ammo this is a low-intensity conflict with relatively few pitched battles.

The military has huge stockpiles of small arms ammo (it's cheap and the technology hasn't changed much) so I doubt that there have been huge changes in the market for 5.56. Our smart weapons stockpiles on the otherhand (not cheap and you can't even train with the older stuff) probably are not in as good a shape.

I've read stories of soldiers going short of ammo in Iraq and I'd bet that is was a supply train problem and not a supply shortage problem.
Link Posted: 10/10/2004 8:43:29 PM EST
[Last Edit: 10/10/2004 8:43:55 PM EST by El_Roto]
Actually, the U.S. Military is not awash in small-arms munitions by any means. Read the article in link below.

DoD looks to private sector for long-term small-arms
Link Posted: 10/11/2004 3:18:14 AM EST
IMI manufactured ammo for the US military is only allowed for training purposes.
Link Posted: 10/11/2004 5:35:43 AM EST
A friend just got back from training Designated Marksman Instructors for the 101st at Ft. Campbell. He said during the training course, they fired about 10-12K rounds downrange. He was told that was half the division training allotment for the month. 2 rnds./man/mo. for training is pathetic. When are the reserve plants going to be opened?

Link Posted: 10/11/2004 6:37:02 AM EST

Originally Posted By Dracster:
A friend just got back from training Designated Marksman Instructors for the 101st at Ft. Campbell. He said during the training course, they fired about 10-12K rounds downrange. He was told that was half the division training allotment for the month. 2 rnds./man/mo. for training is pathetic. When are the reserve plants going to be opened?



The EMP course that divisional Marines are required (some Marines slip through the cracks on this one) to fire prior to deploying is between 1100-1500 rounds of 5.56mm per Marine.
Link Posted: 10/11/2004 12:09:52 PM EST

Originally Posted By natedogg42:
there are all kinds of factors in play...interesting side note...

we are contracting with israel for them to make a bunch of 5.56 for our troops

some democrat in the senate (a few weeks ago) said that this ammo should not be used in iraq because that would offend the muslims too much (to be shot with jew bullets i suppose), he wants them to ship 5.56 back to the US for use in training from israel (mideast) and send ammo made in US to iraq.....not very efficient....stupid dems


----------------------------
Well, hey they have to take care of their constituants in the shipping businesses....they are afterall mostly union jobs.

Link Posted: 10/11/2004 12:28:05 PM EST
No shortage in my house... stock remains steady at 4,000 rounds. Replenished each time I shoot down 500 rounds.

Link Posted: 10/12/2004 6:45:32 AM EST

Originally Posted By Dracster:
A friend just got back from training Designated Marksman Instructors for the 101st at Ft. Campbell. He said during the training course, they fired about 10-12K rounds downrange. He was told that was half the division training allotment for the month. 2 rnds./man/mo. for training is pathetic. When are the reserve plants going to be opened?




What reserve plants? All the old mothballed plants are being torn down or are way out of date. It would cost a lot of money to retool them and get them up to snuff. I know the St. Louis plant is long gone. Not sure about Twin Cities, Eau Claire, Des Moines, Denver, Frankford Arsenal etc. There were several that made small arms ammunition during WWII, but most haven't been used since then or Korea at the latest. Federal, Winchester, etc. used to make ammunition for the Army. They could again if needed but civilian ammo would take a huge hit.
Link Posted: 10/13/2004 1:53:18 AM EST
I can buy Q3131A for $171.61/1000. What price increase?
Link Posted: 10/14/2004 3:33:45 AM EST
hoosierdaddy,
where do you get your 5.56 for that price?
Thanks, bill1953
Link Posted: 10/18/2004 4:57:03 PM EST
I say coat the Israeli ammo with Pig Blood (Muslims will really love it) and have the Star of David Headstamped on all cases. Who gives a happy horse hockey about the GD Muslim Insurgents!
Kill 'em ALL
Link Posted: 10/18/2004 5:33:28 PM EST

Originally Posted By STLRN:
Because we don't shoot 55 grain rounds.



I Do.

Around here it is hard to find anything else.

Besides didn't the military go to 62 grain ?


Bobwrench
Link Posted: 10/18/2004 5:47:14 PM EST

Originally Posted By bobwrench:
Besides didn't the military go to 62 grain ?

Bobwrench



Exactly I haven't seen 55gn rounds issued in my entire time in
Link Posted: 10/18/2004 5:54:23 PM EST

Originally Posted By STLRN:
Because we don't shoot 55 grain rounds.



By 'we' you are referring to the military, right Major?
Link Posted: 10/18/2004 5:56:04 PM EST

Originally Posted By bobwrench:

Originally Posted By STLRN:
Because we don't shoot 55 grain rounds.



I Do.

Around here it is hard to find anything else.

Besides didn't the military go to 62 grain ?


Bobwrench



Bob, he's USMC

He's saying that the military doesn't use 55gr anymore, so the price of 55gr stays constant, possibly a little higher as ammo plants stop making the obselete M193 in order to turn out M855
Link Posted: 10/18/2004 6:09:31 PM EST

Originally Posted By Dave_A:

Originally Posted By STLRN:
Because we don't shoot 55 grain rounds.



By 'we' you are referring to the military?



Yep
Link Posted: 10/18/2004 8:00:34 PM EST
Link Posted: 10/19/2004 4:42:40 PM EST
I am with the "ammo prices have gone up" crowd. In Feb. 2004, I bought 1000 rounds of XM193 from Wholwsale Hunter. Cost $166.80 delivered. Look at their price now, not that they have any.
Link Posted: 10/20/2004 2:27:03 AM EST
bmwmc,
If your in the Nashville area,Gun Mart has 1000 round cases of Q3131A for $179.00.Its marked $249.95 but they sell it for $179.00.
They have cases of Wolf for around $110.00.
There are several cases of each in front of the counters.
Thought I'd share my source with ya if your interested.I think Im about the only person that buys it.
Link Posted: 10/20/2004 3:25:41 AM EST
Thank you. But I am about 70 miles south of Nashville. I can oeder off the internet and have delivered cheaper than I can drive to Nashville, and pay our high sales tax.
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